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Ephemeron
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Posted - 2006.09.18 05:49:00 -
[1]
I was thinking about possible enemy gang/fleet that I would be most vulnerable against. Basically, a gang with least number of people yet most effective force.
Then it hit me: 10~ force recons with covert ops.
Can you imagine a 10+ gang made fully of cloaking force recons? What can possibly defeat such a gang? even if you gather 100 people blob, standard fleet bs setup, the 10 covert ops will simply disappear and wait until they spot a weakness, sneak up on some lone enemy, quickly kill and disappear again.
Sure, force recons that cloak don't have great DPS, but their gang can be much more effective in getting kills than high dps bs/HAC gang because the enemy can't anticipate where the attack is coming from.
Have EVE seen such gangs in action yet?
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Sexorella hotz
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Posted - 2006.09.18 05:51:00 -
[2]
you do realize once targeted a ship cannot cloak right?
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Tunajuice
Demon Womb Xelas Alliance
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Posted - 2006.09.18 05:58:00 -
[3]
I'd say 9 carriers and 1 tackler with an auto-target do-hicky would be a good start.
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LUKEC
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2006.09.18 05:59:00 -
[4]
All it takes is 1 bait and 1-2 tempest sniping at you. Oh you won't warp, those non combat recons die in 1 volley.
But i've heard nice things about 1 interdictor and 3-4 ravens. --------------------- Looking for frentix? Mail me.
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Ephemeron
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Posted - 2006.09.18 06:09:00 -
[5]
Originally by: LUKEC All it takes is 1 bait and 1-2 tempest sniping at you. Oh you won't warp, those non combat recons die in 1 volley.
But i've heard nice things about 1 interdictor and 3-4 ravens.
But the sniping tempest's can't hide. Lets assume that we are dealing with smart people here. Lets take a 4 man force recon gang against 2 sniper tempest and a bait. The first force recon in system will know the enemy has 2 tempests. Then the other force recons get in, 1-2 position themselves near bait while other 2 remain in long distance, perhaps 60km from target. If sniper tempest try to warp in after bait is attacked, there's good chance of bait dying before any force recons die. There's a good chance the sniper tempest will be in EW range of some force recons, gimping their damage. The bait itsel may have uber tank, but it's likely to be jammed or sensor damped. It won't have scramble on force recons and they can warp out if sniper tempest starts hitting too hard.
A good force recon pilot that is setup for close range combat is going to have a decent tank, it's not going to die in 1 volley. Less tanked force recons are probably focusing a lot on EW, which is defense enough.
If you think about it carefully, 2 sniper tempests + bait are at serious disadvantage against 4 force recons. It is the force recon gang that has the initiative, it dictates the tactics. If force recon gang doesn't see a sure way to kill the enemy, they simply won't start a fight.
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Deva Blackfire
DAB RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2006.09.18 06:50:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 18/09/2006 06:51:32
Quote: If sniper tempest try to warp in after bait is attacked, there's good chance of bait dying before any force recons die.
Bilts like 2x LAR, plated apocs with injectors die SLOWLY. 4 recons (even set for max damage) will take more than 2 minutes to break it. On the other hand recons die easily to 2 (max 3) salvos from two snipers (tested already... unfortunately it was me who died ;p)
Quote: If you think about it carefully, 2 sniper tempests + bait are at serious disadvantage against 4 force recons. It is the force recon gang that has the initiative, it dictates the tactics. If force recon gang doesn't see a sure way to kill the enemy, they simply won't start a fight.
If you think so get 4 force recons and i invite you to MSHD - its often camped by 2-3 russian (RTSQ) snipers. Feel free to check how good your advantage is...
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Nebuli
Caldari Art of War Cult of War
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Posted - 2006.09.18 06:53:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Ephemeron
Originally by: LUKEC All it takes is 1 bait and 1-2 tempest sniping at you. Oh you won't warp, those non combat recons die in 1 volley.
But i've heard nice things about 1 interdictor and 3-4 ravens.
But the sniping tempest's can't hide. Lets assume that we are dealing with smart people here. Lets take a 4 man force recon gang against 2 sniper tempest and a bait. The first force recon in system will know the enemy has 2 tempests. Then the other force recons get in, 1-2 position themselves near bait while other 2 remain in long distance, perhaps 60km from target. If sniper tempest try to warp in after bait is attacked, there's good chance of bait dying before any force recons die. There's a good chance the sniper tempest will be in EW range of some force recons, gimping their damage. The bait itsel may have uber tank, but it's likely to be jammed or sensor damped. It won't have scramble on force recons and they can warp out if sniper tempest starts hitting too hard.
A good force recon pilot that is setup for close range combat is going to have a decent tank, it's not going to die in 1 volley. Less tanked force recons are probably focusing a lot on EW, which is defense enough.
If you think about it carefully, 2 sniper tempests + bait are at serious disadvantage against 4 force recons. It is the force recon gang that has the initiative, it dictates the tactics. If force recon gang doesn't see a sure way to kill the enemy, they simply won't start a fight.
Snipers would have a cov warp in point anyway making those 60k away recons completely useless.
CEO - Art of War
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Testy Mctest
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Posted - 2006.09.18 07:25:00 -
[8]
Gangs of cloaking recons is a fun, and interesting, tactic. But it's far from being the deadliest tactic.
Personally, from experience, I'd say 3-4 properly outfitted Ravens, 1-2 gunship BSes for anti-support, 1-2 interdictors, some form of cloaking ship, and a couple of tackling frigs/vagas is the best setup at the moment. There's not much it can't take on happily, including fleets 5+ times its size.
Scrapheap Challenge Forums - All the cool kids are doing it!
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Ephemeron
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Posted - 2006.09.18 08:09:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Testy Mctest Gangs of cloaking recons is a fun, and interesting, tactic. But it's far from being the deadliest tactic.
Personally, from experience, I'd say 3-4 properly outfitted Ravens, 1-2 gunship BSes for anti-support, 1-2 interdictors, some form of cloaking ship, and a couple of tackling frigs/vagas is the best setup at the moment. There's not much it can't take on happily, including fleets 5+ times its size.
This may be one of the strongest fleets, but I disagree that this is the deadliest.
Smart people will simply avoid engagement with such a gang. It can be easily scouted with cheap frigs or friendly covert ops. The strongest gang is only deadliest to noobs.
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MuffinsRevenger
Brenodi Capital Constructions
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Posted - 2006.09.18 08:12:00 -
[10]
6-7 pilgrims will dry annything of cap and swarm it with drones, the enemy will have a extremly slim chance of figgureing out when they are about to be attacked due to the sneeky nature of those ships, and a falcon or two will help the pilgrims to basicly make sure that they will never be targeted, so yeah, thats defenatly a evil fleet :):)
Originally by: The Wizz117 jeez those guyz @ ccp talk like sweedish nobody will take u seriouse with that cind of accent.
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Ephemeron
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Posted - 2006.09.18 08:14:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Nebuli Snipers would have a cov warp in point anyway making those 60k away recons completely useless.
If that happens and the force recon gang is unable to put EW on those snipers, then they simply warp out, possibly killing the bait first.
The force recon gang has initiative and it forces the enemy to play by its rules. If force recon gang sees a lot of snipers warping in - they all warp out. If there aren't enough snipers, they kill the bait. If there are a lot of tacklers and snipers about, they don't even engage in first place.
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Testicular Testes
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Posted - 2006.09.18 08:36:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Ephemeron
Originally by: Nebuli Snipers would have a cov warp in point anyway making those 60k away recons completely useless.
If that happens and the force recon gang is unable to put EW on those snipers, then they simply warp out, possibly killing the bait first.
The force recon gang has initiative and it forces the enemy to play by its rules. If force recon gang sees a lot of snipers warping in - they all warp out. If there aren't enough snipers, they kill the bait. If there are a lot of tacklers and snipers about, they don't even engage in first place.
Interdictors mean they really don't. Interdictors and ganking mean force recons can be headed off once they have to travel through chokes to get to a desired location.
At that point, it's a matter of throwing a few sensor damp Ravens around and having the odd multispec sitting about. Your recon gang won't guess correctly as to who all has ewar, and you die rather miserably.
The deadliest gang is simply not the one that brings the most excessive amount of Eagles possible (or with perfect targetting, all Tempests and about ~5 eagles to instapop small-ish stuff). Of course that doesn't satisify for "least amount of people possible", but in that case I'd rather keep it to myself because I don't look forward to facing it ;)
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AsfALT
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Posted - 2006.09.18 08:53:00 -
[13]
Any recon force (from eve, rl, another planet...) has it's advantages, but as any other thing it also has disadvantages. The major being holding a location for your team.
There is no such thing as deadlyest fleet for all purposes. There can only be a deadly fleet for one or a limited number of purposes... This is the great thing about eve IMHO.
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Crellion
Art of War Cult of War
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Posted - 2006.09.18 09:20:00 -
[14]
Deadliest gang is the one thats best set up to kill whats comming... I dont think there is a cookie cutter deadliest gang.
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welsh wizard
Celestial Apocalypse
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Posted - 2006.09.18 09:33:00 -
[15]
Edited by: welsh wizard on 18/09/2006 09:34:43 5 Ravens, 2 Scorps, 3 or 4 Eagles, maybe some Cerbs, couple of Falcons/Rooks, 4 or 5 Crows and a flycatcher.
Should beat any fleet of a similar size with similar ships. Shame about the lack of web though..
Theres no doubt about it, Caldari have been given the most thought when it comes to fleet operations. They'll be invulnerable when the Rokh shows up!
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General Apocalypse
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Posted - 2006.09.18 09:36:00 -
[16]
About gangs of recons .
A single ninja is deadly a mob of ninjas is cannon folder.
As for the most powerfull gang of 10 how about 10 titans
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James Lyrus
Lyrus Associates Interstellar Starbase Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.09.18 10:32:00 -
[17]
Recon ships appear to have been thought out about how they're complementing each other - you have a pair that are good at tackling, 1 that breaks tanks, and the last that's just good at long range jamming.
Uber? Naah, not really. The advantage of a force recon is cloaked mobility and suprise. Otherwise they're not all that robust, and lacking in damage output. Oh, and sensor recalibration is a real nuisance.
A wing of 10 'ceptors is about the deadliest fleet, simply because they can deep strike so fast.
One day, I'll have a 'scorpion only' fleet, and use that for a rampage.
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Jenny Spitfire
Caldari
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Posted - 2006.09.18 10:37:00 -
[18]
Originally by: James Lyrus A wing of 10 'ceptors Vagabonds is about the deadliest fleet, simply because they can deep strike so fast.
--------- Cruelty is God's way of showing kindness and God is kind.
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Bazman
Caldari The Establishment Establishment
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Posted - 2006.09.18 11:33:00 -
[19]
Force Recons don't usually equip webs. That makes them prime for meh Nanofibred bombathron :P Just try and jam a smartbomb ya basties :P -----
Hi TUXFORD! Blasterboat for tier 3 Gallente battleship please! Make it look cool too. Thanks.
I am a Gallente Whiner. Minmatar Whining is currently in training. |
Rina Shanu
Phoenix Knights
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Posted - 2006.09.18 11:44:00 -
[20]
Not the most deadly, but if you get good BMs of the area, a bunch of friends who think like you, have a full pack of maticores.... KBum, full damage monsters heading towards the enemy, then just warp away. Of course, not a full head on tactic, but guerilla tactics work very well nehind enemy lines.
this ok dear? |
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ZelRox
Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2006.09.18 11:48:00 -
[21]
try a fleet of blackbirds :D cheap and nasty ---------------------- I got pwnt by the giggling admiral BiH 4tw |
XGS Crimson
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Posted - 2006.09.18 12:22:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Ephemeron I was thinking about possible enemy gang/fleet that I would be most vulnerable against. Basically, a gang with least number of people yet most effective force.
Then it hit me: 10~ force recons with covert ops.
Can you imagine a 10+ gang made fully of cloaking force recons? What can possibly defeat such a gang? even if you gather 100 people blob, standard fleet bs setup, the 10 covert ops will simply disappear and wait until they spot a weakness, sneak up on some lone enemy, quickly kill and disappear again.
Sure, force recons that cloak don't have great DPS, but their gang can be much more effective in getting kills than high dps bs/HAC gang because the enemy can't anticipate where the attack is coming from.
Have EVE seen such gangs in action yet?
Interceptors... hundreds of em lol
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xlop
Gallente
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Posted - 2006.09.18 12:33:00 -
[23]
10 taranis
ions t2, ofline remote rep, 2 dmg mods, mwd, 7.5km, web
should kill any target before they lock the cepters, guess only problem would be smartbomb BS. combined they output 2.9K DPS which is gona kill any BS really really fast. it should also kill a carrier before it locks [assuming drones dont auto attack].
==========================================
1 mini recon, 1 interdictor, 8ravens would be great
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XGS Crimson
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Posted - 2006.09.18 12:35:00 -
[24]
Originally by: xlop 10 taranis
ions t2, ofline remote rep, 2 dmg mods, mwd, 7.5km, web
should kill any target before they lock the cepters, guess only problem would be smartbomb BS. combined they output 2.9K DPS which is gona kill any BS really really fast. it should also kill a carrier before it locks [assuming drones dont auto attack].
==========================================
1 mini recon, 1 interdictor, 8ravens would be great
Haha i <3 inty gangbangs... we should meet up and do it some time! Ranis is my shex toy
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Jin Entres
Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2006.09.18 12:45:00 -
[25]
1 Titan and all the interdictors you can get. r0ar. ---
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Dagis
United Knights Mining and Security
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Posted - 2006.09.18 13:11:00 -
[26]
Its got to be 10 ibis's...
Those things are just like UBER!!!
But i recon the +10 force recon (esp all races) would hurt a plenty and be hard too locate, well unless they sucked at covert ops.
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Shin Ra
BURN EDEN
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Posted - 2006.09.18 14:18:00 -
[27]
8 Ravens, Jave torps, dampners, stabs. 1 cov ops 1 interdictor.
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Viktor Fyretracker
Caldari Worms Corp
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Posted - 2006.09.18 14:29:00 -
[28]
300 afterburning kestrels with T2 light missle launchers.
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DeadDuck
Amarr DAB RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2006.09.18 14:33:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Shin Ra 8 Ravens, Jave torps, dampners, stabs. 1 cov ops 1 interdictor.
These are the most efective and combat proved
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XGS Crimson
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Posted - 2006.09.18 14:45:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Viktor Fyretracker 300 afterburning kestrels with T2 light missle launchers.
I love you!
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