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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 8 post(s) |
Tristan Agion
Viziam Amarr Empire
57
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Posted - 2016.01.28 21:17:43 -
[1621] - Quote
N00B-SAIB0T wrote:I look forward to this. Now I don't have to get low-balled on that 40 million SP alt that I have on the Character Bazaar. I'll probably extract the alt down to 5 million and then biomass it. Roughly 28 million SPs to throw at my main will be nice. If you are just going to biomass the 5M SP "rest", I would happily take that depleted toon (for free). |
Zozoll Neblyn
Ziggurat Forge
16
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Posted - 2016.01.28 21:46:29 -
[1622] - Quote
Lol. Yeah. 5 mil Sp characters are perfect SP farms!!
HeXxploiT wrote:So whatever Dev it was at the end of the 07 show was talking about how he was curious to see how much injectors would go for in game. This is a deliberately misleading comment because CCP so obviously sets the price. These are not ship skins these are a high demand item therefor they will reach their plex/$$ equivalent.
If CCP sells them for $2.50 they will be 150mil on market, $5 they will be about 300mil, $10 they will be 600mil on market and if they sell for the same price as a plex they will be the same price as a plex in game.
Silly
The only question is how much different will the price of an extractor vs. the price of an injector.
I'm thinking that after a few months it will settle down to be like this:
(Price of extractor) + (1/4 * Price of a Plex) = Price of Injector
Maybe they'll sell for just barely more than that.
For the first few months, though, there will be a "loose change" effect, and a "new product" effect. The loose change will be players with skills they don't need scrubbing them off with extractors, and that might drive down the price a bit. The newness of it may also drive the price up a bit due to people being willing to pay more because of the novelty.
Nothing terribly surprising. |
Moac Tor
Cyber Core Stain Confederation
400
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Posted - 2016.01.28 22:59:13 -
[1623] - Quote
Primary This Rifter wrote:If you really want a cash grab, do this... and then bring back skillpoint loss on pod death. Without bringing back clone insurance. The new Eve is about removing consequences, not increasing them. Need to keep CCPs new intended audience happy.
Modulated ECM Effects
An Alternative to Skill Trading
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Cixi
18
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Posted - 2016.01.29 00:02:18 -
[1624] - Quote
Tristan Agion wrote: If you are just going to biomass the 5M SP "rest", I would happily take that depleted toon (for free).
Would you pay 2 PLEX for the transfer fee ? |
Mike Azariah
The Scope Gallente Federation
3372
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Posted - 2016.01.29 00:57:43 -
[1625] - Quote
HeXxploiT wrote:So whatever Dev it was at the end of the 07 show was talking about how he was curious to see how much injectors would go for in game.
That was CCP Quant. Maker of graph porn extraordinaire
and I am fairly sure he was saying that he was looking forward to how the player driven market will drive the prices of the FULL injectors.
m
Mike Azariah Gö¼GöÇGöÇGö¼n++ ¯|(pâä)/¯
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Yonis Kador
KADORCORP
586
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Posted - 2016.01.29 01:14:57 -
[1626] - Quote
Oh, I was so bedazzled by Quant's damn accent & good looks that I'm not even sure what I learned from his SP-trading presentation. Something about players having more characters on their 2nd account and that their 2nd character created tends to be female? What does that have to do with the evils of sp-trading, Quant?? I waited all week for this master class in misdirection.
:) |
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CCP Quant
C C P C C P Alliance
47
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Posted - 2016.01.29 01:42:28 -
[1627] - Quote
HeXxploiT wrote:So whatever Dev it was at the end of the 07 show was talking about how he was curious to see how much injectors would go for in game. This is a deliberately misleading comment because CCP so obviously sets the price. These are not ship skins these are a high demand item therefor they will reach their plex/$$ equivalent.
If CCP sells them for $2.50 they will be 150mil on market, $5 they will be about 300mil, $10 they will be 600mil on market and if they sell for the same price as a plex they will be the same price as a plex in game.
Silly
No you're missing the point I am curious to see how players will value the skillpoint part of the injector, as you say we know the extractor prices. The injector prices are thus floored at extractor prices, but on top of that comes the unknown added isk value for the skillpoints themselves. THAT is the interesting thing to watch for when this goes live. |
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Cixi
18
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Posted - 2016.01.29 01:46:16 -
[1628] - Quote
CCP Quant wrote:HeXxploiT wrote:So whatever Dev it was at the end of the 07 show was talking about how he was curious to see how much injectors would go for in game. This is a deliberately misleading comment because CCP so obviously sets the price. These are not ship skins these are a high demand item therefor they will reach their plex/$$ equivalent.
If CCP sells them for $2.50 they will be 150mil on market, $5 they will be about 300mil, $10 they will be 600mil on market and if they sell for the same price as a plex they will be the same price as a plex in game.
Silly No you're missing the point I am curious to see how players will value the skillpoint part of the injector, as you say we know the extractor prices. The injector prices are thus floored at extractor prices, but on top of that comes the unknown added isk value for the skillpoints themselves. THAT is the interesting thing to watch for when this goes live.
Well the maximum price for SP will be 0.25, if the composite price for injector is more than that, people will start SP farms, it will most likely be less than that, at least at first |
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CCP Quant
C C P C C P Alliance
47
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Posted - 2016.01.29 01:49:04 -
[1629] - Quote
Yonis Kador wrote: What does that have to do with the evils of sp-trading, Quant?? I waited all week for this master class in misdirection.
:)
Well the female/male ratios were out of context, just interesting random stats :) The slot-stats might be used as an input into skill point- pool and generation speculation. Initially I actually did include extractor prices, but in the end making them public wasn't my decision to make.
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CCP Quant
C C P C C P Alliance
47
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Posted - 2016.01.29 01:52:47 -
[1630] - Quote
Cixi wrote:CCP Quant wrote:HeXxploiT wrote:So whatever Dev it was at the end of the 07 show was talking about how he was curious to see how much injectors would go for in game. This is a deliberately misleading comment because CCP so obviously sets the price. These are not ship skins these are a high demand item therefor they will reach their plex/$$ equivalent.
If CCP sells them for $2.50 they will be 150mil on market, $5 they will be about 300mil, $10 they will be 600mil on market and if they sell for the same price as a plex they will be the same price as a plex in game.
Silly No you're missing the point I am curious to see how players will value the skillpoint part of the injector, as you say we know the extractor prices. The injector prices are thus floored at extractor prices, but on top of that comes the unknown added isk value for the skillpoints themselves. THAT is the interesting thing to watch for when this goes live. Well the maximum price for SP will be 0.25, if the composite price for injector is more than that, people will start SP farms, it will most likely be less than that, at least at first
Yeah we can already see from the character bazaar that people are willing to sell SPs below training cost. The upper limit depends a bit on supply and demand, but as you say, if the conditions are favorable, players will turn to SP farming. |
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Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1884
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Posted - 2016.01.29 01:58:11 -
[1631] - Quote
CCP Quant wrote:Yonis Kador wrote: What does that have to do with the evils of sp-trading, Quant?? I waited all week for this master class in misdirection.
:) Well the female/male ratios were out of context, just interesting random stats :) The slot-stats might be used as an input into skill point- pool and generation speculation. Initially I actually did include extractor prices, but in the end making them public wasn't my decision to make. Is someone over there deriving some manner of pleasure from denying us this information? Do they enjoy out rampant and pointless speculation and keeping us on edge?
Are you all sadists? |
Masao Kurata
Perkone Caldari State
317
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Posted - 2016.01.29 01:59:21 -
[1632] - Quote
It will absolutely be far less than training cost, I fully expect injectors to be only marginally more expensive than extractors. |
Dynamus Deckerman
Perkone Caldari State
11
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Posted - 2016.01.29 02:06:19 -
[1633] - Quote
CCP Quant wrote:Cixi wrote:CCP Quant wrote:HeXxploiT wrote:So whatever Dev it was at the end of the 07 show was talking about how he was curious to see how much injectors would go for in game. This is a deliberately misleading comment because CCP so obviously sets the price. These are not ship skins these are a high demand item therefor they will reach their plex/$$ equivalent.
If CCP sells them for $2.50 they will be 150mil on market, $5 they will be about 300mil, $10 they will be 600mil on market and if they sell for the same price as a plex they will be the same price as a plex in game.
Silly No you're missing the point I am curious to see how players will value the skillpoint part of the injector, as you say we know the extractor prices. The injector prices are thus floored at extractor prices, but on top of that comes the unknown added isk value for the skillpoints themselves. THAT is the interesting thing to watch for when this goes live. Well the maximum price for SP will be 0.25, if the composite price for injector is more than that, people will start SP farms, it will most likely be less than that, at least at first Yeah we can already see from the character bazaar that people are willing to sell SPs below training cost. The upper limit depends a bit on supply and demand, but as you say, if the conditions are favorable, players will turn to SP farming. So CCP condones SP farming as another lucrative isk faucet?? Sweet, I'll never have to pay another cent out of my pockets to play this game ever again.
How about CCP add a skill a player can just automatically train to transfer SP directly to the injector so that you don't need the extractors. That will be the sweetest deal :D. |
Rain6637
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
33256
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Posted - 2016.01.29 02:08:51 -
[1634] - Quote
I recall a long time ago a Dev said the most (or one of the most) OP things in the game is unallocated SP.
Help, I can't download EVE
President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub
PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
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Mike Azariah
The Scope Gallente Federation
3372
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Posted - 2016.01.29 02:34:54 -
[1635] - Quote
Rain6637 wrote:I recall a long time ago a Dev said the most (or one of the most) OP things in the game is unallocated SP.
I think I know what he meant but it is incorrect in essence. Unallocated is unused. It is like a fat isk wallet. If you do not spend it then it has no effect upon the game.
m
Mike Azariah Gö¼GöÇGöÇGö¼n++ ¯|(pâä)/¯
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Rain6637
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
33257
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Posted - 2016.01.29 03:04:21 -
[1636] - Quote
Hey mike.
So this was a nice trip down memory lane. A post of mine in response to a proposed skill reassignment mechanic.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5475127#post5475127
Kinda proud to see my opinion on the matter is basically the same after a year.
Quote:Lastly, because the skill system is the same for everyone, it's not necessarily good or bad. It is equal.
Help, I can't download EVE
President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub
PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
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Scotsman Howard
The Mjolnir Bloc The Bloc
6
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Posted - 2016.01.29 03:06:42 -
[1637] - Quote
Dynamus Deckerman wrote:CCP Quant wrote:Cixi wrote:CCP Quant wrote:HeXxploiT wrote:So whatever Dev it was at the end of the 07 show was talking about how he was curious to see how much injectors would go for in game. This is a deliberately misleading comment because CCP so obviously sets the price. These are not ship skins these are a high demand item therefor they will reach their plex/$$ equivalent.
If CCP sells them for $2.50 they will be 150mil on market, $5 they will be about 300mil, $10 they will be 600mil on market and if they sell for the same price as a plex they will be the same price as a plex in game.
Silly No you're missing the point I am curious to see how players will value the skillpoint part of the injector, as you say we know the extractor prices. The injector prices are thus floored at extractor prices, but on top of that comes the unknown added isk value for the skillpoints themselves. THAT is the interesting thing to watch for when this goes live. Well the maximum price for SP will be 0.25, if the composite price for injector is more than that, people will start SP farms, it will most likely be less than that, at least at first Yeah we can already see from the character bazaar that people are willing to sell SPs below training cost. The upper limit depends a bit on supply and demand, but as you say, if the conditions are favorable, players will turn to SP farming. So CCP condones SP farming as another lucrative isk faucet?? Sweet, I'll never have to pay another cent out of my pockets to play this game ever again. How about CCP add a skill a player can just automatically train to transfer SP directly to the injector so that you don't need the extractors. That will be the sweetest deal :D.
You belief that this is an isk faucet makes me laugh at your misunderstanding of what an isk faucet is.
For the billionth time, an isk faucet is an activity that creates isk out of thin air. Examples of this are bounty and insurance payouts.
This is not an isk faucet because no new isk is created. |
Mike Azariah
The Scope Gallente Federation
3373
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Posted - 2016.01.29 03:21:12 -
[1638] - Quote
Rain6637 wrote:Hey mike. So this was a nice trip down memory lane. A post of mine in response to a proposed skill reassignment mechanic. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5475127#post5475127 Kinda proud to see my opinion on the matter is basically the same after a year. Quote:Lastly, because the skill system is the same for everyone, it's not necessarily good or bad. It is equal.
Nice to see consistency.
Yeah, once USED it is OP.
and I do hope that last quote does not get appliec to the new sp transfers because it is not the same for everyone. unless everyone has the same amount of money (if so, I must have missed that line up)
m
Mike Azariah Gö¼GöÇGöÇGö¼n++ ¯|(pâä)/¯
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Rain6637
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
33257
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Posted - 2016.01.29 03:25:29 -
[1639] - Quote
yeah but higher SP players are supposed to need it less. and it *is* a consistent system.
mike I know there's no way you do this in person. Then no one would talk to you.
Help, I can't download EVE
President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub
PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
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Mike Azariah
The Scope Gallente Federation
3373
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Posted - 2016.01.29 03:33:41 -
[1640] - Quote
Rain6637 wrote:yeah but higher SP players are supposed to need it less. and it *is* a consistent system.
mike I know there's no way you do this in person. Then no one would talk to you.
True, at times my literal side ticks people off. It harks back to the argument that afk cloakers are not a problem because they are afk.
Yes, the ability to switch and turn on a dime, skill wise will be a very very powerful tool.
m
Mike Azariah Gö¼GöÇGöÇGö¼n++ ¯|(pâä)/¯
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Memphis Baas
1001
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Posted - 2016.01.29 03:48:18 -
[1641] - Quote
It's only a powerful tool if used intelligently, much like officer modules.
Idiot afk cloakers are not a problem; and afk cloakers using predictable ships and tactics are somewhat easy to counter.
Similarly, it kinda depends on what skill you're activating "on a dime" and how you use it to surprise your enemies. Who will then keep track of your new ability and not be surprised a second time.
I expect most people won't try to be sneaky, and will use the system simply to take to 5 some of the skills that they currently have at 4, because they haven't had enough years available to train them to 5 yet, but they want to. So yeah, maybe there will be a few surprise T2 siege modules when they could only fit T1 before, and maybe a few extra km on the ECM, web, or disruptor range of a few T2 cruisers, but otherwise extra 5% bonus from skills would hardly be a great surprise. |
Oreb Wing
Black Fox Marauders
145
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Posted - 2016.01.29 03:51:18 -
[1642] - Quote
Mike Azariah wrote:Rain6637 wrote:I recall a long time ago a Dev said the most (or one of the most) OP things in the game is unallocated SP. I think I know what he meant but it is incorrect in essence. Unallocated is unused. It is like a fat isk wallet. If you do not spend it then it has no effect upon the game. m
I just hope that there's a failsafe in place to prevent mass unpenalized injections that sit unallocated in the reserved bank. Stressed enough to say it twice.
I'll wait to see what the set price is set as. High enough to prevent the sp farming, I hope. ::edit:: At least minimize it.::edit::
There is no grey area when the light of reason directs wisdom.
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Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
1885
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Posted - 2016.01.29 04:04:46 -
[1643] - Quote
Oreb Wing wrote:I just hope that there's a failsafe in place to prevent mass unpenalized injections that sit unallocated in the reserved bank. It was confirmed in the test server thread that both allocated and unallocated SP was counted when determining how much SP an injector gave.
On a related note, CS V is going to be in the queue for the last character I have that lacks it as soon as I'm back in front of my home PC. |
Dynamus Deckerman
Perkone Caldari State
11
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Posted - 2016.01.29 04:07:35 -
[1644] - Quote
Scotsman Howard wrote:CCP Quant wrote:Cixi wrote:CCP Quant wrote:[quote=HeXxploiT]So whatever Dev it was at the end of the 07 show was talking about how he was curious to see how much injectors would go for in game. This is a deliberately misleading comment because CCP so obviously sets the price. These are not ship skins these are a high demand item therefor they will reach their plex/$$ equivalent. If CCP sells them for $2.50 they will be 150mil on market, $5 they will be about 300mil, $10 they will be 600mil on market and if they sell for the same price as a plex they will be the same price as a plex in game. No you're missing the point I am curious to see how players will value the skilloint part of the injector, as you say we know the extractor prices. The injector prices are thus floored at extractor prices, but on top of that comes the unknown added isk value for the skillpoints themselves. THAT is the interesting thing to watch for when this goes live. Well the maximum price for SP will be 0.25, if the composite price for injector is more than that, people will start SP farms, it will most likely be less than that, at least at first Yeah we can already see from the character bazaar that people are willing to sell SPs below training cost. The upper limit depends a bit on supply and demand, but as you say, if the conditions are favorable, players will turn to SP farming. So CCP condones SP farming as another lucrative isk faucet?? Sweet, I'll never have to pay another cent out of my pockets to play this game ever again. How about CCP add a skill a player can just automatically train to transfer SP directly to the injector so that you don't need the extractors. That will be the sweetest deal :D. You belief that this is an isk faucet makes me laugh at your misunderstanding of what an isk faucet is. For the billionth time, an isk faucet is an activity that creates isk out of thin air. Examples of this are bounty and insurance payouts. This is not an isk faucet because no new isk is created. Oh umm then this is a bad idea xD. -1 |
Cixi
19
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Posted - 2016.01.29 05:53:43 -
[1645] - Quote
Tyberius Franklin wrote:Oreb Wing wrote:I just hope that there's a failsafe in place to prevent mass unpenalized injections that sit unallocated in the reserved bank. It was confirmed in the test server thread that both allocated and unallocated SP was counted when determining how much SP an injector gave. On a related note, CS V is going to be in the queue for the last character I have that lacks it as soon as I'm back in front of my home PC.
What is funny is that if you have more than 5mil SP unallocated then you can 0 out all your skills (not sure if this is a bug) |
The Receptionist
Astra Zeneca.
7
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Posted - 2016.01.29 06:29:35 -
[1646] - Quote
Mindseamstress wrote:Having spent 13 ears in Eve I absolutely detest this idea. Didn't quite take it seriously at first glance as I thought this was making a mockery of Eve but yes... this is obviously being rolled out and again with an emphasis on boosting low SP character.
Rather than wrecking the sandbox yet again it would be nice to see work put into actually expanding the game. Stop tweaking. Stop the bad tweaks in particular. Start delivering more content. Thanks!
My two cents.
After reading pages and pages, this is gthe post that I found to be most applicable.
Sure, this mmight be an OK thing, I'm not sure I agree with a 13 y/o player deciding for newbros whether they should get SP easier ("grrrr back in my day, we had to wait for our SP, and skillques couldn't be longer than 24 hours......")
However this change from a monthly release of small tweaks and stuff rather than yearly releases of cool new content is cancer. Hopefully the citadel patch will be cool enough to bring back that feel of the old patches but time spent on constant rebalancing is time taken away from providing new content. |
Gully Alex Foyle
Black Fox Marauders
4280
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Posted - 2016.01.29 07:10:48 -
[1647] - Quote
Warde Guildencrantz wrote:Here's another question, if I can buy skillpoints via the market, are you going to make a new subscription option that doesn't allow skill training but costs less?
Why expand in one direction but not the other? I should be able to play the game without having to train my character for a lower price. You already will be able to do just that!
It's an interesting consequence of the new system, that apparently not many people have realized so far:
1. Get 1-month sub with your own money (cash or PLEX) 2. Gain SP, even though you do not want it for yourself 3. Sell all of that SP, get ISK 4. Use ISK to puy PLEX (you may or may not have to add some of your own ISK to get a full PLEX out of 1 month SP, depending on market prices; still it's highly probable that 1 month SP will allow you to fund at least 80-90% of a PLEX) 5. Play for free, or at least play 'at a discount'
Make space glamorous!
Is EVE dying or not? Ask the EVE-O Death-o-meter!
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The Receptionist
Astra Zeneca.
7
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Posted - 2016.01.29 11:47:48 -
[1648] - Quote
Personally, I am curious about how players will value SP as well. Personally I hope an empty injector is dirt cheap, so that it's very easy to clean up SP on your own characters and fix SP you wasted early on when you didn't know better on skills that you never use.
However I hope that a full injector is super expensive as valued by player market, so that it's much more expensive to use these to build character up from scratch. |
Oreb Wing
Black Fox Marauders
145
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Posted - 2016.01.29 12:00:29 -
[1649] - Quote
Gully Alex Foyle wrote:Warde Guildencrantz wrote:Here's another question, if I can buy skillpoints via the market, are you going to make a new subscription option that doesn't allow skill training but costs less?
Why expand in one direction but not the other? I should be able to play the game without having to train my character for a lower price. You already will be able to do just that! It's an interesting consequence of the new system, that apparently not many people have realized so far: 1. Get 1-month sub with your own money (cash or PLEX) 2. Gain SP, even though you do not want it for yourself 3. Sell all of that SP, get ISK 4. Use ISK to puy PLEX (you may or may not have to add some of your own ISK to get a full PLEX out of 1 month SP, depending on market prices; still it's highly probable that 1 month SP will allow you to fund at least 80-90% of a PLEX) 5. Play for free, or at least play 'at a discount'
I have two alts that do indie for me on the extra two slots. One was transferred, the other skilled up while my main was paused. In a way, you can already do this.
The scenario Gulley is painting is the one I nearly lost my **** trying to explain until Tristan slapped a little sense into my babbling.
There is no grey area when the light of reason directs wisdom.
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Officer Pressly
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
2
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Posted - 2016.01.29 13:33:42 -
[1650] - Quote
Amanda Orion wrote:Memphis Baas wrote:Quote:Money grabbing is a cancer of the whole gaming branch. Trying to make money is what drives the whole industry forward; you call it a cancer but it's not. If you feel like spending 5+ years developing a product only to give it away for free, go ahead. We'll then come to your forums and shoot your in-game monuments complaining that you've done a ****** job, and that you should "fix it" for free, because the game is free. Feel free to rage on, but the reality of the world out there is that things are done for money, and more money often (not always) results in more things done. You're wasting effort, but whatever, go ahead. You have conflated "charging" which is fair and expected, with "money grabbing". They are not giving it away, they are being paid for it already.
This comming from a group of players that denies its members to fly anything but frigates, and only enables them to fly cruisers after a couple months. I think you are just afraid this will ruin your type of keeping your members the way you want them kept. |
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