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Plato Forko
Forko Nanorobotics
125
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Posted - 2015.01.21 20:17:32 -
[1] - Quote
Quote:All small artillery will be receiving: +10% damage multiplier -3% tracking speed
so buff to RFF and Thrasher/Sabre
Quote:All autocannons will receive +7.5% falloff Barrage ammo will provide a +40% falloff bonus instead of +50%
buff to Rifter.
Together with the changes for small lasers it seems there's an effort to make scram kiting (don't get pedantic with me) the fighting style of choice. It would be nice if some of the ships that are already way OP could get a speed nerf to bring some much needed balance. As things are looking now, Comet and RFF will be the only viable T1 frigs and that sucks.
There's nothin' like skating away from a fight with the hull on fire, some mods burned out and a cargohold full of loot.
See my terribad blog for stories.
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Chessur
Mining Industry Exile Foundation The Camel Empire
455
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Posted - 2015.01.21 20:41:11 -
[2] - Quote
Plato Forko wrote:Quote:All small artillery will be receiving: +10% damage multiplier -3% tracking speed so buff to RFF and Thrasher/Sabre Quote:All autocannons will receive +7.5% falloff Barrage ammo will provide a +40% falloff bonus instead of +50% buff to Rifter. Together with the changes for small lasers it seems there's an effort to make scram kiting (don't get pedantic with me) the fighting style of choice. It would be nice if some of the ships that are already way OP could get a speed nerf to bring some much needed balance. As things are looking now, Comet and RFF will be the only viable T1 frigs and that sucks.
Arty were ok to begin with. They could use some help with fitting, but the changes are nice i guess. However they were uneeded.
AC's
They need so much more love than 7.5% base falloff increase. This is not going to fix Medium AC's or small AC's. At the end of they day, they do such little damage up close- and are anemic at range. Please don't try and hit me with 'selectable damage' as a huge pro. Because that is just simply not the case when you are kiting with AC's. These paltry changes (even on falloff boats like the stabber / vaga / cyna) Are still not going to make up for the fact that they have anemic DPS at 24+K and because of that are forced to use barrage. The barrage changes are not helping the matter, if range / dps is staying similar. While a step in the right direction, WAY more needs to be done in order to address Small and medium AC's. The only thing this change will have, is give Large AC's (Tornado and particularly the Mach) A slight boost.
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Doctor Knuckles
Black Fox Marauders Spaceship Bebop
87
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Posted - 2015.01.21 22:43:48 -
[3] - Quote
Plato Forko wrote:Comet and RFF will be the only viable T1 frigs and that sucks.
i really don't see why |
Tsukino Stareine
Sock Robbers Inc.
895
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Posted - 2015.01.22 01:09:05 -
[4] - Quote
its like theyre trying to reverse the TE but for projectiles only! |
Plato Forko
Forko Nanorobotics
125
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Posted - 2015.01.22 02:31:11 -
[5] - Quote
dang i just realized the AC changes are to all sizes. derp! But yeah on cruisers AC seem to be more suited for anti-frig and anti-dessie work
There's nothin' like skating away from a fight with the hull on fire, some mods burned out and a cargohold full of loot.
See my terribad blog for stories.
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Trey Kutoi
Nyarlthotep Holdings Ltd.
37
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Posted - 2015.01.22 05:01:13 -
[6] - Quote
just going to say, that right now. scramkiting in a kestrel is in a pretty crappy place. other minmatar ships, namely rifters and slashers are the only things that I can reliably out dps with my **** skills, so they're in an even worse spot.
I don't appreciate losing my only source of prey, but I won't deny they need it |
Zarnak Wulf
Amarrian Vengeance Team Amarrica
1823
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Posted - 2015.01.22 05:43:31 -
[7] - Quote
Small artillery has very few platforms that it can be successfully placed on. Take the Jaguar as an example. With an optimal bonus it's obviously designed for artillery. With 43 PG and 170 CPU before skills it struggles with fitting. Three 280's and a MWD eat almost all of it's power grid. To fit any kind of tank you will probably need at least two fitting mods, ignore the utility high, and still be unable to fit the neccesary gyros and tracking enhancers to be viable.
With only three turrets it can't compete with other AF. Even though the Jag has a 4-4-4 slot layout it's armor is much less then it's shields - preventing an effective active armor tank. Contributing to that is the ship having the same capacitor as the Rifter.
Lastly - rails have so much flexibility that they are a much better choice. A rail cat has replaced my arty thrasher. And a rail Enyo with four turrets, optimal, tracking, double damage bonuses and a more generous fitting grid - simply blows the Jaguar away. |
Futt Isimazu
State War Academy Caldari State
3
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Posted - 2015.01.22 11:46:13 -
[8] - Quote
Unfortunately this seems to be like the ishtar buff - small, insignificant and a sign that no further change will happen for a while.
CCPlease. |
Varrinox
Last Whisper
58
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Posted - 2015.01.22 11:49:37 -
[9] - Quote
I think the arty change was not needed, arty already has great alpha and considering all the things arty have going for them they didn't need a buff. Arty thrasher is going to become something paintful.
As for the AC buff, I think the 7.5% falloff is a good change, they should not have reduced barrage at the same time though.
Overall I think its a good change that will greatly help ships like the rifter and firetail which were in need of some love. |
Liam Inkuras
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
1419
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Posted - 2015.01.22 14:41:24 -
[10] - Quote
Medium ACs will still suck
I wear my goggles at night.
Any spelling/grammatical errors come complimentary with my typing on a phone
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Shelom Severasse
Burning Alder
49
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Posted - 2015.01.22 18:14:04 -
[11] - Quote
Plato Forko wrote:Quote:All small artillery will be receiving: +10% damage multiplier -3% tracking speed so buff to RFF and Thrasher/Sabre Quote:All autocannons will receive +7.5% falloff Barrage ammo will provide a +40% falloff bonus instead of +50% buff to Rifter. Together with the changes for small lasers it seems there's an effort to make scram kiting (don't get pedantic with me) the fighting style of choice. It would be nice if some of the ships that are already way OP could get a speed nerf to bring some much needed balance. As things are looking now, Comet and RFF will be the only viable T1 frigs and that sucks. idt arty needed the buff.
ACs imo will always be crap compared to other weapon systems. thats not to say they cant be effective, i just prefer other weapons. imo, their problem stems from their inherently low optimal. an increase to falloff wont help them (much), but an increase to optimal will. |
Bronson Hughes
The Knights of the Blessed Mother of Acceleration
1245
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Posted - 2015.01.22 18:45:44 -
[12] - Quote
Chessur wrote:Plato Forko wrote:Quote:All small artillery will be receiving: +10% damage multiplier -3% tracking speed so buff to RFF and Thrasher/Sabre Quote:All autocannons will receive +7.5% falloff Barrage ammo will provide a +40% falloff bonus instead of +50% buff to Rifter. Together with the changes for small lasers it seems there's an effort to make scram kiting (don't get pedantic with me) the fighting style of choice. It would be nice if some of the ships that are already way OP could get a speed nerf to bring some much needed balance. As things are looking now, Comet and RFF will be the only viable T1 frigs and that sucks. Arty were ok to begin with. They could use some help with fitting, but the changes are nice i guess. However they were uneeded. AC's They need so much more love than 7.5% base falloff increase. This is not going to fix Medium AC's or small AC's. At the end of they day, they do such little damage up close- and are anemic at range. Please don't try and hit me with 'selectable damage' as a huge pro. Because that is just simply not the case when you are kiting with AC's. These paltry changes (even on falloff boats like the stabber / vaga / cyna) Are still not going to make up for the fact that they have anemic DPS at 24+K and because of that are forced to use barrage. The barrage changes are not helping the matter, if range / dps is staying similar. While a step in the right direction, WAY more needs to be done in order to address Small and medium AC's. The only thing this change will have, is give Large AC's (Tornado and particularly the Mach) A slight boost. As long as ACs remain so heavily dependent on falloff and T1 ammo remains entirely optimal-oriented, ACs will suffer. I think the most straightforward solution to "fixing" ACs is to change projectile ammo to have bonuses/penalties to falloff instead of optimal.
My Many Misadventures
Reading Comprehension: so important it deserves it's own skillbook.
I seek to create content, not become content.
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Doctor Knuckles
Black Fox Marauders Spaceship Bebop
87
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Posted - 2015.01.23 16:23:02 -
[13] - Quote
edit: gah, ****. wrong thread lol. |
Lloyd Roses
811
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Posted - 2015.01.26 12:23:14 -
[14] - Quote
Rails are really good, beams just became pretty awesome, artillery got slightly less crappy. Yay.
Nothing that justifies not flying something with LMLs instead.
I GÖÑ Sleipnir
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Thanatos Marathon
Black Fox Marauders Spaceship Bebop
395
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Posted - 2015.01.26 16:49:58 -
[15] - Quote
Lloyd Roses wrote:Rails are really good, beams just became pretty awesome, artillery got slightly less crappy. Yay.
Nothing that justifies not flying something with LMLs instead.
1. Brawl fits suck with LMLs for the most part 2. Counter-Kite fits generally work better with a higher DPS weapon system than LMLs 3. Scram-Kite fits generally work better with a higher DPS weapons system than LMLs 4. other stuff |
Chesterfield Fancypantz
Radical Astronauts Plundering Eve WormHole Occupation and Resource Exploitation
30
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Posted - 2015.01.29 19:49:12 -
[16] - Quote
Thanatos Marathon wrote:Lloyd Roses wrote:Rails are really good, beams just became pretty awesome, artillery got slightly less crappy. Yay.
Nothing that justifies not flying something with LMLs instead. 1. Brawl fits suck with LMLs for the most part 2. Counter-Kite fits generally work better with a higher DPS weapon system than LMLs 3. Scram-Kite fits generally work better with a higher DPS weapons system than LMLs 4. other stuff
Only thing R/LMLs are good for right now is the smallgang kite.
Couple orthros picking apart noob fleets etc. |
Phaade
Perimeter Defense Systems Templis CALSF
306
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Posted - 2015.02.05 22:44:32 -
[17] - Quote
Plato Forko wrote:Quote:All small artillery will be receiving: +10% damage multiplier -3% tracking speed so buff to RFF and Thrasher/Sabre Quote:All autocannons will receive +7.5% falloff Barrage ammo will provide a +40% falloff bonus instead of +50% buff to Rifter. Together with the changes for small lasers it seems there's an effort to make scram kiting (don't get pedantic with me) the fighting style of choice. It would be nice if some of the ships that are already way OP could get a speed nerf to bring some much needed balance. As things are looking now, Comet and RFF will be the only viable T1 frigs and that sucks.
My hookbill disagrees with you.
However, I agree that ACs need more. Barrage should have stayed the same, I'd buff ROF by about 10% as well. They are "autocannons" after all.
Arty didn't change the way it needed to, fitting requirements. |
Mr Spaxi
The Bastards The Bastards.
13
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Posted - 2015.02.06 00:50:14 -
[18] - Quote
I think the 10% damage buff on arties is well placed; it's either that or reduce fitting requirements. If they reduced fitting requirements, it would make easier to fit high alpha - high tanked ships, which can be very effective in fleets and would possibly make those fleet compositions superior in an unfair way. Like this, you get a damage increase but your tank remains the same, which is a very decent buff itself. It's more of a buff to Destroyers than Frigates, but it works.
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Arla Sarain
273
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Posted - 2015.02.06 08:57:31 -
[19] - Quote
Mr Spaxi wrote:can be very effective in fleets and would possibly make those fleet compositions Such consideration is given to Artillery, but not to sentries, which can be assisted and will all fire at the same time. Oh look another drone thread.
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Mr Spaxi
The Bastards The Bastards.
15
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Posted - 2015.02.06 17:07:29 -
[20] - Quote
Well, this is a topic about projectile weapon changes, isn't it?
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Baali Tekitsu
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
665
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Posted - 2015.02.07 01:37:37 -
[21] - Quote
Im glad that fozzie already mentioned that this is not the end of the changes and that projectile ammo is finally going to be rebalanced aswell (Im looking at you Proton M), because this js from enough to make Projectiles competetitive again.
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Arla Sarain
277
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Posted - 2015.02.07 12:38:59 -
[22] - Quote
Baali Tekitsu wrote:Im glad that fozzie already mentioned that this is not the end of the changes and that projectile ammo is finally going to be rebalanced aswell (Im looking at you Proton M), because this js from enough to make Projectiles competetitive again. Where was this from? |
Baali Tekitsu
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
665
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Posted - 2015.02.07 21:42:18 -
[23] - Quote
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5462383#post5462383
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Shailagh
WTB Somalians
74
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Posted - 2015.02.08 05:43:22 -
[24] - Quote
So back in the 6month major expansion updates... they would have just wholly adjusted the weapon system. (How they did when they messed up med autocannons most recently)
Yet with the 6week ones now errrybody fell in love with.. theg just lol2% scorch nerf... barely adjust autocannon optimal... adjust barage the tiniest bit... Yet it takes at minimum 3-4 of these mini expansions to do anything of substance.
Have they done their sov/null fixes yet? Nope just jump fatigue (rest of fixes coming later TBA date...)
Have they fixed corps yet? Nope just awox fix and the 24hr corp-kick queue (rest of fixes maybe coming sometime this year..)
Have they made graphics better? Nope the PBR is a joke and devs even admitted they need to majorly rework it and redo it again over several releases lol.
I can seriosuly go on and on. Id rather have JUST ONE COMPLETE FIX/UPDATE versus all these halfass half baked fixes.
But but but we get them faster! They can now QA better cuz look how small changes affect things and make more small adjustments. .. dude stfu. Its a joke. This release schedule is all smoke and mirrors and sill ****
Also, autocannons need moar buffs. ... still and prob still after the next 3 small patch releasess coming next |
Mr Spaxi
The Bastards The Bastards.
16
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Posted - 2015.02.08 11:08:00 -
[25] - Quote
^That post is just a proof that you can't please everyone. You're in the minority, most of us are satisfied by the pace of the changes. Makes adapting to them a whole lot easier. Well, besides the jump fatigue.
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Esnaelc Sin'led
AdAstra. Beach Club Red Whines.
9
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Posted - 2015.02.08 16:14:42 -
[26] - Quote
Don't forget tiericide changes comin along. CCP might put in a buff or two to AC's like they slightly nerfed LML's.
For that comparison with Enyo / Jaguar, i believe it's an error to do it like it has been done. I concider Enyos like pure brawlers, while Jaguars are like anti-support AFs to me, less tank, but higher speed, and not 'that' bad dps when it's correctly applied. |
Arla Sarain
278
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Posted - 2015.02.08 20:10:21 -
[27] - Quote
Baali Tekitsu wrote:https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5462383#post5462383 Yeah but the balance seems to be entirely in relation to how well the Svipul does.
Kinda dumb, considering it will no doubt be better than anything else that uses A/Cs. Especially considering its bonused to MWD and has optimal bonuses, hence will likely never see A/C fits unless dual prop? |
Zarnak Wulf
Amarrian Vengeance Team Amarrica
1842
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Posted - 2015.02.09 20:22:08 -
[28] - Quote
If CCP decides to mess around with the ammo it will be very interesting. The range on the short range ammo - EMP, Fusion, Phased Plasma - will be where they desire it after this 7.5% falloff buff. The argument as I understand it is that the falloff of the intermediate ammo - depleted uranium and titanium sabot - and the long range ammo - proton, nuclear, carbonized lead - should be increased to offer an incentive to use them with autocannons.
It's a really thin line. The two intermediate ammos might be appealing if they get a range buff putting them closer to barrage in range. Twenty percent tracking bonus vs. a twenty five percent tracking penalty and only a 14% drop in DPS vs T2 ammo. Depleted Uranium also does strong thermal damage which makes it different to Barrage. It would be easy to overdo it. I really don't see the long range ammo going into AC no matter what. On the other hand a falloff buff would really do wonderful things for artillery platforms. |
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