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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 28 post(s) |
Anthar Thebess
863
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Posted - 2015.02.13 13:09:33 -
[721] - Quote
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:
To throw a question back at you. Are learning implants a significant LP sink in the economy? A set of +5s is a lot of LP that someone has spent. What economic implications would removing that sink have?
Quite big. Many players live from selling those implants in many LP stores this is the only thing actually valuable that can be sold. So this is first and very big player group impacted . Next one is traders that buy and sell stuff. Last but very active are gankers - someone have to move those implants, so they will loose potential targets. |
Leannor
Central Builders Incorporated Northern Associates.
116
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Posted - 2015.02.13 13:10:57 -
[722] - Quote
Phoenix Jones wrote:Zappity wrote:Kaely Tanniss wrote:These are all things that have to be considered by the player. It's all choice. Will you risk the expensive implants to avoid the 18hr cooldown..or will you jc to a cheap clone to avoid the loss in isk ut have to wait. This is where YOU, the player, have to weigh the risk vs reward. Risk: loss of expensive implants...reward: avoid the cooldown...
You are wrong. The fundamental argument has nothing to do with risk of losing the implants. My +5 learning clone is much cheaper than my PvP clones. It is about choosing learning speed vs in game attribute enhancement such as speed, tracking, armour etc. And this is the core of the other argument. It is about choosing learning speed vs in game attribute enhancements such as speed, tracking, armor... One gives you no practical ingame benefit except to learn faster, ala the old learning skills. The other has a actual pilot Impact benefit. you balance out the field, people can commit their game time and ISk to buying implants that will help them fly their ship. Yaay I have a training implant I spent 50 million on... But it doesn't help me fly my frigate/destroyer any better...
better and sooner are two very distinct and desriable qualities.
Just look at teh queues outside an Apple shop when iPhone6 comes out ... because you get it earlier doesn't mean you'll be any better at using it when you get it ... but, importantly, some people wish to get their before other people (in EVE this can give you an advantage).
"Lykouleon wrote:
STOP
TOUCHING
ICONIC
SHIP
PARTS"
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Anthar Thebess
863
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Posted - 2015.02.13 13:38:06 -
[723] - Quote
Don't mix RL and EVE. Eve is game , game that should give pleasure or challenge. Waiting ages for something that you need now can be only justified by ability to do something already.
New players needs lot of time before they will be able to do something.
From my perspective , new players should start with specific builds that could offer them to be : - warrior ( racial frigate and guns V) - industrialist (same for industry ) - miner ( barge from the beginning)
For new people ability to fly tech 2 frigate 5 days earlier is very important.
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Leannor
Central Builders Incorporated Northern Associates.
116
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Posted - 2015.02.13 13:40:52 -
[724] - Quote
Anthar Thebess wrote:Don't mix RL and EVE. Eve is game , game that should give pleasure or challenge. Waiting ages for something that you need now can be only justified by ability to do something already.
New players needs lot of time before they will be able to do something.
From my perspective , new players should start with specific builds that could offer them to be : - warrior ( racial frigate and guns V) - industrialist (same for industry ) - miner ( barge from the beginning)
For new people ability to fly tech 2 frigate 5 days earlier is very important.
the 'time savings' provided by implants is not massive ... it's a tiny proportion.
And, real life attitudes often find their way into a virtual reality - wether genuine or contrived - it's part of the reason why it's a virtual reality. ;)
"Lykouleon wrote:
STOP
TOUCHING
ICONIC
SHIP
PARTS"
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CCP Darwin
C C P C C P Alliance
986
|
Posted - 2015.02.13 16:59:25 -
[725] - Quote
Leannor wrote:the 'time savings' provided by implants is not massive ... it's a tiny proportion.
Implants offer about a third of the benefit of remaps. The difference between +5 implants and no implants will still typically cut a month off a year of training. I wouldn't call a little under 10% a "tiny" proportion, but it's not overwhelming either.
Regarding the economic and LP implications of the idea of removing learning implants, just wanted to reinforce that this is a very significant concern that's known to the developers on the team and that they wouldn't do it without satisfying themselves that they have a solid answer for that concern.
Finally, thanks to everyone who's posting here for carrying on a substantive and constructive discussion about the idea. That kind of tone makes it a lot easier for game designers to understand and think about everyone's arguments either way, and we appreciate the thought and time everyone's brought to this.
CCP Darwin GÇó Senior Technical Artist, EVE Online GÇó @mark_wilkins
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Serene Repose
2233
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Posted - 2015.02.13 17:38:46 -
[726] - Quote
Personally, I think +5s and 10%s offered by devs in all games...add two to your strength, add 1.8 to your endurance...is BS. Always has been. Always will be. "Not overwhelming..." Yeah, not significant, and certainly not worth what it costs to get it. I've always wondered how stupid devs think players are, then I see scads of epeeners turn it into a religious precept:
"Thou must have this or thou is fail."
Then, cry about the implant losses. Add them to gankers loot so they can swell up with a fascinating sensation of diabolical accomplishment. Even the titillation factor is miniscule - but for the other tenet:
"Simple pleasures for simple minds."
Oh yes, but if you've got the +4 implant, and he's got the +5 you're guaranteed to lose, regardless of all your training, experience, support, skills...yeah, the intellect meter is riding high with this one. +5 Whatta boost. Oh yeah. It's higher than without it.
Riiiiiiiiiiiiiight.
Treason never prospers. What is the reason?
Why, if it prospers, none dare call it "treason."
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Chance Ravinne
WiNGSPAN Delivery Services
77
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Posted - 2015.02.13 17:39:19 -
[727] - Quote
Anthar Thebess wrote:Don't mix RL and EVE. Eve is game , game that should give pleasure or challenge. Waiting ages for something that you need now can be only justified by ability to do something already.
New players needs lot of time before they will be able to do something.
From my perspective , new players should start with specific builds that could offer them to be : - warrior ( racial frigate and guns V) - industrialist (same for industry ) - miner ( barge from the beginning)
For new people ability to fly tech 2 frigate 5 days earlier is very important.
This is a genus idea.
You've just read another awesome post by Chance Ravinne, CEO of EVE's #1 torpedo delivery service. Watch our misadventures on my YouTube channel: WINGSPANTT
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Pok Nibin
Filial Pariahs
487
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Posted - 2015.02.13 17:45:00 -
[728] - Quote
Chance Ravinne wrote:Anthar Thebess wrote:Don't mix RL and EVE. Eve is game , game that should give pleasure or challenge. Waiting ages for something that you need now can be only justified by ability to do something already.
New players needs lot of time before they will be able to do something.
From my perspective , new players should start with specific builds that could offer them to be : - warrior ( racial frigate and guns V) - industrialist (same for industry ) - miner ( barge from the beginning)
For new people ability to fly tech 2 frigate 5 days earlier is very important.
This is a genus idea. Did we redefine "genius"? Send me an update. I missed that memo.
Dont fight it; Rejoin your Amarrian patriarchs; You know you want to.
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Lady Rift
What Shall We Call It
179
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Posted - 2015.02.13 17:46:13 -
[729] - Quote
CCP Darwin wrote:Leannor wrote:the 'time savings' provided by implants is not massive ... it's a tiny proportion. Implants offer about a third of the benefit of remaps. The difference between +5 implants and no implants will still typically cut a month off a year of training. I wouldn't call a little under 10% a "tiny" proportion, but it's not overwhelming either. Regarding the economic and LP implications of the idea of removing learning implants, just wanted to reinforce that this is a very significant concern that's known to the developers on the team and that they wouldn't do it without satisfying themselves that they have a solid answer for that concern. Finally, thanks to everyone who's posting here for carrying on a substantive and constructive discussion about the idea. That kind of tone makes it a lot easier for game designers to understand and think about everyone's arguments either way, and we appreciate the thought and time everyone's brought to this.
Whats the difference between +3's and +5's and then include the training time to get cybernetics from that required for lv4-5
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Gregor Parud
Ordo Ardish
1089
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Posted - 2015.02.13 17:50:19 -
[730] - Quote
Lets just accept that 0.0 CSM shills and management get their way anyway and stop bothering & caring. And that all pretence of "discussion" is just that: pretence. |
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Serene Repose
2233
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Posted - 2015.02.13 17:55:57 -
[731] - Quote
Gregor Parud wrote:Lets just accept that 0.0 CSM shills and management get their way anyway and stop bothering & caring. And that all pretence of "discussion" is just that: pretence. Now you're talkin'.
Treason never prospers. What is the reason?
Why, if it prospers, none dare call it "treason."
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Pok Nibin
Filial Pariahs
488
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Posted - 2015.02.13 18:14:05 -
[732] - Quote
There's this good movie, futuristic. Code 64. Rather than implants to boost abilities, these guys use a virus. Only one will work at a time, but, you get abilities way beyond your norm for a limited time.
See the idea here? Make implants active, like active ship modules. Let them significantly boost AN attribute for a limited time. Doesn't matter which, charm, aim, diplomacy, warpdrive. Make them task specific and exclusive. You can load the whole set, but run one at a time for say.... 24-hours.
AND, what'd be different than the virus is you can turn them off, and turn on another one. You won't have to wait for the virus to dissipate. Use them like switches.
Where EVE gets in trouble is these attributes in gaming tradition, charm/intelligence/wisdom, the standard rack, are handled through leveling - which we do not have. We could increase the attributes through study - which we do not do, rather than an annual shot at the attributes sliders...you get the idea.
EVE is using a very convoluted system to try to handle this feature. No matter how they try to implement this it'll always come out funky in some way or another. Like repairing bad plumbing, fix one leak, another appears - endlessly.
The urge is to get rid of the plumbing entirely, rather than be bothered by the reapproach and redesign. Not very bright, really.
Just a thought. I'm not begging to alter your game, so don't react like someone is trying to steal your bleggy.
Dont fight it; Rejoin your Amarrian patriarchs; You know you want to.
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Memphis Baas
159
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Posted - 2015.02.13 18:18:37 -
[733] - Quote
Another idea could be:
- remove attributes and remaps, give everyone a flat training speed
- change attribute implants to just be implants that give a bonus to training speed
- have ships give training speed bonus to the skills that are listed in their "recommended certificates" page when UNDOCKED and FLYING said ships, call it "hands-on training."
This way you can either sit in station and rely on your +5 implants, or undock and rely on your ship to give you equivalent training speed bonus as you fly it, or combine the two for even faster training but if you lose the implants that's risk vs. reward. |
Vyl Vit
1046
|
Posted - 2015.02.13 18:25:27 -
[734] - Quote
Gregor Parud wrote:Lets just accept that 0.0 CSM shills and management get their way anyway and stop bothering & caring. And that all pretence of "discussion" is just that: pretence. Judging by CSM participation on this forum of late, I'd vote for this before I'd vote for a CSM.
Anyone with any sense has already left town.
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Lady Rift
What Shall We Call It
179
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Posted - 2015.02.13 18:28:26 -
[735] - Quote
Memphis Baas wrote:Another idea could be:
- remove attributes and remaps, give everyone a flat training speed
- change attribute implants to just be implants that give a bonus to training speed
- have ships give training speed bonus to the skills that are listed in their "recommended certificates" page when UNDOCKED and FLYING said ships, call it "hands-on training."
This way you can either sit in station and rely on your +5 implants, or undock and rely on your ship to give you equivalent training speed bonus as you fly it, or combine the two for even faster training but if you lose the implants that's risk vs. reward.
cloak + sit in dead space |
Celestia Via
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc The 11th Hour Alliance
57
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Posted - 2015.02.13 18:33:24 -
[736] - Quote
Even though I agree that the attribute system needs work and that, as is made obvious by my previous posts, the learning implants are indeed useless and even reason for some not to risk PVP, I disagree with removing attributes entirely.
Even if attributes are not a meaningful mechanic they do have one important role which noone seems to have brought up. (unless I missed it somehow, in which case im sorry)
They represent character investment. Dont forget, EvE is not all about numbers and calculations, its an RPG. With characters. Character attributes and the ability to alter them (remaps) are the main thing that makes your character feel abit different and unique from others. If we abolish them, all thats left to differentiate one toon from another is the mugshot.
EvE is an impersonal game as it is, since you cant actually see the character interact with anything else than the couch in officers quarters.
Taking away even the little things that make your Brutor different from a Civire would make the characters even more impersonal and harder to relate to, i.e. "be proud of". For that matter, we could just as well be spaceships rather than people.
In my opinion EvE characters need more human - relatable (is that even a word??) traits, taking away the few already there would be a mistake.
There's no place like space
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Dominique Vasilkovsky
BFG Tech
172
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Posted - 2015.02.13 18:50:19 -
[737] - Quote
Celestia Via wrote:Even though I agree that the attribute system needs work and that, as is made obvious by my previous posts, the learning implants are indeed useless and even reason for some not to risk PVP, I disagree with removing attributes entirely.
Even if attributes are not a meaningful mechanic they do have one important role which noone seems to have brought up. (unless I missed it somehow, in which case im sorry)
They represent character investment. Dont forget, EvE is not all about numbers and calculations, its an RPG. With characters. Character attributes and the ability to alter them (remaps) are the main thing that makes your character feel abit different and unique from others. If we abolish them, all thats left to differentiate one toon from another is the mugshot.
EvE is an impersonal game as it is, since you cant actually see the character interact with anything else than the couch in officers quarters.
Taking away even the little things that make your Brutor different from a Civire would make the characters even more impersonal and harder to relate to, i.e. "be proud of". For that matter, we could just as well be spaceships rather than people.
In my opinion EvE characters need more human - relatable (is that even a word??) traits, taking away the few already there would be a mistake.
Fine leave the attributes in but decouple them from the learning speed.
Dominique Vasilkovsky EVEboard
Once known as:
Mashie Saldana sold - Anastasia Rigel sold - Monica Foulkes sold
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Celestia Via
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc The 11th Hour Alliance
57
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Posted - 2015.02.13 18:58:29 -
[738] - Quote
Dominique Vasilkovsky wrote: Fine leave the attributes in but decouple them from the learning speed.
okay, but they have to mean something ingame.
I, the average player, "need" to imagine my high strength punching your high intelligence in the face :P unless there is actually any way of that happening, a high *whatever* character is meaningless.
any suggestions?
There's no place like space
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Mara Pahrdi
The Order of Anoyia
921
|
Posted - 2015.02.13 19:00:29 -
[739] - Quote
Anthar Thebess wrote:Don't mix RL and EVE. Eve is game , game that should give pleasure or challenge. Waiting ages for something that you need now can be only justified by ability to do something already.
New players needs lot of time before they will be able to do something.
From my perspective , new players should start with specific builds that could offer them to be : - warrior ( racial frigate and guns V) - industrialist (same for industry ) - miner ( barge from the beginning)
For new people ability to lose expensive tech 2 frigates 5 days earlier is very important.
/fixed
In EVE "I want it all and I want it now" often ends in "I lost it all...".
Remove insurance.
This thread is the reason, why CCP should stop advertising any aspect of EVE PvE
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Ace Northmen
Sanctuary Reapers Holdings
5
|
Posted - 2015.02.13 19:35:14 -
[740] - Quote
I think what people fails to understand learning implants are ment to have an edge on others in training .
it gives a feeling that you are better than someone else ,who started at the same time as you, skill point wise .
removing them will beat the whole concept of i wanna risk more in order to get more advanced ships faster. |
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Rinai Vero
Moira. Villore Accords
409
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Posted - 2015.02.13 19:36:12 -
[741] - Quote
Celestia Via wrote:Even though I agree that the attribute system needs work and that, as is made obvious by my previous posts, the learning implants are indeed useless and even reason for some not to risk PVP, I disagree with removing attributes entirely.
Even if attributes are not a meaningful mechanic they do have one important role which noone seems to have brought up. (unless I missed it somehow, in which case im sorry)
They represent character investment. Dont forget, EvE is not all about numbers and calculations, its an RPG. With characters. Character attributes and the ability to alter them (remaps) are the main thing that makes your character feel abit different and unique from others. If we abolish them, all thats left to differentiate one toon from another is the mugshot.
EvE is an impersonal game as it is, since you cant actually see the character interact with anything else than the couch in officers quarters.
Taking away even the little things that make your Brutor different from a Civire would make the characters even more impersonal and harder to relate to, i.e. "be proud of". For that matter, we could just as well be spaceships rather than people.
In my opinion EvE characters need more human - relatable (is that even a word??) traits, taking away the few already there would be a mistake.
Can you ever think of a situation where your stats actually had an effect on your roleplay in EVE?
Like, say you remap all your int into cha... do you all of a sudden start auto piloting billions of isk worth of assets through known gatecamps planning on charming any hostiles?
Character sheets have no impact on EVE as an "RPG" as you are presenting it... and they shouldn't. Your *actions* in game are your roleplay, and only your actions distinguish your character. If you care about RP, how you play should reflect that regardless of your stats.
Is your Civire character a Caldari Loyalist? Probably not consistent RP to be running missions for Fed Navy LP. That's impactful to your play in a way that a Civire racial stat bonus to Wilpower vs Brutor +1 to Strengh probably never will be.
EVE doesn't need game mechanics to make characters have "more human - relatable traits." That's your job as a human who plays EVE: to portray your own character in the sandbox. |
Jane Shapperd
SUPERFLUOUS WANDERLUST Gentlemen's.Club
96
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Posted - 2015.02.13 20:07:28 -
[742] - Quote
Memphis Baas wrote:Another idea could be:
- remove attributes and remaps, give everyone a flat training speed
+ 1 i've already suggested the very same thing in my earlier post , i am just gonna quote what i wrote
Jane Shapperd wrote: A good solution would be scrap the whole re. map thing and give all characters same attributes. but keep learning implants as they are( with minor editing in slots see the end of the post ) . That way people who wants to train faster could risk more , and for those who doesn't want to risk they have jump clone choice or not injecting implants at all
Memphis Baas wrote: - change attribute implants to just be implants that give a bonus to training speed
I have already posted why it was bad idea
Jane Shapperd wrote: The problems with this having 1 implants that effect training all skills are
1- They could be more costly than having two +5 or whatever implants you use. As the current system requires you to have 2 training implants to get the max SP/hour .
2 - It removes the punishment for training some skill out with attributes other than the 2 implants u are using .
Memphis Baas wrote: - have ships give training speed bonus to the skills that are listed in their "recommended certificates" page when UNDOCKED and FLYING said ships, call it "hands-on training."
This way you can either sit in station and rely on your +5 implants, or undock and rely on your ship to give you equivalent training speed bonus as you fly it, or combine the two for even faster training but if you lose the implants that's risk vs. reward.
as it was mentioned by 2 posts older than this post clock + deep dead space afking
Again the thing with implants is concept of having an edge on others by training faster . The difference is good while being the same as any other player is bad
I think we all agree remap is bad and should be scraped or reworked so my suggestion is that all characters have the same attributes
also it would be move viable to remove the whole training learning attributes from implants that uses slot 1 to 5 ( including pirate faction implants )
Add new slots (11 and 12 ) these slots for training implants ( since it takes only 2 implants to effect a speed of training a skill) and if they are filled with learning implants you get a bonus in space based on the value the implant give to your attribute . ( i don't like the bonus idea but hey many of the posts suggested that) so at least it will be worth while to use learning implants while flying in space .
that for those who say my pvp clone worth more than my learning could use the pvp clone and learning at the same time. aka pirate faction set in 1-6 , Hardwiring 7-10 and learning 11-12 |
Memphis Baas
159
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Posted - 2015.02.13 20:21:33 -
[743] - Quote
Who is this "others" you think you have an edge on?
It's like "I'm going to buy a car so I have an edge compared to others" and you live in the New York suburbs. I suppose you can feel smug when passing the bicycle guy, but otherwise there's no edge; your car is just the average, expected thing you're supposed to have in today's world.
Meanwhile, you're arguing against free public transportation because you want to retain the choice to have an edge vs. the bicycle guy who can't get a car for whatever reason. Or because "choice is good." |
Seiko Sorrelius
Garoun Investment Bank Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2015.02.13 20:36:44 -
[744] - Quote
CCP Darwin wrote:Finally, thanks to everyone who's posting here for carrying on a substantive and constructive discussion about the idea. That kind of tone makes it a lot easier for game designers to understand and think about everyone's arguments either way, and we appreciate the thought and time everyone's brought to this.
I agree with everything that you've said thus far. I respond specifically to you because I'd rather not read 37 pages of text that probably go over the same few things 30 times, but I wanted to throw in my support for an implant and remap overhaul. Their effect on skill training being removed AND/OR replaced entirely is my ideal.
No game mechanic should ever place fun against permanent character growth: remaps.
No game mechanic should place isk loss against permanent charcter growth: attribute implants.
Isk is the lifeblood of the game and can almost directly correlate to fun, at least for the players for which attribute implants are a substantial investment.
I propose that to fix both of these issues, we detach attributes from skills and instead give them different bonuses as a traditional rpg does, but this is only one potential solution where many others could work.
I.e. perception = weapon damage, charisma = trading or industry bonus, intelligence = tank, etc. 1% per level.
Drop attribute bases down to 0. 10 allocatable points, 5 max per attribute. Essentially, attributes become powerful hardwires. Economy shouldn't change significantly, but will shift around. Remap code can be left in place. Implant code can be left in place. And primarily, skill training is no longer linked to a loss in fun. |
Aureus Ahishatsu
Deadspace Knights
83
|
Posted - 2015.02.13 21:32:15 -
[745] - Quote
So started up this topic in the features and idea's section because that's usually where future ideas are discussed I did not realize people were discussing in the general area. I had an idea though for removing attributes which i'll outline again since this forum is remaining open.
If they removed remapping and standardized all attributes to a flat value.
-It would not be fair to the people who spent time training cybernetics to 4 or 5 to suddenly have an increase in training time due to a low 'base' attribute value. -currently training cybernetics V takes over a year of training with +5's to make up for the 10+days it takes to train cybernetic V
It's for those reasons I recommend the following changes. -double the effect of all implants (2,4,6,8,10) -use standard implants (current +4) as the base to shape everything around
The end effect would be as follows assuming you currently have max mapping for a skill -improved implants users would see a slight buff to train time reducing the payoff time for cybernetics V to about half a year -standard implants users would see zero change -basic through limited implant users would see a slight increase in training time however that is only IF MAPPED PERFECTLY FOR SKILL as i'll explain below.
It may seem like the limited - basic implant users are getting a hard nerf keep in mind that nerf is ONLY if you are max mapped for a skill currently. Most people who are going for max training through aren't using these implants anyways. if you're currently mapped incorrectly or mapped evenly across all 4/5 you would still see a slight decrease in training as the base training rate would be raised across the board from the current 17points per attribute to a flat 23 across all attributes. The end result would look like this for attribute points with each implant.
improved - 33 standard - 31 basic - 29 limited beta - 27 limited - 25 none - 23
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Bones Outten
Council of Economic Advisors Liga Hanseatica
10
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Posted - 2015.02.13 21:39:11 -
[746] - Quote
CCP Darwin wrote:Gregor Parud wrote:people accept risk in this pvp centric MMO where consequences can be harsh? I'm not on the team that brought this question up with the CSM, but I do have a question for you. If your practice, normally, is to spend, say, 50 million ISK for a pod full of implants today, why would that not be your practice tomorrow, if learning implants were to be removed? Wouldn't you just spend your money on hardwirings instead, and maybe get an even larger edge in combat? Or, is your concern that learning implants would be viewed by the average player as inherently more valuable than non-learning-implants, so their willingness to spend on their pod decreases? I ask because it's not evident to me that making skill training speed independent of implants will somehow reduce the overall average value of a pod, or the average risk that a player is willing to take on its contents.
I avoid PvP purely because the implants cost as much as the ship I am flying.
o/ |
Jane Shapperd
SUPERFLUOUS WANDERLUST Gentlemen's.Club
96
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Posted - 2015.02.13 21:42:26 -
[747] - Quote
Memphis Baas wrote:Who is this "others" you think you have an edge on?
It's like "I'm going to buy a car so I have an edge compared to others" and you live in the New York suburbs. I suppose you can feel smug when passing the bicycle guy, but otherwise there's no edge; your car is just the average, expected thing you're supposed to have in today's world.
Meanwhile, you're arguing against free public transportation because you want to retain the choice to have an edge vs. the bicycle guy who can't get a car for whatever reason. Or because "choice is good."
i mean by and edge on other is that i am training faster than other pilots because i am willing to risk more.
to tie it with real world
no implants = public transportation +1 =bicycle +2 = motorcycle +3 = average car +5 = some sport or expensive ass car.
now i don't have anything public transportation nor any other choice people will use that so be it but i want to have the choice to chose one of these choices |
Aureus Ahishatsu
Deadspace Knights
83
|
Posted - 2015.02.13 21:43:06 -
[748] - Quote
Dominique Vasilkovsky wrote:baltec1 wrote:Zappity wrote:The problem with learning implants is that they don't contribute to in game activities. Having them active means you are less likely to be doing something else which other people can interact with. So when I'm in my +5 learning I'm not in my snakes, or industry, or whatever else.
Encouraging people into learning clones rather than 'interacting' clones is bad game design. Thats not the implants that entirely down to you. True but why promote a feature that makes people chose inactivity for a large percentage of the playerbase? If the option for attribute implants didn't exist people wouldn't get themselfs locked in "in the wrong clone" in the first place.
This could be helped if they introduced a different timer for jumpcloning within the same station. Say 2 hours or something. |
Gregor Parud
Ordo Ardish
1090
|
Posted - 2015.02.13 21:57:09 -
[749] - Quote
Bones Outten wrote:CCP Darwin wrote:Gregor Parud wrote:people accept risk in this pvp centric MMO where consequences can be harsh? I'm not on the team that brought this question up with the CSM, but I do have a question for you. If your practice, normally, is to spend, say, 50 million ISK for a pod full of implants today, why would that not be your practice tomorrow, if learning implants were to be removed? Wouldn't you just spend your money on hardwirings instead, and maybe get an even larger edge in combat? Or, is your concern that learning implants would be viewed by the average player as inherently more valuable than non-learning-implants, so their willingness to spend on their pod decreases? I ask because it's not evident to me that making skill training speed independent of implants will somehow reduce the overall average value of a pod, or the average risk that a player is willing to take on its contents. I avoid PvP purely because the implants cost as much as the ship I am flying. o/
You avoid it because you choose to be bad at it, your implants have nothing to do with it. |
Seiko Sorrelius
Garoun Investment Bank Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2015.02.13 22:24:14 -
[750] - Quote
Gregor Parud wrote:Bones Outten wrote:
I avoid PvP purely because the implants cost as much as the ship I am flying.
o/
You avoid it because you choose to be bad at it, your implants have nothing to do with it.
Yeah man, everyone is lying to you. You know them better than they know themselves. Good work! |
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