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Aminari Talar
KarnalKnowledge Void..
31
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Posted - 2015.09.13 06:04:06 -
[1] - Quote
Assault ships are still out of their element. With the current meta being really heavily around nano-kiting, we could really use a anti-nano ship. Luckly we have the Assault ship working in that way, so i want to make some radical suggestions to this ship class
Covert-Assault ships
Bonus's - Improved Movement Speed While Cloaked - Improved Rate of Fire, Damage, Optimal Fall off. Role Bonus: Can Fit Covert Ops
The Idea here would be something like a Recon and bomber but with normal weapons, and high damage. This assault ship would be less tanky then its tackle counter part with a 10-15k tank, and slower speeds (1500-2k ish) but it's trade off would be offering higher dps (300-400 dps) Rates, and cloaking options.
The Heavy Tackle Assault ship
Bonus's - Web, Scram Range bonus - MWD Speed Bonus
Role Bonus:- Resistances
The Idea of this model would be to give all assault ships a special type of armor (Role play) which grants something like 60% Base Resistance across the board for its taking type (Armor/shield). The idea to this concept is it would be great.
The idea would be a 35k-40k Tanked 3-4k Assault ship, with 40-60km web/scrams. The Draw backs would be inferior damage (max of 3 turrets).
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Zavand Crendraven
Rolling Static Gone Critical
21
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Posted - 2015.09.13 07:51:43 -
[2] - Quote
Aminari Talar wrote:Assault ships are still out of their element. With the current meta being really heavily around nano-kiting, we could really use a anti-nano ship. Luckly we have the Assault ship working in that way, so i want to make some radical suggestions to this ship class
Covert-Assault ships
Bonus's - Improved Movement Speed While Cloaked - Improved Rate of Fire, Damage, Optimal Fall off. Role Bonus: Can Fit Covert Ops
The Idea here would be something like a Recon and bomber but with normal weapons, and high damage. This assault ship would be less tanky then its tackle counter part with a 10-15k tank, and slower speeds (1500-2k ish) but it's trade off would be offering higher dps (300-400 dps) Rates, and cloaking options.
So im gonna assume this is a frigate since 300 - 400 dps range is quite common on cruisers. No theres no reason to give a cloaky frigate a 10 - 15k tank. Cloaky ships gets a covert ops cloak which is insanely good of a module theres no reason to give it 10 - 15k tank and 300 - 400 dps. Stealth bombers get if tanked usually ~7k ehp and about 370 - 550dps depending on how many BCU you put on them but they have to deal the damage with torpedoes which has one of the worst damage applications in the game.
Aminari Talar wrote: The Heavy Tackle Assault ship
Bonus's - Web, Scram Range bonus - MWD Speed Bonus
Role Bonus:- Resistances
The Idea of this model would be to give all assault ships a special type of armor (Role play) which grants something like 60% Base Resistance across the board for its taking type (Armor/shield). The idea to this concept is it would be great.
The idea would be a 35k-40k Tanked 3-4k Assault ship, with 40-60km web/scrams. The Draw backs would be inferior damage (max of 3 turrets).
Get a Minmatar/Gallente Recon this is pretty much exactly what you asked for. |
Aminari Talar
KarnalKnowledge Void..
31
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Posted - 2015.09.13 11:12:51 -
[3] - Quote
No,
10-15k Tank is what inties are at. It's nothing but paper. A Covert Op;s option would provide a great benefit to assault for tackle and roaming options. The Dps gives them a buff and helps put them in the current bottom meta (in this case i mean the starter area of training).
Additionally, Its not a recon, because recons warp cloaked. A 35-40k Tank is slightly higher then recons. Additionally The speed makes them faster then recons, so it would give them a heavy, speed tackle which is something highly needed in eve atm being that its so hard to catch faster nano crap.
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Reaver Glitterstim
Dromedaworks inc Test Alliance Please Ignore
2618
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Posted - 2015.09.13 11:40:59 -
[4] - Quote
Tackle ships need to be fast and agile, and fast and agile ships need to be squishy. The interceptor is basically an assault ship built for speed. If you want a variant of it with more tank and DPS, it'll have to have its speed reduced, and then it's no good for catching anything small and fast because it has no speed or tracking. Combat recon ships are good for catching medium speed ships, and they trade heavy DPS for a strong ability to hold the target down. There aren't any existing cruisers really built to be fast tackle, but you can very easily fit a strategic cruiser into that role if you want to.
I think there is a precedence for giving us fast tackle cruisers, but with less DPS output and a bigger focus on interceptor-like tackling ability and tank, with high maneuverability (for a cruiser) to supplement its moderate tank. It would be a heavy interceptor suitable for holding down a bigger catch that can fight back, or maybe just when you expect your fleet to take a moment to arrive and you need to survive for a while and not let the target go. It would not be prudent to give such a ship both good webbing ability and good DPS, or else it could be used to overly great effect in which it uses its webbing to allow its slow-tracking weapons to score good hits. That's a little too powerful for one ship.
Stealth bombers give up control for DPS, Recons give up DPS for control, and both of them give up maneuverability for sheer output. Force Recons and Stealth Bombers are nice for ambushing, but neither one is very good at giving chase. The covert ops role simply helps them to mitigate their large weakness without actually removing it.
Pirate ship Nightmare, can you fathom
Larger but with smaller spikes than Phantasm
The Succubus looks meaner
But the Revenant cleaner
Seems as they get bigger, the smaller spikes they has'm
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Aminari Talar
KarnalKnowledge Void..
32
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Posted - 2015.09.13 11:47:27 -
[5] - Quote
Not really.
Realistically if we look at the buffs to the more tackle oriented aslt frig here, we are talking about a 10% Resistance buff, and some bonus changes.
Since i get about 28k tank in my current assault fit, its not really much more of a buff out side of maybe one low, or that 10% Bonus. With new bonus's we are really only changing the roles and what not.
the major change to assault purposed comes in the covert ops variant. But i favor the idea of more cloak based ships. |
Lugh Crow-Slave
1223
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Posted - 2015.09.13 12:03:19 -
[6] - Quote
Lol near bomber dps but can be applied to almost any target what could be unballanced about that?
Fuel block colors? Missiles for Caldari T3? Corp Stasis
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Aminari Talar
KarnalKnowledge Void..
32
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Posted - 2015.09.13 12:30:03 -
[7] - Quote
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:Lol near bomber dps but can be applied to almost any target what could be unballanced about that?
Bombers do 1100 dps with the right fits. |
Imustbecomfused
Clandeshawl Industry
58
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Posted - 2015.09.13 13:04:24 -
[8] - Quote
and can we please have the jag and wolf head-lights back please? |
Azazel The Misanthrope
Proioxis Assault Force Exodus.
57
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Posted - 2015.09.13 14:59:19 -
[9] - Quote
Really? Assault Ships? Please reference whether you mean the frigate class or the cruiser class, it is pretty apparent which one you mean based on context, but seriously, they have two different names for a reason please vindicate their usage.
Secondly, I do not think this is a good idea, last thing eve needs is even more power creep. AF's need only enough speed to make them, at the very least, competitive with T1 frigates, and slightly more buffer values to make up for the stripping you would need to do to make them comparable to T1s. Even with that being said; they are really far too expensive to be used as tacklers half of the time anyway. |
Zepheros Naeonis
TinklePee
49
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Posted - 2015.09.13 17:56:43 -
[10] - Quote
Aminari Talar wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:Lol near bomber dps but can be applied to almost any target what could be unballanced about that? Bombers do 1100 dps with the right fits.
With polarized launchers overheated and faction BCS, sure. Otherwise, no, they do not. |
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ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Snuffed Out
8665
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Posted - 2015.09.13 18:07:32 -
[11] - Quote
Aminari Talar wrote:10-15k Tank is what inties are at. It's nothing but paper.
Aminari Talar wrote:Since i get about 28k tank in my current assault fit
Aminari Talar wrote:Bombers do 1100 dps with the right fits. Those numbers are WAY too high IMO (see: they are double what is realistic). Show me fits or I'm going to have to call "troll" on this.
edit: also... cloaking abilities + high damage + high tank + high speed = overpowered.
Cloaking ships are, by default, supposed to be squishy and/or have anemic damage output to compensate for their ability to pick and choose engagements.
You are not supposed to "have it all."
How did you Veterans start?
The Skillpoint System and You
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Lugh Crow-Slave
1227
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Posted - 2015.09.13 18:09:28 -
[12] - Quote
Aminari Talar wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:Lol near bomber dps but can be applied to almost any target what could be unballanced about that? Bombers do 1100 dps with the right fits.
A standard bomber will do around 550-750 dps and is locked to one damage type
Fuel block colors? Missiles for Caldari T3? Corp Stasis
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Samillian
Angry Mustellid Decayed Orbit
980
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Posted - 2015.09.13 21:45:37 -
[13] - Quote
While Assault frigates need something since they were made virtually obsolete by T3Ds making them massively overpowered and obsoleting a variety of other ship classes in the process is not the way to go.
Not supported.
NBSI shall be the whole of the Law
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Imustbecomfused
The-Ultraviolet-Realm
61
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Posted - 2015.09.25 04:03:38 -
[14] - Quote
Azazel The Misanthrope wrote:Really? Assault Ships? Please reference whether you mean the frigate class or the cruiser class, it is pretty apparent which one you mean based on context, but seriously, they have two different names for a reason please vindicate their usage.
Secondly, I do not think this is a good idea, last thing eve needs is even more power creep. AF's need only enough speed to make them, at the very least, competitive with T1 frigates, and slightly more buffer values to make up for the stripping you would need to do to make them comparable to T1s. Even with that being said; they are really far too expensive to be used as tacklers half of the time anyway.
bullshit. they need HEADLIGHTS! |
Imustbecomfused
The-Ultraviolet-Realm
61
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Posted - 2015.09.25 04:04:26 -
[15] - Quote
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:Aminari Talar wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:Lol near bomber dps but can be applied to almost any target what could be unballanced about that? Bombers do 1100 dps with the right fits. A standard bomber will do around 550-750 dps and is locked to one damage type
gives cookie |
Arya Ikahrus
5
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Posted - 2015.09.25 08:39:34 -
[16] - Quote
Putting covops cloaks on Assault Frigates would be fun.
No idea if it would be balanced, probably not without a lot of tweaking, but it certainly would be fun. |
SFM Hobb3s
Wrecking Shots Northern Coalition.
377
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Posted - 2015.09.25 13:38:48 -
[17] - Quote
Samillian wrote:While Assault frigates need something since they were made virtually obsolete by T3Ds making them massively overpowered and obsoleting a variety of other ship classes in the process is not the way to go.
Not supported.
Assault frigs are fine as is. And they are by no means made obsolete by t3d's (maybe just svipuls because they are still way too OP). People forget that T3D's were designed to DESTROY small stuff, hence being known as DESTROYERS. For instance, any decent Wolf or Jag pilot worth his mettle, or a pair of them for that matter, should be able to wreck a confessor.
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Samillian
Angry Mustellid Decayed Orbit
1004
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Posted - 2015.09.25 13:55:57 -
[18] - Quote
Really? If so why do I see almost zero AF's in use in small gang warfare anymore?
AFs were one of EvEs great pleasures but now they no longer have the speed, projection, damage or tank to deal with most T3Ds which have almost completely taken over there role. While I grant you that two to one AFs they may stand a chance of taking down a Confessor if the pilot is inexperienced, unlucky or running without links but the chances are even if the Confessor doesn't score a kill it will be able to deaggro or tank until support arrives.
It is a shame but it is the how things have been since T3Ds were introduced.
NBSI shall be the whole of the Law
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James Baboli
Warp to Pharmacy
1038
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Posted - 2015.09.25 14:45:18 -
[19] - Quote
Zepheros Naeonis wrote:Aminari Talar wrote:Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:Lol near bomber dps but can be applied to almost any target what could be unballanced about that? Bombers do 1100 dps with the right fits. With polarized launchers overheated and faction BCS, sure. Otherwise, no, they do not.
All t2, no implants, max skills, the lowest DPS bomber, when DPS fit, is the manticore at a pathetic.... 690 DPS cold and 811 hot. If you go for faction or implants without polarized guns, they quickly reach 1 k.
Talking more,
Flying crazier,
And drinking more
Making battleships worth the warp
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