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TheMaxys
Funk Soul Brothers Phoenix Company Alliance
0
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Posted - 2016.02.09 08:02:56 -
[1] - Quote
Hi
WALL OF TEXT WARNING
The prologue.
We are all aware there are people in game who run one man corporations for sole purpose of invention/copying/production. Such person may have 3-6 accounts with 3 characters each designated to industry and nothing else. At this stage we have limit of 11 production slots per character and our person has 6acc*3char*11slots=198 slots in total. So imagine normal playing evening for such a person? he should waste 45 min just for log in/out each of his character to start/deliver/check condition of all his jobs. The is no fun here - it is like working and the person is willing to have fun in game(he finds it fun to run production plant in game, but not having to login/out his characters).
The idea.
Why don't we unite all those 198 manufacturing slots in possession of one single character so such people could have fun in-game instead of having to type in passwords all over again and again?
The realization.
Lets make one character have a corporation role Production manager. The rest of characters have role of Production Specialist or whatever names may be. Or as an option a skill instead of corp role(but roles are mandatory so only corp members could form production network and no one else outside this corp could join). So once character is given role of production specialist he may choose how many of his manufacturing slots will be available for Production Network usage. Production manager from the other side is given the ability to operate by his own 11 slots plus as much as his corpmates delegated to manufacturing network.
There is straight away one problem - huge corporations will have big numbers of players so it will make their production managers overpowered with thousands of manufacturing slots. The way around this is to make this networking possible not by just having the roles/skills, but also by necessity of plugging in implant in slot 10 - Production Network Mindlink(or whatever name might be). This implant should cost considerably high to not allow every other pilot have it just for loolz. Lets say 300mil or so. this way we eliminate possibility of huge corporations to utilize all of their pilots for production/research purposes and leave only characters, designated for industry purposes, connected to production network.
Epilogue
In other words - whoever was into industry will stay into industry, but will get really useful tools to avoid logging in many characters and whoever was not into industry - will stay unaffected as there is vast number of implants for slot 10 which will be used instead for characters not designated to industry(even miners will rather use yield increase implant in slot 10).
Same goes to invention slots. May be united into 1 implant and one corp role. Or to make it even more targeted for specialized industry characters it may be split into two different implants/roles/skills. |
Lugh Crow-Slave
1536
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Posted - 2016.02.09 08:16:40 -
[2] - Quote
I'll ignore why the idea as a hole is bad and focus on your fix for your for seen problem.
Say ccp wise up and let's us swap in station clones freely. Now I have plenty of members who would be willing to give up their slots to the corp freely as they never bother with industry. So I simply ask my members to swap into such an implant before they log off.
Now even if they don't I still have a large number of members willing to give up their 10 slot to help the corp. I will also give any new player this implant as odds are over time I'll have a good number of characters in my corp that no longer play the game but I can use their slots even if it's only one per character it'll add up
Citadel worm hole tax
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TheMaxys
Funk Soul Brothers Phoenix Company Alliance
0
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Posted - 2016.02.09 13:07:15 -
[3] - Quote
You should be aware about time limit on clone jumps, do you? If you ask people from your corp to commit clone jumping at your willing and provide em with expensive implant, assuming they have sufficient skills - why wouldn't it be possible to organize production network? All this complications already remove characters which are not into industry. And implants only working in active clone(i think you aware of thet).
As to new characters... if character skills are not allow him to build a jump freighter it is obvious what you cannot build that jump freighter in that slot remotely.
And do I have to remind what implants/skills/any activity at all only possible for characters with active subscription, so it is impossible to use slots of people who quit gaming long time ago.
p.s.
I see no arguments from your side, sorry. |
SurrenderMonkey
Space Llama Industries
1823
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Posted - 2016.02.09 14:15:34 -
[4] - Quote
I do a lot of industry, and the last thing industry needs is to be even more passive than it already is.
"Help, I'm bored with missions!"
http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
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Daichi Yamato
Xero Security and Technologies
3080
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Posted - 2016.02.09 15:22:11 -
[5] - Quote
SurrenderMonkey wrote: I'm perfectly happy to allow him to subsidize the game with as many accounts as he likes, but under no circumstance should the game be mechanically altered to actually encourage this behavior.
Agreed. Whilst no one can stop you making alts purely to get extra planets, more slots or to assist your ratting main, these are mechanically no different to having a group of players work with un-canny coordination. But I'm against making mechanics that will allow these chars to influence the sandbox without even logging in, let alone without pressing the buttons or moving to the locations they need to.
EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"
Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs
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TheMaxys
Funk Soul Brothers Phoenix Company Alliance
0
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Posted - 2016.02.09 20:21:35 -
[6] - Quote
SurrenderMonkey wrote:I do a lot of industry, and the last thing industry needs is to be even more passive than it already is.
Also, if you're doing this kind of thing and haven't come up with some sort of batching plan to assign jobs based on length to each character (e.g., "I log in Alice every day, she gets 24 hour jobs. Bob gets month long research jobs. Bob gets logged in once a month.") to reduce the burden on yourself, you deserve to sit there and waste 45 minutes logging in and out every day.
Whet works fine, if you have Bob and Alice. But what if you have Bob1, Bob2- Bob 10? Do you sereously remember who does what and for how long? Your desk is burried under paper notes with login details only, then you add on top of thet lenghts of jobs for each...i'd say easier to just login back and forth, than go and try to find information in your garbage table notes after having this project for one or two years...
Daichi Yamato wrote:[quote=SurrenderMonkey] moving to the locations they need to.
What you talking about? All skills which affect your industry jobs will affect network as well. If some character is in range for industry job to be started - it will get started, doesn't matter by himself or through industry network. If thet character is too far from facility - he cant start or deliver jobs. Also if he get podded and loose his implant - he cannot deliver or start jobs enymore untill get implant back. |
Gadget Helmsdottir
Gadget's Workshop
121
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Posted - 2016.02.09 20:34:03 -
[7] - Quote
TheMaxys wrote: Whet works fine, if you have Bob and Alice. But what if you have Bob1, Bob2- Bob 10? Do you sereously remember who does what and for how long? Your desk is burried under paper notes with login details only, then you add on top of thet lenghts of jobs for each...i'd say easier to just login back and forth, than go and try to find information in your garbage table notes after having this project for one or two years...
Blah, Blah, Blah.
Excel.
If people can do this IRL for a corporation or their country, then you can do this for your personal corporation.
As for the whole porposal, -1 for reasons stated by others earlier in this thread.
--Gadget 1,2,3 et al
Work smarter, not harder. --Scrooge McDuck, an eminent old-Earth economist
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SurrenderMonkey
Space Llama Industries
1828
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Posted - 2016.02.09 20:34:30 -
[8] - Quote
TheMaxys wrote:
Whet works fine, if you have Bob and Alice. But what if you have Bob1, Bob2- Bob 10? Do you sereously remember who does what and for how long?
There's this thing called an "API".
Use it, you helpless numpty.
Quote: .i'd say easier to just login back and forth, than go and try to find information in your garbage table notes after having this project for one or two years...
Sorry you suck at production scheduling, but this is a problem entirely of your own making. Fix it yourself.
"Help, I'm bored with missions!"
http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
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Daichi Yamato
Xero Security and Technologies
3081
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Posted - 2016.02.09 20:45:54 -
[9] - Quote
Why would one of these chronies get podded when there is no reason to ever log them in?
EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"
Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs
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TheMaxys
Funk Soul Brothers Phoenix Company Alliance
0
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Posted - 2016.02.10 04:40:22 -
[10] - Quote
Be it my poor management or laziness or whatever - it doesn't matter. Most creative inventions came from laziness(dust blower , microwave to name few). Whoever was logging in 5 characters for industry - he will continue. Why to create 3rd party software for some obvious basic stuff, which could be eliminated all at once by introducing new interesting feature in-game itself?
Blah, Blah, Blah.
Excel.
If people can do this IRL for a corporation or their country, then you can do this for your personal corporation.
I assume such people get paid for their efforts rather than pay themselves to do it, isn't it?
I understand industry ppl are posting here negatives just to protect their small tycoons. Sleep well, as I can assure there are much more skilled players than you - no need to stand your ground here.
My proposal is to make things more simple for whoever wants it to be more simple. If something is not done yet - it doesn't mean it shouldn't be done. Thinking out of the box.
My post is about how collective mind can make this idea more advanced and more suitable for our glorious game, and not about why this idea is bad/stupid/dumb. Also, forum trolls, please stay away. |
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SurrenderMonkey
Space Llama Industries
1834
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Posted - 2016.02.10 04:47:43 -
[11] - Quote
TheMaxys wrote:Be it my poor management or laziness or whatever - it doesn't matter. Most creative inventions came from laziness(dust blower , microwave to name few). Whoever was logging in 5 characters for industry - he will continue. Why to create 3rd party software for some obvious basic stuff, which could be eliminated all at once by introducing new interesting feature in-game itself?
Blah, Blah, Blah.
Excel.
If people can do this IRL for a corporation or their country, then you can do this for your personal corporation.
I assume such people get paid for their efforts rather than pay themselves to do it, isn't it?
I understand industry ppl are posting here negatives just to protect their small tycoons. Sleep well, as I can assure there are much more skilled players than you - no need to stand your ground here.
My proposal is to make things more simple for whoever wants it to be more simple. If something is not done yet - it doesn't mean it shouldn't be done. Thinking out of the box.
My post is about how collective mind can make this idea more advanced and more suitable for our glorious game, and not about why this idea is bad/stupid/dumb. Also, forum trolls, please stay away.
Nobody gives a single **** about the quality of life for the poor guy doing a **** job of managing 6 accounts. No, the game is not going to be changed to cater to his weird combination of "Obsessive" and "Incompetent".
"Help, I'm bored with missions!"
http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
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TheMaxys
Funk Soul Brothers Phoenix Company Alliance
0
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Posted - 2016.02.10 06:42:35 -
[12] - Quote
Once again I am asking, in very polite way, for forum trolls to leave the thread. Thank you. |
SurrenderMonkey
Space Llama Industries
1838
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Posted - 2016.02.10 06:57:44 -
[13] - Quote
TheMaxys wrote:Once again I am asking, in very polite way, for forum trolls to leave the thread. Thank you.
Nobody finds the whole, "People who disagree with my awful idea are trolls!" rhetoric remotely compelling, or anything other than infantile.
You don't actually get to dictate the type of feedback you receive when you make an awful suggestion in a public forum.
"Help, I'm bored with missions!"
http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
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Daichi Yamato
Xero Security and Technologies
3082
|
Posted - 2016.02.10 10:31:11 -
[14] - Quote
We're not trolling. QOL improvements are one thing, but what you're asking for is to play the game for chars without even logging them in. This would be like mission runners using their alts like drones or controlling 60 PI networks with one char. I dont mind, and no one can stop you, if you log in and do the actual leg work. But doing the whole puppet master thing without even using the chars is a no go.
Take for example, when CCP nerfed drone assist and are wanting to nerf fleet warp. This is because they dont want one char controlling many.
You could ask for more skills for more slots per char...
EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"
Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs
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TheMaxys
Funk Soul Brothers Phoenix Company Alliance
0
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Posted - 2016.02.10 11:03:02 -
[15] - Quote
There was no asking for more slots. What i asked is not interfering with current gameplay. You still can use only character which you've paid for, you still can use only as many slots as you have trained for and those slots can be used only for jobs your characters trained for. The one single thing what is changing - you don't have to log in and log out many of your character all the time. It will actually reduce strain on login server. How many characters do we have online? 33000? I assume 2000 of em is industry characters doing nothing - just sitting on stations forever for the sole purpose of pressing some buttons once a day or so. If you take em out of sight - what will it change? -Nothing for those who is not into industry, accept for reducing lag slightly. -A lot for those who had to do stupid login/logout every day. |
SurrenderMonkey
Space Llama Industries
1841
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Posted - 2016.02.10 15:52:19 -
[16] - Quote
Quote:The one single thing what is changing - you don't have to log in and log out many of your character all the time.
And that one single thing is the problem.
Everyone understands that you want to be able to use your characters without having to - perish the thought - actually log them into the ******* game. We get it. Nobody cares.
This is not a problem with the game itself. You've made the personal choice to run an abnormal number of accounts. The various challenges inherent to doing so are entirely your problem to deal with.
The game does not need to be changed because you're lazy.
"Help, I'm bored with missions!"
http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
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TheMaxys
Funk Soul Brothers Phoenix Company Alliance
0
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Posted - 2016.02.11 02:31:11 -
[17] - Quote
SurrenderMonkey wrote:Quote:The one single thing what is changing - you don't have to log in and log out many of your character all the time. And that one single thing is the problem. Everyone understands that you want to be able to use your characters without having to - perish the thought - actually log them into the ******* game. We get it. Nobody cares. This is not a problem with the game itself. You've made the personal choice to run an abnormal number of accounts. The various challenges inherent to doing so are entirely your problem to deal with. Hell, why stop there? Just make jobs (and skills, and market orders, and contracts) writable from the API. Then you could just do it all from a phone app. Plus, it would be trivial to automate, sparing you all of that burdensome clicking! And why limit it to manu slots? What about the poor guy multiboxing 20 miners by hand (since, y'know... they banned input replication because nobody actually gives a **** about the quality of life for mass multiboxers)? That hardly seems fair. His alts should be able to just install some sort of implant that allows them to apply all of their bonuses to a single mining ship. Then he can just log in one character that mines as well as 20. Bam, major server load savings! The game does not need to be changed because you're lazy. In fact, that actual underlying problem here is that the passive nature of research and industry make them trivial to parallelize ad infinitum. The true "fix" would be to change the gameplay around research and industry such that there is no longer an effectively linear return on N+1 accounts for a single player.
I got your point from the first post. Unfortunately you didn't got mine. Solution to this problem is you go look for another thread to troll. Thank you. |
SurrenderMonkey
Space Llama Industries
1858
|
Posted - 2016.02.11 03:12:01 -
[18] - Quote
TheMaxys wrote:SurrenderMonkey wrote:Quote:The one single thing what is changing - you don't have to log in and log out many of your character all the time. And that one single thing is the problem. Everyone understands that you want to be able to use your characters without having to - perish the thought - actually log them into the ******* game. We get it. Nobody cares. This is not a problem with the game itself. You've made the personal choice to run an abnormal number of accounts. The various challenges inherent to doing so are entirely your problem to deal with. Hell, why stop there? Just make jobs (and skills, and market orders, and contracts) writable from the API. Then you could just do it all from a phone app. Plus, it would be trivial to automate, sparing you all of that burdensome clicking! And why limit it to manu slots? What about the poor guy multiboxing 20 miners by hand (since, y'know... they banned input replication because nobody actually gives a **** about the quality of life for mass multiboxers)? That hardly seems fair. His alts should be able to just install some sort of implant that allows them to apply all of their bonuses to a single mining ship. Then he can just log in one character that mines as well as 20. Bam, major server load savings! The game does not need to be changed because you're lazy. In fact, that actual underlying problem here is that the passive nature of research and industry make them trivial to parallelize ad infinitum. The true "fix" would be to change the gameplay around research and industry such that there is no longer an effectively linear return on N+1 accounts for a single player. I got your point from the first post. Unfortunately you didn't got mine. Solution to this problem is you go look for another thread to troll. Thank you.
Another thing nobody cares about is the impact of negative feedback on your fee-fees. Sack up.
It seems that if you could actually defend your idea, you would likely do that instead of pretending that illustrating the myriad ways it is awful somehow constitutes "trolling".
"Help, I'm bored with missions!"
http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
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Max Deveron
Deveron Shipyards and Technology
253
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Posted - 2016.02.11 05:36:40 -
[19] - Quote
Dude, I am industry....... But I am also not a carebear..... You want to do something log the F*** in and do it.....it takes seconds to do so especially with the new launcher. Take your self-entitled "waah waah I want to play without loggin in" crap and stuff it and your pod up the nearest Nyx thruster port.
In fact if things are so troublesome to you....delete some accounts, or repurpose some of the alts on them for somethng else like ganking, scouting, wardecs, etc.......sheesh |
TheMaxys
Funk Soul Brothers Phoenix Company Alliance
0
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Posted - 2016.02.11 06:46:28 -
[20] - Quote
Guys, seriously, This post is not for trolling. It is about finding a better way for new feature implementation.
Believe me, I am old enough to be able to decide for myself what to do in EVE, how many characters do i need. Also there is no need for making some assumptions about my intentions. I am not asking for anything other than described in first post. It is not connected in any way to PI or mining or whatever you assuming it may be connected to.
It is as simple as - how to develop this idea to be good enough to be part of our magnificent game.
If you do not have such improvement in mind but only some decisions towards what should i do or who cares about myself or whatever troll thinking you have - please stay away and let adult people talk. Thank you in advance. |
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SurrenderMonkey
Space Llama Industries
1860
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Posted - 2016.02.11 06:50:15 -
[21] - Quote
TheMaxys wrote:
It is as simple as - how to develop this idea to be good enough to be part of our magnificent game.
Literally impossible. It's a fundamentally bad idea that could only serve to make the game worse.
"Help, I'm bored with missions!"
http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
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Amarisen Gream
Divine Demise Apocalypse Now.
203
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Posted - 2016.02.11 09:03:06 -
[22] - Quote
After reading this thread is needs to be locked like every thread in F&I, then purged and burned.
The primary issue is this - logging in and out of characters? It would be nice if CCP would take the time and fix the logout/login of the game.
If there was some way to be in station - hit escape - click character tab - click character and it would switch characters for you. That would be a milk and honey. Yet, from the impressions I get, CCP has no interest in fixing/redoing the login/character select system as they are to busy developing micro transaction methods for more $$$$
"The Lord loosed upon them his fierce anger
All of his fury and rage.
He dispatched against them a band of Avenging Angels"
- The Scriptures, Book II, Apocalypse 10:1
DIDE- is open to new members
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maxys Prime
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2016.02.12 13:17:10 -
[23] - Quote
Still that requires you to login quite a few characters to do the very same stuff. But, by adding this feature we would have even more diversity into industry as a whole part of the game, isn't it? |
SurrenderMonkey
Space Llama Industries
1895
|
Posted - 2016.02.12 20:46:53 -
[24] - Quote
maxys Prime wrote:Still that requires you to login quite a few characters to do the very same stuff. But, by adding this feature we would have even more diversity into industry as a whole part of the game, isn't it?
No. All it does is promote the idea that high volume multiboxing is a desirable form of gameplay, instead of something that is merely tolerated.
"Help, I'm bored with missions!"
http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
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Takari
Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective
511
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Posted - 2016.02.13 01:06:31 -
[25] - Quote
Amarisen Gream wrote: It would be nice if CCP would take the time and fix the logout/login of the game.
It's not broken.
maxys wrote: Still that requires you to login quite a few characters to do the very same stuff. But, by adding this feature we would have even more diversity into industry as a whole part of the game, isn't it?
How would this add diversity? Adding multi-account convenience is not diversity. This is a HTFU moment if I ever saw one.
Themaxys wrote:It is as simple as - how to develop this idea to be good enough to be part of our magnificent game.
Really did you use an alt to post an argument for yourself up there? There is no development of this idea. Allowing multiple characters or multiple accounts to work together without individual effort is a no-go full-stop. People who disagree with you are not trolling.
Think of features on a per-character basis for more intriguing game play. Each of your characters is a separate individual competing with the others for limited resources. This is the way of EvE.
"Roll the dice, don't think twice. This is the way of things.
Welcome to EVE." ~ CCP Falcon
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Lugh Crow-Slave
1557
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Posted - 2016.02.13 01:50:46 -
[26] - Quote
Takari wrote:Amarisen Gream wrote: It would be nice if CCP would take the time and fix the logout/login of the game. It's not broken.
Even ccp acknowledged it's broken. Just not broken enough for it to be worth the 6+months it would take a dedicated team to fix
Citadel worm hole tax
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ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors Snuffed Out
9598
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Posted - 2016.02.13 03:39:45 -
[27] - Quote
SurrenderMonkey wrote:maxys Prime wrote:Still that requires you to login quite a few characters to do the very same stuff. But, by adding this feature we would have even more diversity into industry as a whole part of the game, isn't it? No. All it does is promote the idea that high volume multiboxing is a desirable form of gameplay, instead of something that is merely tolerated. Agreed.
Alt gameplay is allowed. It gives a single player a non-insignificant boost in gameplay diversity and economic scale. The trade off is the inconvenience of managing it all.
That is more than a fair deal.
How did you Veterans start?
"Learn how things work. The intricacies, interactions, and hard limits... knowing these things will grant you far more power in the long run."
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