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Caleb Seremshur
The Atomic Fallout Kids
484
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Posted - 2015.02.23 11:01:18 -
[1] - Quote
Seriously why does this still happen? They're launched from external bays they have no excuse for going the wrong direction. I have been robbed of yet another 2 kills tonight because of this farce. Hundreds of lost volleys due to this crap.
Faction warfare pilot and solo/small gang PVP advocate
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Ferni Ka'Nviiou
Republic University Minmatar Republic
6094
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Posted - 2015.02.23 11:08:28 -
[2] - Quote
Caleb Seremshur wrote:Seriously why does this still happen? They're launched from external bays they have no excuse for going the wrong direction. I have been robbed of yet another 2 kills tonight because of this farce. Hundreds of lost volleys due to this crap. The animation does not represent what your missiles are doing.
Your missiles are calculated to come from the centre of your ship, and using the missile's velocity, will hit your target.
If your target is in just in range, but moving away, then guess what? Your missile are going to miss probably.
Once again, the animation has no effect whatsoever, in any way to how the range for missiles is calculated. It's the same regardless of what side they launch from.
Just remember, whenever you see a Carrier die to a Drifter... well....
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Caleb Seremshur
The Atomic Fallout Kids
484
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Posted - 2015.02.23 11:11:59 -
[3] - Quote
I'm going to require a citation for that. I'm prepared to admit I am wrong but I've never read anything to suggest that you're correct and I know the missile game pretty well.
Faction warfare pilot and solo/small gang PVP advocate
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War Kitten
Panda McLegion
5867
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Posted - 2015.02.23 11:24:04 -
[4] - Quote
Missiles also have to accelerate, so their range is a tad shy of the math results of flight-time x max_velocity.
If your target is moving away from you, your missiles have to travel farther than the distance between your ships.
If your target is orbiting you, your missiles travel a curved path to intercept.
All these things tend to indicate that missiles are best used several km inside their max range, not at the absolute edge.
If you need citation for these things, do a little searching. I'm not worried whether you believe me or not.
I find that without a good mob to provide one for them, most people would have no mentality at all.
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Another Posting Alt
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
63
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Posted - 2015.02.23 11:24:18 -
[5] - Quote
picard_facpalm.gif |
Hasikan Miallok
Republic University Minmatar Republic
1410
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Posted - 2015.02.23 11:30:04 -
[6] - Quote
Animation and game mechanics are loosely related if at all.
Many people fail to realise this - as evidenced by the number of players that still think the cloak/MJD trick is a thing. |
Ryder 'ook
Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
125
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Posted - 2015.02.23 11:30:35 -
[7] - Quote
Because I'm so nice...
Every atom in our bodies was forged in the furnace of ancient stars - it's time we return home.
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Ro Fenrios
Armilies corporation Skeleton Crew.
52
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Posted - 2015.02.23 11:32:35 -
[8] - Quote
With that logic, running eve on lowest possible graphic settings would mean missiles are useless since no animation. |
Yarda Black
Militaris Industries Northern Coalition.
564
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Posted - 2015.02.23 12:01:18 -
[9] - Quote
Your missiles can go in any direction. It doesn't matter. What does is the location, speed and sigradius of your target when the missile hit. You're ship is a sphere. What your missiles do inside that sphere before heading of to your target makes no difference. Pure stat-based thing.
Hasikan Miallok wrote: as evidenced by the number of players that still think the cloak/MJD trick is a thing. What do you mean? Could you explain why the MWD-cloak trick doesn't really exist?
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Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
1929
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Posted - 2015.02.23 12:13:58 -
[10] - Quote
Animation is a client side rendering of the vectors server side. Hence why ships can warp sideways when webbed, because the client only renders their turn at a certain rate. |
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Hasikan Miallok
Republic University Minmatar Republic
1410
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Posted - 2015.02.23 12:14:04 -
[11] - Quote
Yarda Black wrote:Hasikan Miallok wrote: as evidenced by the number of players that still think the cloak/MJD trick is a thing. What do you mean? Could you explain why the MWD-cloak trick doesn't really exist?
The MWD/Cloak trick is a thing and works.
The MJD/Cloak trick is not a thing and only appears to work. You look cloaked in the animation but are actually not once you activate the MJD.
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Nicolai Serkanner
Jebediah Kerman's Junkyard and Spaceship Parts Co. Brave Collective
283
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Posted - 2015.02.23 12:14:33 -
[12] - Quote
Caleb Seremshur wrote:Seriously why does this still happen? They're launched from external bays they have no excuse for going the wrong direction. I have been robbed of yet another 2 kills tonight because of this farce. Hundreds of lost volleys due to this crap.
0/10 troll |
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
23074
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Posted - 2015.02.23 15:55:12 -
[13] - Quote
Hasikan Miallok wrote:Yarda Black wrote:Hasikan Miallok wrote: as evidenced by the number of players that still think the cloak/MJD trick is a thing. What do you mean? Could you explain why the MWD-cloak trick doesn't really exist? The MWD/Cloak trick is a thing and works. The MJD/Cloak trick is not a thing and only appears to work. You look cloaked in the animation but are actually not once you activate the MJD. To clarify; to activate any module, you need to have broken gate cloak, you become visible on the overview the moment you move regardless of what the cloak animation says. Unlike a MWD a MJD has a spoolup time, during which you are visible.
"Remember, as a non-combatant, your best tank is being elsewhere." ~ Abrazzar
Nil mortifi sine lucre.
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Aralyn Cormallen
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
764
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Posted - 2015.02.23 16:44:30 -
[14] - Quote
Caleb Seremshur wrote:they have no excuse for going the wrong direction.
You haven't got Defenders or FoF's loaded have you?
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Sebastian N Cain
Aliastra Gallente Federation
256
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Posted - 2015.02.23 17:55:14 -
[15] - Quote
DON'T LISTEN TO THEM! THEY ARE ALL LIARS!!
The sad truth is: Your missiles are a bunch of dirty cowards, running away from battle.
I got lost in thought... it was unfamiliar territory.
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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
4628
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Posted - 2015.02.23 18:59:27 -
[16] - Quote
Caleb Seremshur wrote:I'm going to require a citation for that. I'm prepared to admit I am wrong but I've never read anything to suggest that you're correct and I know the missile game pretty well. Missile animations were added in Inferno, yet missiles were in use well before that
Probably the first major missile change behind the scenes was for compact torpedoes becoming turret-like to avoid melting the server during supercap fleet fights.
Heck there are no ships in EVE. Everything is a sphere with a velocity vector. Not to be confused with model collision surfaces (also spheres).
The EVE physics engine is called "Destiny". A few dev blogs with that keyword in them:
http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/fixing-lag-drakes-of-destiny-part-1-1/ http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/facing-destiny/ http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/more-balancing-changes-for-revelations-2.2/ http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/speed-rebalanced/ http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/gridlock-monikers-and-cpu-per-user-1/ |
Serene Repose
2294
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Posted - 2015.02.23 20:29:45 -
[17] - Quote
Sebastian N Cain wrote:DON'T LISTEN TO THEM! THEY ARE ALL LIARS!!
The sad truth is: Your missiles are a bunch of dirty cowards, running away from battle. I recruit only the best of missiles. A cute trick is to watch the hit/miss data in relation to the animation. I've always thought it interesting I register hits while missiles are still on their way. Then, you may be losing track of which missile is which. It's not as bad as trying to figure out which bullet from your machine gun hit the aorta - the 1,397th or the 1,398th, I guess. But, it's still not easy.
Don't recruit your missiles from bars.
Treason never prospers. What is the reason?
Why, if it prospers, none dare call it "treason."
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Vyl Vit
1062
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Posted - 2015.02.23 20:31:41 -
[18] - Quote
I can't believe this. Really.
Anyone with any sense has already left town.
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Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
20001
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Posted - 2015.02.23 20:39:43 -
[19] - Quote
Have you taken into account the drag induced upon the missiles by space gravy?
What about the backpressure on the launchers also due to the space gravy?
Are you buying the missiles from a less-than-reputable dealer?
How do you know they aren't half loads that use sand as ballast?
Did you check the 'use by' or 'best if used by' date on the missiles before you loaded them?
Have you leveled up your missile bay crew from 'novice' to 'veteran' through to LP store yet?
Do you have a Missile Tracking Enhancer II activated, and if so, scripted?
Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
Vote Sabriz Adoudel for CSM 10!
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Pok Nibin
Filial Pariahs
525
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Posted - 2015.02.23 21:35:23 -
[20] - Quote
The OP is just confused as to how these things work. The missile's engine fires up, then the launcher lets go suddenly, and woosh! No. The launcher sort of just poofs the missile away from the ship, THEN the missiles engine fires up and woosh, off it goes. So, the missile isn't going in any wrong direction. The launcher is working as intended. You just watched too many TV shows and movies pretending they know how missiles work. The missile launcher isn't a pistol.
Imagine it like this, you're in a small spaceship (compared to the size of a planet - small) and you fire up a missile engine right there on your ship. You can see the problem with that, with all those flames and hot gasses in such a confined area that's pressurized, no less. You do it over and over and over again, and your crew will pretty much be risking the vacuum of space rather than stay in that environment. Any oxygen you think you had, for instance...you see what I mean. The solution then is to start the missile's engine when it's outSIDE the ship - not inside.
I think the animation is pretty good, really. I just spent two hours grabbing screenies of missile launches from a Fleet Phoon. I'm going to make a video of it when I get the location and camera angles worked out.
Dont fight it; Rejoin your Amarrian patriarchs; You know you want to.
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Yarda Black
Militaris Industries Northern Coalition.
566
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Posted - 2015.02.24 10:03:37 -
[21] - Quote
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:Hasikan Miallok wrote:Yarda Black wrote:Hasikan Miallok wrote: as evidenced by the number of players that still think the cloak/MJD trick is a thing. What do you mean? Could you explain why the MWD-cloak trick doesn't really exist? The MWD/Cloak trick is a thing and works. The MJD/Cloak trick is not a thing and only appears to work. You look cloaked in the animation but are actually not once you activate the MJD. To clarify; to activate any module, you need to have broken gate cloak, you become visible on the overview the moment you move regardless of what the cloak animation says. Unlike a MWD a MJD has a spoolup time, during which you are visible.
Thanx for the explanation. I misread MJD for MWD. It never occurred to me to use the MJD this way. From what I read, a good thing :)
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Belt Scout
Thread Lockaholics Anonymous
738
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Posted - 2015.02.24 15:23:27 -
[22] - Quote
Caleb Seremshur wrote:I'm going to require a citation for that. I'm prepared to admit I am wrong but I've never read anything to suggest that you're correct and I know the missile game pretty well.
This is the Forums. Only exact precise facts are presented here. That is all you should need.
.
They say most of your brain shuts down on the EvE forums. All but the impatient side, and the sarcastic side. No wonder I'm still awake.
**This IS my main so STFU.
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Serene Repose
2303
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Posted - 2015.02.24 20:44:08 -
[23] - Quote
Caleb Seremshur wrote:I'm going to require a citation for that. I'm prepared to admit I am wrong but I've never read anything to suggest that you're correct and I know the missile game pretty well. The Giant Book of EVE, vol. III, sec. A, Chapter 17, para. 83, "All digital data transference and calcluation results are done apart from the animation." -Lord EVE 1337 Guy-
Lord EVE 1337 Guy is a much revered EVE factoid creator and historian. Wikileaks has been after him for years.
Treason never prospers. What is the reason?
Why, if it prospers, none dare call it "treason."
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Lugh Crow-Slave
790
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Posted - 2015.02.25 06:41:19 -
[24] - Quote
Hasikan Miallok wrote:Animation and game mechanics are loosely related if at all.
Many people fail to realise this - as evidenced by the number of players that still think the cloak/MJD trick is a thing.
this has nothing to do with animation but the fact that you are untargetable when you are doing the acceleration and once you are targetable you are already warping
Fuel block colors? Missiles for Caldari T3?
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Ma'Baker McCandless
The McCandless Clan
36
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Posted - 2015.02.25 09:12:32 -
[25] - Quote
MJD has what to do with missiles? |
Ferni Ka'Nviiou
Republic University Minmatar Republic
6465
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Posted - 2015.02.25 09:18:10 -
[26] - Quote
Ma'Baker McCandless wrote:MJD has what to do with missiles? Animation not representing what is actually happening.
Just remember, whenever you see a Carrier die to a Drifter... well....
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Ma'Baker McCandless
The McCandless Clan
37
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Posted - 2015.02.25 09:19:32 -
[27] - Quote
Ferni Ka'Nviiou wrote:Ma'Baker McCandless wrote:MJD has what to do with missiles? Animation not representing what is actually happening.
In what way does the animation not represent either of these things? |
Ferni Ka'Nviiou
Republic University Minmatar Republic
6471
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Posted - 2015.02.25 09:44:44 -
[28] - Quote
Ma'Baker McCandless wrote:Ferni Ka'Nviiou wrote:Ma'Baker McCandless wrote:MJD has what to do with missiles? Animation not representing what is actually happening. In what way does the animation not represent either of these things? sigh...
With regards to missiles, a quick reference to the OP will tell you exactly what. Depending on what missile bay is activated, the missile will appear to fly away from the ship first, before correcting its path towards the target.
In reality, the missile is calculated to go straight from your ship to the target.
As for Micro-Jump Drives, you could also look back just a few posts, and see what was being discussed. When you activate your MJD and then Cloak, the animation tells you that your ship is cloaked.
In reality, a module is active, and you are thus not cloaked.
Just remember, whenever you see a Carrier die to a Drifter... well....
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Ma'Baker McCandless
The McCandless Clan
37
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Posted - 2015.02.25 09:53:09 -
[29] - Quote
Ferni Ka'Nviiou wrote: sigh...
With regards to missiles, a quick reference to the OP will tell you exactly what. Depending on what missile bay is activated, the missile will appear to fly away from the ship first, before correcting its path towards the target.
This is what its supposed to do. How is this not representative?
Ferni Ka'Nviiou wrote: As for Micro-Jump Drives, you could also look back just a few posts, and see what was being discussed. When you activate your MJD and then Cloak, the animation tells you that your ship is cloaked.
In reality, a module is active, and you are thus not cloaked.
And you appear on sensors, a visual delay is to be expected with this type of device.
Sigh yourself, these animations reflect what is supposed to be happening. |
Serene Repose
2307
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Posted - 2015.02.25 13:01:22 -
[30] - Quote
Ma'Baker McCandless wrote:Sigh yourself, these animations reflect what is supposed to be happening. This, of course, is a matter of opinion. I assume you take your opinion as fact.
Of course, you switch from "represent" to "reflect" as thought they're interchangeable. I don't think they are.
Treason never prospers. What is the reason?
Why, if it prospers, none dare call it "treason."
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