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Twin blade
Minmatar The Caldari Confederation
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Posted - 2006.11.18 23:11:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Twin blade on 18/11/2006 23:19:32 Edited by: Twin blade on 18/11/2006 23:17:40 Edited by: Twin blade on 18/11/2006 23:12:19 Ok i think we can all agree that all most no one like's the maelstorm as it is.
I plan to try and turn it in to a Good auto cannon ship. Bonus 5% ROF 7.5% shield boost Per lvl
Mass 115.000.000 Cargo 550 m3 Drone 100 m3
Hull 8400 Armor 9000 Shield 9600 (charge time 1500.00 sec)
Cap 7200 (charge time 1500.00 sec)
Lock range 75 Max lock 7 Scan rez 90mm Sensor str 21 Signature 460m
Speed 115ms
Cpu 640 Grid 21000
Low 5 Mid 6 Hi 8 Gun 8 Lancher 3
Now its to big and slow so let's make it in to some thing better a fast AC ship that is wanted.
Bonus 5% tracking speed 5% falloff per lvl
Mass 105.000.000 I know more than the Temp Cargo 750 m3 Need's a large cargo bay for ammo Drone 100 m3 Seems ok
Hull 8200 Armor 10.000 Should armor tank for a AC ship Shield 8000 (charge time 1500.00 sec)
Cap 7000 Tiny bit lower cap bit a little faster charge time (charge time 1300.00 sec)
Lock range 70 No need for mega long range for AC's Max lock 7 Scan rez 100mm same as Temp Sensor str 21 Signature 360m Bit larger than the Temp
Speed 145ms Just 5ms faster than Temp but lower than phoon
Cpu 530 Grid 15000 Has to lower Grid or end up as a OP sniper ship
Low 6 Mid 5 Hi 8 Gun 8 Lancher 4
And remove the front Fin's sorry but they just look worng back onme is ok but not the front.
Now it is a fair bit faster and lighter allowing it to become a AC ship.
The new slot's allow a good armor tank and allow you to use a bit of ECM and to still lock the enemy down.
The bonus's will stop it becoming a sniper ship and help it in close range.
What do you think i might of over done it a little and made it a little to strong.
Still tweaking it a bit.
!
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Isyel
Minmatar Masuat'aa Matari Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2006.11.18 23:20:00 -
[2]
No damage bonus whatsoever on ACs? Makes baby jesus cry... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I be needin' some sig love. *sigh* |
Twin blade
Minmatar The Caldari Confederation
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Posted - 2006.11.18 23:23:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Twin blade on 18/11/2006 23:24:41 Edited by: Twin blade on 18/11/2006 23:23:38
Originally by: Isyel No damage bonus whatsoever on ACs? Makes baby jesus cry...
With 8 AC's i was not sure what Bonus to add with out going over the top damage wise.
The tracking and fall off bonus will keep it at a fair range form other ships and allow to to land most hits witch was the thinking behind not giving it a damage or rof bonus.
But i am more than welcome to any bonus you would think would be better. !
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Ath Amon
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Posted - 2006.11.18 23:29:00 -
[4]
mah don't like it that much...
the phoon will probably do more damage
the tempest is more versatile and can still work well as an ac platform...
also imo atm minnies have more need of a long range platform able to compete with the rokh
if close range will become a problem for minnie ships then there are some easy fixes like bigger dronebay for the pest or small changes to the phoon (that is a specialized close range platform atm)
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Isyel
Minmatar Masuat'aa Matari Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2006.11.18 23:42:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Ath Amon mah don't like it that much...
the phoon will probably do more damage
the tempest is more versatile and can still work well as an ac platform...
also imo atm minnies have more need of a long range platform able to compete with the rokh
if close range will become a problem for minnie ships then there are some easy fixes like bigger dronebay for the pest or small changes to the phoon (that is a specialized close range platform atm)
Thing is... the thing is better with ACs as it is. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I be needin' some sig love. *sigh* |
Ithildin
Gallente The Corporation The Corporation Alliance
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Posted - 2006.11.18 23:52:00 -
[6]
Just FYI: 7.5% tracking is the norm and 10% fall off is the norm. - EVE is sick. |
Twin blade
Minmatar The Caldari Confederation
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Posted - 2006.11.18 23:59:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Ath Amon mah don't like it that much...
the phoon will probably do more damage
the tempest is more versatile and can still work well as an ac platform...
also imo atm minnies have more need of a long range platform able to compete with the rokh
if close range will become a problem for minnie ships then there are some easy fixes like bigger dronebay for the pest or small changes to the phoon (that is a specialized close range platform atm)
The maelstorm atm is nothing but a weaker tempest bar the shield tank that is better but still don't make it worth using.
We lack a fast AC ship as the tempest i find make's a much better Sniper ship than AC ship. !
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Ath Amon
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Posted - 2006.11.19 00:13:00 -
[8]
minnies lack a good fleet ship because atm arty is crap...
if arty will ever be fixed the pest will not be able to compete with the rokh due to its few guns and lack of tank bonus
in short range instead noses or missiles can still be a viable option, and so an eventual damp setup
also as said phoon imho is a ship that with small fixes can become an awesome "brawler"... it just need to lose its split weapon setup... <wonders if Tux will ever do that>
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Twin blade
Minmatar The Caldari Confederation
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Posted - 2006.11.19 02:32:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Ath Amon minnies lack a good fleet ship because atm arty is crap...
if arty will ever be fixed the pest will not be able to compete with the rokh due to its few guns and lack of tank bonus
in short range instead noses or missiles can still be a viable option, and so an eventual damp setup
also as said phoon imho is a ship that with small fixes can become an awesome "brawler"... it just need to lose its split weapon setup... <wonders if Tux will ever do that>
I agree but the maelstorm should be a AC ship since we know the phoon won't be fixed i mean hell took them 3 years to alter the bonus.
Tempest needs to be made a better sniper atm its ok since the rokh is not out but once it is out the tempest will be made worthless.
Over all to fix the tempest it needs a 7th gunslot and a bit more lock range and it will be onpar with the rokh. !
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Sally
Caldari R.u.S.H. Red Alliance
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Posted - 2006.11.19 14:09:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Sally on 19/11/2006 14:19:45
I really never seen worse setup than your suggestion... 5 low slots and armour tank? No damage bonus on AC? WTF? Even current Maelstrom is worse than Tempest, but that abomination of your fantasy will be by far the most useless BS (BullSh*t) in the game. If you want samething what resembles true AC boat - then 1. Base mass and speed same as Typhoon. 2. 7 Mids, 4 Low if you want shield tank, overwise 4 mids 7 lows. 3. 8 Turrets 4. ROF bonus 5. shield/armour boost bonus (
You cant make 2th Vaga from that ship as large turrets will never hit orbiting frigs, so speed bonus will be easely negated.
-- Stories: #1 --
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Twin blade
Minmatar The Caldari Confederation
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Posted - 2006.11.19 14:53:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Twin blade on 19/11/2006 15:06:07 Edited by: Twin blade on 19/11/2006 14:55:02
Originally by: Sally Edited by: Sally on 19/11/2006 14:19:45
I really never seen worse setup than your suggestion... 5 low slots and armour tank? No damage bonus on AC? WTF? Even current Maelstrom is worse than Tempest, but that abomination of your fantasy will be by far the most useless BS (BullSh*t) in the game. If you want samething what resembles true AC boat - then 1. Base mass and speed same as Typhoon. 2. 7 Mids, 4 Low if you want shield tank, overwise 4 mids 7 lows. 3. 8 Turrets 4. ROF bonus 5. shield/armour boost bonus (
You cant make 2th Vaga from that ship as large turrets will never hit orbiting frigs, so speed bonus will be easely negated.
Ok since you did not reed it i will help you.
First of all i gave it 6 low slot's for an armor tank not 5.
The fact it has 8 AC's with a tracking and fall off bonus is ment to keep it at close to mid range and been able to land all most every hit.
I think the bonu's i gave it would balance the damage other wise 8 AC's with a damage bonus would most likey overpower the ship.
The reason it i gave it more mass than the tempest is to balance it.
If i was to give it the mass of the phoon there is a risk that people would turn it in to a Mega vagabond given the tracking bonus and fall off would make the ship a bit to strong.
It would be able to MWD orbit curiser and bigger easy and it has 100m3 drone bay for frig's.
There is no need for a bonus to armor/shield as thay take's away form the phoons role as a great armor tank i am trying to balance all 3 ships to have a role.
I have done my best to think of what set up people will use and try to balance it so we don't end up with a Stupidly overpowerd ship. !
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Ath Amon
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Posted - 2006.11.19 16:00:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Ath Amon on 19/11/2006 16:16:03 tempest with 7 guns can be able to compete with rokh (if arty will be ever be fixed)
but it will also be a lot better than the mael with track+faloff
the dps of such mael will be veeeeeery poor...
actually it will be better to use missiles on that ship instead than mounting guns as they will do more damage whitout any tracking or range problems
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Sally
Caldari R.u.S.H. Red Alliance
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Posted - 2006.11.19 16:55:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Sally on 19/11/2006 16:55:51
Originally by: Twin blade
First of all i gave it 6 low slot's for an armor tank not 5.
The fact it has 8 AC's with a tracking and fall off bonus is ment to keep it at close to mid range and been able to land all most every hit.
I think the bonu's i gave it would balance the damage other wise 8 AC's with a damage bonus would most likey overpower the ship.
The reason it i gave it more mass than the tempest is to balance it.
Ok, you dont get it, ya? Tempest ALREADY do 25% more damage than that proposed boat AND have 2 addiditional high slots what it can use for any pleasure. PLUS it have the very same 5-6 slot layot, mass, and speed. So WHY do you think anyone would use your, huh, BSht? Btw, noone in they right mind would call Tempest overpowered, so why bringing ship what is way worse than it ? And well, 35% better tracking and same more falloff will not save that BS. It will still not be able to hit crap. -- Stories: #1 --
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Twin blade
Minmatar The Caldari Confederation
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Posted - 2006.11.19 17:47:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Twin blade on 19/11/2006 17:55:19 I must admit i did forget it needs 1 bonus to its guns damage/rof to keep up with the tempest when just loading guns.
Ok then how about this give it a 5% damage and ROF bonus Per lvl it will allow it to out damage the tempest but lower its lock on range to 60km to stop it been coming a sniper.
the reason for the mass and speed to be close to the tempest is to try and keep it making both the temp and phoon useless.
And i have said more than once the stat's still need to be tweaked if you want to help then help i am more than happy to take any help.
Oh Sally stop whining like a tard if you think it is so bad then talk about making it better and not just shouting how bad it is. !
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prathe
Minmatar Omega Enterprises Dusk and Dawn
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Posted - 2006.11.19 18:47:00 -
[15]
maelstrom is just a big cyclone it's not really a good ship it'll find niches but it's basically a wasted tier on the minmatar lineup
like the typhoon it's a ship with lots of potential but it's just not where it needs to be
tbh ive trained over to the rohk for fleet fights the maelstrom is a huge let down
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Happster
Polaris Project
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Posted - 2006.11.19 18:54:00 -
[16]
Originally by: prathe maelstrom is just a big cyclone it's not really a good ship it'll find niches but it's basically a wasted tier on the minmatar lineup
like the typhoon it's a ship with lots of potential but it's just not where it needs to be
tbh ive trained over to the rohk for fleet fights the maelstrom is a huge let down
Same for me...going for the Rohk instead of maelstrom...
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Sally
Caldari R.u.S.H. Red Alliance
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Posted - 2006.11.19 19:13:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Twin blade Edited by: Twin blade on 19/11/2006 17:55:19 I must admit i did forget it needs 1 bonus to its guns damage/rof to keep up with the tempest when just loading guns.
Ok then how about this give it a 5% damage and ROF bonus Per lvl it will allow it to out damage the tempest but lower its lock on range to 60km to stop it been coming a sniper.
the reason for the mass and speed to be close to the tempest is to try and keep it making both the temp and phoon useless.
And i have said more than once the stat's still need to be tweaked if you want to help then help i am more than happy to take any help.
Oh Sally stop whining like a tard if you think it is so bad then talk about making it better and not just shouting how bad it is.
I allready proposed changes what would make Maelstrom unique. Right now it lacks any purpose. In fleet it will be just the same as Tempest, only more expencive. As PvP AC boat its even worse than Tempest. Well, in PvE it can find same uses, but Raven will remain a much better ship with just all lvl 4 skills than any minny ship with all lvl 5. To make it AC boat: Same bonuses as now. Slightly reduce mass, add speed, 8/7/4 slots layout. If you really will to make it funny, swap shield boost bonus for a 60% per lvl webrange bonus (same as Huginn) if you are lazy or 30% if CCP dont mind to program new bonus and feel 60% is too much. Hmm, in that case you can even leave the mass and speed as is. Interesting enouth? Still, nothing can be compared to teh Rokh... I fail to see how CCP could even think to bring such unbalancing ship in the game... -- Stories: #1 --
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Red Ochre
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Posted - 2006.11.19 19:47:00 -
[18]
No. now leave the premises. |
Twin blade
Minmatar The Caldari Confederation
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Posted - 2006.11.19 23:28:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Sally
Originally by: Twin blade Edited by: Twin blade on 19/11/2006 17:55:19 I must admit i did forget it needs 1 bonus to its guns damage/rof to keep up with the tempest when just loading guns.
Ok then how about this give it a 5% damage and ROF bonus Per lvl it will allow it to out damage the tempest but lower its lock on range to 60km to stop it been coming a sniper.
the reason for the mass and speed to be close to the tempest is to try and keep it making both the temp and phoon useless.
And i have said more than once the stat's still need to be tweaked if you want to help then help i am more than happy to take any help.
Oh Sally stop whining like a tard if you think it is so bad then talk about making it better and not just shouting how bad it is.
I allready proposed changes what would make Maelstrom unique. Right now it lacks any purpose. In fleet it will be just the same as Tempest, only more expencive. As PvP AC boat its even worse than Tempest. Well, in PvE it can find same uses, but Raven will remain a much better ship with just all lvl 4 skills than any minny ship with all lvl 5. To make it AC boat: Same bonuses as now. Slightly reduce mass, add speed, 8/7/4 slots layout. If you really will to make it funny, swap shield boost bonus for a 60% per lvl webrange bonus (same as Huginn) if you are lazy or 30% if CCP dont mind to program new bonus and feel 60% is too much. Hmm, in that case you can even leave the mass and speed as is. Interesting enouth? Still, nothing can be compared to teh Rokh... I fail to see how CCP could even think to bring such unbalancing ship in the game...
I don't think the Rokh is all that but thats for another topic.
I don't think the maelstorm should shield tank as 90% of all minnys have armor tanking skills given how all most eery ship armor tank's bar a few.
How about a ROF+damage bonus on it then and then we move the Tempest bonus to some thing better suited to a Sniper ship. !
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Sally
Caldari R.u.S.H. Red Alliance
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Posted - 2006.11.20 09:58:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Sally on 20/11/2006 09:58:36
Originally by: Twin blade
I don't think the maelstorm should shield tank as 90% of all minnys have armor tanking skills given how all most eery ship armor tank's bar a few.
How about a ROF+damage bonus on it then and then we move the Tempest bonus to some thing better suited to a Sniper ship.
Why change something what is not broken? Do you think CCP has nothing to do but rework Tempest? And all that for what? To intruduce just the same (or even worse) Tempest but to name it Maelstrom? What a weird way of thinking... Actually, there is the very same problem with Hyperion and Abaddon. But thats another topic... All we want is a ship with a _usable_ role. And no, shield tanked arty boat is not one. -- Stories: #1 --
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Twin blade
Minmatar The Caldari Confederation
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Posted - 2006.11.20 17:18:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Twin blade on 20/11/2006 17:20:20
Originally by: Sally Edited by: Sally on 20/11/2006 09:58:36
Originally by: Twin blade
I don't think the maelstorm should shield tank as 90% of all minnys have armor tanking skills given how all most eery ship armor tank's bar a few.
How about a ROF+damage bonus on it then and then we move the Tempest bonus to some thing better suited to a Sniper ship.
Why change something what is not broken? Do you think CCP has nothing to do but rework Tempest? And all that for what? To intruduce just the same (or even worse) Tempest but to name it Maelstrom? What a weird way of thinking... Actually, there is the very same problem with Hyperion and Abaddon. But thats another topic... All we want is a ship with a _usable_ role. And no, shield tanked arty boat is not one.
The Tempest ways all ways made to be a Sniper boat i see no harm in boosting it as a Sniper even if it mean's it will become a back AC ship as the maelstorm will replace it there. !
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