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Buoytender Bob
Ronin Exploration Mission and Mining
25
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Posted - 2015.05.08 16:44:48 -
[31] - Quote
The many thoughtful and well explained replies has helped me convince my friends that gankers aren't complete sociopaths. |
Lendren
Blaze Orange Expeditions Absence of Light
6
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Posted - 2015.05.08 19:41:45 -
[32] - Quote
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:The criteria, from the funding source, is interdiction of highsec commerce in general to boost the profits of other parties that never get ganked.
(But the perfectly legit Eve-ish motive is draped in "greifing" and "grrrr highsec" to cover that fact so to make this matter toxic and "un-game like". Can't have real level headed PVPers take interest in countering the highsec ganking or worse, role players shouting "The Ice must flow!" in local)
The Ice must flow!
ROFL! |
DaReaper
Net 7
2020
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Posted - 2015.05.08 19:53:12 -
[33] - Quote
as stated profit for luls or whatever. I have had a pod autoing to jita hat was ganked, i've lost an empty noob ship, and i've lost a few billion before, so it just depends
OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!
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Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
1232
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Posted - 2015.05.08 19:54:34 -
[34] - Quote
Logan Revelore wrote:Jordan Kandou Worley wrote:So.... what's the criteria for suicide ganks? Fun...
amen.
Accounts may not be used for business purposes. Access to the System and playing EVE is intended for your personal entertainment, enjoyment and recreation, and not for corporate, business, commercial or income-seeking activities.-á
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Nicolai Serkanner
Jebediah Kerman's Junkyard and Spaceship Parts Co. Brave Collective
360
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Posted - 2015.05.08 20:30:11 -
[35] - Quote
Buoytender Bob wrote:The many thoughtful and well explained replies has helped me convince my friends that gankers aren't complete sociopaths.
Gankers are not sociopaths at all my friend. Talk to them again.
... and buy a mining permit for them while you're at it.
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Aalysia Valkeiper
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
70
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Posted - 2015.05.09 02:34:52 -
[36] - Quote
ah, Gankers aren't complete sociopaths...
just immature ones. |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
1103
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Posted - 2015.05.09 04:28:07 -
[37] - Quote
CCP Bartender wrote:Most gankers will have alts in industrials to scoop the loot. For professionals, the criteria is cost of ships they have to suicide to kill you vs value of your loot. Career gankers only attack targets with a loot value greater than 2x the value of the ships they need to sacrifice, because the loot fairy has a 50% chance to drop, so on average they'll do better than break even if they use the >2x metric. I went and looked up some obelisk losses on zkillboard, looks like it takes about 10 talos' to kill one. Each talos seems to be worth about 100mil, so 10 of them is 1bil, so cost effective gankers will be looking for freighters with more than 2bil in the cargo, and sure enough, all the ganks I saw on zkillboard that don't involve plastic wrap are more than 2bil Not sure what the number is like for normal industrials, but it wouldn't surprise me if it was around the 30mil mark (~3 t2 fit catalysts).
plus a little premium to make ganking worth my time over other isk making activities. alhtough it has been a long time since I've ganked.
There are also ganks for lulz, and those pretty much just involve something shiny, people like to take 20+ catalysts and gank marauders in SoE systems regardless of fit.
@ChainsawPlankto
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No Lube ForU
Down Right Dirty
5
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Posted - 2015.05.09 08:25:16 -
[38] - Quote
Normally i just look for players doing dumb things. Havent ganked in a while due to rl But here is an example of somebody doing dumb things in game
Guess mining is a good career lol
Oops didnt know about the killmails so edited it out |
Eve Solecist
Shitt Outta Luck - GANKING4GOOD
2865
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Posted - 2015.05.09 08:27:27 -
[39] - Quote
No Lube ForU wrote:Normally i just look for players doing dumb things. Havent ganked in a while due to rl But here is an example of somebody doing dumb things in game KillGuess mining is a good career lol Killmails outside of C&P are not allowed and only get your post removed.
Abolish Rookiecorps
ISD Ezwal > And then Ezwal comes along and takes all that space(s) away.
Him after realising rigs don't need any skills: Chris Lazeare > That changes everything
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Eve Solecist
Shitt Outta Luck - GANKING4GOOD
2865
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Posted - 2015.05.09 08:28:23 -
[40] - Quote
Aalysia Valkeiper wrote:ah, Gankers aren't complete sociopaths...
just immature ones. They're still better than people raging hard over lost spacepixels ... ... errr actually over the lost imaginary superiority.
Abolish Rookiecorps
ISD Ezwal > And then Ezwal comes along and takes all that space(s) away.
Him after realising rigs don't need any skills: Chris Lazeare > That changes everything
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Dsparil
Einstein-Rosen Frontier Holdings Hell's Pirates
14
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Posted - 2015.05.09 13:44:10 -
[41] - Quote
I do it just for the tears. It's always fun to watch people blow up and start raging in local. Sometimes it's also fun to take 50 catalysts and see if you can clean out an entire known mining system. I used to do that before retribution. It can sometimes be challenging, especially when they get angry enough the miners start camping the stations in insta-lock ships waiting for you to undock.
Fun times. |
John E Normus
New Order Logistics CODE.
555
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Posted - 2015.05.09 17:43:33 -
[42] - Quote
It's ironic that an empty freighter usually carries the most precious resource in eve.
Between Ignorance and Wisdom
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Henry Plantgenet
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
35
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Posted - 2015.05.10 02:02:15 -
[43] - Quote
here's a useful thing to do when ganking: Have 2 alts waiting at the wreck; not 1 alt. 1 alt opens the wreck and goes suspect to dump the contents of the wreck into either 1) a can (If the loot is massive) or 2) Into the fleet hangar of a deep space transport. The alt in the noobship will go suspect and die; while the hauler can warp off without consequences. It's apparently not considered an exploit because someone still loses a noobship (low value) |
Paranoid Loyd
5068
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Posted - 2015.05.10 02:40:28 -
[44] - Quote
I look for people not properly protecting their space pixels.
"Gankers are just other players, not supernatural monsters who will get you if you don't follow some arbitrary superstition. Haul responsibly and without irrational fear." Masao Kurata
Fix the Prospect!!!
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Jimmy O'Shanty
The Westies
40
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Posted - 2015.05.10 04:26:46 -
[45] - Quote
Jordan Kandou Worley wrote: So.... what's the criteria for suicide ganks?
If you're unlucky enough to be on the near side of the herd you fit the criteria.
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Sykaotic
Renegade Armada.
38
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Posted - 2015.05.10 07:32:09 -
[46] - Quote
Quote:
What do suicide gankers look for?
Hot Chicks |
Lil' Brudder Too
Pistols for Pandas
125
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Posted - 2015.05.10 22:43:42 -
[47] - Quote
Also note, no matter what you do, if gankers really want to kill you, they can, and will do it. No amount of prep, tank, or tactics can save you. Even if you are using a friendly webber. All they need is a ship with quicker lock time than your webber, to hold you long enough for a fleet of headshot nado's to finish get their volley off.
You can do your best to avoid all the 'small time' guys, and make it much more costly for them to hit you, but if an organized group wants you dead, there is nothing you can do short of contracting the hauling to someone else, and never undocking.
That said, i may have made a habit out of baiting several 'small-time' gankers in various pipelines with various tanked haulers with +1b in the hold...then laughing when they only take 15% out of my shield. I also know exactly what it would take to pop my ship having done the tests. It hasn't failed yet, but i'm sure the more i push my luck, the sooner it will. Might be one reason i haven't been out in those ships much lately.
Also, never break your own rules for hauling expensive stuff, no matter what, if you are too lazy that day to do it right, don't do it until you are willing to put the effort in. The moment you let complacency win...you lose. |
Hir Miriel
Elves In Space
185
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Posted - 2015.05.11 07:45:51 -
[48] - Quote
It's all a conspiracy by the industrialists selling freighters.
~
~~
Thinking inside Schrodinger's sandbox.
~~
~
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BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie
Love Squad Confederation of xXPIZZAXx
1682
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Posted - 2015.05.11 07:52:04 -
[49] - Quote
CCP Bartender wrote:Most gankers will have alts in industrials to scoop the loot. For professionals, the criteria is cost of ships they have to suicide to kill you vs value of your loot. Career gankers only attack targets with a loot value greater than 2x the value of the ships they need to sacrifice, because the loot fairy has a 50% chance to drop, so on average they'll do better than break even if they use the >2x metric. I went and looked up some obelisk losses on zkillboard, looks like it takes about 10 talos' to kill one. Each talos seems to be worth about 100mil, so 10 of them is 1bil, so cost effective gankers will be looking for freighters with more than 2bil in the cargo, and sure enough, all the ganks I saw on zkillboard that don't involve plastic wrap are more than 2bil Not sure what the number is like for normal industrials, but it wouldn't surprise me if it was around the 30mil mark (~3 t2 fit catalysts). Depends on the ship used. When I was with code, we could often profit off of a freighter carrying 500 mill if we had a large enough fleet and the freighter was anti-tanked. For solo industrials the number of ships can range from one thrasher to 7 cats. In reality a tanked nereus or racial equivalent should be relatively safe with up to 120m in the cargo hold. An iteron probably shouldn't go above 20m though.
As for the OP. If you can haul it, so can the gankers. I still have an orca and freighter positioned in Uedama for loot scooping.
Founder of Violet Squadron, a small gang NPSI community! Mail me for more information.
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie's Space Mediation Service!
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Basil Pupkin
Why So Platypus
189
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Posted - 2015.05.11 10:00:12 -
[50] - Quote
CCP Bartender wrote:Most gankers will have alts in industrials to scoop the loot. For professionals, the criteria is cost of ships they have to suicide to kill you vs value of your loot. Career gankers only attack targets with a loot value greater than 2x the value of the ships they need to sacrifice, because the loot fairy has a 50% chance to drop, so on average they'll do better than break even if they use the >2x metric. I went and looked up some obelisk losses on zkillboard, looks like it takes about 10 talos' to kill one. Each talos seems to be worth about 100mil, so 10 of them is 1bil, so cost effective gankers will be looking for freighters with more than 2bil in the cargo, and sure enough, all the ganks I saw on zkillboard that don't involve plastic wrap are more than 2bil Not sure what the number is like for normal industrials, but it wouldn't surprise me if it was around the 30mil mark (~3 t2 fit catalysts).
This post is so far into the land of incompetence I almost broke my nose with a facepalm.
As long as catalysts are free, ganking is free (some argument can be made that it's 10m in prime gankfit, but the first freighter you gank pays for a month worth of catalysts anyway, so free it is). As long as there is no measure like reducing CONCORD reaction time to grids with multiple offenses, any ganking problem can be solved by bringing one more free catalyst. As long as ganking remains basically free bacon, we will see all those horrible people who can't even mine doing it without the glimpe of HTFU in their mindless shells.
Make eve harsh to everyone, remove free bacon, decrease CONCORD reaction time to multiple offenses on the same grid - would do almost nothing to talos gank, but will make the "+1 catalyst" approach and most the associated problems (free bacon, recycling of catalyst alts, laugh at ease of dodging -10.0 pathetic excuse of consequences) more manageable.
This is needed to introduce skill component to ganking, which it severely lacks at the moment, to the point of being completely fool-proof, as even morons who literally failed at everything else in eve manage 50% success rate.
Being teh freightergankbear automatically puts you below missionbear and minerbear in carebear hierarchy.
If you're about to make "this will make eve un-eve" argument, odds are you are defending some utterly horrible mechanics against a good change.
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Basil Pupkin
Why So Platypus
189
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Posted - 2015.05.11 10:21:36 -
[51] - Quote
Jordan Kandou Worley wrote:I always assumed that suicide gankers didn't want items too large, as it would just be a waste of time since they can't scoop it up without a industrial around to move it.
Until I was ganked for capital sized modules, 16,000m3
So.... what's the criteria for suicide ganks?
You see, they don't just do it because they can, they do it because they can't do anything else.
Ganking in eve currently is one of the occupations with "negative entry barrier". With usual entry barrier to other occupations, you need to climb some kind of obstacle, like 4-6 years worth of character training for combat PvP, but there are also occupations to which you fall like it's a trap or something (a good real life example would be HR occupation), just because you weren't able to pass the entry barrier for other ones, or got trapped by ridiculous ease of the said occupation against what it offers.
Thus ganking in eve is done out of fear of admitting you failed in eve. That's indeed the last occupation by the height of requirements to participants, and their last chance to save the fading self-esteem by being able to do at least the easiest thing eve currently offers - and try to fool (themselves first) that this makes them "better" than who they just did that unto.
tl;dr They gank to save themselves from the reality of being worst eve players by picking on better people, literally like a pigeon who ***** on the chessboard, tosses away the pieces, and self-proclaims himself the winner of the match afterwards.
Being teh freightergankbear automatically puts you below missionbear and minerbear in carebear hierarchy.
If you're about to make "this will make eve un-eve" argument, odds are you are defending some utterly horrible mechanics against a good change.
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Avaelica Kuershin
60
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Posted - 2015.05.11 10:38:29 -
[52] - Quote
Basil Pupkin wrote:
This post is so far into the land of incompetence I almost broke my nose with a facepalm. . As long as ganking remains basically free bacon, we will see all those horrible people who can't even mine doing it without the glimpe of HTFU in their mindless shells.
.
Indeed your post is best met with a facepalm.
As long as there are people who can't mine without making themselves an easy target then we'll see easy ganks. The same would be true of haulers.
Mining is easy, mining safely (and hauling safely) just requires some thought. |
Basil Pupkin
Why So Platypus
189
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Posted - 2015.05.11 10:42:50 -
[53] - Quote
Avaelica Kuershin wrote:Basil Pupkin wrote:
This post is so far into the land of incompetence I almost broke my nose with a facepalm. . As long as ganking remains basically free bacon, we will see all those horrible people who can't even mine doing it without the glimpe of HTFU in their mindless shells.
.
Indeed your post is best met with a facepalm. As long as there are people who can't mine without making themselves an easy target then we'll see easy ganks. The same would be true of haulers. Mining is easy, mining safely (and hauling safely) just requires some thought.
Since there is no way to escape N+1 gank no matter how much ehp, logi, and escort you bring, your argument is completely invalid. The gankers just need to add more free catalysts until they break it.
Being teh freightergankbear automatically puts you below missionbear and minerbear in carebear hierarchy.
If you're about to make "this will make eve un-eve" argument, odds are you are defending some utterly horrible mechanics against a good change.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE.
12964
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Posted - 2015.05.11 10:50:15 -
[54] - Quote
Basil Pupkin wrote: Since there is no way to escape N+1 gank no matter how much ehp, logi, and escort you bring, your argument is completely invalid.
But since your claim is a lie, and it's easy to escape ganking no matter how many people they bring, their point is valid.
I'm honestly beginning to think you got some Jim Carrey esque curse put on you, where you aren't able to tell the truth.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
Best Meltdown Ever.
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Basil Pupkin
Why So Platypus
189
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Posted - 2015.05.11 10:55:23 -
[55] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Basil Pupkin wrote: Since there is no way to escape N+1 gank no matter how much ehp, logi, and escort you bring, your argument is completely invalid.
But since your claim is a lie, and it's easy to escape ganking no matter how many people they bring, their point is valid. I'm honestly beginning to think you got some Jim Carrey esque curse put on you, where you aren't able to tell the truth. Your curse if called common stupid and it makes you not able to see the truth even when people stuff your face with it.
Being teh freightergankbear automatically puts you below missionbear and minerbear in carebear hierarchy.
If you're about to make "this will make eve un-eve" argument, odds are you are defending some utterly horrible mechanics against a good change.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE.
12964
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Posted - 2015.05.11 10:59:39 -
[56] - Quote
Basil Pupkin wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Basil Pupkin wrote: Since there is no way to escape N+1 gank no matter how much ehp, logi, and escort you bring, your argument is completely invalid.
But since your claim is a lie, and it's easy to escape ganking no matter how many people they bring, their point is valid. I'm honestly beginning to think you got some Jim Carrey esque curse put on you, where you aren't able to tell the truth. Your curse is called common stupid and it makes you not able to see the truth even when people stuff your face with it.
This is why I gank, scam, and general all round meanie head stuff.
Because it makes people who don't belong in the game mad. Often reducing them to dripping piles of incoherency, like the above.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
Best Meltdown Ever.
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ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
4544
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Posted - 2015.05.11 11:00:50 -
[57] - Quote
I have removed a rule breaking post and those quoting it.
The Rules: 3. Ranting is prohibited.
A rant is a post that is often filled with angry and counter productive comments. A free exchange of ideas is essential to building a strong sense of community and is helpful in development of the game and community. Rants are disruptive, and incite flaming and trolling. Please post your thoughts in a concise and clear manner while avoiding going off on rambling tangents.
31. Abuse of CCP employees and ISD volunteers is prohibited.
CCP operate a zero tolerance policy on abuse of CCP employees and ISD volunteers. This includes but is not limited to personal attacks, trolling, GÇ£outingGÇ¥ of CCP employee or ISD volunteer player identities, and the use of any former player identities when referring to the aforementioned parties. Our forums are designed to be a place where players and developers can exchange ideas in a polite and friendly manner for the betterment of EVE Online. Players who attack or abuse employees of CCP, or ISD volunteers, will be permanently banned from the EVE Online forums across all their accounts with no recourse, and may also be subject to action against their game accounts.
ISD Ezwal
Vice Admiral
Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)
Interstellar Services Department
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Basil Pupkin
Why So Platypus
189
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Posted - 2015.05.11 11:01:25 -
[58] - Quote
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Basil Pupkin wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Basil Pupkin wrote: Since there is no way to escape N+1 gank no matter how much ehp, logi, and escort you bring, your argument is completely invalid.
But since your claim is a lie, and it's easy to escape ganking no matter how many people they bring, their point is valid. I'm honestly beginning to think you got some Jim Carrey esque curse put on you, where you aren't able to tell the truth. Your curse is called common stupid and it makes you not able to see the truth even when people stuff your face with it. This is why I gank, scam, and general all round meanie head stuff. Because it makes people who don't belong in the game mad. Often reducing them to dripping piles of incoherency, like the above.
Exactly!
You can only do things that require no brain and unable to comprehend what you're being told. Those are the typical symptoms of common stupid.
Being teh freightergankbear automatically puts you below missionbear and minerbear in carebear hierarchy.
If you're about to make "this will make eve un-eve" argument, odds are you are defending some utterly horrible mechanics against a good change.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Glorious Revolutionary Armed Forces of Highsec CODE.
12965
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Posted - 2015.05.11 11:20:06 -
[59] - Quote
You'd think it would stop being funny after a while, but it doesn't. It's the perfect drug, metaphorically speaking.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
Best Meltdown Ever.
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Freya Sertan
Tyrell Heavy Industries
123
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Posted - 2015.05.11 17:41:04 -
[60] - Quote
Basil Pupkin wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Basil Pupkin wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Basil Pupkin wrote: Since there is no way to escape N+1 gank no matter how much ehp, logi, and escort you bring, your argument is completely invalid.
But since your claim is a lie, and it's easy to escape ganking no matter how many people they bring, their point is valid. I'm honestly beginning to think you got some Jim Carrey esque curse put on you, where you aren't able to tell the truth. Your curse is called common stupid and it makes you not able to see the truth even when people stuff your face with it. This is why I gank, scam, and general all round meanie head stuff. Because it makes people who don't belong in the game mad. Often reducing them to dripping piles of incoherency, like the above. Exactly! You can only do things that require no brain and unable to comprehend what you're being told. Those are the typical symptoms of common stupid.
Aww. Where did the ganker touch you? Point it out on this doll. |
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