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Sticky:[AEGIS] Fleet Warp Changes

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 8 post(s)
Tyberius Franklin Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 1506	Posted - 2015.06.12 23:14:58 - [991] - Quote Sirran The Lunatic wrote: Want to command Fleets? Better sub an alt account. $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$lolccp Also, all this "rip bombers" "rip petes" garbage.... But yeah. Alt account$. Well played. Why would you need an alt account? Why does this theoretical FC not know a single competent scout?
Steven Hackett Future Corps Sleeper Social Club 177	Posted - 2015.06.12 23:21:34 - [992] - Quote CCP Larrikin wrote: Hi Mates, The original post has been updated with a few more Q&A's answering some of your questions. We've got a lot of amazing feedback and we're going to go back to the CSM with some ideas. Expect an update next week. Have a great weekend! Please don't. We would like this change to be reviewed by an objective team who will take all of EVE into account, and not just butter their own bread. Miss EVE 2015 popularity contest isn't a good venue for that sort of things.
Marech Bhayanaka The Night Crew The Night Crew Alliance 13	Posted - 2015.06.12 23:22:41 - [993] - Quote FT Diomedes wrote: .As it is, you keep multiplying the number of thankless roles that are best done on an alt - because your business strategy seems to be to squeeze as much out of the existing humans as possible. At the same time, you consistently nerf the ability for one player to control multiple ships doing the same task Just reread this part of what you wrote. Cash you not see how conflicted and improbable it is? Marech.
BrundleMeth Caldari Provisions Caldari State 441	Posted - 2015.06.13 00:03:25 - [994] - Quote RIP EVE...
Marech Bhayanaka The Night Crew The Night Crew Alliance 14	Posted - 2015.06.13 00:52:12 - [995] - Quote Bill Lane wrote: So you want to take away responsibilities of the FLEET COMMANDER to give more to members.....FLEET COMMANDER to me implies he leads the fleet. FFS A fleet commander commands the fleet. He doesn't, or shouldn't have to, control their every twitch. Command and control are not the same thing. Marech.
Lyra Gerie Garoun Investment Bank Gallente Federation 50	Posted - 2015.06.13 01:00:35 - [996] - Quote Manfred Sideous wrote: Lyra Gerie wrote: I like this change as much as I hate it. I love the idea of individuals being more responsible, but it KILLS quality of living at the same time. Unfortunately the two are fairly closely linked. This issue goes double in wormholes where bookmarks are used almost more often for logistics than killing or fleet fights. Perhaps a new deployable anchors and or anchor probes? An anchor probe would show up on D-scan when launched at a 100% signal before showing on grid. They would have a warp of 4.5 AU/s and EHP around 10-25k depending on meta level and balance. After landing on grid it would auto deploy over 5-15 seconds again based on meta level and balance. The attackers can now still warp to a target however it gives the target fair warning and time to destroy the probe before the scouts fleet can warp in. As for deployable anchors they would stay in space for a certain amount of time or require some kind of fuel to stay anchored. There could be those that are short term used in single battles, or long term/more global anchors. So the guy in the wormhole warps to the bookmark and WWWWWW's up. Then everyone gets fleet warped OMG THE TRAVESTY THAT THOSE EXTRA FEW SECONDS WILL CREATE. THINK OF ALL THE BELLY LENT YOU COULD HAVE PICKED IN THOSE FEW PRECIOUS SECONDS. DAMN YOU CCP DAMN YOU!!!!!!!111ON1E This post shows you have NO idea how wormhole space works in actual practice and that your hard push to get this in was ignorant and not thought through. Wormhole chains would require that you have someone ahead of you the whole time, it's not a matter of warping to public gates, but bookmarked wormholes with limited life. If no one is around to bring you through or share the book marks you have to scan them. That's not seconds, but minutes, or depending on the chain and people online to help scan it out, hours. Logistic chains will be a pain in the ass to set up without fleet warps especially when it's an alliance and not just one corp occupying a wormhole. Sure there is bookmark sharing but even that by itself is a pain in the ass which is why people have been pushing for alliance bookmarks. We're talking an extra 10-30 minutes on average between attacking, defending, logistics and further reliance on bookmark sharing which is already a terrible system. Add to that things like D-scan immune ships, harder to roll holes and so on it seems like CCP is making quality of life terrible for wormhole residents and there are other ways to approach the problem of more individual control in fleet battles. But this solution does too much to too many without regard to them and only with regard to it's effects in null and that is wrong.
Marech Bhayanaka The Night Crew The Night Crew Alliance 14	Posted - 2015.06.13 01:01:05 - [997] - Quote afkalt wrote: Moving a fleet through a wormhole chain in a cohesive manner WITHOUT needing to put a scout on EVERY bookmark first. You need ONE scout with bookmarks. The fleet warps to the scout and before they even land he is through the wormhole and off to the next BM. What am I missing here? (Seriously asking.) Marech.
HiddenPorpoise Expendable Miscreants 358	Posted - 2015.06.13 01:27:57 - [998] - Quote Marech Bhayanaka wrote: afkalt wrote: Moving a fleet through a wormhole chain in a cohesive manner WITHOUT needing to put a scout on EVERY bookmark first. You need ONE scout with bookmarks. The fleet warps to the scout and before they even land he is through the wormhole and off to the next BM. What am I missing here? (Seriously asking.) Marech. Wormholes make people rightly paranoid and they'd rather punt people down a chain than be in the open at what is more or less a permanently blind gate. That and large systems where the scout may take nearly 30 seconds to cross in the first place are why wormholers are so upset.
Ganthrithor GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 899	Posted - 2015.06.13 01:43:26 - [999] - Quote THIS IS THE DUMBEST GOD-DAMNED IDEA I HAVE EVER READ. There, I said it. Seriously though, why don't you let ISIS just put this game in a cage and burn it to death? There are a zillion and one uses for fleetwarps that don't involve 250-man fleets being moved around like lemmings by bloc-level FCs. If you want to make big fleet ops, "more involving for regular grunts," or whatever then take these warp-targets away from FLEET commanders. For god's sake, leave the ability to squad warp to bookmarks and probe results. If you do this to the game you are literally worse than Pol Pot. Seriously. I don't use all-caps, bold type, or underlines much, but this absolutely deserves all three. Do not do this.
Marech Bhayanaka The Night Crew The Night Crew Alliance 14	Posted - 2015.06.13 01:43:26 - [1000] - Quote baltec1 wrote: Again, people running the second they see probes has nothing to do with this change. Actually this seems like one of the few legitimate concerns. It will increase the time between probes appearing and the aggressing fleet landing on grid by the warp time of the probing ship. The concern is that this may significantly increase the probability of the grid being empty when the aggressors arive. Marech.

Mitchellion Saroir Sudden Buggery Prolapse. 0	Posted - 2015.06.13 02:03:27 - [1001] - Quote I don't believe anyone has suggested it yet but as a solution to the proposed issue of different sized fleet compositions landing at different time on corp bookmarks such as wormholes (tackle before dps before triage for example) risking the early arrivals being volleyed; Is it possible to add an option for the player to set their warpspeed to the slowest ship in the fleet? That way everyone warps at triage speed and so lands within a few seconds of each other, assuming they were all aligned. obviously this would have to be able to be toggled else 'fast tackle' would rapidly become a misnomer...
Jenshae Chiroptera 1673	Posted - 2015.06.13 02:23:16 - [1002] - Quote Sakul Aubaris wrote: ... Here is your new "challenge". ... Note how even while saying it he stresses how ridiculous it is. I think they are trying to force more engagements. Instead, I believe it will make people more risk adverse. No longer +1 scouts and risk getting caught in a system but +2 and +3 scouts front and back. CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids . High Sec needs a stepping stone to other areas of space, where they can grow Fozzie is treating a symptom.
SilentAsTheGrave Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective 298	Posted - 2015.06.13 02:26:48 - [1003] - Quote 50 pages of F1 monkey tears. Buddy Program: If you sign up with my buddy invite link and subscribe with a valid payment method - I will give you 95% of the going rate for PLEX!
Emma Yassavi Lonestar Distribution Inc. Waterboard Comedy Tour 4	Posted - 2015.06.13 02:27:55 - [1004] - Quote This is stupid. I recently got an alt account so I could participate more in my corp's pvp, but this would destroy what we do, and there'd be litterally no reason for me to have that account.
Rath Valent 235MeV Waterboard Comedy Tour 2	Posted - 2015.06.13 02:28:55 - [1005] - Quote This is a really bad solution in search of a problem and it should be dropped. There are too many game activities which I enjoy -- both PvP and non-PvP in nature -- that need the ability to warp a group of ships to a bookmark. It also arguably creates an unkillable class of ship -- the booster T3 -- unless its pilot is afk while uncloaked. People who are experienced enough to fly booster T3s don't make that sort of mistake. RV
Jenshae Chiroptera 1674	Posted - 2015.06.13 02:30:36 - [1006] - Quote Lyra Gerie wrote: Manfred Sideous wrote: Blah. This post shows you have NO idea how wormhole space works ... ... bookmark sharing which is already a terrible system. ... To chime in on this, ratting in high end worm holes usually requires a good little team, with mixed ship types (so different warp speeds) going to a book marked and scanned site. Let us assume though that they are going to use just Tech 3 cruisers and logistics, so one of the logistics is too slow and pop goes the first one to land ... and pop goes a T3 cruiser. Risk is now far out weighing reward. Sakul Aubaris wrote: ... Here is your new "challenge". ... Note how even while saying it he stresses how ridiculous it is. I think they are trying to force more engagements. Instead, I believe it will make people more risk adverse. No longer +1 scouts and risk getting caught in a system but +2 and +3 scouts front and back. CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids . High Sec needs a stepping stone to other areas of space, where they can grow Fozzie is treating a symptom.
Shadowforge Dawkins Catastrophic Overview Failure Brave Collective 8	Posted - 2015.06.13 02:32:15 - [1007] - Quote Sakul Aubaris wrote: Rowells wrote: didthat hurt wrote: Rowells wrote: didthat hurt wrote: Your initial goal from this was to nerf bombers: Since when? Since the initial post on page one, which was quoted in my reply. The one that literally mentioned it's not just for bombers? The initial goal is to remove the posibillitiy to relocate your whole fleet with the bookmarks/ combatscanresulst of a single person in just one second. Interceptors and cloaky scouts are the new way to add a bid more delay and complexity. In wh space there is allmost allways a scout with the fleet, who can give you a warpin on a wh. Ceptors are already part of most midscale and bigger fleet, because they are great tackling ships and give you purges easily. Yes it might be a bit more complex, but when ccp removed other features, a lot of guys complained about eve getting to easy: Here is your new "challenge". Adopt it, or die. This is not just about wormholes, bookmarks are equally important, If I (the scout) cannot get on top of the target without being de-cloaked, or said target is moving too fast from can-to-can in a relic site, we use our squad warps to land us in front of the target, or IN the cloud that would otherwise decloak us. also, remember the people in areas away from cities where they don't have the luxury of high speed internet. they rely on their team for help in the event they hit a lag spike. just warp the guy to the safe... I have had this happen with a corp member twice Lastly, no there is NOT always a scout as said 'scout' had to go back and re-ship because he/she is needed for dps or logi. Oh we found a Armageddon, we only have 5 people, no room for a scout we need dps, neuts, a jamgu would be nice. the scout found the target sure, but for some smaller groups there is no room for someone to sit around and watch. Leave the squad warp ability at least.
Emma Yassavi Lonestar Distribution Inc. Waterboard Comedy Tour 4	Posted - 2015.06.13 02:32:57 - [1008] - Quote SilentAsTheGrave wrote: 50 pages of F1 monkey tears. Because only people in large alliances should be able to affect fleets. This change would make t3 boosters in deep safes unkillable if the pilot is paying any attention at all. There's an easy compromise: let squad commanders warp. It lets small fleets still be effective while helping to prevent the blobs that CCP seems to be trying to prevent with this.
M1k3y Koontz Respawn Disabled Initiative Mercenaries 757	Posted - 2015.06.13 02:47:30 - [1009] - Quote Kinete Jenius wrote: The Boogieman wrote: Dunk Dinkle wrote: It appears that to nerf bombers, you are nerfing all fleets. This, of course, has become the new way things are done around the office. It's the same principle that is currently strangling eve and causing so many cancellations in the thousands. Nerfing the entire game to stop single individuals or several individuals with "too much power", because certain people with influence at the top lose sleep over it. It is the cancer killing eve and if it doesent stop, will incrementally cause its collapse. Making nerfs to the entire games player base because of a couple of people. Welcome, to the World of Warcraft. Indeed CCP "We need to nerf ishtars" Nerfs all sentry drones CCP "MISSION ACCOMPLISHED!!!" In comparison this nerf is astoundingly specifically targeted. I do find the willingness to make further adjustments to the nerf and the acknowledgement that it is hitting people it's not intended to hit good. I just hope they follow through with tweaking the nerf to be more friendly to those not intentionally being targeted. They also announced a direct nerf to Ishtars. In the same o7 episode as the idea this thread is supposed to be about. How much herp could a herp derp derp if a herp derp could herp derp.
M1k3y Koontz Respawn Disabled Initiative Mercenaries 757	Posted - 2015.06.13 02:51:49 - [1010] - Quote Lurifax wrote: Slippery pete's online Slippery Pete's die to literally any other sniper with the same range. Their whole thing is that they have no tank, and don't need it. How much herp could a herp derp derp if a herp derp could herp derp.

Potamus Jenkins eXceed Inc. 159	Posted - 2015.06.13 02:52:00 - [1011] - Quote Airi Cho wrote: Potamus Jenkins wrote: "you cannot activate your propulsion module while running command links" sometimes you really wish you could down vote people. Ever ran a small gang with a CS fitting a link or two while also being combat fit? yes we use ongrid boosting occasionally im unclear as to what your statement has to do with the soon to be (already almost) uncatchable off grid booster? you understand the dev has already implied its going to be nerfed yes?
SilentAsTheGrave Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective 300	Posted - 2015.06.13 02:57:49 - [1012] - Quote Emma Yassavi wrote: SilentAsTheGrave wrote: 50 pages of F1 monkey tears. Because only people in large alliances should be able to affect fleets. This change would make t3 boosters in deep safes unkillable if the pilot is paying any attention at all. There's an easy compromise: let squad commanders warp. It lets small fleets still be effective while helping to prevent the blobs that CCP seems to be trying to prevent with this. So instead of one person piloting 255 ships, it will be 25 piloting 250 ships. Hmmm... Sorry, I still like the idea of 256 pilots piloting 256 ships. Buddy Program: If you sign up with my buddy invite link and subscribe with a valid payment method - I will give you 95% of the going rate for PLEX!
SilentAsTheGrave Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective 300	Posted - 2015.06.13 03:02:18 - [1013] - Quote M1k3y Koontz wrote: Lurifax wrote: Slippery pete's online Slippery Pete's die to literally any other sniper with the same range. Their whole thing is that they have no tank, and don't need it. "But, but those sniping ships all die to all those bombers... Wait. Because it will no longer be easy mode for bombers, it means battleships and battlecruisers will have a place on the battlefield now. Damn it. My entire argument is crumbling around me. Curses!" Buddy Program: If you sign up with my buddy invite link and subscribe with a valid payment method - I will give you 95% of the going rate for PLEX!
Winter Archipelago Furtherance. 384	Posted - 2015.06.13 03:09:45 - [1014] - Quote SilentAsTheGrave wrote: "But, but those sniping ships all die to all those bombers... Wait. Because it will no longer be easy mode for bombers, it means battleships and battlecruisers will have a place on the battlefield now. Damn it. My entire argument is crumbling around me. Curses!" This isn't going to be the huge negative impact on bombers that some people seem to believe it will be. Planning a trip to Thera? Check out http://eve-scout.com/ for a list of the current connections. Once you've made your choice, join the channels *EVE-Scout* or *Furtherance Public* and request a scout to make sure your connection is clear!
Amia Katana 235MeV Waterboard Comedy Tour 1	Posted - 2015.06.13 03:16:57 - [1015] - Quote This is absurd , so your saying that if a member of my fleet that scans down a signature , I now will not be able to warp to it ? or vice versa ? You'd think that given all the technology here in New Eden , one could text coordinates data to another ships computer automatically , and all ships in the fleet could warp there simultaneously . This will severely , and adversely impact my game play style , so that if this change occurs , I will unsubscribe because you are no longer selling a product that I am interested in purchasing . Why would I , or anyone else here in New Eden want to play a game with both hands tied behind there backs ? It seems to me that the only people that support this change in game mechanics are either pilots that don't fully understand the negative impact this will have on PvP and fleet cohesion . Not to mention how badly it will affect Corps, and Alliances that live in Wormhole space . And , or , the only other pilots that support this change are capitol , and super capitol pilots . Witch removes a great deal of the " RISK " in the " Risk vs Reward " aspect of the game . An aspect that I greatly enjoy , one of the reasons I play EVE Online almost exclusively , because almost no other game out there has been able to reproduce this risk vs reward mechanic as well as EVE . It seems to me CCP , that you are catering to these capitol , and super capitol pilots , witch breaks down to you favoring the rich and powerful . I have no desire to continue to pay for a game subscription to a company that unfairly plays favorites to the rich and powerful players , and robs less powerful pilots of their gaming content .
Maria Daphiti PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 45	Posted - 2015.06.13 03:18:34 - [1016] - Quote I have no words. This is a horrible idea. From a practical perspective, since i am deaf in real life, I can't use team speak. Fleet warp has helped me stay with the squad, especially in bail out situations where people are too busy to relay via text. This change means if I am in a fleet with multiple corps, or a quickly made book mark, I will be left in the dust. Fleet warping to a celestial is generally not smart in pvp.
Rain InCargo School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 0	Posted - 2015.06.13 03:20:29 - [1017] - Quote do you know how difficult for a inty to tackle a fleet, especially for a high-speed fleet. Seriously, no one like this idea, and you are trolling the FC. I cannot imagine you will implement this **** even most of the people are complaining and even decide to unsub due to this idea
Rowells ANZAC ALLIANCE Fidelas Constans 2500	Posted - 2015.06.13 03:21:10 - [1018] - Quote Public Service Announcement Please do not smoke the tinfoil. I repeat: do not smoke the tinfoil. Thank you
Alavaria Fera GoonWaffe 6719	Posted - 2015.06.13 03:28:57 - [1019] - Quote Jenshae Chiroptera wrote: I think they are trying to force more engagements. Instead, I believe it will make people more risk adverse. No longer +1 scouts and risk getting caught in a system but +2 and +3 scouts front and back. Good thing those things you entosis can be warped to directly ^^ Delicious goon ((tech nerf, siphon, drone assist, supercap)) tears. Taking a wrecking ball to the futile hopes and broken dreams of skillless blobbers.
Tarunik Raqalth'Qui Anomalous Existence Low-Class 211	Posted - 2015.06.13 03:40:15 - [1020] - Quote SilentAsTheGrave wrote: 50 pages of F1 monkey tears. LOL. You really think that this is a good idea? Go share a wormhole with another corporation in your alliance for a month, and then come back to me. Seriously, this is brutal when running joint (i.e multiple corporation) fleets -- instead of a FC fleetwarping to bookmarks, now we will have to send someone with the bookmarks ahead to serve as a fleetwarp target on a very regular basis, or juggle bookmarks back and forth on an equally regular basis. Both of these consume valuable, if not critical, time when in a high-threat situation. Worse yet -- this renders fleetwarps to safespots and scanned signatures impossible. Fleetwarps to scanned signatures are again a staple of joint fleet operations in W-space; further more, fleetwarping to safespots is used by fleets of all shapes and sizes to prevent stragglers from being left behind during manual warp sequences, leading to both easy pickoff kills by a hostile probing fleet and busted safespots for the defending fleet.



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