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Cailais
Amarr THE SEFRIM INSTITUTE Blood Raiders Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.08 13:18:00 -
[1]
Im looking at starting a new career in the IT industry, despite having no qualifications in IT - I was thinking of doing a Cert Internet Webmaster course, and doing web design. So I thought I'd ask this cool community for some advice...
Any other EVE players out there who have any advice on this? Would I need more qualifications, such as C++ programming skills? And is it a viable career??
Hope you guys can help!
Fly safe.
C.
www.sefrim.com - sig design - eve mail for details
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FireFoxx80
Caldari E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2007.01.08 13:47:00 -
[2]
Taking a SQL qualification and something like .NET or Java will help immensely. Or going the other way, look at a Photoshop course.
What I do the rest of the time - Vote for a Jita bypass! |
Cailais
Amarr THE SEFRIM INSTITUTE Blood Raiders Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.08 19:26:00 -
[3]
Thanks FireFoxx - useful info!!
C.
www.sefrim.com - sig design - eve mail for details
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DarkMatter
Amarr Mineral Aquisition Group
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Posted - 2007.01.08 19:27:00 -
[4]
What do you do for a living now? Is IT much different?
Building the homestead |
Ikvar
Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.01.08 19:42:00 -
[5]
There's no money in web design by the way.
Originally by: Rekindle I was in an empire system when they used their grief tactics to explode everything I own.
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Cailais
Amarr THE SEFRIM INSTITUTE Blood Raiders Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.08 19:48:00 -
[6]
Originally by: DarkMatter What do you do for a living now? Is IT much different?
Well basically I have zero IT experience (I'm in the military) - and from what I have researched so far there seems to be a number of qualifications related to any particular 'field' of IT. My worry is I could spend a fortune doing a CIW course, and actually I need courses X, Y and Z also to be employable. I'm also looking at MCSA, Comp TIA A+ & Comp TIA Network. If there's a 'cluster' of qualifications I should look at what would those be?
C.
www.sefrim.com - sig design - eve mail for details
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Cyrus Graham
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.01.08 19:54:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Ikvar There's no money in web design by the way.
This guy begs to differ. ___________________________________
Go play checkers if you want a game where everything's fair and equal. |
Ikvar
Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.01.08 19:56:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Cyrus Graham
Originally by: Ikvar There's no money in web design by the way.
This guy begs to differ.
Wow, an 'ORLY?' image macro. Excuse me while I stitch my sides back together.
Originally by: Rekindle I was in an empire system when they used their grief tactics to explode everything I own.
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Cyrus Graham
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.01.08 19:58:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Cailais
Originally by: DarkMatter What do you do for a living now? Is IT much different?
Well basically I have zero IT experience (I'm in the military) - and from what I have researched so far there seems to be a number of qualifications related to any particular 'field' of IT. My worry is I could spend a fortune doing a CIW course, and actually I need courses X, Y and Z also to be employable. I'm also looking at MCSA, Comp TIA A+ & Comp TIA Network. If there's a 'cluster' of qualifications I should look at what would those be?
C.
Do you have security clearance? If so, you might be able to narrow your job search to jobs that require clearance, because by hiring you over Civilian Bob a company can save themselves time and money in the hiring process. From there you can figure out what sort of training is needed for the jobs you are interested in. ___________________________________
Go play checkers if you want a game where everything's fair and equal. |
Cyrus Graham
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.01.08 19:58:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Ikvar
Originally by: Cyrus Graham
Originally by: Ikvar There's no money in web design by the way.
This guy begs to differ.
Wow, an 'ORLY?' image macro. Excuse me while I stitch my sides back together.
You have 5 minutes. I'll be waiting. ___________________________________
Go play checkers if you want a game where everything's fair and equal. |
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DarkMatter
Amarr Mineral Aquisition Group
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Posted - 2007.01.08 20:01:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Cyrus Graham
Originally by: Cailais
Originally by: DarkMatter What do you do for a living now? Is IT much different?
Well basically I have zero IT experience (I'm in the military) - and from what I have researched so far there seems to be a number of qualifications related to any particular 'field' of IT. My worry is I could spend a fortune doing a CIW course, and actually I need courses X, Y and Z also to be employable. I'm also looking at MCSA, Comp TIA A+ & Comp TIA Network. If there's a 'cluster' of qualifications I should look at what would those be?
C.
Do you have security clearance? If so, you might be able to narrow your job search to jobs that require clearance, because by hiring you over Civilian Bob a company can save themselves time and money in the hiring process. From there you can figure out what sort of training is needed for the jobs you are interested in.
That sounds like a good plan...
Are you a hardware kind of guy (can build comps & such), or software (programmer)?
I'm not in the IT field, but there seems to be a dividing line between the two as far as "types" of IT personnel...
Building the homestead |
Cyrus Graham
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.01.08 20:08:00 -
[12]
Originally by: DarkMatter
Originally by: Cyrus Graham
Originally by: Cailais
Originally by: DarkMatter What do you do for a living now? Is IT much different?
Well basically I have zero IT experience (I'm in the military) - and from what I have researched so far there seems to be a number of qualifications related to any particular 'field' of IT. My worry is I could spend a fortune doing a CIW course, and actually I need courses X, Y and Z also to be employable. I'm also looking at MCSA, Comp TIA A+ & Comp TIA Network. If there's a 'cluster' of qualifications I should look at what would those be?
C.
Do you have security clearance? If so, you might be able to narrow your job search to jobs that require clearance, because by hiring you over Civilian Bob a company can save themselves time and money in the hiring process. From there you can figure out what sort of training is needed for the jobs you are interested in.
That sounds like a good plan...
Are you a hardware kind of guy (can build comps & such), or software (programmer)?
I'm not in the IT field, but there seems to be a dividing line between the two as far as "types" of IT personnel...
I was hardware. Now I'm a crew chief for KC-135s in the Air Force. ___________________________________
Go play checkers if you want a game where everything's fair and equal. |
Cailais
Amarr THE SEFRIM INSTITUTE Blood Raiders Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.08 20:23:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Cyrus Graham
Originally by: Cailais
Originally by: DarkMatter What do you do for a living now? Is IT much different?
Well basically I have zero IT experience (I'm in the military) - and from what I have researched so far there seems to be a number of qualifications related to any particular 'field' of IT. My worry is I could spend a fortune doing a CIW course, and actually I need courses X, Y and Z also to be employable. I'm also looking at MCSA, Comp TIA A+ & Comp TIA Network. If there's a 'cluster' of qualifications I should look at what would those be?
C.
Do you have security clearance? If so, you might be able to narrow your job search to jobs that require clearance, because by hiring you over Civilian Bob a company can save themselves time and money in the hiring process. From there you can figure out what sort of training is needed for the jobs you are interested in.
Software interests me more than the hard ware aspect. I'm security cleared (SC) and was DV (direct vetting), but I think that's lapsed now. In simple terms I'm cleared to review up to secret, and was cleared to view secret and above; so yes it could be an advantage I guess. Seems to be some dispute over wether web design rakes in the big bucks... My questions stem from a job advert I saw asking for CIW Webmaster and C++. I was under the impresion that C++ was pure code programming and not really related to HTML, Java or Flash so I couldn't see a link (though I might be wrong there)?
C.
www.sefrim.com - sig design - eve mail for details
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DarkMatter
Amarr Mineral Aquisition Group
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Posted - 2007.01.08 20:54:00 -
[14]
Edited by: DarkMatter on 08/01/2007 20:51:16
Originally by: Cyrus Graham
Originally by: DarkMatter
Originally by: Cyrus Graham
Originally by: Cailais
Originally by: DarkMatter What do you do for a living now? Is IT much different?
Well basically I have zero IT experience (I'm in the military) - and from what I have researched so far there seems to be a number of qualifications related to any particular 'field' of IT. My worry is I could spend a fortune doing a CIW course, and actually I need courses X, Y and Z also to be employable. I'm also looking at MCSA, Comp TIA A+ & Comp TIA Network. If there's a 'cluster' of qualifications I should look at what would those be?
C.
Do you have security clearance? If so, you might be able to narrow your job search to jobs that require clearance, because by hiring you over Civilian Bob a company can save themselves time and money in the hiring process. From there you can figure out what sort of training is needed for the jobs you are interested in.
That sounds like a good plan...
Are you a hardware kind of guy (can build comps & such), or software (programmer)?
I'm not in the IT field, but there seems to be a dividing line between the two as far as "types" of IT personnel...
I was hardware. Now I'm a crew chief for KC-135s in the Air Force.
Cool, I live near the Niagara Falls Air Force base, they have KC-135's (or they used too, not sure what happend when they had all the cuts). Bunch of good old C-130's too...
Used to have F-4's and then F-16 throughout the early 90's, but it's just air-lift & Re-fueling wings now...
Building the homestead |
Gunstar Zero
Caldari Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.09 00:44:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Gunstar Zero on 09/01/2007 00:41:54
Originally by: Cailais Im looking at starting a new career in the IT industry, despite having no qualifications in IT - I was thinking of doing a Cert Internet Webmaster course, and doing web design. So I thought I'd ask this cool community for some advice...
Any other EVE players out there who have any advice on this? Would I need more qualifications, such as C++ programming skills? And is it a viable career??
Hope you guys can help!
Fly safe.
C.
It's not a decision to take lightly - to get a decent wage in I.T. you have to be good / or have skills in the flavour of the month skill shortage. If you like coding, .net / c# / mssql is not a bad way to go - It's in demand right now, but who know what it would be like in 12-24 months.
Have you thought about going into project management? With PRINCE2 / ITIL / MSF or similar you can make a really good living. A lot of ex-military types I know do this kind of thing. -- Kicking ass and organising people to get **** done essentially. Good money.
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Xrak
Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.01.09 01:08:00 -
[16]
So what jobs are there, that aren't coding, artistic or management?
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Ravelin Eb
Minmatar Infinitus Odium
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Posted - 2007.01.09 01:16:00 -
[17]
Networking :) its probably the best thing in the industry
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Cailais
Amarr THE SEFRIM INSTITUTE Blood Raiders Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.09 01:48:00 -
[18]
It's not a decision to take lightly - to get a decent wage in I.T. you have to be good / or have skills in the flavour of the month skill shortage. If you like coding, .net / c# / mssql is not a bad way to go - It's in demand right now, but who know what it would be like in 12-24 months.
Have you thought about going into project management? With PRINCE2 / ITIL / MSF or similar you can make a really good living. A lot of ex-military types I know do this kind of thing. -- Kicking ass and organising people to get **** done essentially. Good money.
had a look at ITIL - And thats perfect - exactly what I should be looking at I think - thankyou. I might combine that with some 'tech knowledge' so I can get my hands dirty if need be. Probably useful to have at least some practical knowledge rather than just the 'theory' that ITIL seems to be (at first glance). PRINCE 2 Im aware of already, bit generalist and a tad...well dull...but doable. Some good advice here, cheers guys!
C.
www.sefrim.com - sig design - eve mail for details
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Frank Horrigan
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Posted - 2007.01.09 02:51:00 -
[19]
I'm highly intrested in this topic as i'm going to college in august..
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Cailais
Amarr THE SEFRIM INSTITUTE Blood Raiders Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.09 06:09:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Cailais on 09/01/2007 06:06:20
Originally by: Frank Horrigan I'm highly intrested in this topic as i'm going to college in august..
Frank
I can't say if these sites I have looked at are actually any good, but they helped me do a bit more research into the subject, wikipedia also quite useful for terminology. Good luck at college.
microsoft learning
IT Jobs Watch
e skills.com
about - certifiction
C
www.sefrim.com - sig design - eve mail for details
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Weebear
The Bowrey
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Posted - 2007.01.09 09:50:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Ikvar There's no money in web design by the way.
Not entirely true, but he is right in that you will make no money from sitting any of these "webmaster" courses you mentioned.
Download the free web express version of Visual Studio from the microsoft site, and obtain a few books on XHTML, C#, CSS and designing accessible websites, and a database of your choice (probably MS SQL, as you get the developer edition with the version of Visual Studio above) and you are well on your way |
Tonoppa
The Collective Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2007.01.09 10:51:00 -
[22]
There is also Quality Assurance or Field Support in big companies. But without any qualification I dont think you'll get in.
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Jiekon
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Posted - 2007.01.09 11:36:00 -
[23]
I started out doing a course in Software Development. failed and started a course in Computer & Network Support realised the Computer Support industry wasn't for me and went back to Software Development
I'm currently halfway through my degree (just finished 2 years at college, going to uni for 2 years in September) and i ended up working for CCP, the best job i've ever had so far to be honest.
So i'd reccomend going for some form of programming job if you're into it. university course im doing is Software Engineering \o/ ___________________________ ~Jiekon
Known Issues Bug Reporting Guides for new Revelations Features
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FireFoxx80
Caldari E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2007.01.09 12:44:00 -
[24]
Just to elaborate on my point a bit,"webmaster" is a wide description of the task at hand. From it, you can cover:
Web content editors, cut-and-paste monkeys. Web designers, mostly a Photoshop background and/or some knowledge of typography (Adobe Illustrator, Quark, etc). Good web designers will also have knowledge of what is technically possible, rather than creating beautifully useless designs. Web developers, take the design (HTML + images/flash/etc) and konfabulate them with PHP/ASP/.NET/Java/etc. 80% of the time this is just doing database queries (see SQL below), validating form inputs, and sending out emails. Hence most 'web designers' are combination of Web Design and Web Developer. Systems programmers/Online programmers, rarely touch HTML, instead focus on doing hardcore programming side of things. Much more technically minded than Web Developers above, but unlikely to be as 'artistically gifted' as true Web 'designers'. Database experts/administrators, look after the databases, create tables, and optimise queries for the developers and programmers above. Systems administrators, look after the physical server machine. Network administrators, look after the physical server, talking to the interweb.
People are rarely a single entity on this (made up) chart. Everyone I know covers about 3-4 areas (web content to web developer, or systems programmer to network admin), whilst I myself focus on web development to systems administration). Though I think every serious 'webmaster' I know, has a basic knowledge of all areas; eg. the designers know that the server people may need to install extra software on the server, to cope with a particular site).
So, you should really focus your training at an area you want to work in. I must admit, design is something that few people can get from brain to paper; so it sounds like you want to concentrate on the more technical side of things.
To be completely honest the industry is one that is saturated at low levels. Everyone knows someone who "has designed a web site". So focusing on the technical side of things where transferable skills come into effect, is probably a good way to go. As people above have mentioned, you can get all sorts of certificates, but you should have an idea of where you want to be at the end of it all before spending cash on random qualifications.
.NET is the big thing at the moment. But I know qualifications like CCNA (Cisco), Java, Photoshop, Windows 2000/2003 administration (MCSE), Red Hat Linux (RHCE ?); have all been in long-term demand.
Incidentally, with your military background, have you looked into whether the MOD have any IT programs?
Anyway, this is just my own opinion of it all. Others might think I am totally wrong.
What I do the rest of the time - Vote for a Jita bypass! |
Stevie mcStepherson
Second Wave Supplies
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Posted - 2007.01.09 12:47:00 -
[25]
Rather than these indvidual courses, you might want to look at a uni course. Think it was in my first year, they had an article stating that some of the bigger companies are looking more at 'soft (generic) skills' IE you learn the main theory of software development, project management whatever. Then you can use this knowledge to rapidly learn new methodologies, update your current knowledge etc.
If you are going down the specialist course route, make sure it is a reputable company you are doing it with. In the UK employment papers you see one to many "Get an it job after our training course ads". Never done one but they smell like a freeform contract to me!
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FireFoxx80
Caldari E X O D U S Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2007.01.09 12:50:00 -
[26]
Edited by: FireFoxx80 on 09/01/2007 12:47:06 Blatant plug
What I do the rest of the time - Vote for a Jita bypass! |
Oriodus
The Caldari Confederation
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Posted - 2007.01.09 12:53:00 -
[27]
I'm a web designer/developer...the way in which i got to where i am was by trying out different job roles within the media industry. I used to be a graphic artist at an architectural practice now i work for the government.
I've got qualifications in animation & creative media, aswell as information & communication technology. This combined set of qualification (both technical and design oriented) helped me secure my job, but i dont think you need a full set of web design orientated qualifications as long as you can successfully show what you can do.
I'd suggest playing with basic web design, learn some aspects of HTML, PHP, CSS, Action Scripting/Flash and of course how to use the web editing software such as Dreamweaver. It wont take you long after you've played around to decide whether you want to continue down that path...if you do then qualifications can be obtained while working. I for one am now going to gain more qualifications based on dynamic/database web contents.
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Mother Clanger
Royal Amarr Institute
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Posted - 2007.01.09 20:41:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Ikvar There's no money in web design by the way.
Not altogether true if what I've read is accurate.
Failing that, ever thought about helpdesk?
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Cailais
Amarr THE SEFRIM INSTITUTE Blood Raiders Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.09 21:26:00 -
[29]
Thanks for all the reponses, shows there's a good amount of enthusiasm for the industy which sounds encouraging. My impression so far is:
1. Web design is a bit of a 'flooded market', and in actuality broken down into several specialisations - and it won't stand alone. 2. Most careers within the IT sector require a portfolio of skills and experience - a single qualification won't get you too far. 3. Project management / ITIL is closest to my current skill set, but its high level stuff. 4. Programming (of whatever nature) is quite 'hard core' - but seems popular and crucially in demand in the right areas.
I think the web design aspect is something I could probably teach myself rather than invest to heavily in a course - I'm certainly getting that impression, and I managed to botch together a corp web site so I have a little bit of an idea about where to go next. Programming being less 'transparent' really requires some external tuition - and thats where I think I need to focus. ITIL / Project Management looks feasible - but I will probably need to get into the industry first: its not really entry level stuff. Helpdesk work would certainly give me an umbrella to cover me while I qual'd up. Any one think I'm wide of the mark on these assumptions?
(Im also concerned about the large percentage of caldari players who know about this subject, a conspiracy perhaps?....tin foil hat time me thinks...)
C.
www.sefrim.com - sig design - eve mail for details
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Cailais
Amarr THE SEFRIM INSTITUTE Blood Raiders Alliance
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Posted - 2007.01.10 01:24:00 -
[30]
Edited by: Cailais on 10/01/2007 01:21:34 Edited by: Cailais on 10/01/2007 01:21:03
Originally by: smashsmash it isn't too late to become a **** star!
Clearly you're speaking from experience, and I couldn't agree more - but I don't want to peak to early..
My plan is 1. learn to programme some stuff 2. Join CCP 3. CEO CCP 4. Massive scandal as my 'other career' is leaked!
I think Jiekon might have the lead on me though!
C.
Post Script - thanks for all the advice everyone
www.sefrim.com - sig design - eve mail for details
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