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La Rynx
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
377
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Posted - 2015.09.11 12:46:16 -
[181] - Quote
Hasikan Miallok wrote: You miss the point.
Forget all about "freeholding carebears versus awesome PvPers that pay real money to play".
I did not say anything like that. I buy Plex and i play everything. Mining, indu, own hauling, missions, ratting and PvP.
So you already start off the point.
Hasikan Miallok wrote: What happens to the PLEX once those PLEX are sold in the game is irrelevant.
More specific: when the PLEX are redeemed into the game.
Hasikan Miallok wrote: What is important is that every time buying ISK gets cheaper, people will need less real dollars to fund their PvP. In other words the more expensive a PLEX becomes the less income CCP are getting to pay for the game.
Funny conclusion.
Its even better: If isk gets cheaper, ships and fits get cheaper. Cheap stuff would be good for PvP since you do not loose expensive stuff. How can CCP get less for the game? The Plex was already sold? Expensive PLEX and cheap ISK are good for CCP: ppl wil risk more since all is cheaper.
Atomic Virulent : "You can't spell DOUCHE. without CODE."
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Jeremiah Saken
The Fall of Leviathan
350
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Posted - 2015.09.11 13:14:22 -
[182] - Quote
La Rynx wrote:Its even better: If isk gets cheaper, ships and fits get cheaper. Cheap stuff would be good for PvP since you do not loose expensive stuff. How can CCP get less for the game? The Plex was already sold? Expensive PLEX and cheap ISK are good for CCP: ppl wil risk more since all is cheaper. because you can buy more assets per 1 PLEX. So before ppl sell 1 PLEX per month, now will be selling 1 PLEX per two or three months. Less real cash for CCP.
"(...) I am tormented with an everlasting itch for things remote. I love to sail forbidden seas (...)"
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flakeys
Arkham Innovations
3233
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Posted - 2015.09.11 13:43:03 -
[183] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:
If something is not worth it's price, why do they keep buying it?
They don't , that's exactly the point .They do however complain how they are not able to play for free.
We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.
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Zihao
Signal Cartel EvE-Scout Enclave
59
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Posted - 2015.09.11 14:06:24 -
[184] - Quote
Jeremiah Saken wrote:La Rynx wrote:Its even better: If isk gets cheaper, ships and fits get cheaper. Cheap stuff would be good for PvP since you do not loose expensive stuff. How can CCP get less for the game? The Plex was already sold? Expensive PLEX and cheap ISK are good for CCP: ppl wil risk more since all is cheaper. because you can buy more assets per 1 PLEX. So before ppl sell 1 PLEX per month, now will be selling 1 PLEX per two or three months. Less real cash for CCP.
There is not a fixed pool of isk or players selling PLEX, so no. |
Market McSelling Alt
Bernie Madoff Investment Services LLC
569
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Posted - 2015.09.11 14:56:47 -
[185] - Quote
Zihao wrote:Jeremiah Saken wrote:La Rynx wrote:Its even better: If isk gets cheaper, ships and fits get cheaper. Cheap stuff would be good for PvP since you do not loose expensive stuff. How can CCP get less for the game? The Plex was already sold? Expensive PLEX and cheap ISK are good for CCP: ppl wil risk more since all is cheaper. because you can buy more assets per 1 PLEX. So before ppl sell 1 PLEX per month, now will be selling 1 PLEX per two or three months. Less real cash for CCP. There is not a fixed pool of isk or players selling PLEX, so no.
So yes...
As long as the general trend of prices of all non-plex items is deflationary, the rising price of Plex has a compounding effect on itself in that people need to sell less of them to do what they want in the game... where as the people buying plex need to do more in game to gather the isk to buy.
Again, it is a Hurricane effect.
Best description of Eve Online and why the community is the way it is
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Johnny Riko
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
18
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Posted - 2015.09.11 17:20:16 -
[186] - Quote
Market McSelling Alt wrote:Zihao wrote:Jeremiah Saken wrote:La Rynx wrote:Its even better: If isk gets cheaper, ships and fits get cheaper. Cheap stuff would be good for PvP since you do not loose expensive stuff. How can CCP get less for the game? The Plex was already sold? Expensive PLEX and cheap ISK are good for CCP: ppl wil risk more since all is cheaper. because you can buy more assets per 1 PLEX. So before ppl sell 1 PLEX per month, now will be selling 1 PLEX per two or three months. Less real cash for CCP. There is not a fixed pool of isk or players selling PLEX, so no. So yes... As long as the general trend of prices of all non-plex items is deflationary, the rising price of Plex has a compounding effect on itself in that people need to sell less of them to do what they want in the game... where as the people buying plex need to do more in game to gather the isk to buy. Again, it is a Hurricane effect.
I think what is implying is that as the ISK value of a PLEX increases, more people will consider buying one to sell in game for ISK to fund their activities/give themselves an ISK injection. Which is correct.
Unless CCP publish numbers on the amount of PLEX bought with cash and the number of PLEX redeemed in game for game time, we will never actually understand the ISK value increase. It is as simple as that.
I wanna join up. I think I got what it takes to be a Citizen.
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Zihao
Signal Cartel EvE-Scout Enclave
59
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Posted - 2015.09.11 23:13:05 -
[187] - Quote
Johnny Riko wrote: I think what is implying is that as the ISK value of a PLEX increases, more people will consider buying one to sell in game for ISK to fund their activities/give themselves an ISK injection. Which is correct.
Precisely. |
Rain6637
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
32282
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Posted - 2015.09.12 01:25:44 -
[188] - Quote
$30 for a Hel, sure.
Help, I can't download EVE
President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub
PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
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La Rynx
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
377
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Posted - 2015.09.12 01:38:43 -
[189] - Quote
Jeremiah Saken wrote:La Rynx wrote:Its even better: If isk gets cheaper, ships and fits get cheaper. Cheap stuff would be good for PvP since you do not loose expensive stuff. How can CCP get less for the game? The Plex was already sold? Expensive PLEX and cheap ISK are good for CCP: ppl wil risk more since all is cheaper. because you can buy more assets per 1 PLEX. So before ppl sell 1 PLEX per month, now will be selling 1 PLEX per two or three months. Less real cash for CCP.
as i already wrote: cheaper isk gets your ships cheaper. you care less for ships that you can easily replace, so you take em out and get more kills and get more killed. Still one plex a month but 2 as much titans / svipuls / whatever killed
Atomic Virulent : "You can't spell DOUCHE. without CODE."
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Market McSelling Alt
Bernie Madoff Investment Services LLC
571
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Posted - 2015.09.12 01:59:20 -
[190] - Quote
Johnny Riko wrote:Market McSelling Alt wrote:Zihao wrote:Jeremiah Saken wrote:La Rynx wrote:Its even better: If isk gets cheaper, ships and fits get cheaper. Cheap stuff would be good for PvP since you do not loose expensive stuff. How can CCP get less for the game? The Plex was already sold? Expensive PLEX and cheap ISK are good for CCP: ppl wil risk more since all is cheaper. because you can buy more assets per 1 PLEX. So before ppl sell 1 PLEX per month, now will be selling 1 PLEX per two or three months. Less real cash for CCP. There is not a fixed pool of isk or players selling PLEX, so no. So yes... As long as the general trend of prices of all non-plex items is deflationary, the rising price of Plex has a compounding effect on itself in that people need to sell less of them to do what they want in the game... where as the people buying plex need to do more in game to gather the isk to buy. Again, it is a Hurricane effect. I think what is implying is that as the ISK value of a PLEX increases, more people will consider buying one to sell in game for ISK to fund their activities/give themselves an ISK injection. Which is correct. Unless CCP publish numbers on the amount of PLEX bought with cash and the number of PLEX redeemed in game for game time, we will never actually understand the ISK value increase. It is as simple as that.
The velocity (Market term for volume bought and finally used) has been decreasing for a long time. 2014 fanfest the reporting was velocity was falling as fast as the price was increasing, which is why CCP injected the market with Plex from banned accounts.
So no, people aren't buying more plex to sell to inject isk just because the price is going up. In fact market volume is way down on Plex and there is even less of it on the market this week than last, and the week before.
Plex is drying up. Like I said, If I need 1bil isk a month to fund my pvp, now I only have to sell 1 plex instead of 2. The guy buying my one has to grind twice as hard to buy it. It is a cycle.
Best description of Eve Online and why the community is the way it is
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Zihao
Signal Cartel EvE-Scout Enclave
61
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Posted - 2015.09.12 02:46:41 -
[191] - Quote
Market McSelling Alt wrote: In fact market volume is way down on Plex and there is even less of it on the market this week than last, and the week before.
Source?
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Webvan
All Kill No Skill
13879
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Posted - 2015.09.12 05:14:42 -
[192] - Quote
Zihao wrote:Market McSelling Alt wrote: In fact market volume is way down on Plex and there is even less of it on the market this week than last, and the week before.
Source? At least for Jita, looks like two on the market for every one sold. A lot more being sold the past couple weeks as well (oh no! EVE isn't dying??!?). Certainly there is no shortage of PLEX in item hangers, since CCP did state last year at fanfest that on avg a PLEX gets traded 2 or 3 times before being used. So, people buy it off the market and sit on it for a while as they wait for prices to go up enough. Yes, the "not enough exists" argument is totally bogus and neophyte EVE market understanding. The only reason it's selling at 1.19b right now and rising, is because traders want it to go up. It's an easy bet, really, compared to faster ISK trading other things that can also lose.
I'm in it for the money
Ctrl+Alt+Shift+F12
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NeoShocker
Oppose Militancy and Neutralize Invasion. Exodus.
215
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Posted - 2015.09.12 05:21:02 -
[193] - Quote
It was long overdue. I was expecting plex card to reach 1b by new years. :s Instead, quite almost a year later towards 2016. |
SuperM8
4S Corporation Goonswarm Federation
0
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Posted - 2015.09.15 14:00:21 -
[194] - Quote
1.2+bil today... will it ever stop rising? |
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2202
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Posted - 2015.09.15 14:51:37 -
[195] - Quote
SuperM8 wrote:1.2+bil today... will it ever stop rising?
Probably not and there is nothing wrong with that. |
Markus Reese
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
575
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Posted - 2015.09.15 15:48:01 -
[196] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:SuperM8 wrote:1.2+bil today... will it ever stop rising? Probably not and there is nothing wrong with that.
I have been tempted to buy a plex and sell it to market actually.
To quote Lfod Shi
The ratting itself is PvE. Getting away with it is PvP.
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Marcus Tedric
Zebra Corp Goonswarm Federation
53
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Posted - 2015.09.15 15:54:03 -
[197] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:SuperM8 wrote:1.2+bil today... will it ever stop rising? Probably not and there is nothing wrong with that.
No & Correct
EVE is a nice simple example of an economy with rampant inflation caused by 'printing money' - the only real way that that would come under control is when Rat bounties (sic) get reduced and, particularly, Incursion income drops dramatically.
Ships (for Minerals will), Modules (those that are made, not dropped), Ice and PLEX will continue to increase. The first 3 affected by how many are actually destroyed too.
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Ruskarn Andedare
Lion Investments
735
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Posted - 2015.09.15 16:14:15 -
[198] - Quote
Markus Reese wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:SuperM8 wrote:1.2+bil today... will it ever stop rising? Probably not and there is nothing wrong with that. I have been tempted to buy a plex and sell it to market actually. That's my kind of plan tbh |
Bagrat Skalski
Poseidaon
9563
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Posted - 2015.09.15 16:20:26 -
[199] - Quote
Markus Reese wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:SuperM8 wrote:1.2+bil today... will it ever stop rising? Probably not and there is nothing wrong with that. I have been tempted to buy a plex and sell it to market actually.
What holds you?
You need that ISK right? Or maybe ISK not really equals fun?
Or maybe making that ISK yourself would feel like fun? What is your goal?
I never sold even one PLEX on market, I bought a lot of them.
Ever thought about situation when you can make enough ISK in one day to buy yourself a PLEX the same day? What really counts for you then? I had do ask myself that question many times.
Custom ship skins | Since 2014 | Character creator style "repaint" | Bring back the dream
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Erin Crawford
485
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Posted - 2015.09.15 16:49:49 -
[200] - Quote
I suppose players trying to sell PLEX for just above the going rate might taken them off market only to put in back on market for a much higher selling point, in order to gain even more, also adds to the sudden overall price increase.
"Those who talk donGÇÖt know. Those who know donGÇÖt talk. "
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Salvos Rhoska
1452
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Posted - 2015.09.15 17:03:24 -
[201] - Quote
Erin Crawford wrote:I suppose players trying to sell PLEX for just above the going rate might taken them off market only to put in back on market for a much higher selling point, in order to gain even more, also adds to the sudden overall price increase. wat
PvE v PvP
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Markus Reese
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
575
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Posted - 2015.09.15 17:10:25 -
[202] - Quote
Bagrat Skalski wrote: What holds you?
You need that ISK right? Or maybe ISK not really equals fun?
Or maybe making that ISK yourself would feel like fun? What is your goal?
I never sold even one PLEX on market, I bought a lot of them.
Ever thought about situation when you can make enough ISK in one day to buy yourself a PLEX the same day? What really counts for you then? I had do ask myself that question many times.
Is a simple balance of roleplay, isk and time. I roleplay and dont farm so my play has a decent balance of isk earnings to shinies. The previous plex prices was not enough dollar to fun, but above a bil is an easy buffer for a solo account player. For many it may not seem like much, and I could farm it easy. However, that is lack of fun that could be spent on fun. 20 bucks is worth the savings vs 1 bil of farm or market/industry fiddling.
To quote Lfod Shi
The ratting itself is PvE. Getting away with it is PvP.
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Mir Jana
Soft Blow LLC Krab Republic
11
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Posted - 2015.09.15 17:42:20 -
[203] - Quote
1.2b isk...
ffs.... WoT dont charge anything.... LoL dont charge anything... Neverwinter dont charge anything... ffs, chesscube dont charge anything...
why do I have to spend 3 hours daily to rat to be able to pvp on weekends... ?!?!
wtf....?!?! |
Odie McCracken
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
29
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Posted - 2015.09.15 17:43:28 -
[204] - Quote
Mir Jana wrote:1.2b isk...
why do I have to spend 3 hours daily to rat to be able to pvp on weekends... ?!?!
wtf....?!?!
I give up, why do you? |
Mir Jana
Soft Blow LLC Krab Republic
11
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Posted - 2015.09.15 17:47:54 -
[205] - Quote
1 account Eve = 1 account in WoT + 1 account in LoL + 1 account in (random game name) = more fun then EVE at these plex prices... |
Hadrian Blackstone
Immortalis Fratres Vacui Legio immortales CXCI
185
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Posted - 2015.09.15 17:55:30 -
[206] - Quote
Mir Jana wrote:1.2b isk...
ffs.... WoT dont charge anything.... LoL dont charge anything... Neverwinter dont charge anything... ffs, chesscube dont charge anything...
why do I have to spend 3 hours daily to rat to be able to pvp on weekends... ?!?!
wtf....?!?!
3 hours? n00b, just take your 12 marauder alts into a C6 wormhole, boom 15 minutes later you've plexed for the month. You're welcome |
Markus Reese
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
576
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Posted - 2015.09.15 18:05:28 -
[207] - Quote
Mir Jana wrote:1.2b isk...
ffs.... WoT dont charge anything.... LoL dont charge anything... Neverwinter dont charge anything... ffs, chesscube dont charge anything...
why do I have to spend 3 hours daily to rat to be able to pvp on weekends... ?!?!
wtf....?!?!
Or spend 13 dollars... less than cost of a movie?
Those other ones are simple arena style combat. Compare their server requirements and overhead to what CCP runs? Hell, my sub doesn't even cover my power bill?
To quote Lfod Shi
The ratting itself is PvE. Getting away with it is PvP.
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Gillia Winddancer
Aliastra Gallente Federation
438
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Posted - 2015.09.15 18:12:30 -
[208] - Quote
Boo hoo hoooooo. Buying PLEX is a privilege, not a right. Don't like it? Don't pay ISK. Pay real money. Don't like that either? Don't play at all then. Go find a job instead or do something more useful to society than sitting here whining about said privilege.
Market will be what it is with or without you whiners.
*edit*
Forgot to add "whiners" |
Salvos Rhoska
1453
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Posted - 2015.09.15 18:36:48 -
[209] - Quote
Blah blah blah.
Its simple fact, that the higher PLEX costs go, the lower player activity will be.
No matter what side or angle of the argument you are on, you are going to have to deal with that simple systemic fact.
Whining at the leaving players isnt going to help. Whining about PLEX price, isnt going help you leavers either.
Decline in activity is imminent and present, and will continue along that trend as long as PLEX prices rise.
Inversely, even if PLEX prices drop, miraculously and irrationally, to 750mil again from the current 1.2bil, its too late for either party, and too late to increase player activity.
This is the FUBAR we live in. Deal with it, or abandon ship. Your choice.
PvE v PvP
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Markus Reese
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
576
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Posted - 2015.09.15 18:51:14 -
[210] - Quote
Salvos Rhoska wrote:Blah blah blah.
Its simple fact, that the higher PLEX costs go, the lower player activity will be.
No matter what side or angle of the argument you are on, you are going to have to deal with that simple systemic fact.
Then we must look at what the end player base will be and goals of CCP. If the quality of play improves, then people who want a quality and in depth MMO will make up the player base. I will use my movie cost for an example.
I can get a movie a few ways....
1. See it in Theater on release 2. Get a Theatre pirated and downloaded 3. Wait for it to come out for sale 4. Legal streaming 5. Pirate of commercial available
Lets start from from general experience. I can watch on my monitor, or TV on home system. But for a good movie, I really might want to see it on the IMAX in 3D. That is worth the few bucks. Fury Road is a fine example. It had to be experienced on the big screen.
In the end, it comes down to profit. A big screen spectacle costs big money to make vs a made for stream movie. So if they swap eve to be a "F2P" model where it is expected that you can use plex to pay for all subs, supply and demand. Many players are happy with a sub and selling plex occasionally. Like all things, is a balance. I wouldn't pay 20 bucks for a destructible battleship hull. So where is the plex from? Abuse of the buddy system, and a small number of non entitled sub payers.
If a person wants FTP, then best be expecting made for TV. Eve play relegated to massive 20v20 player battles in arena. Want a blockbuster? Best pay.
To quote Lfod Shi
The ratting itself is PvE. Getting away with it is PvP.
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