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Privateer Cove
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2015.03.04 21:41:47 -
[1] - Quote
Apparently i can't post in idea's and suggestions due to being on trial. So, i'll do it right here.
So i saw the Retribution Trailer for EVE online, and well who doesn't want to be a bounty-hunter. As I'm currently training towards a Manticore i was sadly disappointed in hearing the mechanics of the bounty system. So i figured CCP's game designers needed a bit of help.
They got the idea right in regards to linking the bounty payment towards character assets, but yet have seem to come up with a rather soft-core approach.
[img]http://s18.postimg.org/on48rm1ph/Bounty_system_overhaul_42wswud3.jpg[/img]
If the flowchart is not clear, let me know so i can clarify.
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Cannibal Kane
Snuggle Society Snuggle Society.
4804
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Posted - 2015.03.04 21:57:02 -
[2] - Quote
I suggest you play the game further before thinking up ideas.
By simply allowing players to hunt down players freely that has a bounty will cause complete anarchy. People like me will have a field day.
So I am not going to say why your idea is bad, but only ask that you actually play the game and you will realize why your idea is bad.
"Kane is the End Boss of Highsec." -Psychotic Monk
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Paranoid Loyd
4019
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Posted - 2015.03.04 22:02:21 -
[3] - Quote
Cannibal Kane wrote:I suggest you play the game further before thinking up ideas.
By simply allowing players to hunt down players freely that has a bounty will cause complete anarchy. People like me will have a field day.
So I am not going to say why your idea is bad, but only ask that you actually play the game and you will realize why your idea is bad. Couldn't have said it better myself.
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
Fix the Prospect!!!
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J'Poll
Green Skull LLC
5912
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Posted - 2015.03.04 22:09:56 -
[4] - Quote
Amen brother Kane...
Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy
Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded
Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
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Privateer Cove
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2015.03.04 22:27:06 -
[5] - Quote
As the first chart says, legal bounty placement. Therefore, it would be common sense to only place said 'legal bounties' on pilots with negative security status.
But i thank you for pointing out the obvious, after all, to some it is not so obvious. |
Cannibal Kane
Snuggle Society Snuggle Society.
4805
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Posted - 2015.03.04 22:35:29 -
[6] - Quote
Privateer Cove wrote:As the first chart says, legal bounty placement. Therefore, it would be common sense to only place said 'legal bounties' on pilots with negative security status.
But i thank you for pointing out the obvious, after all, to some it is not so obvious.
Well considering that you can already shoot freely at -5 and below characters what is your point then or the point?
Your idea also says nothing about negative sec status chars.
I have a positive sec status and a bounty of over 2 Billion ISK on me. Very few people will try and claim that bounty and even then it is not a simple matter of just attacking me.
"Kane is the End Boss of Highsec." -Psychotic Monk
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Paranoid Loyd
4019
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Posted - 2015.03.04 22:38:56 -
[7] - Quote
Sec status does not determine if you are bad or good. It may be an indicator, but some of the most dangerous people I know have a sec status of 5.0 or just below it.
Kane is arguably one of the most dangerous people around and he currently has a positive sec status.
I currently have a -4.2 sec status but in a day or two it will be back to .05.
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
Fix the Prospect!!!
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Privateer Cove
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2015.03.04 22:57:57 -
[8] - Quote
Cannibal Kane wrote:Privateer Cove wrote:As the first chart says, legal bounty placement. Therefore, it would be common sense to only place said 'legal bounties' on pilots with negative security status.
But i thank you for pointing out the obvious, after all, to some it is not so obvious. Well considering that you can already shoot freely at -5 and below characters what is your point then or the point? Your idea also says nothing about negative sec status chars. I have a positive sec status and a bounty of over 2 Billion ISK on me. Very few people will try and claim that bounty and even then it is not a simple matter of just attacking me.
Right you are, that would mean the defining factor is what is a legal bounty and what is an illegal bounty. Of course the mathematical implication of defining those factors is infinite. Therefore security status is taken as a standard. I will adjust the flow chart accordingly and be more concrete.
I'm sure people would be interested in trying there hand on a 2B ISK payout. Of course the aftermath would be is that they can't show there faces in high-sec anymore to a certain extent. Also, the risk of them attacking you is one they have to decide for themselves if its worth it or not.
This would make bounty-hunting a dependable career path, yet still it depends on user generated content for the most part.
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Orlacc
824
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Posted - 2015.03.04 23:03:26 -
[9] - Quote
I am sure you are a swell guy, but as stated you will need to play a bit before any suggestions will be taken seriously. That, and the fact that CCP and we players have been trying for years to come up with a system that works.
Yours would not.
"Measure Twice, Cut Once."
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Privateer Cove
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2015.03.04 23:04:39 -
[10] - Quote
Paranoid Loyd wrote:Sec status does not determine if you are bad or good. It may be an indicator, but some of the most dangerous people I know have a sec status of 5.0 or just below it.
Kane is arguably one of the most dangerous people around and he currently has a positive sec status.
I currently have a -4.2 sec status but in a day or two it will be back to .05.
I understand your point, but you have to draw the line somewhere when re-designing a mechanic. Currently the line is drawn at a % of active asset pay-out. Regardless of that, bounty-hunting if lucrative comes with its risks.
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Steppa Musana
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
25
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Posted - 2015.03.04 23:06:45 -
[11] - Quote
Paranoid Loyd wrote:Kane is arguably one of the most dangerous people around and he currently has a positive sec status Lol. Where do you guys come up with this nonsense, seriously?
I hear this all the time about Kane, from people like you who have no business making that claim. You sit around at the same gate every day doing the exact same thing and somehow you are an authority on the most dangerous pilots.... Yeah, right. Authority on bot aspirancy maybe.
Arguably one the most dangerous people around... Sorry but killing 50-60 carebears a month in a T3 doesnt make him dangerous. There are people that will solo multiple PVP ships and come out on top, consistently. They are dangerous. Blowing up miners or failfit missioners while in a T3 doesn't make you anything but some random pirate.
I mean no offense to you Kane, you seem like a swell guy, Im just tired of hearing this ridiculous claim about you from the highsec grief community. Just another part of the hive mind they are all connected to. |
Privateer Cove
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2015.03.04 23:10:30 -
[12] - Quote
Orlacc wrote:I am sure you are a swell guy, but as stated you will need to play a bit before any suggestions will be taken seriously. That, and the fact that CCP and we players have been trying for years to come up with a system that works.
Yours would not.
I'm sure you're a swell guy as well all though that opinion is entirely subjective. I'll ask you kindly to stick to constructive feedback.
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Paranoid Loyd
4020
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Posted - 2015.03.04 23:10:59 -
[13] - Quote
I make you mad and you decide to put a bounty on me. You are really mad and want me dead so you put a 1 bil isk bounty on me. When you put the 1 bil isk bounty on me I get in a hauler load it with loot that has been manipulated to inflate it's value so the system thinks it is worth 1 bil isk, I then kill my self with an alt and collect your isk.
You have to design a system that can not be manipulated to kill one's self for profit. This is the whole issue with the bounty mechanic.
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
Fix the Prospect!!!
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Cannibal Kane
Snuggle Society Snuggle Society.
4806
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Posted - 2015.03.04 23:13:36 -
[14] - Quote
Steppa Musana wrote:Paranoid Loyd wrote:Kane is arguably one of the most dangerous people around and he currently has a positive sec status Lol. Where do you guys come up with this nonsense, seriously? I hear this all the time about Kane, from people like you who have no business making that claim. You sit around at the same gate every day doing the exact same thing and somehow you are an authority on the most dangerous pilots.... Yeah, right. Authority on bot aspirancy maybe. Arguably one the most dangerous people around... Sorry but killing 50-60 carebears a month in a T3 doesnt make him dangerous. There are people that will solo multiple PVP ships and come out on top, consistently. They are dangerous. Blowing up miners or failfit missioners while in a T3 doesn't make you anything but some random pirate. I mean no offense to you Kane, you seem like a swell guy, Im just tired of hearing this ridiculous claim about you from the highsec grief community. Just another part of the hive mind they are all connected to.
Yep I hear that a lot as well to.
But I guess it comes from the fact in the past that is what happened. I use to post stories about engaging people outnumbered and winning. in the end though what actually happens is reputation and less people want to try and engage you so you end up killing the idiots.
I think the last real fight I had was a few month ago, it was a 12 vs me. They lost 8 ships and the rest ran.
but let's not derail this bad idea thread.
"Kane is the End Boss of Highsec." -Psychotic Monk
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Privateer Cove
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2015.03.04 23:20:23 -
[15] - Quote
Paranoid Loyd wrote:I make you mad and you decide to put a bounty on me. You are really mad and want me dead so you put a 1 bil isk bounty on me. When you put the 1 bil isk bounty on me I get in a hauler load it with loot that has been manipulated to inflate it's value so the system thinks it is worth 1 bil isk, I then kill my self with an alt and collect your isk.
You have to design a system that can not be manipulated to kill one's self for profit. This is the whole issue with the bounty mechanic.
As the chart says, a bounty pay out cannot be extracted if the character in question with a bounty has been captured that does not have the required assets available. Therefore, destroying yourself would equal stealing from yourself. And as long the bounty is not paid in full, all assets of the character in question are frozen. Which means, ALL assets are basically compounded and liquified in statis untill the bounty payment has been reached.
Come on people, this ain't rocket science. |
Cannibal Kane
Snuggle Society Snuggle Society.
4806
|
Posted - 2015.03.04 23:26:35 -
[16] - Quote
Privateer Cove wrote:Paranoid Loyd wrote:I make you mad and you decide to put a bounty on me. You are really mad and want me dead so you put a 1 bil isk bounty on me. When you put the 1 bil isk bounty on me I get in a hauler load it with loot that has been manipulated to inflate it's value so the system thinks it is worth 1 bil isk, I then kill my self with an alt and collect your isk.
You have to design a system that can not be manipulated to kill one's self for profit. This is the whole issue with the bounty mechanic. As the chart says, a bounty pay out cannot be extracted if the character in question with a bounty has been captured that does not have the required assets available. Therefore, destroying yourself would equal stealing from yourself. And as long the bounty is not paid in full, all assets of the character in question are frozen. Which means, ALL assets are basically compounded and liquified in statis untill the bounty payment has been reached. Come on people, this ain't rocket science.
I think you are missing Loyd point.
So I will once again state, play the game, learn the game and you will understand.
I am removing myself from this conversation since I can see this will just keep going in circles.
o/ Enjoy.
EDIT: This should maybe be moved by the ISD out of here and into F&I so the forum trolls can tear you apart.
"Kane is the End Boss of Highsec." -Psychotic Monk
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Privateer Cove
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2015.03.04 23:40:08 -
[17] - Quote
Cannibal Kane wrote:Privateer Cove wrote:Paranoid Loyd wrote:I make you mad and you decide to put a bounty on me. You are really mad and want me dead so you put a 1 bil isk bounty on me. When you put the 1 bil isk bounty on me I get in a hauler load it with loot that has been manipulated to inflate it's value so the system thinks it is worth 1 bil isk, I then kill my self with an alt and collect your isk.
You have to design a system that can not be manipulated to kill one's self for profit. This is the whole issue with the bounty mechanic. As the chart says, a bounty pay out cannot be extracted if the character in question with a bounty has been captured that does not have the required assets available. Therefore, destroying yourself would equal stealing from yourself. And as long the bounty is not paid in full, all assets of the character in question are frozen. Which means, ALL assets are basically compounded and liquified in statis untill the bounty payment has been reached. Come on people, this ain't rocket science. I think you are missing Loyd point. So I will once again state, play the game, learn the game and you will understand. I am removing myself from this conversation since I can see this will just keep going in circles. o/ Enjoy. EDIT: This should maybe be moved by the ISD out of here and into F&I so the forum trolls can tear you apart.
The point that Loyd has, is having a bounty paid in full was in the the past vulnerable to exploitation.
I'll explain it simple, basically the character in question has to match the bounty with his own assets. When he does, it gets compounded and basically is "Removed from the game". But the sum of bounties paid, gets re-directed to the bounty hunter.
So when an "alt" captures the target in question. He basically trades assets of his character for a bounty.
To simplify it even further, you have to match the bounty with your own assets. |
Paranoid Loyd
4020
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Posted - 2015.03.04 23:55:13 -
[18] - Quote
Steppa Musana wrote:Paranoid Loyd wrote:Kane is arguably one of the most dangerous people around and he currently has a positive sec status Lol. Where do you guys come up with this nonsense, seriously? I hear this all the time about Kane, from people like you who have no business making that claim. You sit around at the same gate every day doing the exact same thing and somehow you are an authority on the most dangerous pilots.... Yeah, right. Authority on bot aspirancy maybe. Arguably one the most dangerous people around... Sorry but killing 50-60 carebears a month in a T3 doesnt make him dangerous. There are people that will solo multiple PVP ships and come out on top, consistently. They are dangerous. Blowing up miners or failfit missioners while in a T3 doesn't make you anything but some random pirate. I mean no offense to you Kane, you seem like a swell guy, Im just tired of hearing this ridiculous claim about you from the highsec grief community. Just another part of the hive mind they are all connected to.
Confirming this is my only character and I don't do anything but sit at a gate all day. With that logic you have no roll in the game besides forum shiptoaster.
My claim about him being one of the most dangerous pilots has nothing to do with the way I play the game or my ability to gather intel sitting at a gate. (That being said, you would be surprised how much intel you can gain just sitting at a gate)
He is dangerous because of his knowledge of the game and his use of the mechanics, he is also a man of his word instead of someone who just spews garbage all day without doing anything about it. The reason I use the term "one of the most dangerous" is he has done most of what he has done solo in a game that is designed to not be easy solo. Not to mention he has a reputation that precedes him due to his ability to generate content. He may not be the greatest pilot or have as many shiny kills as you would (in your opinion) expect for someone to be properly labeled as dangerous but there is a lot more to being considered dangerous than having a kill board that only has shiny kills.
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
Fix the Prospect!!!
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Paranoid Loyd
4020
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Posted - 2015.03.04 23:56:53 -
[19] - Quote
Privateer Cove wrote:Cannibal Kane wrote:Privateer Cove wrote:Paranoid Loyd wrote:I make you mad and you decide to put a bounty on me. You are really mad and want me dead so you put a 1 bil isk bounty on me. When you put the 1 bil isk bounty on me I get in a hauler load it with loot that has been manipulated to inflate it's value so the system thinks it is worth 1 bil isk, I then kill my self with an alt and collect your isk.
You have to design a system that can not be manipulated to kill one's self for profit. This is the whole issue with the bounty mechanic. As the chart says, a bounty pay out cannot be extracted if the character in question with a bounty has been captured that does not have the required assets available. Therefore, destroying yourself would equal stealing from yourself. And as long the bounty is not paid in full, all assets of the character in question are frozen. Which means, ALL assets are basically compounded and liquified in statis untill the bounty payment has been reached. Come on people, this ain't rocket science. I think you are missing Loyd point. So I will once again state, play the game, learn the game and you will understand. I am removing myself from this conversation since I can see this will just keep going in circles. o/ Enjoy. EDIT: This should maybe be moved by the ISD out of here and into F&I so the forum trolls can tear you apart. The point that Loyd has, is having a bounty paid in full was in the the past vulnerable to exploitation. I'll explain it simple, basically the character in question has to match the bounty with his own assets. When he does, it gets compounded and basically is "Removed from the game". But the sum of bounties paid, gets re-directed to the bounty hunter. So when an "alt" captures the target in question. He basically trades assets of his character for a bounty. To simplify it even further, you have to match the bounty with your own assets. Did you not see the part about manipulating the market to artificially inflate the value of said assets?
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
Fix the Prospect!!!
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Privateer Cove
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2015.03.05 00:16:28 -
[20] - Quote
Paranoid Loyd wrote:Privateer Cove wrote:Cannibal Kane wrote:Privateer Cove wrote:Paranoid Loyd wrote:I make you mad and you decide to put a bounty on me. You are really mad and want me dead so you put a 1 bil isk bounty on me. When you put the 1 bil isk bounty on me I get in a hauler load it with loot that has been manipulated to inflate it's value so the system thinks it is worth 1 bil isk, I then kill my self with an alt and collect your isk.
You have to design a system that can not be manipulated to kill one's self for profit. This is the whole issue with the bounty mechanic. As the chart says, a bounty pay out cannot be extracted if the character in question with a bounty has been captured that does not have the required assets available. Therefore, destroying yourself would equal stealing from yourself. And as long the bounty is not paid in full, all assets of the character in question are frozen. Which means, ALL assets are basically compounded and liquified in statis untill the bounty payment has been reached. Come on people, this ain't rocket science. I think you are missing Loyd point. So I will once again state, play the game, learn the game and you will understand. I am removing myself from this conversation since I can see this will just keep going in circles. o/ Enjoy. EDIT: This should maybe be moved by the ISD out of here and into F&I so the forum trolls can tear you apart. The point that Loyd has, is having a bounty paid in full was in the the past vulnerable to exploitation. I'll explain it simple, basically the character in question has to match the bounty with his own assets. When he does, it gets compounded and basically is "Removed from the game". But the sum of bounties paid, gets re-directed to the bounty hunter. So when an "alt" captures the target in question. He basically trades assets of his character for a bounty. To simplify it even further, you have to match the bounty with your own assets. Did you not see the part about manipulating the market to artificially inflate the value of said assets?
You will have to invest more than the actual worth of the bounty. As such it would be infeasible. |
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Ned Thomas
Signal Cartel EvE-Scout Enclave
1016
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Posted - 2015.03.05 00:17:34 -
[21] - Quote
Paranoid Loyd wrote:Privateer Cove wrote:Cannibal Kane wrote:Privateer Cove wrote:Paranoid Loyd wrote:I make you mad and you decide to put a bounty on me. You are really mad and want me dead so you put a 1 bil isk bounty on me. When you put the 1 bil isk bounty on me I get in a hauler load it with loot that has been manipulated to inflate it's value so the system thinks it is worth 1 bil isk, I then kill my self with an alt and collect your isk.
You have to design a system that can not be manipulated to kill one's self for profit. This is the whole issue with the bounty mechanic. As the chart says, a bounty pay out cannot be extracted if the character in question with a bounty has been captured that does not have the required assets available. Therefore, destroying yourself would equal stealing from yourself. And as long the bounty is not paid in full, all assets of the character in question are frozen. Which means, ALL assets are basically compounded and liquified in statis untill the bounty payment has been reached. Come on people, this ain't rocket science. I think you are missing Loyd point. So I will once again state, play the game, learn the game and you will understand. I am removing myself from this conversation since I can see this will just keep going in circles. o/ Enjoy. EDIT: This should maybe be moved by the ISD out of here and into F&I so the forum trolls can tear you apart. The point that Loyd has, is having a bounty paid in full was in the the past vulnerable to exploitation. I'll explain it simple, basically the character in question has to match the bounty with his own assets. When he does, it gets compounded and basically is "Removed from the game". But the sum of bounties paid, gets re-directed to the bounty hunter. So when an "alt" captures the target in question. He basically trades assets of his character for a bounty. To simplify it even further, you have to match the bounty with your own assets. Did you not see the part about manipulating the market to artificially inflate the value of said assets?
Not to mention the market manipulation of liquidating the assets without the hassle of selling them.
Don't get lost alone - Join Signal Cartel, New Eden's premier haven for explorers!
Onward to Thera with Eve Scout
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Paranoid Loyd
4020
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Posted - 2015.03.05 00:18:14 -
[22] - Quote
Privateer Cove wrote:You will have to invest more than the actual worth of the bounty. No you wouldn't if you did it right, you would actually profit from the manipulation as well. As Kane said learn to play the game before you try to change it.
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
Fix the Prospect!!!
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Privateer Cove
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2015.03.05 00:29:09 -
[23] - Quote
Paranoid Loyd wrote:Privateer Cove wrote:You will have to invest more than the actual worth of the bounty. No you wouldn't if you did it right, you would actually profit from the manipulation as well. As Kane said learn to play the game before you try to change it.
So you're telling me, certain players can corner the market on PLEX. Whilst PLEX is being safeguarded by CCP.
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Paranoid Loyd
4020
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Posted - 2015.03.05 00:31:40 -
[24] - Quote
When did I say PLEX? It's hardly the only thing on the market.
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
Fix the Prospect!!!
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Ned Thomas
Signal Cartel EvE-Scout Enclave
1016
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Posted - 2015.03.05 00:32:34 -
[25] - Quote
Privateer Cove wrote:Paranoid Loyd wrote:Privateer Cove wrote:You will have to invest more than the actual worth of the bounty. No you wouldn't if you did it right, you would actually profit from the manipulation as well. As Kane said learn to play the game before you try to change it. So you're telling me, certain players can corner the market on PLEX. Whilst PLEX is being safeguarded by CCP.
PLEX is not safegaurded by CCP in terms of it's isk value.
Market manipulation is a key form of gameplay in EVE.
Don't get lost alone - Join Signal Cartel, New Eden's premier haven for explorers!
Onward to Thera with Eve Scout
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Kaiserin Schlacht
Rolling Static Gone Critical
4
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Posted - 2015.03.05 00:38:44 -
[26] - Quote
A functional and meaningful bounty system is on every EVE players wishlist.
Its just so darn difficult considering the sheer amount of exploitation in this game |
Privateer Cove
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2015.03.05 01:01:41 -
[27] - Quote
Well the important points to get clear currently are:
Defining asset est.value Defining illegal/legal bounty placement
Defining and liquidating est.value can be done by making PLEX the standard guideline for measuring bounty value. Defining bounty placement depends on where to draw to line, it has no benefit of exploitation.
Problem solved
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Paranoid Loyd
4021
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Posted - 2015.03.05 01:06:00 -
[28] - Quote
How do you relate the value of Fedos to the value of PLEX?
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
Fix the Prospect!!!
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Ned Thomas
Signal Cartel EvE-Scout Enclave
1017
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Posted - 2015.03.05 01:07:01 -
[29] - Quote
Privateer Cove wrote:Well the important points to get clear currently are:
Defining asset est.value Defining illegal/legal bounty placement
Defining and liquidating est.value can be done by making PLEX the standard guideline for measuring bounty value. Defining bounty placement depends on where to draw to line, it has no benefit of exploitation.
Problem solved
Asset value and PLEX prices are determined though player actions on the market. You've solved nothing.
Really, they weren't kidding when they said learn the game.
Don't get lost alone - Join Signal Cartel, New Eden's premier haven for explorers!
Onward to Thera with Eve Scout
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Privateer Cove
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2015.03.05 01:10:53 -
[30] - Quote
Paranoid Loyd wrote:How do you relate the value of Fedos to the value of PLEX?
I'm unaware of the definition Fedos, could you clarify this? |
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