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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
InigoMontoya
Amarr KIA Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.14 11:11:00 -
[1]
Ok, I had a large discussion with ppl in another thread regarding 'stealth' bonuses to skills. I went away and asked a Senior GM and a Dev whether this was true, both said it wasn't. The skills I am referring to are hacking, salvaging, and Archeology.
All these skills show an increase in the likelyhood of a successful hack/salvage/analyze. They do NOT say they give an increased chance of the quality of the contents.
I have run 2 tests on a hacking and a an arcsal low sec site, both times, the scanning of the can shows much more in the way of contents than are eventually given when the can is hacked/salvaged/analyzed.
i.e lowsec ARCSAL site
Guristas Wreck - Scanned 44 rig components, Salvaged 7 Guristas Rubble - Scanned 20 rig compnenents, Salvaged 4 Guristas Debris - Scanned 7 Rig components, Analyzer showed can to be empty.
I have bug reported this, but I would like a response. Low sec exploration has proven virtually worthless to me so far. Balancing is all well and good, but so far I have had nothign that could not be obtained by an hour belt ratting in 0.5 or running a cosmos plex in an assault frigate for 20 minutes. Whereas the contents I have had so far have cost me approx 20 hours of scanning, and countless millions in scan probes.
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Baleorg
Gallente Guys of Sarcasm
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Posted - 2007.01.14 12:17:00 -
[2]
i never scanned, just salvaged etci got salvaging 4 and the other stuff at 2 i get like 15 rig components from those salvaging cans some exploration site labeled like "serpentis - lowsec - arcsal"
BTW: A GOOD Cache-Cleaner |
InigoMontoya
Amarr KIA Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.14 12:20:00 -
[3]
Yeah, this is it, you can live without knowing you have just lost out on x amount of components, but I wanted to know, as I have hacked/salvaged cans which are empty. Pls note, some cans even on scanner are empty, just as the devs said. This is not my complaint.
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Jarnau Gurgeh
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Posted - 2007.01.14 12:47:00 -
[4]
Originally by: InigoMontoya
: I have run 2 tests on a hacking and a an arcsal low sec site, both times, the scanning of the can shows much more in the way of contents than are eventually given when the can is hacked/salvaged/analyzed. :
isn't it a exploit to scan these items? (using a bug)
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Baleorg
Gallente Guys of Sarcasm
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Posted - 2007.01.14 12:51:00 -
[5]
well i thougth i asked, but it seems i didnt.. so.. WHAT level is you rsalvaging? i guess its below 4
BTW: A GOOD Cache-Cleaner |
Tobias Raddick
Caldari Raddick Explorations
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Posted - 2007.01.14 13:21:00 -
[6]
Scanning a can shows the potential drops, not the actual drops. The actual drops aren't determined until you open / salvage it.
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InigoMontoya
Amarr KIA Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.14 16:57:00 -
[7]
Edited by: InigoMontoya on 14/01/2007 16:56:19 Edited, petition under review, I will not reply until it is concluded.
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Joerd Toastius
Octavian Vanguard
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Posted - 2007.01.14 17:02:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Joerd Toastius on 14/01/2007 16:58:48 I don't understand either what you're complaining about or what it has to do with "stealth" skill bonuses?
{edit} And why does it always seem to be KIA corp people complaining about new content?
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Baleorg
Gallente Guys of Sarcasm
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Posted - 2007.01.14 17:04:00 -
[9]
and neither can he answer a simple question like "what level is your salvaging" so its just another whine of "aaww there was 37 rigs but i only got 35"
BTW: A GOOD Cache-Cleaner |
Lisento Slaven
Amarr The Drekla Consortium Kurai Komichi
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Posted - 2007.01.14 17:08:00 -
[10]
He wanted to know if the *amount* salvaged/looted increases along with your skill level. The skill says only your CHANCE of salvaging increases and that it does not increase the amount. Some people say the AMOUNT is increased.
He wanted to test if the amount is increased. ---
Lisento Slaven wants to be a Space Whaler in EVE.
Put in space whales!
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InigoMontoya
Amarr KIA Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.14 17:11:00 -
[11]
Edited by: InigoMontoya on 14/01/2007 17:10:41 Because we are passionate ppl, who care about eve ;)
I have hacking/Archeology and Salving all at lvl4 fyi. I have already quoted a dev AND a GM on saying that the skill has NO effect on the quality of the drop. Yet my findings to date show very different. If I had a char with hacking 5 I would now be using it, as it is, I have to wait a couple of weeks.
I didnt train to lvl5, as it was said that you only need to train to lvl4 to access the higher tier cans, not to increase chances of a better drop.
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Baleorg
Gallente Guys of Sarcasm
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Posted - 2007.01.14 17:21:00 -
[12]
i see
so if you had a lower skill than me ( igot 4 myself) then there would be som eindicators that highe rlevel gives indeed a more income of rigs guess i need to test 2-3 salvager modules on my salvager ship to see what happens
BTW: A GOOD Cache-Cleaner |
InigoMontoya
Amarr KIA Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.14 17:35:00 -
[13]
well, the issue on this one as actually hacking, but it seems all three skill are affected by this stealth bonus to actual loot gained from the can/wreck.
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Hockston Axe
Amarr
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Posted - 2007.01.14 19:59:00 -
[14]
I have salvaging at level 4 and when I put three salvage tackles on my looter it brought my access difficulty to 50% and I immediately noticed a huge change in the amount and quality of salvage comps that I got. It also appears although IÆm not entirely sure that I fail in salvaging much more frequently then before (nothing found).
The big difference is that I get a lot less circuits and a lot more of the rare parts. On a level 3 mission I used to get about 40 circuits to 2 or 3 rare parts, now I come away from a mission with 15 circuits to 10 rare parts. ItÆs nice and annoying at the same time, because now my stock of rare parts is catching up to and overtaking my stock of circuits, and my total amount of salvage has been roughly halved by increasing my access difficulty. IÆm eager to train salvaging to level 5 now so that maybe having 55% access will stop the apparently increased salvage failure.
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Nadarius Chrome
Minmatar
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Posted - 2007.01.14 22:42:00 -
[15]
I have salvaging at 4 and have 3 salvage tackles on my salvaging ship. I've not noticed an increase in failures, in fact just the opposite. The "access difficulty" seems about right; most things salvage on the first cycle. I haven't noticed any increase in salvage though, just quicker success (by which I mean, the wreck is removed, whether salvage is produced or not).
As for the amount of salvage produced on a successful cycle, that seems to vary wildly. Just to compare, I did "Duo of Death" L4 twice yesterday, both in a 0.7 security system. It has two Gist battleships in it. The first time I got a grand total of 4 components from the two ships, the second a total of 28. You'd have to do quite a number of tests with identical ships in identical systems with only variation in Salvaging skill or Salvage Tackle rigs to get any kind of reliable picture.
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Dromidas Shadowmoon
Minmatar 54th Knights Templar
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Posted - 2007.01.14 23:06:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Dromidas Shadowmoon on 14/01/2007 23:03:19 exploration is very valuablue.. unknowns should be avoided. I go for grav and radar only pretty much. I found a belt worth over a bil in gneiss and dark ochre. Spent about 2 hours tracking down a hack site with 50 mil in loot. Just an hour ago I spent 30 minutes hunting down an agent from a radar signature that gave me a mission with a +3 implant reward. Granted it costs a lot of money and time to find them, they can be quite rewarding if you're lucky.. but I guess so can ratting, or missions, or hunting pirates/pirating.
Its not supposed to be 'everyone drop what you're doing and explore' its just supposed to be another way to have fun.
As far as stealth bonuses go, I think it might just be coincidence, but maybe not.. I noticed as I got higher in salvaging I salvaged more per successful salvage.. but again, I only had 1-2 in salvaging for a brief period of time.
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InigoMontoya
Amarr KIA Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.15 13:07:00 -
[17]
Still waiting for Senoir Gee'em (must be some spanish guy) to reply to my petition so I thought I would get this back up so the Devs may spot it (coz we all know they were permadrunk over the weekend, and wouldn't even ba able to focus on the screen)
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Barry Cantona
Gallente Garoun Investment Bank
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Posted - 2007.01.15 13:10:00 -
[18]
Man no wonder the petition ques are so long. This has never been a valid reason to write one. Salvaging is chance based, live with it.
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InigoMontoya
Amarr KIA Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.15 13:32:00 -
[19]
Edited by: InigoMontoya on 15/01/2007 13:31:47 Edited by: InigoMontoya on 15/01/2007 13:30:32 If it was JUST salvaging, then it wouldn't be an issue. This is a VALID reason for petitioning, go flame ppl who log in battle then petition their pod loss or something.
When you get this when you hack a can. Then scan it and see this would you not petition?
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Aiyleena Iluvatar
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Posted - 2007.01.15 14:03:00 -
[20]
it still dont see the reason for a petition..
its just chance based the actual loot in the container apears when the container spawns (what u see on your cargo scan) but now u have a max chance of 36% (with lvl5 and 2 rigs) to: 1. open the can when it opens the next ones are calculated (u see the lag when u open them??) 2. get the first loot 3. next item ... ...
where is your problem here?
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Vasiliyan
PAX Interstellar Services Anarchy Empire
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Posted - 2007.01.15 14:05:00 -
[21]
I suspect there is a bug here, and it's the reason why the devs aren't boosting the drop rate of these things - they imagine it's perfectly fine, but the components aren't actually accessible for some reason.
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Joerd Toastius
Octavian Vanguard
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Posted - 2007.01.15 14:10:00 -
[22]
Originally by: InigoMontoya Edited by: InigoMontoya on 15/01/2007 13:31:47 Edited by: InigoMontoya on 15/01/2007 13:30:32 If it was JUST salvaging, then it wouldn't be an issue. This is a VALID reason for petitioning, go flame ppl who log in battle then petition their pod loss or something.
When you get this when you hack a can. Then scan it and see this would you not petition?
Uh, no. Happens a lot. My thought process is "hmm, obviously we don't fully understand the mechanics of this yet, let's gather more data", rather than "OMG I am totally ENTITLED to that loot the fact that I'm not getting it is WRONG and I am SPECIAL so I will ADD TO THE PETITION QUEUE to find out why I am not getting the loot I DESERVE" :P
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Aiyleena Iluvatar
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Posted - 2007.01.15 14:11:00 -
[23]
/puts on his tinfoil hat
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SoniClover
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Posted - 2007.01.15 14:29:00 -
[24]
Hi,
The profession skills ONLY affect the chance to open the profession containers. They have NO effect on the loot drop chances.
Regards, Clover
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InigoMontoya
Amarr KIA Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.15 14:29:00 -
[25]
Joerd, I have gathered more data, many times over. I have fraps and screenshots of times when I have SCANNED, then hacked, and the other way fround for many many sites. I have spoken to GMs and Devs regarding it, and according to them, the cans spawns for EXPLORATION sites is random and spawned when you find it and is NOT based on ANY of your skills.
So why is it that there is stuff in the can that I can see, do a show info on, and not take upon a successful hacking? "You have SUCCESSFULLY accessed the can....but your skill level is not high enough to claim all the contents" is not a message I have ever seen. If I had, I would have hacking lvl5 and 2-3 rigs, but I havent as I didn't.
Have you ever seen this message? No, you haven't, because there isn't anything to tell you - either in the skill itself, or the game mechanics - that the level of CHANCE of SUCCESSFULLY hacking has ANYTHING to do with the QUALITY of the drop.
Your argument is based on the fact that everyone in eve will live the life of a sheep and just follow blindly. I prefer to try and found out WHY things are not as they seem, and share that information to increase all of our gaming experiences. I dont hide all my findings to better my own play only, bit things change.
Mods, pls lock this thread, anything I do find out will be kept to myself from now on, and not shared with these trolls and flamers.
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Joerd Toastius
Octavian Vanguard
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Posted - 2007.01.15 14:34:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Joerd Toastius on 15/01/2007 14:32:42 I don't just blindly accept things either, and I certainly don't hide my findings, but when I have a problem I don't run to the forums shouting about how I've been robbed either.
SoniClover, I don't suppose you want to enlighten us as to why stuff shows up on scan but not in the can? :)
{edit}
Quote: They have NO effect on the loot drop chances.
Suggests to me that loot drops are based on chance, and that therefore presumably there's a random chance that each of the things found by a cargo scanner actually drops.
Has anyone made an effort to log what each can shows up on scan for each site? Is the potential drop randomised or do certain cans contain certain items or classes of items?
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InigoMontoya
Amarr KIA Corp
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Posted - 2007.01.15 14:34:00 -
[27]
Cheers for the reply Clover, but that is the 3rd time I have heard that, and it does not explain why I am seeing items in cans that I cannot get to.
Can you have a word with Mehysto, I spoke to him about this the other day.
Pls lock, thanks.
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Aiyleena Iluvatar
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Posted - 2007.01.15 14:40:00 -
[28]
why do u think that u have to get all out of a container??
cant it be that the loot inside has chances on themselfes? let say a can has 4 slots ranging from high chances that there is loot to low and these chances also apply when u try to open it??
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SoniClover
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Posted - 2007.01.15 14:40:00 -
[29]
I honestly don't know the reason for this scan discrepancy, it might be some sort of a bug. But it has nothing to do with the drops, skills have no effect on that. So there's nothing sinister going on
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Ivan Kirilenkov
Forum Moderator Interstellar Services Department
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Posted - 2007.01.15 14:47:00 -
[30]
Locked at OP's request.
eve-crc.net | forum rules |
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