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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 13 post(s) |
Jim McGregor
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Posted - 2006.11.24 12:26:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Crumplecorn I say they don't release Kali until there are provably no bugs at all in it.
Anyone who knows the first thing about software development will surely agree that this is both possible and practical.
This is irony right? --- Eve Wiki | Eve Tribune | Eve Pirate |
Gradinger
Euphoria Released Euphoria Unleashed
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Posted - 2006.11.24 12:26:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker Edited by: Niccolado Starwalker on 24/11/2006 12:03:38
Originally by: sidthesexist
Originally by: Jim McGregor Edited by: Jim McGregor on 24/11/2006 10:22:40
You do know that those bugs most likely are in the TQ build as well, right? :) I dont think ccp would go ahead with this unless they knew that Kali is actually better than Dragon even with some bugs still remaining. So just relax. :)
Thats the point, good business ethics is not releasing something until those bugs are quashed.
As for Kali being better than dragon, well go on the test server and check the lag with 200 people, its not a huge improvement if any at all.
The lag comes of the reason that they are not running on TQ hardware, but on SiSi hardware which is faaar from as advanced as TQ. They have however tested the build on TQ in its downtime periods. Internally, but still tested it.
I am sure it will be fine
they ¦ve tested it without the tq-database - so i think actually it wont prove much - but better than nothing...
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Crumplecorn
Gallente Aerial Boundaries Inc. Interstellar Starbase Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.11.24 12:31:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Originally by: Crumplecorn I say they don't release Kali until there are provably no bugs at all in it.
Anyone who knows the first thing about software development will surely agree that this is both possible and practical.
This is irony right?
I think it's closer to sarcasm personally, but TBH I'm never sure... ----------
IBTL \o/ It's great being in ur forums mixing ur memes, ain't it? |
Jim McGregor
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Posted - 2006.11.24 12:33:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Crumplecorn
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Originally by: Crumplecorn I say they don't release Kali until there are provably no bugs at all in it.
Anyone who knows the first thing about software development will surely agree that this is both possible and practical.
This is irony right?
I think it's closer to sarcasm personally, but TBH I'm never sure...
Yeah, I meant sarcasm. I think. I get the two mixed together too sometimes... --- Eve Wiki | Eve Tribune | Eve Pirate |
Crumplecorn
Gallente Aerial Boundaries Inc. Interstellar Starbase Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.11.24 12:34:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Originally by: Crumplecorn
Originally by: Jim McGregor
Originally by: Crumplecorn I say they don't release Kali until there are provably no bugs at all in it.
Anyone who knows the first thing about software development will surely agree that this is both possible and practical.
This is irony right?
I think it's closer to sarcasm personally, but TBH I'm never sure...
Yeah, I meant sarcasm. I think. I get the two mixed together too sometimes...
Can it be both? I think it might be both, but I'm not sure if that's actually possible... ----------
IBTL \o/ It's great being in ur forums mixing ur memes, ain't it? |
Sirial Soulfly
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Posted - 2006.11.24 12:35:00 -
[36]
If it would be up to the playerbase to decide when to release patches, nothing would be done.
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Cleric Lifuate
Viziam
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Posted - 2006.11.24 12:43:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker Edited by: Niccolado Starwalker on 24/11/2006 12:03:38
Originally by: sidthesexist
Originally by: Jim McGregor Edited by: Jim McGregor on 24/11/2006 10:22:40
You do know that those bugs most likely are in the TQ build as well, right? :) I dont think ccp would go ahead with this unless they knew that Kali is actually better than Dragon even with some bugs still remaining. So just relax. :)
Thats the point, good business ethics is not releasing something until those bugs are quashed.
As for Kali being better than dragon, well go on the test server and check the lag with 200 people, its not a huge improvement if any at all.
The lag comes of the reason that they are not running on TQ hardware, but on SiSi hardware which is faaar from as advanced as TQ. They have however tested the build on TQ in its downtime periods. Internally, but still tested it.
I am sure it will be fine
Niccolado, you are indeed correct SISI has less nodes (Older Equipment too), it hasn't got Ramsans on the DB's boxes, altogether SISI is underpowered for what can be thrown at it. Hence the limits on people access SISI during testing.
Performance testing is an art that has to be quantified into 2 different areas, both Functional (Does it work if I click this button) and Non-Functional (Will it support x amount of users). In regards to the performance of SISI and TQ calculations have to be performed on the results you garner from testing and then extrapolate for the increased TQ hardware and architecture. This is no easy process, and performing a full blended test of vUsers (Virtual Users) in this case a peak load of 31k users would be pointless on SISI without it being exactly the same kit and architecture as TQ.
So to just come to the forums adn cry 'The Sky is falling, it doesn't perform as well' is pointless and Scaremongering.
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Niccolado Starwalker
Syncore Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.11.24 13:00:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Gradinger
Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker Edited by: Niccolado Starwalker on 24/11/2006 12:03:38
Originally by: sidthesexist
Originally by: Jim McGregor Edited by: Jim McGregor on 24/11/2006 10:22:40
You do know that those bugs most likely are in the TQ build as well, right? :) I dont think ccp would go ahead with this unless they knew that Kali is actually better than Dragon even with some bugs still remaining. So just relax. :)
Thats the point, good business ethics is not releasing something until those bugs are quashed.
As for Kali being better than dragon, well go on the test server and check the lag with 200 people, its not a huge improvement if any at all.
The lag comes of the reason that they are not running on TQ hardware, but on SiSi hardware which is faaar from as advanced as TQ. They have however tested the build on TQ in its downtime periods. Internally, but still tested it.
I am sure it will be fine
they ¦ve tested it without the tq-database - so i think actually it wont prove much - but better than nothing...
You worry too much. Smile and be happy! I am sure Oveur and Co knows what they are doing!
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Matthew
Caldari BloodStar Technologies
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Posted - 2006.11.24 13:22:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Gradinger they ¦ve tested it without the tq-database - so i think actually it wont prove much - but better than nothing...
Well, the tests do tell them whether it will boot up with an appropriate database accessible. Just making the sisi database has also tested the conversion of the dragon DB to a revelations one. Sure, there's still a gap there for strange issues to sneak through with the TQ DB hardware, but it's a significantly smaller gap than if they hadn't done those tests.
Originally by: sidthesexist
Originally by: Sakura Nihil The lag is more tolerable I've found on the Revelations test server. We'll see if it holds up on TQ soon, won't we?
The systems like FD-MLJ are all on dedicated nodes, go to a different system with 100 people and test the lag, one where a Dev/GM doesn't know about.
Others have already pointed out the hardware differences, but I would also add the differences in the monitoring software being run.
Sisi is going to be logged much more heavily than TQ. In the recent stress tests Sharkbait has talked about the server being monitored by 2 Devs in runtime, which suggests some pretty load-heavy monitoring tools.
The stress tests aren't really there to see how many people it takes to make things lag anyway - there's too much different about the operating environments of TQ and sisi to do that effectively. What they are for is to see what the server does when it gets to a high load - i.e. where are the cycles going, what's hogging all the memory etc. That isn't going to be at all obvious to the players, but will be very evident to the devs viewing the monitors. ------- There is no magic Wand of Fixing, and it is not powered by forum whines. |
Big Al
The Aftermath
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Posted - 2006.11.24 13:34:00 -
[40]
Marketing: We've got to get it out before Christmas!
Devs: Umm, it's still kinda buggy and we are all going on vacation soon.
Player Base: Oh bugger, not again.
Kill a farmer, win some isk! |
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Gone'Postal
Minmatar LuthorCorp Combat Division
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Posted - 2006.11.24 13:36:00 -
[41]
The parts of Kali that matter to me are the parts I'll never see, Never fly, Never shoot at and never train for...
The man without a face... The company without a clue. Login, Login, Login, Login, Login... Pah Stupid Forum |
BBQ
Gallente Suicidal Tendencies Ltd
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Posted - 2006.11.24 14:00:00 -
[42]
Edited by: BBQ on 24/11/2006 14:08:32
Originally by: Sirial Soulfly If it would be up to the playerbase to decide when to release patches, nothing would be done.
And everyones ships would have an I-WIN button
Kali is alot better than the current TQ build, those of you asking for Kali to be delayed and TQ to be bug fixed before releasing Kali are just very short sighted. I guess you would be the sort of people that would love to have a car that is a total write off fixed before going out to buy your replacement car, purley because things must be fixed before they are improved.
Bug will always be present, so far with last nights stress test and my playing experience I have found no show stopping bugs, I have also not found any really annoying bugs either but I have seen some lag related bugs that dont appear when you get to another system, autopilot bug, map bug etc (I get the autopilot bug on TQ currently where it does not continue to gate).
I look forward to Wednesday and playing Revelations for real. It changes alot of things in eve that needed changing, changes things that didn't need changing and generally makes for a totally new game with some new rules. Shame the scammers are going to have a harder time scamming contracts rather than escrow. ----
God gave us a brain, he also gave us a voice.
Shame some people have yet to connect them.
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Flaming sambuka
Trinity Nova
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Posted - 2006.11.24 14:02:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Big Al Marketing: We've got to get it out before Christmas!
Devs: Umm, it's still kinda buggy and we are all going on vacation soon.
Player Base: Oh bugger, not again.
In a nutshell
Trinity Nova Mercenary Services |
Gradinger
Euphoria Released Euphoria Unleashed
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Posted - 2006.11.24 14:28:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Matthew
Originally by: Gradinger they ¦ve tested it without the tq-database - so i think actually it wont prove much - but better than nothing...
Well, the tests do tell them whether it will boot up with an appropriate database accessible. Just making the sisi database has also tested the conversion of the dragon DB to a revelations one. Sure, there's still a gap there for strange issues to sneak through with the TQ DB hardware, but it's a significantly smaller gap than if they hadn't done those tests.
yea sure.. as said, better than nothing - and surely a step in the right direction
but they gotta convert the old db to the new structure, so they gotta fill it with quite some default values and also the tq db is sooo big i dont wanna know.
and i do agree with most ppl here, it¦s practically impossible to make the patch bug-free. millions of code-lines, ten-thousands of players, different hard and software - oh mammah :)
so there will be bugs and ppl with insane amounts of time will find some and make billions of it and i wont be one of em. but i guess thats just life. and its rather pure envy than a sense of fairness - so im quite relaxed ;)
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Niccolado Starwalker
Syncore Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.11.24 14:30:00 -
[45]
Edited by: Niccolado Starwalker on 24/11/2006 14:31:00 Edited by: Niccolado Starwalker on 24/11/2006 14:30:21
Originally by: Flaming sambuka
Originally by: Big Al Marketing: We've got to get it out before Christmas!
Devs: Umm, it's still kinda buggy and we are all going on vacation soon.
Player Base: Oh bugger, not again.
In a nutshell
A positive view on Revelation is possible too. like...
Marketing: We've got to get it out before Christmas! All the people out there who are off work and school, and who wants to play their favorite game: EVE!
Devs: Umm ye. We cant dissapoint those people, and Revelation is quite good, even if it still got some minor bugs... So lets do it!
Player Base: Oh bugger! Now I have to skip the traditional christmas family dinner again! Its sooo good I cant leave the game long enough to take a pee!!
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Skarsnik
Caldari A.W.M Ka-Tet
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Posted - 2006.11.24 14:34:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker Edited by: Niccolado Starwalker on 24/11/2006 14:31:00 Edited by: Niccolado Starwalker on 24/11/2006 14:30:21
Originally by: Flaming sambuka
Originally by: Big Al Marketing: We've got to get it out before Christmas!
Devs: Umm, it's still kinda buggy and we are all going on vacation soon.
Player Base: Oh bugger, not again.
In a nutshell
A positive view on Revelation is possible too. like...
Marketing: We've got to get it out before Christmas! All the people out there who are off work and school, and who wants to play their favorite game: EVE!
Devs: Umm ye. We cant dissapoint those people, and Revelation is quite good, even if it still got some minor bugs... So lets do it!
Player Base: Oh bugger! Now I have to skip the traditional christmas family dinner again! Its sooo good I cant leave the game long enough to take a pee!!
I'm really liking your positive attitude Nicco. I'm in the same boat as a lot of other happy campers, yes it's coming, yes there will be a few bugs, but hey I get to play ti on TQ for real ------------- EVE-CCG Order EVE-Ink Tattoo Project |
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