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Nightwings
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Posted - 2006.11.30 11:31:00 -
[1]
First off let me say I have nothing against piracy. Love it being a part of the game. I understand when you go into low-sec space be prepared to lose your ship.
BUT, I don't like the pvp part of this game, so I don't do much of it. I Do like the mission running. I do lots of it. I run them out of a 0.5 sec area, with some missions taking me into a 0.4 area 1 jump away. I always went prepared with stabs. Since the patch, my 3 stabs raise my targeting time to 2 and 3 minutes for lock-on. So, I took them off knowing that I would only have to worry about gatecamping. But now with the new scanning equipment, pirates can find you while you are on a mission. And yes, I got jumped in the middle of Tech Secret3, killed and podded.
This is the end of just about Anyone running missions solo in low-sec space. Me included. Unless I can a bunch of sensor upgrades on top of everything else in my ship I don't see how it can be done solo.
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VeNT
Minmatar Freelancer Union Unaffiliated
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Posted - 2006.11.30 11:33:00 -
[2]
you're not supposed to be SAFE everywhere. also, you must have been taking a while doing that mission as iirc it still takes time to do system scanning.
now you mission runners have to keep an eye on local like all other 0.4-0.0 resedents.
-------------------- Selena 001 > has VeNT left system? its gone really quiet! |
Ryas Nia
Minmatar Stormriders Fimbulwinter
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Posted - 2006.11.30 11:34:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Nightwings I don't see how it can be done solo.
I think you have found your solution, dont do them solo, its a massivly multiplayer game bring some friends. The more people the less pirates are going to be inclined to attack.
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Joshua Foiritain
Gallente Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.11.30 11:35:00 -
[4]
Reject missions that take you into low sec? -----
[Coreli Corporation Mainframe] |
Crumplecorn
Gallente Aerial Boundaries Inc. Interstellar Starbase Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.11.30 11:37:00 -
[5]
I thought pirating had been nerfed? Then again, it was the pirates saying that....
Anyway, every one of these threads tempts me more and more to take up piracy ----------
IBTL \o/ EVE is upside down! WTZ+Slower Warp=Win |
Donna Divine
Gilded Goose Brokerage
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Posted - 2006.11.30 11:41:00 -
[6]
Ok, I'll give this tip out once, for those that can't seem to come up with it on their own:
when you enter a deadspace pocket or level, move at least 30km AWAY from the beacon while you kill the contents, and stay aligned out as long as you are within 30km of it
If you do this, there is only one way that a pirate is going to kill you, and that is when using an arazu, which you can kill easily enough with drones or fof anyway. Yes he may force you do fail a mission or to keep it for later and fail the time bonus, but he doesn't stand much of a chance of killing you. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gilded Goose Brokerages Trading to order. |
Lord WarATron
Amarr Vanguard Frontiers Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.11.30 11:48:00 -
[7]
Or better still, fit cap rigs and run a couple of smartbombs at gate non-stop :) --- Slot 10 Akemons Modified 'Noble'Zet 5000 implant +8% Armour FREE |
Ishquar Teh'Sainte
Euphoria Released Euphoria Unleashed
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Posted - 2006.11.30 11:54:00 -
[8]
the problem is imho not that he got busted in the mission.
the problem is - with the new scan system it's far to easy to bust a mission-runner.
if you use scan-probe launchers with the 10au scan probes you can easily get a warp-in on a missionrunner in less than 5 minutes.
if the recon probe launcher gets seeded it will be possible to get a warp-in point on a missionrunnre in less than 30seconds.
now let's talk about risk vs. reward in lowsec. ___________________
EVE: Revelations - The Game for Carebears and Gankbears
no more skill needed for PvP - only skillpoints for Large Bubble and CovOps n00b-alts |
Braaage
eXceed Inc. Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.11.30 11:54:00 -
[9]
The new probing system is FANTASTIC......
Just wanted to state it ___________________________________________ http://www.eve-tutor.com - Picture based tutorial site for EVE-Online.
40 today, Happy B'day me |
Mangold
Freelance Unincorporated Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2006.11.30 12:01:00 -
[10]
Are the recon probe launchers in game yet?
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King Khanlei
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Posted - 2006.11.30 12:06:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Ishquar Teh'Sainte if you use scan-probe launchers with the 10au scan probes you can easily get a warp-in on a missionrunner in less than 5 minutes.
Do they warp in on the mission runner or to the Entrance to the deadspace area?
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Ishana
Minmatar The Black Rabbits
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Posted - 2006.11.30 12:06:00 -
[12]
I have to say, that as a pirate I think this new scanning system sucks big time. I used to probe out people doing mission before kali. (yes it could be done but it was hard) But this new system lets you find your people so easy it's a complete joke. Yesterday we went around ganking mission runner after mission runner, and no, moving away from the entry point doesn't help. Revelation as it is now will kill low sec mission running.
A corp mate of mine said "eventually they will start fighting back" but I don't believe that. Tbh the carebears have no chance. With the increase in hp us pirates just form larger gangs instead of trying to solo.
The whole scanning system like it is now, should never have made it IMHO. _________________________________________________________
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Big Al
The Aftermath
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Posted - 2006.11.30 12:18:00 -
[13]
Move to a .5 system where no missions take you to low sec, the reward will be exactly the same. Too bad there are only a few systems like this and as of yesterday one of them had 40% more people in local than usual.
If you are going to venture into low sec to run missions at all you might as well run the missions out of lowsec - if you can find a nice little backwater system you'll be better off than being in the systems that border high sec.
With warp to zero now a reality you can't blame pirates for using the new easy-to-scan-down-the-carebear scanning system to find kills. In the past mission running in low sec was fairly safe, the only risks were undocking and maybe in the mission if it was too close to the plane of the system. Even with the bonuses removed for covops with the current scan probes odds are very good you will be found within 5-6 minutes, when the cov ops scan probe launcher is seeded it will be even worse. There are of course ways to avoid gankage in missions, move away from the warp-in point, stay alligned - not always feasible though.
Unfortunately, after a few kills there the only people left living in low sec will be pirates, noobs who don't know better, anti-pirates crying about the stab nerf, and crazy people.
The best option if you wish to continue running in low sec will be to find a backwater system with a mid-quality agent that has a fairly low local population. Watch local like a hawk, keep your scanner open all the time at max range and keep an eyeball out for scan probes.
Another option would be joining or making a corp that supports low sec mission running - having friends that are ready willing and able to come immediately to your aid might deter piracy in that system.
In the end, with the current mission payout system and the current scanning system - low sec missions are no longer worth the risk. From a Q18 lvl 4 agent in .5 to a Q20 lvl 4 agent in .1 with all relevant connections at 4 it's only another 30ish % lp. Sadly I suspect this will result in a massive (well, probably not that massive, there weren't THAT many low sec runners to begin with) increase in local in those .5 systems that do not border low sec.
The only way to get them back to low sec now would be to completely remove lvl 4 agents from high sec space.
Kill totals/payouts from the Kill a farmer campaign |
Adrian Kerensky
Caldari STK Scientific Ascendant Frontier
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Posted - 2006.11.30 12:20:00 -
[14]
You could always find mission runners as a pirate, I used to do it all the time.
In fact mission runners are some of the easiest people to catch because they think they're safe.
To all pirates: Scan probes are your friends .
Originally by: Ebedar Hyperion setup that put out about 1500 DPS, yet it still lost to a ridiculously well well tanked BC.
Wrong?
Latest Vid: Curses to all |
Ishana
Minmatar The Black Rabbits
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Posted - 2006.11.30 12:24:00 -
[15]
Some people here obviously never heard of recon cruisers. Moving away from warpin points doesn't make a **** bit of difference, when an arazu can uncloak within scramble range and dampen you enough to not be locked. _________________________________________________________
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Big Al
The Aftermath
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Posted - 2006.11.30 12:37:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Ishana Some people here obviously never heard of recon cruisers. Moving away from warpin points doesn't make a **** bit of difference, when an arazu can uncloak within scramble range and dampen you enough to not be locked.
Not every pirate flys a recon, why risk sitting right on top of the warp in? Even if he is in a recon if/when his buddies warp in they will have to move to get in range. At the very least it gives you more time while he moves toward you for you to react to the scan probes on the scanner.
I won't be running any low sec missions with the current scan probes, and I seriously doubt the people willing to give it a shot will be either after they have to continually warp out when probes keep showing up.
Kill totals/payouts from the Kill a farmer campaign |
Wolfmoon
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Posted - 2006.11.30 12:37:00 -
[17]
I said before this patch that the inside of missions should have been off limits to pirates...or anyone not ganged with you, the mission owner.
Now with the new scanning system it's been made 1000 times worse. No, I'm not going on any lowsec mission. I'm not going lowsec at all. I'll sell my goods in highsec until CCP decides to allow piracy there, then I'll just unsub.
Come to think of it...I only log in now twice a week for a few minutes at a time. That unsub is coming soon at a terminal near me...real near.
Good job CCP. You took a game with promise and broke it IMO. Ah well, there are others coming.
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Ishana
Minmatar The Black Rabbits
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Posted - 2006.11.30 12:40:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Wolfmoon I said before this patch that the inside of missions should have been off limits to pirates...or anyone not ganged with you, the mission owner.
Now with the new scanning system it's been made 1000 times worse. No, I'm not going on any lowsec mission. I'm not going lowsec at all. I'll sell my goods in highsec until CCP decides to allow piracy there, then I'll just unsub.
Come to think of it...I only log in now twice a week for a few minutes at a time. That unsub is coming soon at a terminal near me...real near.
Good job CCP. You took a game with promise and broke it IMO. Ah well, there are others coming.
I fear that this will be what CCP will do in order to stop the flame fest that will ensue soon. However this will be day i quit eve, because then carebears will actually be save and EVE will have become WoW. _________________________________________________________
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Big Al
The Aftermath
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Posted - 2006.11.30 12:44:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Ishana
I fear that this will be what CCP will do in order to stop the flame fest that will ensue soon. However this will be day i quit eve, because then carebears will actually be save and EVE will have become WoW.
I don't know that the voice of the low sec mission runner will be enough to trump the voice of the pirate, the numbers just don't add up. I would expect something like this after all the lowsec carebears are depleted and the pirates move to fixing their sec and wardeccing empire mission runners.
Kill totals/payouts from the Kill a farmer campaign |
Tachy
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Posted - 2006.11.30 12:44:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Ishana Some people here obviously never heard of recon cruisers. Moving away from warpin points doesn't make a **** bit of difference, when an arazu can uncloak within scramble range and dampen you enough to not be locked.
With all the **** floating round in a mission area, the Arazu pilot must be really good for that. Many mission areas are filled with clouds, miniroids, buildings, acceleration gates and whatnot.
That doesn't change the fact though that the mission runner is at a massive disadvantage. --*=*=*--
The cause for this is not yet known, but we do have a possible fix in testing. by Sharkbait | 2006.09.20 |
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Mather Maelstrom
Gallente Azure Horizon Coalition Of Empires
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Posted - 2006.11.30 12:53:00 -
[21]
I don't mind this at all. A couple of months back I was flying around Placid to shoot at pirates, though I myself wasn't running missions there. Of the people running missions at that time, only like 20% cared to figth back against pirates.
The other 80% let's it up to "anti-pirates" to clear the system for them and take the risks or they just stay docked and wait till the bad guys leave.
Low secure missions pay out more isk and also give chance on faction spawns (shadow serpentis loot). You could increase the chance of officers spawns or increase the isk made from running missions in low security, but in the end it is upto the mission runners themselfs to pick up arms and make a stand. No PvP = high secure empire.
//No Pro Gallente RP, no Coreli & Cyrene anymore\\ |
Irrilian
Eve University Ivy League
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Posted - 2006.11.30 12:54:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Wolfmoon I said before this patch that the inside of missions should have been off limits to pirates...or anyone not ganged with you, the mission owner.
This isnt the solution, what you're advocating essentially amounts to instancing, the antithesis of Eve.
Probing used to be a dark art, it took patience and skill to be profient in it, let alone to master the more arcane aspects like busting off ecliptic e.g. missions and deep safespots, it sorely needed improvement, principally full 3d scan probes. However currently anyone who's trained up the skills can squeeze out a long range probe and be fairly confident of getting good results for bs sized craft, small vessels are more problematic. Whats needed is to make probing a bit more of a challenge, not in terms of skill points required but putting the thought back into the process.
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Ishana
Minmatar The Black Rabbits
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Posted - 2006.11.30 12:56:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Tachy
Originally by: Ishana Some people here obviously never heard of recon cruisers. Moving away from warpin points doesn't make a **** bit of difference, when an arazu can uncloak within scramble range and dampen you enough to not be locked.
With all the **** floating round in a mission area, the Arazu pilot must be really good for that. Many mission areas are filled with clouds, miniroids, buildings, acceleration gates and whatnot.
That doesn't change the fact though that the mission runner is at a massive disadvantage.
Pfff let's just say this isn't some theory that I'm working on. We've been doing this for a while, and now it's just 100x easier to find the missions. _________________________________________________________
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oodin
Euphoria Released Euphoria Unleashed
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Posted - 2006.11.30 13:02:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Ishana I have to say, that as a pirate I think this new scanning system sucks big time. I used to probe out people doing mission before kali. (yes it could be done but it was hard) But this new system lets you find your people so easy it's a complete joke. Yesterday we went around ganking mission runner after mission runner, and no, moving away from the entry point doesn't help. Revelation as it is now will kill low sec mission running.
A corp mate of mine said "eventually they will start fighting back" but I don't believe that. Tbh the carebears have no chance. With the increase in hp us pirates just form larger gangs instead of trying to solo.
The whole scanning system like it is now, should never have made it IMHO.
QFT.i dont run missions,i pvp but this is getting to frikkin ridiclous.the hunt/the chase/the thrill is going straight out the window in eve pvp!!!
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Lustre
ISK Sink Incorporated
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Posted - 2006.11.30 13:02:00 -
[25]
I agree that deadspace should be accessible only by the mission runner and others in his gang. In a perfect carebear world, this would happen. But, as someone said above, the numbers don't stack up - there are far more paying players (and devs) that are pirates rather than mission-runners. So we will always be at the back of the queue.
It really wouldn't be that bad if the mission-runner wasn't at such a gross disadvantage. The fact is that once the cov-op pirate has you scrambled you're toast - the best you can start doing is looking for the pod warp-out point and hope to get away with that.
Doing missions in gangs is, of course, a solution. In fact, the security status pick up is better, the time/ISK ratio is good, and it's a lot more fun. But it's simply not always viable. The fact is that I mostly do missions solo because, get this, I generally only do missions when my mates aren't online. I'm sure a lot of folks out there do the same thing.
The only viable solution comes back to my first point above, only the mission runner and his gang should be able to access the deadpsace complex. - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
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Mangold
Freelance Unincorporated Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2006.11.30 13:08:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Irrilian
Probing used to be a dark art, it took patience and skill to be profient in it, let alone to master the more arcane aspects like busting off ecliptic e.g. missions and deep safespots, it sorely needed improvement, principally full 3d scan probes. However currently anyone who's trained up the skills can squeeze out a long range probe and be fairly confident of getting good results for bs sized craft, small vessels are more problematic. Whats needed is to make probing a bit more of a challenge, not in terms of skill points required but putting the thought back into the process.
QFT.
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oodin
Euphoria Released Euphoria Unleashed
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Posted - 2006.11.30 13:16:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Irrilian
Originally by: Wolfmoon I said before this patch that the inside of missions should have been off limits to pirates...or anyone not ganged with you, the mission owner.
This isnt the solution, what you're advocating essentially amounts to instancing, the antithesis of Eve.
Probing used to be a dark art, it took patience and skill to be profient in it, let alone to master the more arcane aspects like busting off ecliptic e.g. missions and deep safespots, it sorely needed improvement, principally full 3d scan probes. However currently anyone who's trained up the skills can squeeze out a long range probe and be fairly confident of getting good results for bs sized craft, small vessels are more problematic. Whats needed is to make probing a bit more of a challenge, not in terms of skill points required but putting the thought back into the process.
qft. pirates may have fun now but low sec will be deserted in no time because of this crap ccp. if it eve is turning into a game of no brain and just pure sp then eve is dead!!
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Malus Phasmatis
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Posted - 2006.11.30 13:27:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Wolfmoon I said before this patch that the inside of missions should have been off limits to pirates...or anyone not ganged with you, the mission owner.
Now with the new scanning system it's been made 1000 times worse. No, I'm not going on any lowsec mission. I'm not going lowsec at all. I'll sell my goods in highsec until CCP decides to allow piracy there, then I'll just unsub.
Come to think of it...I only log in now twice a week for a few minutes at a time. That unsub is coming soon at a terminal near me...real near.
Good job CCP. You took a game with promise and broke it IMO. Ah well, there are others coming.
Good riddance.
You go into low-security space. Low-security space is, save one fundamental difference, identical to high security: the main content is pirates. The reason mission rewards and mining and belt NPC's and everything else is (at least somewhat) better there is because you have to fight for it against the content: pirates.
If you could just sit there peacfully farming isk untouchable by the content of that system, why does that system even need to exist? Why does low-sec need to exist? it doesn't.
Making your isk factory untouchable would break eve a lot more than you losing a ship in low-sec. Grow up.
But I digress, it shouldnt be TOO easy to probe out missions, for the obvious reprocussion of nobody will take the missions. It does however need to be easier than it was before, everyone else in low sec (especially the pirates) has to watch closely for hostiles in local and scan probes, there is no reason for mission runners to be exempt from this.
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Ghoest
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Posted - 2006.11.30 13:58:00 -
[29]
Mission running in low sec is suicide now(unless you are all alone in a system, which of course means the agents there arent worth using.)
Driving all of us mission runners into high sec doesnt seem like a game improveement.
Wherever you went - here you are.
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Altaree
Gallente Red Frog Investments Daikoku Trade Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.11.30 14:35:00 -
[30]
Since no one else has asked: Can I have your stuff? Have fun on WOW.
Originally by: Wolfmoon I said before this patch that the inside of missions should have been off limits to pirates...or anyone not ganged with you, the mission owner.
Now with the new scanning system it's been made 1000 times worse. No, I'm not going on any lowsec mission. I'm not going lowsec at all. I'll sell my goods in highsec until CCP decides to allow piracy there, then I'll just unsub.
Come to think of it...I only log in now twice a week for a few minutes at a time. That unsub is coming soon at a terminal near me...real near.
Good job CCP. You took a game with promise and broke it IMO. Ah well, there are others coming.
Fix The Web Servers
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