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Avan Thannis University of Caille Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2015.01.20 08:36:32 - [1] - Quote I'm currently flying an Apocalypse, the standard hull, not the navy version, and I'm wondering where to go from there. I've got T2 pulse lasers as well as T2 drones, having recently finished training for T2 sentry drones. I've been considering getting a Navy Armageddon, but I'm unsure if that'd be the best choice, and if it is, what sort of fit to run with it. I'm still very much a rookie, so any input or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
erg cz Tribal Core Defiant Legacy 129	Posted - 2015.01.20 11:39:24 - [2] - Quote Take a look here. But still you will be much better off with Dominix or Rattlesnake. Adjustable type of damage, effective range sniping... al the L4 newbee needs. When you learn the game, you can also try Machariel to get some action.
Avan Thannis University of Caille Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2015.01.20 12:04:32 - [3] - Quote erg cz wrote: Take a look here. But still you will be much better off with Dominix or Rattlesnake. Adjustable type of damage, effective range sniping... al the L4 newbee needs. When you learn the game, you can also try Machariel to get some action. Much appreciated. And I'd prefer to stick with a laser using ship, to not entirely waste the skillpoints I invested in getting T2 lasers. Training for an entirely different damage source, seems like it'd take a long time.
Spugg Galdon APOCALYPSE LEGION The Obsidian Front 599	Posted - 2015.01.20 12:54:19 - [4] - Quote [Apocalypse Navy Issue, L4 PvE] Damage Control II Large Armor Repairer II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Armor Explosive Hardener II Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Co-Processor II Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Script Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Script Omnidirectional Tracking Link II, Optimal Range Script Large Micro Jump Drive Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Large Drone Control Range Augmentor I Large Energy Collision Accelerator I Large Auxiliary Nano Pump I Curator II x3 Hobgoblin II x5 I'd go for this more than the Navy Geddon that was posted but that's just personal preference. Use this the same way as that Navy Geddon. Switch out the tank to be mission specific.
Avan Thannis University of Caille Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2015.01.20 13:24:40 - [5] - Quote Spugg Galdon wrote: [Apocalypse Navy Issue, L4 PvE] Damage Control II Large Armor Repairer II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Armor Explosive Hardener II Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Co-Processor II Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Script Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Script Omnidirectional Tracking Link II, Optimal Range Script Large Micro Jump Drive Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Large Drone Control Range Augmentor I Large Energy Collision Accelerator I Large Auxiliary Nano Pump I Curator II x3 Hobgoblin II x5 I'd go for this more than the Navy Geddon that was posted but that's just personal preference. Use this the same way as that Navy Geddon. Switch out the tank to be mission specific. Any reason why you'd go for this one, instead of the Geddon? Easier to fit for, higher damage, better survivability, or a mix?
Tsukino Stareine Sock Robbers Inc. 878	Posted - 2015.01.20 13:28:23 - [6] - Quote problem with laser heavy platforms and missioning is that some missions are going to give you problems as they are heavily resistant to em/thermal damage. Thus laser boats aren't the most efficient at missioning, they are great in almost all other aspects of pve though.
HoruSeth Republic University Minmatar Republic 11	Posted - 2015.01.20 13:31:44 - [7] - Quote In Amarr Space I am very happy with the Nightmare and Tachyons! For some missions swap to Pulse Laser. But in General nowadays I am flying as well Rattlesnake.
Avan Thannis University of Caille Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2015.01.20 13:32:11 - [8] - Quote Tsukino Stareine wrote: problem with laser heavy platforms and missioning is that some missions are going to give you problems as they are heavily resistant to em/thermal damage. Thus laser boats aren't the most efficient at missioning, they are great in almost all other aspects of pve though. I know, it's a problem and in hindsight I should've probably gone a different route. At this point, I'm just trying to make the best of a bad situation, getting a fit that works while sticking to areas of space where I get missions against rats with resistances that won't -completely- screw me over. Quote: In Amarr Space I am very happy with the Nightmare and Tachyons! For some missions swap to Pulse Laser. But in General nowadays I am flying as well Rattlesnake. The Nightmare is a bit outside of my price range, it's nearly a billion for just the hull, isn't it? I'm trying to stick with navy ships, so I won't go completely broke. That said, I'm still curious about fits for various ships, so I have something to aim for in the future.
Tsukino Stareine Sock Robbers Inc. 878	Posted - 2015.01.20 13:49:12 - [9] - Quote I would keep going down the drone route and pick up a geddon, you can stick lasers on that as supplementary damage and use sentries for your damage selection. Or, you could move away from missioning and start doing incursions, null ratting or even wormholes.
Spugg Galdon APOCALYPSE LEGION The Obsidian Front 599	Posted - 2015.01.20 15:17:41 - [10] - Quote Avan Thannis wrote: Spugg Galdon wrote: [Apocalypse Navy Issue, L4 PvE] Damage Control II Large Armor Repairer II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Armor Explosive Hardener II Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Co-Processor II Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Script Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Script Omnidirectional Tracking Link II, Optimal Range Script Large Micro Jump Drive Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Mega Pulse Laser II, Scorch L Large Drone Control Range Augmentor I Large Energy Collision Accelerator I Large Auxiliary Nano Pump I Curator II x3 Hobgoblin II x5 I'd go for this more than the Navy Geddon that was posted but that's just personal preference. Use this the same way as that Navy Geddon. Switch out the tank to be mission specific. Any reason why you'd go for this one, instead of the Geddon? Easier to fit for, higher damage, better survivability, or a mix? Mostly damage application.

HoruSeth Republic University Minmatar Republic 11	Posted - 2015.01.20 15:24:58 - [11] - Quote Avan Thannis wrote: The Nightmare is a bit outside of my price range, it's nearly a billion for just the hull, isn't it? No. https://eve-central.com/home/quicklook.html?typeid=17736 And for Fitting I worked with simple T2 / cheap Faction Fitting. My Nightmare is worth 850M ISK, but just because of Faction Damage Mods. Full T2 (incl. T2 Rigs) it is just approx. 650M ISK. ;)
erg cz Tribal Core Defiant Legacy 129	Posted - 2015.01.20 15:44:41 - [12] - Quote HoruSeth wrote: In Amarr Space I am very happy with the Nightmare and Tachyons! For some missions swap to Pulse Laser. Even in Apanake I got Angel extravaganza and similar missions so often, that I decided to buy second battleship, that was bonused to kintic damage at least. With time I understood, that I can use Dominix as a single ship for any kind of missions. No ammunition costs, you actually can fit up to 3 tachyon lasers there as well and still have reasonable drone contol range. And about damage projection... [Dominix, Expedition combat omnitank 180 km cheap] Federation Navy Drone Damage Amplifier Federation Navy Drone Damage Amplifier Drone Damage Amplifier II Drone Damage Amplifier II Shadow Serpentis Large Armor Repairer Internal Force Field Array I Drone Damage Amplifier II Large Micro Jump Drive Sensor Booster II, Targeting Range Script Federation Navy Omnidirectional Tracking Link, Optimal Range Script Federation Navy Omnidirectional Tracking Link, Optimal Range Script Federation Navy Omnidirectional Tracking Link, Optimal Range Script Tachyon Modulated Energy Beam I, Microwave L Tachyon Modulated Energy Beam I, Microwave L Drone Link Augmentor I Drone Link Augmentor II Drone Link Augmentor II Drone Link Augmentor II Large Drone Scope Chip II Large Ionic Field Projector II Large Drone Control Range Augmentor II Garde II x5 Warden II x5 Curator II x5 Can target and hit for 170 km with almost 700 DPS (Warden II), almost 800 dps at 112 km optimal with curators and 855 DPS with Garde II and standard crystals at 65 km. Try to outproject this. ;)
Avan Thannis University of Caille Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2015.01.20 16:00:19 - [13] - Quote HoruSeth wrote: Avan Thannis wrote: The Nightmare is a bit outside of my price range, it's nearly a billion for just the hull, isn't it? No. https://eve-central.com/home/quicklook.html?typeid=17736 That was long time ago. And for Fitting I worked with simple T2 / cheap Faction Fitting. My Nightmare is worth 850M ISK, but just because of Faction Damage Mods. Full T2 (incl. T2 Rigs) it is just approx. 650M ISK. ;) At the Moment it looks like training for Drones is the way to go, but usually in EVE when you start to train for something that is mor than just good when you started it, CCP has nerfed that at the latest when you finished the Skill Queue :) Nevertheless drones was and is always something useful! I like the Nightmare because you can pull out >1k dps without drones, immediate damage (compared to missiles), a very nice alpha and without need to skill T2 skills at V, even though it's tough to fit Tachyons on it. But even with T1 Meta Faction Guns this ship is very nice in Amarr Space! Though T2 Tachyons are desirable! Hah, well that goes to show outdated some of my information is. The downside of a Nightmare is that it's shield tanked though, and my tanking skills are all focused on armor, as that's what I've been using as Amarr up until this point. The drone bandwith doesn't allow for a full flight of sentries either, so that'd be a bit of a waste too.
Ralph King-Griffin Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance 8574	Posted - 2015.01.20 16:34:49 - [14] - Quote Paladin. "I'm also quite confident that you are laughing and it's the kind of laugh that gives normal people shivers." =]I[=
Avan Thannis University of Caille Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2015.01.21 07:28:19 - [15] - Quote Ralph King-Griffin wrote: Paladin. That'd be out of both my price as well as skill range. Will probably end up going for the suggested Navy Geddon, as it'd take advantage of both my laser and drone skills.
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE 909	Posted - 2015.01.21 08:11:48 - [16] - Quote shield tanks have low skill requirements. t2 shield hardeners only require tactical shield manipulation to level 4. xl shield boosters need shield operation 3. beyond that I'd put in a few levels of shield compensation for the cap reduction. yea the sentry skills are a little wasted, but that is true on nearly every amarr boat. the nightmare certainly makes the most of the gunnery skills. I'd take the nightmare all the way, especially since it costs almost the same as a navy boat. Paladin when you can get around to it. As for angels extra, I always decline it and I can fly a mach with AC spec 5. I'll join the chorus asking CCP, don't take my fancy names away from me! In the name of the Limos, the Malkuth, and the Arbalest, so help me pod - Mara Rinn
Avan Thannis University of Caille Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2015.01.21 08:35:48 - [17] - Quote Chainsaw Plankton wrote: shield tanks have low skill requirements. t2 shield hardeners only require tactical shield manipulation to level 4. xl shield boosters need shield operation 3. beyond that I'd put in a few levels of shield compensation for the cap reduction. yea the sentry skills are a little wasted, but that is true on nearly every amarr boat. the nightmare certainly makes the most of the gunnery skills. I'd take the nightmare all the way, especially since it costs almost the same as a navy boat. Paladin when you can get around to it. As for angels extra, I always decline it and I can fly a mach with AC spec 5. Well that's two votes for the Nightmare, so it's starting to look rather tempting. Anyone happen to have a solid fit for one? Solid for running missions, I mean, not entirely blinged out for top dps in incursions, can't quite afford that yet.
Dalloway Jones Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 262	Posted - 2015.01.21 10:15:30 - [18] - Quote When I lost my first Apoc in a Gurista mission I switched to Raven for a while. So much more versatile and so much tankier. I almost never have to move at all. Just take a beating and pop the shield regen every now and then whilst my pretty missiles with their cool animations fly off and kill the enemy. But I love Amarr ships so much I am working my way up to Paladin and just bought a Navy Apoc the other night. I'm going to keep the Raven around though for Gurista missions.
atomic killer State War Academy Caldari State 1	Posted - 2015.01.21 10:33:59 - [19] - Quote In my opinion, for missions you need a ship which can change damage types. Thats drone ships, missile ships and artys (can't change damage 100%). Apoc isn't good because of the lasers.
Catalytic morphisis Viziam Amarr Empire 82	Posted - 2015.01.21 13:05:08 - [20] - Quote The paladin is the daddy of Amarrian mission running, However the nightmare is a hell of a boat, Both are laser centralized so fit into your skills. Although I'd say with the Budget you have I'd go for a Navy Apoc, They run missions relatively quickly and painlessly Quad Boxing Trading Extroadinaire, Actual Link free solo PvP'er

Tsukino Stareine Sock Robbers Inc. 885	Posted - 2015.01.21 13:13:37 - [21] - Quote You can easily armour tank a nightmare btw
Avan Thannis University of Caille Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2015.01.21 14:00:22 - [22] - Quote Tsukino Stareine wrote: You can easily armour tank a nightmare btw Isn't that horribly inefficient, or am I missing something?
Lady Rift What Shall We Call It 161	Posted - 2015.01.21 14:18:53 - [23] - Quote Avan Thannis wrote: Tsukino Stareine wrote: You can easily armour tank a nightmare btw Isn't that horribly inefficient, or am I missing something? its not horrible horrible now that they have an extra low slot. 3 heat sinks and 4/5 TC's rest of slots for tank/cap with tachs still gives ~900 dps w/o drones. cap life of 5 mins with decent implants. But the nightmare can tank so much more witha shield tank and not have to worry about incoming dps.
HoruSeth Republic University Minmatar Republic 12	Posted - 2015.01.21 14:23:51 - [24] - Quote atomic killer wrote: In my opinion, for missions you need a ship which can change damage types. Thats drone ships, missile ships and artys (can't change damage 100%). Laser boats aren't good because of the lasers, which only do EM/Thermal damage. That's a valid, but very simple POV. Against your valid arguments in Amarr Space there is nothing better than an Amarr boat. Lasers have very nice, immediate damage projection. Scorch for Pulses and a very high Alpha with Long optimal for Tachyon Beams is what make them very easy. I had splitted my NM Beams into two Groups and were insta popping aproaching Frigs, Cruiser and even some Battlecruiser with one volley. And the spawn distance in most Amarr Missions fits perfectly together with the optimal ranges of a full skilled Amarr Battleship! I would bet: no way you can apply the damge with Missiles, Drones or projectiles nearly as good as you can do with a Pala or Nightmare. Maybe the Vargur, but I haven't flown this ship yet. @Tank: I never had an issue with the tank of my NM as most times Sansha and Blood Raider die before they are a real threat. What I can recommend for lazy Misisonrunners really is as well the Dominix. Not the fastest Missionrunner ship for sure, but a very handy one in most missions. @Missiles: Problem with Missiles is the slow damage application. Unless you know what you do and count the cycles, you waste a lot of damage. No doubt. Easy to fly and I started my career with Caldari all the way up as well, but a good share of the paper damage is most of the times wasted as people usually do not tend to count the volleys nor do they know for each NPC how much Volleys they would need.
Agent Unknown Night Theifs DamnedNation 7	Posted - 2015.01.21 15:06:24 - [25] - Quote erg cz wrote: HoruSeth wrote: In Amarr Space I am very happy with the Nightmare and Tachyons! For some missions swap to Pulse Laser. Even in Apanake I got Angel extravaganza and similar missions so often, that I decided to buy second battleship, that was bonused to kintic damage at least. With time I understood, that I can use Dominix as a single ship for any kind of missions. No ammunition costs, you actually can fit up to 3 tachyon lasers there as well and still have reasonable drone contol range. And about damage projection... [Dominix, 170 km] Federation Navy Drone Damage Amplifier Federation Navy Drone Damage Amplifier Drone Damage Amplifier II Drone Damage Amplifier II Shadow Serpentis Large Armor Repairer Internal Force Field Array I Drone Damage Amplifier II Large Micro Jump Drive Sensor Booster II, Targeting Range Script Federation Navy Omnidirectional Tracking Link, Optimal Range Script Federation Navy Omnidirectional Tracking Link, Optimal Range Script Federation Navy Omnidirectional Tracking Link, Optimal Range Script Tachyon Modulated Energy Beam I, Microwave L Tachyon Modulated Energy Beam I, Microwave L Drone Link Augmentor I Drone Link Augmentor II Drone Link Augmentor II Drone Link Augmentor II Large Drone Scope Chip II Large Ionic Field Projector II Large Drone Control Range Augmentor II Garde II x5 Warden II x5 Curator II x5 Can target and hit for 170 km with almost 700 DPS (Warden II), almost 800 dps at 112 km optimal with curators and 855 DPS with Garde II and standard crystals at 65 km. Try to outproject this. ;) You'd be better off with an EANM instead of one of the drone amplifiers...the stacking penalty doesn't make anything after the 3rd module really worth it (I see the argument for 4, but 5 is too many).
Tsukino Stareine Sock Robbers Inc. 888	Posted - 2015.01.21 15:26:14 - [26] - Quote Avan Thannis wrote: Tsukino Stareine wrote: You can easily armour tank a nightmare btw Isn't that horribly inefficient, or am I missing something? What's horribly inefficient about it? You get the same number of heat sinks as you would in a shield fit (maybe 1 less but it's penalised to like 30% anyway).
Avan Thannis University of Caille Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2015.01.21 16:09:03 - [27] - Quote Tsukino Stareine wrote: Avan Thannis wrote: Tsukino Stareine wrote: You can easily armour tank a nightmare btw Isn't that horribly inefficient, or am I missing something? What's horribly inefficient about it? You get the same number of heat sinks as you would in a shield fit (maybe 1 less but it's penalised to like 30% anyway). True I guess, just always assumed it was better used as a shield tanked ship. Anyhow, if you or anyone else have some fits for it(Both shield tanked and armor tanked), those'd certainly be appreciated.
Lady Rift What Shall We Call It 161	Posted - 2015.01.21 17:22:55 - [28] - Quote Avan Thannis wrote: Tsukino Stareine wrote: Avan Thannis wrote: Tsukino Stareine wrote: You can easily armour tank a nightmare btw Isn't that horribly inefficient, or am I missing something? What's horribly inefficient about it? You get the same number of heat sinks as you would in a shield fit (maybe 1 less but it's penalised to like 30% anyway). True I guess, just always assumed it was better used as a shield tanked ship. Anyhow, if you or anyone else have some fits for it(Both shield tanked and armor tanked), those'd certainly be appreciated. [Nightmare, New Setup 1] Damage Control II Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Tracking Enhancer II Gist X-Type X-Large Shield Booster Thermic Dissipation Field II Pithum B-Type Adaptive Invulnerability Field Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Navy Cap Booster 800 Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Script Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Script Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Script Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L [empty high slot] [empty high slot] Large Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer II Large Core Defense Field Extender II Large Energy Discharge Elutriation II Hammerhead II x5 something like this is what I use to run (rigs aren't optimal for l4 pve as this is made to do incursions also) 48km optimal 960 dps. tracking is 0.026 [Nightmare, armor pve] Core A-Type Large Armor Repairer Core X-Type Armor EM Hardener Core X-Type Armor Thermic Hardener Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Imperial Navy Heat Sink Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Script Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Script Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range Script Tracking Computer II, Tracking Speed Script Tracking Computer II, Tracking Speed Script Tracking Computer II, Tracking Speed Script Heavy Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Navy Cap Booster 800 Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L Tachyon Beam Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency L [empty high slot] [empty high slot] [empty rig slot] [empty rig slot] [empty rig slot] Hammerhead II x5 is the best I can be bothered with for armor the longer I had it open in eft and fit in eve the more dirty I felt doing that to this ship. 900dps 47km optimal tracking is 0.046. Rigs to taste T2 things as you see fit. Both can fit a 100mn afterburner for the loss of a tracking computer (careful as you run out of pg really fast if you put a afterburner on the armor one along with active armor tank rigs)


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