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Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
5790
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Posted - 2015.04.27 22:19:31 -
[1] - Quote
Patch notes: http://community.eveonline.com/news/patch-notes/patch-notes-for-mosaic
Are those patch notes missing details such as either a reduction in batch size for refining, or a reduction in ore volume?
With just those changes as listed, "high end" ores have dropped in value by about 50% due to removal of the higher-end minerals they used to contain.
Day 0 Advice for New Players
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Paranoid Loyd
4915
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Posted - 2015.04.27 22:26:25 -
[2] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:With just those changes as listed, "high end" ores have dropped in value by about 50% due to removal of the higher-end minerals they used to contain. As I understand it the doubling of the material requirements for production should cover this reduction.
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
Fix the Prospect!!!
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Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
5790
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Posted - 2015.04.28 03:59:55 -
[3] - Quote
Paranoid Loyd wrote:Mara Rinn wrote:With just those changes as listed, "high end" ores have dropped in value by about 50% due to removal of the higher-end minerals they used to contain. As I understand it the doubling of the material requirements for production should cover this reduction.
I don't share your optimism. Hisec still has access to these minerals, and the ores in hisec are now worth more per cubic metre than the nullsec ores. If the value of Mexallon etc increase, the ores still accessible in hisec will become even more valuable, while pushing down the value of tritanium and pyerite which are the bulk of the value of the newly adjusted nullsec ores.
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Selaria Unbertable
POS Mortem Renegades Of Silence
78
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Posted - 2015.04.28 10:47:44 -
[4] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:Paranoid Loyd wrote:Mara Rinn wrote:With just those changes as listed, "high end" ores have dropped in value by about 50% due to removal of the higher-end minerals they used to contain. As I understand it the doubling of the material requirements for production should cover this reduction. I don't share your optimism. Hisec still has access to these minerals, and the ores in hisec are now worth more per cubic metre than the nullsec ores. If the value of Mexallon etc increase, the ores still accessible in hisec will become even more valuable, while pushing down the value of tritanium and pyerite which are the bulk of the value of the newly adjusted nullsec ores.
In my calculation, the "high end" ores gain quite a bit of value per m-¦. The biggest jump in value, however, has Jaspet as far as I've seen, which has almost doubled. What CCP forgot to adjust are the volumes. Hemorphite now has a compression ratio of over 1:100 (compared to the volume of the refined minerals, the intended ratio is about 1:20) due to the removal of pyerite and the addition of lots of tritanium. One unit of compressed Hemorphite now has a slightly higher volume than one of compressed Veldspar, but more than five times the amount of Tritanium in it... Except for Bistot, all the other changed ores have the same "problem". It's good for those who haul compressed ore instead of minerals, but I doubt this was CCP's intention. |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
5790
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Posted - 2015.04.28 11:15:57 -
[5] - Quote
Selaria Unbertable wrote:In my calculation, the "high end" ores gain quite a bit of value per m-¦. Have to update the prices, but so far, almost all of them are above 300 ISK/m-¦, while the high sec ones are in the range of 170-200 ISK/m-¦.
(at current mineral prices)
Once the bot-aspirants in nullsec have done their duty, it'll all be back down to about 200ISK/m3. I give them about two months, tops.
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Selaria Unbertable
POS Mortem Renegades Of Silence
78
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Posted - 2015.04.28 11:23:15 -
[6] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:Selaria Unbertable wrote:In my calculation, the "high end" ores gain quite a bit of value per m-¦. Have to update the prices, but so far, almost all of them are above 300 ISK/m-¦, while the high sec ones are in the range of 170-200 ISK/m-¦. (at current mineral prices) Once the bot-aspirants in nullsec have done their duty, it'll all be back down to about 200ISK/m3. I give them about two months, tops.
You're right, that might happen. We'll see. |
Kisle
AGM Incorporated Fidelas Constans
0
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Posted - 2015.04.28 13:09:25 -
[7] - Quote
You know it is extremely more difficult to bot in 0.0 than in high sec? :) |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
5790
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Posted - 2015.04.28 13:13:44 -
[8] - Quote
Kisle wrote:You know it is extremely more difficult to bot in 0.0 than in high sec? :)
LOL
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Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
5790
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Posted - 2015.04.28 13:15:32 -
[9] - Quote
The ores are showing up as having refining batch sizes of 100 in-game at the moment. I don't have a batch of arkonor handy, is this the actual batch size? If those refining quantities are for a batch of 100, that puts Arkonor at about 750 ISK/m3 right now!
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Selaria Unbertable
POS Mortem Renegades Of Silence
78
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Posted - 2015.04.28 13:19:26 -
[10] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:The ores are showing up as having refining batch sizes of 100 in-game at the moment. I don't have a batch of arkonor handy, is this the actual batch size? If those refining quantities are for a batch of 100, that puts Arkonor at about 750 ISK/m3 right now!
Yep, batch size is 100 since... Crius I think? For every ore, both compression and refining. And 750/m-¦ is quite a lot Oo |
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Celgar Thurn
Department 10
180
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Posted - 2015.04.28 13:20:28 -
[11] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:Patch notes: http://community.eveonline.com/news/patch-notes/patch-notes-for-mosaic Are those patch notes missing details such as either a reduction in batch size for refining, or a reduction in ore volume? With just those changes as listed, "high end" ores have dropped in value by about 50% due to removal of the higher-end minerals they used to contain.
If you go on the 'F&I board' and look for CCP Fozzie entry on the new null/low ore values you will see a full list of the new compositions. If you look at the comments about three down you will find a link from Steve Ronuken showing the old values. Except if Steve has updated his site it may no longer show the old values. |
Celgar Thurn
Department 10
180
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Posted - 2015.04.28 13:33:08 -
[12] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:Paranoid Loyd wrote:Mara Rinn wrote:With just those changes as listed, "high end" ores have dropped in value by about 50% due to removal of the higher-end minerals they used to contain. As I understand it the doubling of the material requirements for production should cover this reduction. I don't share your optimism. Hisec still has access to these minerals, and the ores in hisec are now worth more per cubic metre than the nullsec ores. If the value of Mexallon etc increase, the ores still accessible in hisec will become even more valuable, while pushing down the value of tritanium and pyerite which are the bulk of the value of the newly adjusted nullsec ores.
Currently the price of Tritanium & Pyerite have fallen by about 10% and the price of Mexallon has fallen by nearly 20% since the initial Fanfest announcement on making null-sec self sufficient. The price of Zydrine and Megacyte have approximately trebled in price plus the requirements for them have doubled.
The 'market manipulators' think the price of 'low-ends' will collapse down to very low levels and the price of Zydrine & Megacyte will rise a lot higher. Aside from this being very bad for the game I doubt this will happen to a great extent or as far as they suggest. But it is probable that prices will continue as they going for a while further.
I do agree that (null-sec) miners cannot control themselves or their actions though so eventually they will dump so much high end minerals onto the market that the Zydrine & Megacyte prices will collapse back down quite a lot. |
Celgar Thurn
Department 10
180
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Posted - 2015.04.28 13:34:54 -
[13] - Quote
Selaria Unbertable wrote:Mara Rinn wrote:Paranoid Loyd wrote:Mara Rinn wrote:With just those changes as listed, "high end" ores have dropped in value by about 50% due to removal of the higher-end minerals they used to contain. As I understand it the doubling of the material requirements for production should cover this reduction. I don't share your optimism. Hisec still has access to these minerals, and the ores in hisec are now worth more per cubic metre than the nullsec ores. If the value of Mexallon etc increase, the ores still accessible in hisec will become even more valuable, while pushing down the value of tritanium and pyerite which are the bulk of the value of the newly adjusted nullsec ores. In my calculation, the "high end" ores gain quite a bit of value per m-¦. Have to update the prices, but so far, almost all of them are above 300 ISK/m-¦, while the high sec ones are in the range of 170-200 ISK/m-¦. What CCP forgot to adjust are the volumes. Hemorphite now has a compression ratio of over 1:110 (compared to the volume of the refined minerals, the intended ratio is about 1:20), assuming max. skills, due to the removal of pyerite and mexallon and the addition of way too many tritanium. One unit of compressed Hemorphite now has a slightly higher volume than one of compressed Veldspar, but more than five times the amount of Tritanium in it. Have to check the volumes of the compressed ores once the server is up again, but I doubt this was intended...
Aye hell of a lot of Tritanium in Hemorphite now. 2200 per batch I think. |
Elena Thiesant
Sun Micro Systems
1656
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Posted - 2015.04.28 16:05:42 -
[14] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:The ores are showing up as having refining batch sizes of 100 in-game at the moment.
Been that way for almost a year now. Refining batch sizes were changed with the rest of the refining/reprocessing changes in Crius.
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Paranoid Loyd
4918
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Posted - 2015.04.28 16:29:11 -
[15] - Quote
Mara Rinn wrote:Paranoid Loyd wrote:Mara Rinn wrote:With just those changes as listed, "high end" ores have dropped in value by about 50% due to removal of the higher-end minerals they used to contain. As I understand it the doubling of the material requirements for production should cover this reduction. I don't share your optimism. I wasn't really trying to convey anything, just telling you my understanding of the logic behind the changes. Half the time I think " the logic" is purposely flawed just to troll us.
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
Fix the Prospect!!!
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Rowells
ANZAC ALLIANCE Fidelas Constans
2360
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Posted - 2015.04.28 23:03:30 -
[16] - Quote
I'm not seeing the loss in value. Even with some older prices (when zyd and meg were both under 1000isk) the value went up.
If I'm to point out a trend, it was the removal of certain minerals in ore and replacing it with an existing or newly added mineral for compensation.
My spreadsheet only shows Cronkite and gneiss(?) getting the shaft with barely a percentage point of movement up or down.
Mind sharing how you came to the -50% conclusion? |
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
5210
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Posted - 2015.04.28 23:30:55 -
[17] - Quote
My site was updated pretty quickly. by 14:30
Woo! CSM X!
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
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Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
5791
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Posted - 2015.04.29 04:16:39 -
[18] - Quote
Rowells wrote:I'm not seeing the loss in value. Even with some older prices (when zyd and meg were both under 1000isk) the value went up.
Mind sharing how you came to the -50% conclusion?
PEBCAK*, I have been not mining for so long that I entirely missed the refining batch size being adjusted to 100.
* I believe the contemporary vernacular is "derp"
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Caldari 5
D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F. S.A.S
379
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Posted - 2015.04.29 07:52:45 -
[19] - Quote
Based on current Jita prices of minerals, the best ISK per m3 is Monoclinic Bistot, for compressed Glazzed Hedbergite, although I haven't gotten around to comparing mineral prices to compressed ore prices on my spreadsheet yet
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/11YWJMGIQGWLCGlWwERFJvv0tpNM6cUh-5JvimQ_B1T0/edit?usp=sharing |
SJ Astralana
Syncore
101
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Posted - 2015.04.29 08:42:19 -
[20] - Quote
I've lost the ability to read threads like this other than in the voice of Sheldon Cooper applied to all posters.
Hyperdrive your production business: Eve Production Manager
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Selaria Unbertable
POS Mortem Renegades Of Silence
78
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Posted - 2015.04.29 13:00:08 -
[21] - Quote
Celgar Thurn wrote: Aye hell of a lot of Tritanium in Hemorphite now. 2200 per batch I think.
About 1.655 with perfect skills, an implant and refining at a POS. Good time to build capitals ;)
SJ Astralana wrote:I've lost the ability to read threads like this other than in the voice of Sheldon Cooper applied to all posters.
Bazinga! |
Acitoxe Mrots
Galaxy Guardian Angels
0
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Posted - 2015.04.30 09:23:01 -
[22] - Quote
Has Anybody noticed that some ores in Nul sec seem to have disappeared in the anomalys Like Scordite, Veldspar, hermorphite and a few others, or am i missing something in the patch notes. I just went through 7 systems and warped to the anom belts and all those ores are missing, even right after the patch. |
Wadiest Yong
Porcus Volans Sev3rance
6
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Posted - 2015.04.30 12:48:46 -
[23] - Quote
Acitoxe Mrots wrote:Has Anybody noticed that some ores in Nul sec seem to have disappeared in the anomalys Like Scordite, Veldspar, hermorphite and a few others, or am i missing something in the patch notes. I just went through 7 systems and warped to the anom belts and all those ores are missing, even right after the patch.
Correct, anything below Gneiss has gone (hedbergite, kernite, plagio etc). Basically you need more skill points in resource processing to get all your minerals from the anoms. Ores like kernite have not been added to the normal belts in null either, as far as I can check. Not a biggy for pro miners, but the casual miner faces new "challenges". |
Acitoxe Mrots
Galaxy Guardian Angels
0
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Posted - 2015.04.30 13:46:22 -
[24] - Quote
Well that sucks, CCP will end up killing the game anyways. Back to high sec then :( |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
5791
|
Posted - 2015.04.30 21:16:33 -
[25] - Quote
I wonder if CCP realises they were being unintentionally newbie-unfriendly by taking out the low-end ores?
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