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Eveanne
Gallente Sperm Trumpet Industries
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Posted - 2006.12.08 09:52:00 -
[1]
As we approach patch patch #3 and some semblance of stability in Revelations something occurs to me concerning missions and wrecks/salvaging as an example.
With the third patch CCP will be making a complete about-face from what was initially implemented in Revelations in these areas. This is because, well let's face it, it wasn't what the player base wanted and, along with other factors, affected gameplay to such an extent that low-sec is moving to high-sec and not the other way OO.
My question is - just who game-play tests this stuff? How could it NOT be obvious that the wrecks just weren't viable as implemented? that salvage was going to be a nightmare and...just...wrong? that missions would become impossible for the majority? that these things and other core issues would have to be revised yet again?
Perhaps CCP would benefit from a good reality check and seeking to get a wider view of new features than is currently the case. Because, frankly, the process they appear to have now implements the views of players that can't represent the majority in important aspects of the game and it's mechanics.
Make of this as you will.
xx E
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Dendrin Koljn
Minmatar Elite United Corp
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Posted - 2006.12.08 09:58:00 -
[2]
Bit unfair i think
Testing is on the test server...
Most of which involves people flying new ships and testing setups with new stuff.
Anything that requires 'work' and not just fitting a ship and blasting stuff has to wait to it goes online. This is not CCP's fault, its the fault of us THE PLAYERS.
CCP continually ask for people to get on the server and the most i've ever seen is 400 or so, and thats outta how many ? 100K or sumin.
Don't blame CCP just because the Player base are lazy and would rather just wait and moan about changes.
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Ariel Stardust
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Posted - 2006.12.08 10:04:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Dendrin Koljn Bit unfair i think
Testing is on the test server...
Most of which involves people flying new ships and testing setups with new stuff.
Anything that requires 'work' and not just fitting a ship and blasting stuff has to wait to it goes online. This is not CCP's fault, its the fault of us THE PLAYERS.
CCP continually ask for people to get on the server and the most i've ever seen is 400 or so, and thats outta how many ? 100K or sumin.
Don't blame CCP just because the Player base are lazy and would rather just wait and moan about changes.
True.
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Kazuma Saruwatari
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Posted - 2006.12.08 10:16:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Dendrin Koljn CCP continually ask for people to get on the server and the most i've ever seen is 400 or so, and thats outta how many ? 100K or sumin.
Don't blame CCP just because the Player base are lazy and would rather just wait and moan about changes.
Along the lines as well, we're talking about 150 people with CCP, and not all of them are bughunters or program devs.
They're human too, and they make oopsies as well, even with extended-"extendedstill" downtimes at times.
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Mallikanth
Minmatar
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Posted - 2006.12.08 10:17:00 -
[5]
Can we have a new test server for moaning? I wanna practice my moans.
The difference between a thing that might go wrong and a thing that cannot possibly go wrong is that when a thing that cannot possibly go wrong goes wrong, it usually turns out to be impossible |
Eveanne
Gallente Sperm Trumpet Industries
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Posted - 2006.12.08 10:18:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Dendrin Koljn Bit unfair i think
Testing is on the test server...
Most of which involves people flying new ships and testing setups with new stuff.
Anything that requires 'work' and not just fitting a ship and blasting stuff has to wait to it goes online. This is not CCP's fault, its the fault of us THE PLAYERS.
CCP continually ask for people to get on the server and the most i've ever seen is 400 or so, and thats outta how many ? 100K or sumin.
Don't blame CCP just because the Player base are lazy and would rather just wait and moan about changes.
I don't think that's valid, and I think it's too easy to blame the player base for a lack of thought or misguided bias.
Apart from the devs there must be 3-400 people who have access to test new features before it goes onto SISI for the majority. I just fail to see how they could not see this coming if they represent us, the majority of players.
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Doc Extropy
Gallente Cradle of Freedom Inc.
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Posted - 2006.12.08 10:21:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Eveanne
Originally by: Dendrin Koljn Bit unfair i think
Testing is on the test server...
Most of which involves people flying new ships and testing setups with new stuff.
Anything that requires 'work' and not just fitting a ship and blasting stuff has to wait to it goes online. This is not CCP's fault, its the fault of us THE PLAYERS.
CCP continually ask for people to get on the server and the most i've ever seen is 400 or so, and thats outta how many ? 100K or sumin.
Don't blame CCP just because the Player base are lazy and would rather just wait and moan about changes.
I don't think that's valid, and I think it's too easy to blame the player base for a lack of thought or misguided bias.
Apart from the devs there must be 3-400 people who have access to test new features before it goes onto SISI for the majority. I just fail to see how they could not see this coming if they represent us, the majority of players.
Which is ESPECIALLY true with the chaos that wrecks caused. Noone can seriously believe that the devs didn't play a single mission with the wrecks in place. So they must have seen how bad that works. Thats why I'm still concerned that they did it purposely (same with the new "I win" - griefing tactics!) to nerf pve.
Originally by: Fortior Good things come to those who persevere.
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SonOTassadar
The Dead Parrot Shoppe Inc. Brutally Clever Empire
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Posted - 2006.12.08 10:22:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Eveanne
Originally by: Dendrin Koljn Bit unfair i think
Testing is on the test server...
Most of which involves people flying new ships and testing setups with new stuff.
Anything that requires 'work' and not just fitting a ship and blasting stuff has to wait to it goes online. This is not CCP's fault, its the fault of us THE PLAYERS.
CCP continually ask for people to get on the server and the most i've ever seen is 400 or so, and thats outta how many ? 100K or sumin.
Don't blame CCP just because the Player base are lazy and would rather just wait and moan about changes.
I don't think that's valid, and I think it's too easy to blame the player base for a lack of thought or misguided bias.
Apart from the devs there must be 3-400 people who have access to test new features before it goes onto SISI for the majority. I just fail to see how they could not see this coming if they represent us, the majority of players.
You don't think that is valid? How long has Windows Vista been delayed? How many people did they have beta testing it? I fully understand that CCP could miss things like loot collection and overly-pre-nerfed loot tables of salvaging. While salvaging is going to be a huge part of the game in the near future, who would have guessed something so simple as loot-tables would have such a dramatic impact on its implementation? ----- Griffin -- 100,000 ISK ECM - Multispectral Jammer Is -- 20,000 ISK Standar Missile Launcher Is -- 10,000 ISK War target sobbing over losing a fight in his T2 fitted Battleship -- priceless |
Eveanne
Gallente Sperm Trumpet Industries
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Posted - 2006.12.08 10:42:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Eveanne on 08/12/2006 10:42:39 Edit - Too much swearing ^^
Originally by: SonOTassadar
Originally by: Eveanne
Originally by: Dendrin Koljn Bit unfair i think
Testing is on the test server...
Most of which involves people flying new ships and testing setups with new stuff.
Anything that requires 'work' and not just fitting a ship and blasting stuff has to wait to it goes online. This is not CCP's fault, its the fault of us THE PLAYERS.
CCP continually ask for people to get on the server and the most i've ever seen is 400 or so, and thats outta how many ? 100K or sumin.
Don't blame CCP just because the Player base are lazy and would rather just wait and moan about changes.
I don't think that's valid, and I think it's too easy to blame the player base for a lack of thought or misguided bias.
Apart from the devs there must be 3-400 people who have access to test new features before it goes onto SISI for the majority. I just fail to see how they could not see this coming if they represent us, the majority of players.
You don't think that is valid? How long has Windows Vista been delayed? How many people did they have beta testing it? I fully understand that CCP could miss things like loot collection and overly-pre-nerfed loot tables of salvaging. While salvaging is going to be a huge part of the game in the near future, who would have guessed something so simple as loot-tables would have such a dramatic impact on its implementation?
No. Windows Vista hasn't been released so it's not even a valid counter except to show that their testers are possibly saying, "Whoa this is ****** don't release it ffs"
All I'm saying is that with a balanced panel of testers this will not happen. It's not a technical problem, it's a planning and testing problem. If they keep doing things the way they are it will happen again and I don't think any of us want that if it can be avoided.
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Oedus Caro
Caldari Caldari Deep Space Ventures
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Posted - 2006.12.08 11:01:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Oedus Caro on 08/12/2006 11:01:57
Originally by: Eveanne
I don't think that's valid, and I think it's too easy to blame the player base for a lack of thought or misguided bias.
Apart from the devs there must be 3-400 people who have access to test new features before it goes onto SISI for the majority. I just fail to see how they could not see this coming if they represent us, the majority of players.
You don't think that is valid? How long has Windows Vista been delayed? How many people did they have beta testing it? I fully understand that CCP could miss things like loot collection and overly-pre-nerfed loot tables of salvaging. While salvaging is going to be a huge part of the game in the near future, who would have guessed something so simple as loot-tables would have such a dramatic impact on its implementation?
No. Windows Vista hasn't been released so it's not even a valid counter except to show that their testers are possibly saying, "Whoa this is ****** don't release it ffs"
All I'm saying is that with a balanced panel of testers this will not happen. It's not a technical problem, it's a planning and testing problem. If they keep doing things the way they are it will happen again and I don't think any of us want that if it can be avoided.
How, exactly, would you find a "balanced" panel of testers from the player base?
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Eveanne
Gallente Sperm Trumpet Industries
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Posted - 2006.12.08 11:10:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Eveanne on 08/12/2006 11:10:26
Originally by: Oedus Caro Edited by: Oedus Caro on 08/12/2006 11:01:57
How, exactly, would you find a "balanced" panel of testers from the player base?
Now that is a very good question. Some parts are easy, maybe like:
* Mix of Old to New by age of account * Mix of lazy to fanatical by SP/age of account ;) * Mix of races * Mix of profession by spread of skills and/or points * Mix of style by alliance/corp/profession
The difficult bit is style but a lot of it comes from the above and you can then throw in some free psychoanalysis to determine true PVP'er <--> All-Rounder <--> Complete Carebear
xx E
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Caleb Paine
ISS Navy Task Force Interstellar Starbase Syndicate
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Posted - 2006.12.08 11:30:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Caleb Paine on 08/12/2006 11:30:11 CCP are a friendly folk, yet very amateuristic in several ways, planning and testing have never been the strongpoint. The game has grown, more players, more options, more code and although CCP have gotten more people they haven't grown with the game.
Is that a problem? Dunno, at least it means that CCP are still close to the playerbase, but at times they could use some more structure.
-------------------------------- ISS Navy Task Force; Protecting your interest. |
Jessica Lorelei
Minmatar Decimus Corp Namtz'aar k'in
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Posted - 2006.12.08 11:32:00 -
[13]
Originally by: SonOTassadar
Originally by: Eveanne
Originally by: Dendrin Koljn
who would have guessed something so simple as loot-tables would have such a dramatic impact on its implementation?
maybe the guys that created the tables? im pretty sure they know how thier own engine works. 'death is only an upgrade' |
Splagada
Minmatar Tides of Silence
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Posted - 2006.12.08 11:34:00 -
[14]
You know, in my very limited, very humble and very honest opinion, and i'll say this the most nicely i could, but anyone who did NOT took part in the testing on SiSi pre patch and now complains should just get a giant cup of STFU if they're not happy with the changes
want to change stuff? be part of the stuff
------
relaxed corp looking for members |
Lysit Kaune
Minmatar Brutor tribe
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Posted - 2006.12.08 11:38:00 -
[15]
If anyone has done any sort of coding, hell, made anything that will be released to the general public they know that no matter how much testing you do theres always going to be a problem when the general public get there hands on it (even when you invited them to test).
There is only so much you can do before you have to open the doors for people to get there hands on it. The problem then is fixing the problems, whilst not breaking anything else, while always in the public eye.
Everything I have seen from Revelations has, in theory, been an improvement. The implimentation may lack something, but if CCP could have predicted all the problems (or fixed them without proper feedback, hands up those who ran lvl 4's on the test server) I'd start bugging the Dev team for Lottery numbers.
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Kuolematon
Space Perverts and Forum Warriors United
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Posted - 2006.12.08 11:41:00 -
[16]
TBH, only thing that was poorly made was inventions and exodus from lowsec to hisec due retardted easy way to pinpoint mission runners. "It's great being Amarr, ain't it?Ö"
"A world without pain" |
Aphotic Raven
Gallente Spectral Armada Eternal Empire
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Posted - 2006.12.08 11:42:00 -
[17]
There wasnt that much *****ing about wrecks in testing was there?
And when i was on the test server... no one else was...
Those that were seemed to test the new ships a lot.. i admit i did... but its slowly getting fixed... lets hope eve grows from this
(insert rant about t2 bpos needing to GTFO)
Quote: Melicien Tetro: I tried to fight a shark with a pistol underwater once, and I'll be ****ed if he didn't laugh at me and eat me. Sharks need a ******* nerf. True story
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Plutoinum
German Cyberdome Corp Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2006.12.08 11:42:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Plutoinum on 08/12/2006 11:42:27 (Almost) every player has access to the test-server. So you could have tested salvaging etc. yourself.
The problem with changes that effect the balance between piracy and mission runners or pvp balance on a big scale is, that you can't test it on SiSi. A server, where a few hundred players are trying out stuff in a consentual pvp environment can't be compared to Tranquility. There are neither mission grinders on tranquility, who need to do it to earn their isk, nor pirates chasing them.
There are no pos wars etc., there are no means to adjust drop-rates etc. Those things can only be tested 'live' on Tranquiility. And that's what we are doing now.
CTD/con-loss vs. log-out. A proposal for a fix. |
Doc Extropy
Gallente Cradle of Freedom Inc.
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Posted - 2006.12.08 11:45:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Plutoinum Edited by: Plutoinum on 08/12/2006 11:42:27 (Almost) every player has access to the test-server. So you could have tested salvaging etc. yourself.
The problem with changes that effect the balance between piracy and mission runners or pvp balance on a big scale is, that you can't test it on SiSi. A server, where a few hundred players are trying out stuff in a consentual pvp environment can't be compared to Tranquility. There are neither mission grinders on tranquility, who need to do it to earn their isk, nor pirates chasing them.
There are no pos wars etc., there are no means to adjust drop-rates etc. Those things can only be tested 'live' on Tranquiility. And that's what we are doing now.
Yes. We are paying betatesters.
How about CCP giving each active subscriber a month worth of free playing time for their testing?
Originally by: Fortior Good things come to those who persevere.
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The Snowman
Gallente Center for Advanced Studies
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Posted - 2006.12.08 11:49:00 -
[20]
I think the OP is right in a way..
To me its instantly obvious from the moment I did one mission that the wrecks on the overview etc were wrong and desperatly needed altering. Or am I wrong? - did a Dev run a level 3 mission and think "oh yes, I love having to check every wreck for loot and finding that most of them are empty - and I really like the fact that once you check a wreck you forget if you've checked it"
I dont really think they need players on the test server to tell them this, its blatently obvious.. to anyone.
But most games companies have this problem, I think 'offical' game testers are so wrapped up the testing of fine balances and game mechanics that they miss the blatently obvious.
<------------> Poker RPG 60 jumps 'Flop' by.. |
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Xaildaine
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Posted - 2006.12.08 11:52:00 -
[21]
With regard to the Mission crashing situation.. I think CCP UNDER-estimated the Lameness of those who could no longer gate snipe/camp stabbed up the yingang.
If there wernt so many Griefers and Lamers then the mission crashing issue wouldnt be an issue.
basicly i think the Playerbase is nolonger as mature as it once was, and where before, a few players might have engaged in this practice we now have far to many willing to play griefer just because CCP didnt absolutly tie up all the loose ends and make it imposable for them.
In short .. To many ex-WoW teenages
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Eveanne
Gallente Sperm Trumpet Industries
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Posted - 2006.12.08 21:53:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Eveanne on 08/12/2006 21:53:50
Originally by: Plutoinum Edited by: Plutoinum on 08/12/2006 11:42:27 <snip> A server, where a few hundred players are trying out stuff in a consentual pvp environment can't be compared to Tranquility. There are neither mission grinders on tranquility, who need to do it to earn their isk, nor pirates chasing them.
There are no pos wars etc., there are no means to adjust drop-rates etc. Those things can only be tested 'live' on Tranquiility. And that's what we are doing now.
This is largely my point I think. The only things that get tested, and this is largely encouraged, is PVP and ship battles - surely the simplest of scenarios? We NEED, for example, mission grinders to test etc etc whereas I feel they are discouraged and as for testing when it's live yes - it's completely arse but that's what we're paying for.
It shouldn't be that way and with a will CCP can make it better
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Xorus
Forum Moderator Interstellar Services Department
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Posted - 2006.12.08 22:26:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Eveanne
I don't think that's valid, and I think it's too easy to blame the player base for a lack of thought or misguided bias.
Apart from the devs there must be 3-400 people who have access to test new features before it goes onto SISI for the majority. I just fail to see how they could not see this coming if they represent us, the majority of players.
yes there are people other than the devs who have access to it they are called players, if theres a bug on TQ its because people were too busy looking at the shiny new ships, nobody wants to sit on SISI and run missions because they could do the same on TQ and keep the isk, there are players out there who do actually test but a majority of players on SISI are just there to test new ship setups nothing more, the dev's don't have all day to sit down and playtest every feature constantly, if they did that nothing would get released, trust me i've tried to organise a few larger tests using a group of people and its not easy to do. ---
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Eveanne
Gallente Sperm Trumpet Industries
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Posted - 2006.12.08 22:51:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Xorus
Originally by: Eveanne
I don't think that's valid, and I think it's too easy to blame the player base for a lack of thought or misguided bias.
Apart from the devs there must be 3-400 people who have access to test new features before it goes onto SISI for the majority. I just fail to see how they could not see this coming if they represent us, the majority of players.
yes there are people other than the devs who have access to it they are called players, if theres a bug on TQ its because people were too busy looking at the shiny new ships, nobody wants to sit on SISI and run missions because they could do the same on TQ and keep the isk, there are players out there who do actually test but a majority of players on SISI are just there to test new ship setups nothing more, the dev's don't have all day to sit down and playtest every feature constantly, if they did that nothing would get released, trust me i've tried to organise a few larger tests using a group of people and its not easy to do.
I'd like to keep clarifying this. I'm not talking about bugs. I expect them; that's just a fact of software life. Saying that the Devs haven't got time to test everything really sounds quite poor and points to a lack of resources though. Stuff gets released that isn't tested. Great.
Again my point is that some major areas of mechanics just get changed and thrown in without proper examination - in this instance salvaging/wrecks and missions. You tried organising missions on SISI? Mining Ops? Hiding in deadspace? Scanning out mission runners? Well I just trawled back through the Dev test posts and all I see is "try to kill me in a big gang". Please do point me at your requests though. All I'm saying is make an effort to test things methodically and with a cross section of the base. It's not as difficult concept, is it?
BTW what percentage of the player base use these forums anyway?
xx E
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Jeune
Terran Robotics Knights Of the Southerncross
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Posted - 2006.12.08 23:34:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Eveanne
Originally by: Xorus
Originally by: Eveanne
I don't think that's valid, and I think it's too easy to blame the player base for a lack of thought or misguided bias.
Apart from the devs there must be 3-400 people who have access to test new features before it goes onto SISI for the majority. I just fail to see how they could not see this coming if they represent us, the majority of players.
yes there are people other than the devs who have access to it they are called players, if theres a bug on TQ its because people were too busy looking at the shiny new ships, nobody wants to sit on SISI and run missions because they could do the same on TQ and keep the isk, there are players out there who do actually test but a majority of players on SISI are just there to test new ship setups nothing more, the dev's don't have all day to sit down and playtest every feature constantly, if they did that nothing would get released, trust me i've tried to organise a few larger tests using a group of people and its not easy to do.
I'd like to keep clarifying this. I'm not talking about bugs. I expect them; that's just a fact of software life. Saying that the Devs haven't got time to test everything really sounds quite poor and points to a lack of resources though. Stuff gets released that isn't tested. Great.
Again my point is that some major areas of mechanics just get changed and thrown in without proper examination - in this instance salvaging/wrecks and missions. You tried organising missions on SISI? Mining Ops? Hiding in deadspace? Scanning out mission runners? Well I just trawled back through the Dev test posts and all I see is "try to kill me in a big gang". Please do point me at your requests though. All I'm saying is make an effort to test things methodically and with a cross section of the base. It's not as difficult concept, is it?
BTW what percentage of the player base use these forums anyway?
xx E
Eveanne, I can't help but wonder... Were you on the test server checking out these features? I admit, I didn't read the entire thread as I couldn't stomach the whinage. Perhaps if you're interested in the testing of new features you could do more to encourage it instead of battering the people who are doing something.
Originally by: Eveanne
I don't think that's valid, and I think it's too easy to blame the player base for a lack of thought or misguided bias.
Too easy to blame the Player Base? WFT?? Oh... right, blaming the Devs is never done. No one ever blames CCP on these forums. </sarcasm> Perhaps you would prefer to play WoW and have devs like EA? *cringes* If players are interested in the results of a patch perhaps they should be on the test server checking things out...
Anyway... sorry if this seems like a flame. It's just that it seems that the ones to complain the most are the ones that do nothing productive to improve things. Kinda like not voting then whining about who was voted into office.
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Falcione
Mortis Angelus
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Posted - 2006.12.08 23:37:00 -
[26]
Out of curiosity Eveanne, did you ever log into the test server and see how things were going?
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Daar
Gallente United Alliance
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Posted - 2006.12.08 23:55:00 -
[27]
I'm sorry, but this is the silliest thing ever. Yes, we, the players, get access to a test server. True enough. But WE ARE NOT GAME TESTERS! If I'd get paid for testing, or hell, have a free EVE subscription for testing EVE, then I would "test" my heart out probably.
Whoever says that it's the players fault that these problems (I'm talking about the obvious stuff: wreck in missions for example) weren't discovered early should really wake up. A developer, when he puts a change in, should really, really try it out, at least as far as he can do it alone (or in a small team). In the perfect scenario, then a dedicated group of testers (the larger, the better; picked from the playerbase, PAID to test- either that, or those who are complete fanatics) should go and do some more testing. Finally, then the changes can go live.
In the case of EVE, it seems there are no real testers. The devs have put up a test server, and seem to be happy. But you can't expect a casual player to wander into that server and start doing a real game-testers job. In any case, I actually wonder, if anyone really did make a mission run on the test server, and complained about the wrecks... would anyone listen? Finally, certain things like the map (and it's usefulness) would be obvious if a developer actually fired it off himself.
And, o'course, certain things indeed only become apparent after they are released (minor or rare bugs, problems with user hardware, problems with large scale mechanics). ------- Daar
Free will is an illusion... |
Avon
Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2006.12.09 00:07:00 -
[28]
Listen, if you don't think the community is worth a little bit of your time to look at the test client, then why do you think that same community should care to waste their time listening to your whines?
I tested on Sisi quite a lot, and I am guilty of not noticing that some people may want wreck status simplified for them, and for that I can only beg your forgiveness. (However, surprising as it may seem, there were other more pressing issues to be looked in to.)
The Battleships is not and should not be a solo pwnmobile - Oveur
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Eveanne
Gallente Sperm Trumpet Industries
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Posted - 2006.12.09 00:11:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Jeune Eveanne, I can't help but wonder... Were you on the test server checking out these features? I admit, I didn't read the entire thread as I couldn't stomach the whinage. Perhaps if you're interested in the testing of new features you could do more to encourage it instead of battering the people who are doing something.
Too easy to blame the Player Base? WFT?? Oh... right, blaming the Devs is never done. No one ever blames CCP on these forums. </sarcasm> [:roll: Perhaps you would prefer to play WoW and have devs like EA? *cringes* If players are interested in the results of a patch perhaps they should be on the test server checking things out...
Anyway... sorry if this seems like a flame. It's just that it seems that the ones to complain the most are the ones that do nothing productive to improve things. Kinda like not voting then whining about who was voted into office.
I wasn't aware I *was* whining and I don't know what WoW or EA is? I'm talking about the game I do play which is this one. I did try a number of times to get on the test server and gave up not being able to get the right patch. What I do know is that there were a few hundred invited guests on that server from the start of the testing of Revelations.
My serious, non-whiny request is that CCP think harder about how they test patches for game-play. I don't sit here as an apologist for people who tried SISI but I doubt they would have even looked at the problem areas. Were they asked to?
I would expect major changes to Eve to be thoroughly tested by the maker; even if that means asking for help from customers. By that I don't mean asking for 200 random board warriors to come and chase 1 ship for a day, but for a serious effort to get a cross-section to methodically test the game-play.
I honestly don't think it's Rocket Science V
xx E
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Active1313
Caldari Scorn. Sani Khal'Vecna
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Posted - 2006.12.09 00:33:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Eveanne Edited by: Eveanne on 08/12/2006 10:42:39 Edit - Too much swearing ^^
Originally by: SonOTassadar
Originally by: Eveanne
Originally by: Dendrin Koljn Bit unfair i think
Testing is on the test server...
Most of which involves people flying new ships and testing setups with new stuff.
Anything that requires 'work' and not just fitting a ship and blasting stuff has to wait to it goes online. This is not CCP's fault, its the fault of us THE PLAYERS.
CCP continually ask for people to get on the server and the most i've ever seen is 400 or so, and thats outta how many ? 100K or sumin.
Don't blame CCP just because the Player base are lazy and would rather just wait and moan about changes.
I don't think that's valid, and I think it's too easy to blame the player base for a lack of thought or misguided bias.
Apart from the devs there must be 3-400 people who have access to test new features before it goes onto SISI for the majority. I just fail to see how they could not see this coming if they represent us, the majority of players.
You don't think that is valid? How long has Windows Vista been delayed? How many people did they have beta testing it? I fully understand that CCP could miss things like loot collection and overly-pre-nerfed loot tables of salvaging. While salvaging is going to be a huge part of the game in the near future, who would have guessed something so simple as loot-tables would have such a dramatic impact on its implementation?
No. Windows Vista hasn't been released so it's not even a valid counter except to show that their testers are possibly saying, "Whoa this is ****** don't release it ffs"
All I'm saying is that with a balanced panel of testers this will not happen. It's not a technical problem, it's a planning and testing problem. If they keep doing things the way they are it will happen again and I don't think any of us want that if it can be avoided.
Becuase I am anal and was one of the Offical Beta Testers I feel the need to point out that in fact Vista has gone RTM, and therefore is a valid counter.
Oveur: "so this is what blasphemy on epic scales looks like, huh?" |
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