Pages: [1] 2 3 4 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Avera Mikou
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 03:47:00 -
[1]
When you log into eve online you can already view your character skills by going to the My Character page.
>>>>>>>Let us switch skill training from this page.<<<<<<<<<<
This way, people can still manage their skill training when they dont have the freedom to actually launch the eve client, like if they are at work or something, or from their cell phone if they have web access even.
Even if I am playing Eve at the moment, I am frequently not playing with the character I am currently training...so I would have to continously dock at a station, exit, switch skill, return to game...
This way all I have to do is minimze and switch skill without interrupting my playing.
I can't see any reason to object to this.
Please, guys, show your support on this thread for this feature and maybe we will get it.
|
Hesod Adee
Bright New Dawn
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 03:52:00 -
[2]
This would certainly make things easier for me. -----------------
My door is always open, just don't go in. |
Valandril
Caldari Resurrection R i s e
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 06:05:00 -
[3]
Very nice idea
/signed :-)
|
Alkirin
Gallente Die Hard Mining
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 09:57:00 -
[4]
It would also cut down on traffic after patches for those who are just looking to switch out skills.
[Cogito Ergo Sum Atheios] - Alkirin of Scientia Obscura |
Lygos
Interstellar Starbase Syndicate
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 10:22:00 -
[5]
"Results 1 - 10 of about 1,300 from myeve.eve-online.com for queue."
I always wanted to bump one of these.
--- T2 Risk |
Solomunio Kzenig
Amarr Imperial Academy
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 11:33:00 -
[6]
Excellent Idea...would really help as you could manage your training from work etc..
One Empire, One People, One Emperor, Forever under Heaven. Amarr Aeternus.
|
Solomunio Kzenig
Amarr Imperial Academy
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 11:37:00 -
[7]
Avera Mikou: remember to bump this thread every day and see how much support it gets.
One Empire, One People, One Emperor, Forever under Heaven. Amarr Aeternus.
|
Camperific
Es and Whizz
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 11:55:00 -
[8]
/me signed
|
Raven Timoshenko
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 12:33:00 -
[9]
/signed
|
Rhax
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 12:59:00 -
[10]
/signed too (Although I do think CCP has this in mind already )
|
|
Avera Mikou
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 14:44:00 -
[11]
If CCP had it in mind, they would have already done it. They've already made a website with a secure login to open a connection to the database. All that would be required is to add an html button to send a query to the database. I can't see how that would take anyone more than an hour to do.
Also, btw, I think this is a better option than skill queing, because a lot of people have objections to queing and only want to see active players get to train actively. This stays true to that.
|
Brolly
Caldari The Department of Justice
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 15:53:00 -
[12]
The main reason they haven't done this is that they want players in the game, just think of all those peeps whol would get an account and just train skills until they could do what they want.
If I had ú1 for every intelligent comment posted in general discussion, I'd be hideously in debt |
Rhax
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 17:32:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Avera Mikou If CCP had it in mind, they would have already done it. They've already made a website with a secure login to open a connection to the database. All that would be required is to add an html button to send a query to the database. I can't see how that would take anyone more than an hour to do.
You have a good point here, but implementing your idea wouldn't be a case of just putting a button on there to update the database. And yep, I do know what I am talking about here, as I am an ASP developer of over 5 years.
You might have noticed that the skill training tree isn't "live" as such - so there's no connection to the in game database from your skill tree. The skill information is likely pulled from an XML dump, which would be updated periodically. Try it now - change your skill training in game, then go to "My Character" to see if your skill training information has changed there too.
It would definitely not be a 1 hour job - unfortunately. I haven't looked into what kind of database(s) the game actually runs on, but I am guessing they're pretty custom, so there's no guarentee that ASP will be able to easily connect and update the information required. Although the game DB is able to dump XML data, which ASP can easily parse using MSXMLHTTP or MSXML2, it doesn't mean that the skills data can be directly accessed or updated using ASP.
But yes, it would be nice to set skill training from this site - and I'm sure CCP has at least thought about and discussed it, and perhaps even has plans to make it a feature? - Who knows?
|
Avera Mikou
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 17:46:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Avera Mikou on 09/12/2006 17:48:11
Originally by: Rhax You might have noticed that the skill training tree isn't "live" as such - so there's no connection to the in game database from your skill tree. The skill information is likely pulled from an XML dump, which would be updated periodically. Try it now - change your skill training in game, then go to "My Character" to see if your skill training information has changed there too.
Ok, if it doesn't have an active connection -- then open one. How many lines of code are we looking at here? A few lines to open a connection, then send a query...I have done database web progamming too and I don't see why that would take more than an hour.
|
BigWhale
Gallente
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 17:53:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Rhax It would definitely not be a 1 hour job - unfortunately. I haven't looked into what kind of database(s) the game actually runs on, but I am guessing they're pretty custom, so there's no guarentee that ASP will be able to easily connect and update the information required.
Completely off-topic, but, interfacing most of the major databases with web is nowadays trivial. Really.
|
Karazaan
Rakyra
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 18:00:00 -
[16]
Might be nice but not going to happen.
Long time ago, the web site was used to see the character information (even download it). It appear that for about a month, the Eve online servers were very slow because of the ammount of request that particular page was doing.
It was linked to a program (that shall remind unnamed) that was using that file to manage the skills training.
The pages was taken down and the program was nuked from existance. Let's just say that what came back was... different.
Look like some people ran the program 24/7 and asked it to autoupdate with the game data each 2 seconds. Or it could be hacking... Ethier way, it was shot down as the cause for the game problems.
In plain words: "We don't need any other stupid web pages doing a denial of service on the main game cluster and/or database".
This is also probably why I've read some time ago that we might be able to change skills thru our cell phones. Simple reason would be because it cost $ to send that request (to the cell provider) so you cannot do 1 mil request a day. |
Rhax
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 18:35:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Avera Mikou Ok, if it doesn't have an active connection -- then open one. How many lines of code are we looking at here? A few lines to open a connection, then send a query...I have done database web progamming too and I don't see why that would take more than an hour.
Maybe - IF - ASP can actually open a database connection in the first place. I don't think we're talking about MSSQL databases here for the game data - or any other "out of the box" db solution like DB2 or Oracle. The game data is likely to be stored in a customised way - and this is just my best guess, after reading into how another online game worked server-side some time ago (and that used Python and some serious pre-compiled voodoo in the background, if I remember correctly).
Besides, you've done web programming before, surely you could imagine that accessing and modifying in game MMO data from a website would likely be different than accessing your purpose-built and website friendly database? I mean, this wouldn't exactly be PHP and pulling text from MySQL - which yes, does take a couple of lines of code and a GO! button.
But my best-guesswork aside, perhaps you're right - maybe they do store the in game data (and I'm not talking about account info here) - in a compatible database, like DB2 or Oracle - or any of the other licenced database software that ASP can work with. And perhaps CCP have paid IBM or Sun or Microsoft the fees associated with using their software. And yep, it even take an hour of work to write a couple of lines of code to connect to whatever DB, secure it, and slap a form button on your Character's skill tree.
It's possible I guess, and although I seriously doubt it, I hope you're right and I'm wrong here. Because it'd be really nice for CCP to make this a feature, and the less work they have to do, the more likely it'll be done - quickly, at least.
Just my 0.02isk.
|
Avera Mikou
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 18:54:00 -
[18]
Karazan,
You bring up a valid point, one which cannot be ignored, but is EASILY taken care of.
For example: 1) Enter a visual character recognition code each time you want to update a skill. 2) Limit the number of requests per character to once every 30 minutes.
This pretty much kills any chance of automated abuse. Furthermore, it would actually REDUCE server load because all those people who are just logging on and off with the client to switch skill training are actually sending and recieving tons of data with the server, whereas this would greatly reduce the information exchange to the server for simply switching a skill.
|
Avera Mikou
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 18:59:00 -
[19]
Rhax,
Well, if what Karazaan says is true, then CCP already has the connection issues sorted out long ago!
|
BigWhale
Gallente
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 21:31:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Rhax Besides, you've done web programming before, surely you could imagine that accessing and modifying in game MMO data from a website would likely be different than accessing your purpose-built and website friendly database? I mean, this wouldn't exactly be PHP and pulling text from MySQL - which yes, does take a couple of lines of code and a GO! button.
My guess would be that in the very end, they are probably using Oracle or MSSQL. However cluster nodes are probably talking to the DB through some 'application server' which can provide all sorts of extra features that SQL servers can't. And that application server could be running on cluster node, on database server or it could be a dedicated server(s).
And all those protocols are probably well documented and could be used in many ways. I'm just not sure that this is something CCP would like to do.
Oh, and it is NEVER just 'an hour of work'. It is always a day, two or three. Or more likey, a week, two or three. ;)
|
|
Dai007
Caldari Crabbs
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 21:39:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Avera Mikou Edited by: Avera Mikou on 09/12/2006 18:54:53 To avoid automated abuse of this feature:
1) Enter a visual character recognition code each time you want to update a skill. 2) Limit the number of requests per character to once every 30 minutes.
And you think an image/code will keep people from using bots?, simply to create an OCR reader.
A limit, it would cause havoc - a skill that takes 4 minutes, "OMG I LOST 26 MINS OF TRAINING OMG!!!! WHINE WHINE!!"
It just isnt going to work, too many security issues.
No vote from me :)
|
Avera Mikou
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 22:27:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Avera Mikou on 09/12/2006 22:29:07
Originally by: Dai007 And you think an image/code will keep people from using bots?, simply to create an OCR reader.
First of all, OCR is OPTICAL character recognition. Optical character recognition is for recognizing text on a page. It is very different because text on a page has nice regular font, whereas we are talking about highly distorted text with lots of noise added.
And yes, I do think that it would stop bots, because there are no bots which can actually read characters distorted and messed up to the amount that a human can. That is exactly what these things are designed for -- deterring bots.
It would be a LOT EASIER to program a bot to sit at home and open up the eve client and switch skill training. There would be no need to decipher cryptic text which is impossible to do. Instead all it would have to do is navigate a few cookie cutter menus, recognize some button template images, etc.
I could write this program myself, in fact. However, I don't think anybody has even made such a program. But if they wanted to hack skill queueing, this would be easier than hacking a character recognition problem.
Quote: A limit, it would cause havoc - a skill that takes 4 minutes, "OMG I LOST 26 MINS OF TRAINING OMG!!!! WHINE WHINE!!"
Waiting 26 extra minutes is better than waiting 8 hours to come home from work.
Quote: It just isnt going to work, too many security issues.
All your complaints have been refuted.
|
Avera Mikou
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 22:32:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Avera Mikou on 09/12/2006 22:32:34 double post
|
Rhax
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 23:34:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Avera Mikou Rhax,
Well, if what Karazaan says is true, then CCP already has the connection issues sorted out long ago!
Ahha! - there may be hope yet. I vaguely remember something about what Karazaan mentioned too, when I started playing in 2004. Looks like my guesswork was off the mark . I guess if CCP could sort out the security side of things, and the extra lag it might cause (which probably won't be much if it's JUST the character sheet accessing the data) - then this would be great.
I'm actually surprised that my reply to your reply posted, Avera, as the forum went down on a 500... lol Anyway - I think you're going to get some serious support with this idea from the playerbase... just hope CCP put it into action.
|
Rhax
|
Posted - 2006.12.09 23:37:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Rhax on 10/12/2006 00:00:08
Originally by: BigWhale
Oh, and it is NEVER just 'an hour of work'. It is always a day, two or three. Or more likey, a week, two or three. ;)
lol ... all depends on if the web developers get paid bonuses or not But yep, know exactly what you mean there.
Edit: Oh and btw.. as for OCR and CAPTCHA* tests - Google, Yahoo and a few other of the big sites use (supposedly) almost-unbreakable CAPTCHA* methods - according to the guys at captcha.net (Carnegie Mellon University) who work on the project. (I've done a little research and wrote my own code for outputting a binary-to-bitmap CAPTCHA test recently)
* CAPTCHA = Completely Automated Public Turing Test to Tell Computers and Humans Apart
Originally by: Avera Mikou It would be a LOT EASIER to program a bot to sit at home and open up the eve client and switch skill training. There would be no need to decipher cryptic text which is impossible to do. Instead all it would have to do is navigate a few cookie cutter menus, recognize some button template images, etc.
I could write this program myself, in fact. However, I don't think anybody has even made such a program. But if they wanted to hack skill queueing, this would be easier than hacking a character recognition problem.
Actually, there is a guy (with way too much time on his hands) who wrote a program to decipher even warped and rotated text in images. He came to the conclusion that it was very difficult to do for starters, and it would have to be customised for whatever CAPTCHA method a site was using. He calls his little application PWNTCHA... lol
http://sam.zoy.org/pwntcha/
|
Dai007
Caldari Crabbs
|
Posted - 2006.12.10 00:14:00 -
[26]
Lol, you really think by warping letters and using "fonts" GOSH FONTS!, and noise will stop bots? lmao.
Check nearly every text based game out there like darkfuture, they have all been botted.
Besides that it is a stupid idea... lets stop playing eve and just spend a year viewing a website to train!!. No
|
Avera Mikou
|
Posted - 2006.12.10 00:33:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Avera Mikou on 10/12/2006 00:33:26
Originally by: Dai007 Lol, you really think by warping letters and using "fonts" GOSH FONTS!, and noise will stop bots? lmao.
No Dai, I'm the one laughing my ass off at you. You obviously have not done much research in computer vision.
|
Letheeth Kayl
|
Posted - 2006.12.10 04:45:00 -
[28]
TOO MANY SMART PEOPLE Talking about programming (something I hardly understand). I like the idea, it's as great as the idea of queing skills (though there's alot more people against that idea). May I suggest that the interval time be increased to 1 hour, instead of 30 minutes, that would halve the potential lag or server usage over 30 minutes, while not drastically changing the service. You can't train any l1 skills with this that haven't been already started, and most people do take the time to train their l1 skills while playing, as they only take 5-60 minutes, and most skills take at least 30 minutes for the second level (and that's only with high attributes, which requires alot of previous playing). All in all, fantastic (though I can hardly understand all that hullaballu about coding).
|
Taedrin
Gallente Mercatoris Technologies
|
Posted - 2006.12.10 06:12:00 -
[29]
I thought that this was going to be a stupid suggestion, but I was wrong
/signed
|
XFreedomX
|
Posted - 2006.12.10 07:37:00 -
[30]
Good Idea!
/signed
|
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] 2 3 4 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |