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Deacon Lorenzo Azir Amarr Theology Council	Posted - 2006.10.04 09:22:00 - [1] Approximately two months ago, the Order of St. Tetrimon petitioned to the Theology Council for removal of the Cross of the Sacred Throne Order from Golan Trevize, or the privileges associated with it. After much deliberation, the Council has decided to rule against the petitioners. Golan Travize will retain his medal in its full capacity. Golan Trevize has served the Empire many times, with bravery and faith in his heart. We are sure that, should his services become necessary in the future, he will not hesitate to return to us. Further petitions to this end shall result in a censure against any who would try to drive a wedge between the servants of the Empire. Grand Master Horm, I highly recommend you cease becoming involved in the affairs of more prestigious organizations and people. Such things are frowned upon in high circles. Your allegedly authentic Scriptures are still being reviewed and, until the authentication process is finished, you should refrain from getting involved in affairs that do not concern you. I will take this opportunity to return your quotation of Scripture with my own piece of wisdom: "Submission is not a sign of weakness, but a show of respect." Deacon Lorenzo Azir Theology Council

Davlos Caldari Gilead's Bullet Kimotoro Directive	Posted - 2006.10.04 09:27:00 - [2] * Davlos snickers softly at the recent piece of news. Two months. At the same time I got my pilot's license. Does it take that long for you to decide on something so simple? --------------- Lieutenant Davlos Cain Gilead's Bullet Kimotoro Directive
Jernau Gurgeh Gallente	Posted - 2006.10.04 09:28:00 - [3] My congratulations to Golan Trevize on the retention of his award. There are 10 sorts of people in the world - those who understand binary, and those who do not.
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2006.10.04 09:33:00 - [4] Whilst I do not neccessarily approve of everything that Golan Trevize has done in recent months, I do not believe that his actions warrant the cessation of his membership of the Sacred Throne Order. Well done to the Theology Council on a sensible decision. Dulce et decorum est, pro imperator mori
Verone	Posted - 2006.10.04 11:27:00 - [5] Glad to see that someone in the Empire still has some sense. Even if I disagree with the morals of the Empire, it would be a shame to see a man who has fought so hard and devoted to his cause for so long be stripped of a reward that is rightfully his. BACKSTORY AND FAN FICTION
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.10.04 11:57:00 - [6] It's useful to see how far the Empire now tolerates the peccadilloes and even outrages of capsuleers that are nominally loyal to the tottering old edifice; and further to note the prestige which the Empire acknowledges as the due of capsuleers and capsuleer organisations. The good Deacon may be quoting Scripture against the meddlesome Grand Master but I note how fitting the quotation is as an attempt by the Theology Council to justify it's own submission before a capsuleer warlord. Sadly it doesn't meet the case: the Empire is weak and its need to keep in good odour with the mercenary Trevize is a signal demonstration of this weakness. The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2006.10.04 12:04:00 - [7] Originally by: The Cosmopolite It's useful to see how far the Empire now tolerates the peccadilloes and even outrages of capsuleers that are nominally loyal to the tottering old edifice; and further to note the prestige which the Empire acknowledges as the due of capsuleers and capsuleer organisations. The good Deacon may be quoting Scripture against the meddlesome Grand Master but I note how fitting the quotation is as an attempt by the Theology Council to justify it's own submission before a capsuleer warlord. Sadly it doesn't meet the case: the Empire is weak and its need to keep in good odour with the mercenary Trevize is a signal demonstration of this weakness. The Cosmopolite Do Golan Trevize's more recent activities somehow mean that he didn't serve the Emperor for all of that time? Whilst his active support for the Empire may have been lacking since he left PIE Inc., I am not aware of him purposefully acting against its interests either. As such, I'm sure that he will continue to wear his medal with pride. Dulce et decorum est, pro imperator mori
Ithildin Gallente The Corporation	Posted - 2006.10.04 12:16:00 - [8] Originally by: Davlos * Davlos snickers softly at the recent piece of news. Two months. At the same time I got my pilot's license. Does it take that long for you to decide on something so simple? While one does not necessarily agree with the entirity of a nation's political and moral standpoint, it is still necessary to observe respect to their governmental procedures. This is particulary true when the foreign nation is an ally, as I am sure your superiors will tell you. The membership of the higher echelons in the Amarr nobility is a serious matter in the Amarrian society and as such careful deliberation is not only expected but also required. - Three years old
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.10.04 12:24:00 - [9] Originally by: Rodj Blake Do Golan Trevize's more recent activities somehow mean that he didn't serve the Emperor for all of that time? Whilst his active support for the Empire may have been lacking since he left PIE Inc., I am not aware of him purposefully acting against its interests either. The imperial service of Trevize and his mercenary activities are not in question. The question is whether or not in times gone by the Empire would have tolerated the activities of which you yourself have indicated you may disapprove or indeed tolerated the lack of active support for the Empire which you refer to. I will express the opinion, and it can be nothing more, that not so long ago, the behaviour of Trevize would have earned him extreme censure from the Empire. My purpose in saying this is not to express disregard for the warlord and mercenary himself. I am indifferent to his activities, neither approving or disapproving of them particularly. Rather, I suggest that the Empire has modified its standards in response to the increasing pressures exerted on its frail structure by the capsuleer class. This is something, for I believe it is so, in which I take great delight. The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2006.10.04 13:02:00 - [10] Originally by: The Cosmopolite Originally by: Rodj Blake Do Golan Trevize's more recent activities somehow mean that he didn't serve the Emperor for all of that time? Whilst his active support for the Empire may have been lacking since he left PIE Inc., I am not aware of him purposefully acting against its interests either. The imperial service of Trevize and his mercenary activities are not in question. The question is whether or not in times gone by the Empire would have tolerated the activities of which you yourself have indicated you may disapprove or indeed tolerated the lack of active support for the Empire which you refer to. I will express the opinion, and it can be nothing more, that not so long ago, the behaviour of Trevize would have earned him extreme censure from the Empire. My purpose in saying this is not to express disregard for the warlord and mercenary himself. I am indifferent to his activities, neither approving or disapproving of them particularly. Rather, I suggest that the Empire has modified its standards in response to the increasing pressures exerted on its frail structure by the capsuleer class. This is something, for I believe it is so, in which I take great delight. The Cosmopolite The fact is that Golan Trevize's service to the Empire was exemplary, and deserving of reward. Should capsuleers be denied any rewards available to non-capsuleers? Dulce et decorum est, pro imperator mori
Ethidium Bromide ZEALOT WARRIORS AGAINST TERRORISTS Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2006.10.04 13:31:00 - [11] Originally by: The Cosmopolite rabble rabble i am soo much better rabbel rabble The Cosmopolite oh how much i enjoyed the weeks you seemd to have vanished in some black hole.... Originally by: George Petsch Nochricht: Dei schwarer StroinlSser trifftn Karli[Baatzis] und ruiniert erm so richtig de Dosn, 1343.7 schhodn, oida. My sig is blue not pink although i can't argue with the slave part - Xorus wth whats this blue stuff all of a sudden? Did I miss a mail? -eris Bwahahahaha!11 Immy was here
Revan Neferis Amarr Dark Seraph Verisum Family	Posted - 2006.10.04 14:07:00 - [12] Originally by: Deacon Lorenzo Azir Grand Master Horm, I highly recommend you cease becoming involved in the affairs of more prestigious organizations and people. Such things are frowned upon in high circles. Your allegedly authentic Scriptures are still being reviewed and, until the authentication process is finished, you should refrain from getting involved in affairs that do not concern you. I will take this opportunity to return your quotation of Scripture with my own piece of wisdom: "Submission is not a sign of weakness, but a show of respect." Deacon Lorenzo Azir Theology Council Horm could also use this piece of advice to stop his useless attempts to declare Amarr citzens as Heretics, pretending Tetrimon have power to do such claims. Good to see that The Theology Council is aware and stoping the moves of this mad man. Revan Neferis Verisum
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2006.10.04 14:41:00 - [13] Originally by: Revan Neferis Horm could also use this piece of advice to stop his useless attempts to declare Amarr citzens as Heretics, pretending Tetrimon have power to do such claims. Good to see that The Theology Council is aware and stoping the moves of this mad man. I'm sure that the Theology Council will say so if they feel any of the Order of Saint Tetrimon, the Cult of Cathecization or the PIE Inc. Special Tribunal have made an error in a declaration of heresy. Dulce et decorum est, pro imperator mori
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.10.04 14:47:00 - [14] Originally by: Rodj Blake The fact is that Golan Trevize's service to the Empire was exemplary, and deserving of reward. Should capsuleers be denied any rewards available to non-capsuleers? No. Are you suggesting that exemplary service is an excuse for subsequent behaviour being 'lacking', as you put it, in support of the Empire? If you are, do not mistake me. I would not complain. I would, rather, find it to be further evidence of the impact of capsuleerism on the Empire and its mores. The fitness of the warlord Trevize to receive his honour at the time he did is not in question. Indeed, I have no quibble whatever with the Empire deciding that he remains fit to hold that honour. I am simply suggesting that the fact that this finding has been reached is evidence of the pressure the capsuleer class has brought to bear on the Empire simply by its very existence. Pressure shown, I would maintain, by the buckling and collapse of certain standards that the Empire would once have very stringently upheld. If you truly think that holders of the Cross of the Sacred Throne Order have always been allowed to slouch off and conduct mercenary operations, selling themselves to interests other than the Empire, and even expressing views and making veiled threats that could be interpreted as counter to the Empire's interests, without incurring any censure whatever that is your affair. I believe otherwise. The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2006.10.04 15:00:00 - [15] Edited by: Rodj Blake on 04/10/2006 15:03:49 Edited by: Rodj Blake on 04/10/2006 15:00:55 Originally by: The Cosmopolite Originally by: Rodj Blake The fact is that Golan Trevize's service to the Empire was exemplary, and deserving of reward. Should capsuleers be denied any rewards available to non-capsuleers? No. Are you suggesting that exemplary service is an excuse for subsequent behaviour being 'lacking', as you put it, in support of the Empire? If you are, do not mistake me. I would not complain. I would, rather, find it to be further evidence of the impact of capsuleerism on the Empire and its mores. The fitness of the warlord Trevize to receive his honour at the time he did is not in question. Indeed, I have no quibble whatever with the Empire deciding that he remains fit to hold that honour. I am simply suggesting that the fact that this finding has been reached is evidence of the pressure the capsuleer class has brought to bear on the Empire simply by its very existence. Pressure shown, I would maintain, by the buckling and collapse of certain standards that the Empire would once have very stringently upheld. If you truly think that holders of the Cross of the Sacred Throne Order have always been allowed to slouch off and conduct mercenary operations, selling themselves to interests other than the Empire, and even expressing views and making veiled threats that could be interpreted as counter to the Empire's interests, without incurring any censure whatever that is your affair. I believe otherwise. The Cosmopolite Please don't try to twist my words. As I'm sure Golan would be the first to explain, it's hard to defend the Emperor when there is no Emperor to defend. And the Sacred Throne Order is about just that - defending the Emperor. I'm sure that should the next Emperor require Golan's services, they will be given without question. To the best of my knowledge, Golan has not done anything to directly harm the Empire since leaving PIE Inc. In fact, I believe the worst thing that he has done was throw an insult towards a section of the loyalist paramilitary community. Whilst this was not exactly helpful, I hardly think that it cancels out the work that he has previously done. I'm sure that there are appropriate disciplinary procedures within the order for minor lapses that are conducted in private away from the eyes and ears of voyeuristic contrarians such as yourself, and that there is a scale of punishments that can be meted out. Additionally, how does finding against a pod-pilot in favour of another pod-pilot signify any sort of bias either towards or against capsuleers? Dulce et decorum est, pro imperator mori
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.10.04 16:04:00 - [16] Originally by: Rodj Blake Please don't try to twist my words. I am no more twisting your words than you are twisting mine, paramilitary. Quote: Additionally, how does finding against a pod-pilot in favour of another pod-pilot signify any sort of bias either towards or against capsuleers? In the first place, the finding was for the capsuleer warlord Golan Trevize against the petition of the Order of St. Tetrimon. That the petition was from the Order as a whole was made clear at the time of it being laid and the Theology Council has replied to it on that basis, as their announcement here makes clear. In the second place, whether the parties at issue happen to be both capsuleers or not, is not really the nub of the matter. When one party stands for a retrogression of the Empire into an even more archaic and bankrupt form than currently obtains, as is the case with the Grand Master of the Order of St. Tetrimon, be he capsuleer or not, and when the other party is a capsuleer who very freely takes advantage of all the opportunities available to a capsuleer, not allowing old dogmas to strictly bind him, then I think I am fairly able to claim that a finding for the latter is an implied acquiescence in and acknowledgement of the increasing power of the capsuleer class. The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2006.10.04 17:19:00 - [17] Quote: whether the parties at issue happen to be both capsuleers or not, is not really the nub of the matter. When one party stands for a retrogression of the Empire into an even more archaic and bankrupt form than currently obtains, as is the case with the Grand Master of the Order of St. Tetrimon, be he capsuleer or not, and when the other party is a capsuleer who very freely takes advantage of all the opportunities available to a capsuleer, not allowing old dogmas to strictly bind him, then I think I am fairly able to claim that a finding for the latter is an implied acquiescence in and acknowledgement of the increasing power of the capsuleer class. Or it may simply mean that the Theology Council accepts that taking advantage of all of the opportunites available to a capsuleer does not exclude one from promoting traditional Amarrian values. I don't expect your closed mind to be able to understand that though. Dulce et decorum est, pro imperator mori
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.10.04 17:32:00 - [18] Originally by: Rodj Blake Or it may simply mean that the Theology Council accepts that taking advantage of all of the opportunites available to a capsuleer does not exclude one from promoting traditional Amarrian values. I don't expect your closed mind to be able to understand that though. My mind is fully open to that possibility and I would welcome it. Such a policy would provide simply another opportunity for the capsuleer class to change the nature of the Empire and what constitutes Amarrian values. I might remark, and I foreswear any attempt to twist your wise words here, that if the Theology Council regards the recent activities of Golan Trevize as a model of traditional Amarrian values then the situation is even better than I could have imagined. The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2006.10.04 17:37:00 - [19] Originally by: The Cosmopolite Originally by: Rodj Blake Or it may simply mean that the Theology Council accepts that taking advantage of all of the opportunites available to a capsuleer does not exclude one from promoting traditional Amarrian values. I don't expect your closed mind to be able to understand that though. My mind is fully open to that possibility and I would welcome it. Such a policy would provide simply another opportunity for the capsuleer class to change the nature of the Empire and what constitutes Amarrian values. I might remark, and I foreswear any attempt to twist your wise words here, that if the Theology Council regards the recent activities of Golan Trevize as a model of traditional Amarrian values then the situation is even better than I could have imagined. The Cosmopolite As I feared, you have completely misunderstood what I have said. Dulce et decorum est, pro imperator mori
The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.10.04 17:50:00 - [20] Originally by: Rodj Blake As I feared, you have completely misunderstood what I have said. I had come to that conclusion about your own reading of my remarks several posts ago but courtesy gave me forebearance on the point. I consider myself absolved from that courtesy by your own boorishness. The Cosmopolite Jericho Fraction
Kular Amarr Ubiqua Seraph Aegis Militia	Posted - 2006.10.04 21:05:00 - [21] While I do not usually concern myself with the business of the Theology Council, I will say I am glad Golan Trevize has been allowed to keep a reward he earned in due service to the Empire. I can only hope he continue's to serve the interests of the Empire while he is away, and that should he be needed, return home to serve his god and people. www.AegisMilitia.com For God, Empire, and Sarum!
Golan Trevize Amarr Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2006.10.05 12:28:00 - [22] From:M-C Hydra Archon class Location:Classified. I would hereby thank the Theology Councill for ruling in my favour and i call upon Mr. Horm to publicly apologize for his insults against my honour, should he fail to do so or choose not to, then i shall not be as forgiving as Deacon Azir. Golan Trevize M-C Capital-Operations The Gallente ideals of Freedom, Liberty and Equality will be met by the Amarr realities of Lasers, Armor and Battleships.
Gaius Kador PIE Inc.	Posted - 2006.10.05 13:30:00 - [23] A most wise ruling, and while I was never in doubt of the outcome, this 'public' petition should never have been made. Consider your future actions carefully, 'Grand Master' Horm. For the Empire. ----------------------------------------------
Edward Sarum	Posted - 2006.10.05 13:52:00 - [24] I must say this outcome suprised me, it seems the Empire is slowly becoming more liberal. =============================================== Edward Sarum "God and Empire are all we need..."
Omber Zombie Gallente Frontier Technologies	Posted - 2006.10.05 14:01:00 - [25] I find it interesting that Golan being outside of an Amarrian exclusive group makes people think he is any less loyal. I have spent many hours discussing Amarrian laws and scriptures, and his love of his people shined brightly. The fact that he now sells his expertise to the highest bidder (within his own moral standards) should and has no effect on his loyalty. I believe Hardin, another highly valued member of the Amarrian people does a similar thing nowdays too. ---------------------- Buy shares through the EGSE
Arderich Bruderschaft des Wahrhaftigen	Posted - 2006.10.05 17:02:00 - [26] Golan Trevize, martial words from you in this situation are misplaced. You will not do anything versus Tetrimon as long as the decree is in effect. While many of your former comrades and sympathisants, including me, supported you during this petition, I must admit The Cosmopolite made a few arguments worth to think about. Golan, currently you are walking on very thin ice. Nevertheless congratulations for getting out of this - this time.
Ituralde Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2006.10.05 17:08:00 - [27] Very well done. At least one of the Empires is taking a step in the right direction. Fear is the mind-killer.
Ethidium Bromide ZEALOT WARRIORS AGAINST TERRORISTS Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2006.10.06 09:36:00 - [28] Originally by: Arderich Golan Trevize, martial words from you in this situation are misplaced. You will not do anything versus Tetrimon as long as the decree is in effect. While many of your former comrades and sympathisants, including me, supported you during this petition, I must admit The Cosmopolite made a few arguments worth to think about. Golan, currently you are walking on very thin ice. Nevertheless congratulations for getting out of this - this time. just out of curiosity: are you trying to cammand Golan? are you trying to threaten him? i do not think this is in place for a khanid as imperial matters are concerned here. Originally by: George Petsch Nochricht: Dei schwarer StroinlSser trifftn Karli[Baatzis] und ruiniert erm so richtig de Dosn, 1343.7 schhodn, oida. My sig is blue not pink although i can't argue with the slave part - Xorus wth whats this blue stuff all of a sudden? Did I miss a mail? -eris Bwahahahaha!11 Immy was here
Xaroth Brook Minmatar Doomcraft R i s e	Posted - 2006.10.06 12:47:00 - [29] Originally by: Arderich Golan Trevize, martial words from you in this situation are misplaced. You will not do anything versus Tetrimon as long as the decree is in effect. While many of your former comrades and sympathisants, including me, supported you during this petition, I must admit The Cosmopolite made a few arguments worth to think about. Golan, currently you are walking on very thin ice. Nevertheless congratulations for getting out of this - this time. Why try to stop the man? Let him attack the "Grand Master"... He'll be dead before he can pick up the bible and lecture him... A good Amarr is a dead one.. so let Golan be a good one.. and kill himself. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Xaroth Brook Brainiac of Doomcraft Member of R I S E
Tyrrax Thorrk Amarr Umbra Congregatio Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2006.10.06 13:05:00 - [30] Originally by: Arderich Golan Trevize, martial words from you in this situation are misplaced. You will not do anything versus Tetrimon as long as the decree is in effect. While many of your former comrades and sympathisants, including me, supported you during this petition, I must admit The Cosmopolite made a few arguments worth to think about. Golan, currently you are walking on very thin ice. Nevertheless congratulations for getting out of this - this time. "Shortly after the delivery of the report, the Privy Council released a statement in which it re-opens Amarrian space for the Order of St. Tetrimon once more. "From this day, the Order of St. Tetrimon shall no longer be banished from the Empire. Their Exile is over, for now." And where exactly in the statement of the Privy Council do you see anything about it being forbidden to kill them ? The simple fact they aren't outlaws does not give them the right to offend and insidiously undermine the stability of the Empire without anyone being "allowed" to respond. Since when does "not an outlaw" mean a blow against youis a blow against the Empire ? What makes them so special apart from having been outlaws before ? I'll also remind you of this part of the statement; "We urge the members of the Order to act in accordance with Amarrian law and refrain from trying to subvert the authority of the Emperor and this Council. Until such a time where an Emperor once again sits on the Throne of Amarr and the Theology council finishes their research, the Edict's suspension may be made permanent, or it may be reversed. It is in the Order's hands." The Tetrimon have on multiple occasions shown themselves to be insidious and seditious traitors to the Empire, they have no special rights, so frankly Golan will do whatever he pleases versus the Tetrimon, just like he would with any other Amarrian. http://eve.klaki.net/

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