|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Sapphrine
Kinda'Shujaa Ushra'Khan
|
Posted - 2007.02.03 00:43:00 -
[1]
Originally by: Elsebeth Rhiannon Edited by: Elsebeth Rhiannon on 02/02/2007 21:22:26 In the meeting, Filmir attempted to arrest Muritor, who refused to comply. Filmir received orders to fire, and reluctantly passed them on. Muritor was killed in space, ship to ship, apparently without trying to defend himself.
With respect, this is simply not true. I was the Commander of the Ushra'Khan Forces at the scene of the slaying and I can say with absolute certainty that no effort was made to arrest Karishal. The two men spoke of past conflicts and reminised of an event where Karishal saved Filmir's life. At that point 6 Fleet Tempest Class ships arrived and scrambled Karishal's ship. He was given personal assurances by Filmir prior to the meeting hence the lack of his own men to defend him.
Karishal never stated that he would be willing to be taken into custody and had specifically stated to the contrary in the past. He turned up to a meeting with an old and dear friend out of trust to discuss matters which he had been lead to be of great import. He did not suspect treachery from his dear friend.
It is safe to assume that those higher than Filmir knew full well that Karishal would not be taken without force and the minimal period of time that passed between the refusal to go and the order to fire shows that a standing order to kill him was in place. Whilst the assassination was not as clear cut as turn up and pull the trigger immediately, it is obvious that the intention was to permanently remove Karishal by force.
I agree with you on one thing Elsebeth, Kanth Filmir is a man of honour and he seemed genuinely agonised that he had been chosen for such a mission. He followed his orders, but he betrayed a friend. He will live with that on his conscience.
|
Sapphrine
Kinda'Shujaa Ushra'Khan
|
Posted - 2007.02.03 15:34:00 -
[2]
Originally by: Aodha Khan Edited by: Aodha Khan on 03/02/2007 13:09:11
Originally by: Hakera
So he is nothing more than a theif to you.
Please, don't put words in my mouth. Pilots like Muritor made me who I am today, but that doesn't mean his acts of stealing Republic property become right.
I think both parties are in the wrong here. I just wish Ushra'Khan could see that adding another wrong in declaring open hostilies with the Republic isn't going to help the situation. It will lead to more disaster.
Is Midular the problem? Or, do you wish to see the end to the Republic? If it is the former, then surely there are better ways of removing her from power than acts of war inside Matari borders?
I have no more respect for Midular than you do but I would not resort to having her murdered to remove her from power.
So you feel that the leader of the republic has the right to order the execution of a member of its people. Never mind the fact that he was decieved to get him to the meeting, or that he was a decorated war hero. You see a person standing up against the established order and saying no as someone worthy of being assassinated? If this had been the case in the past where would all Minmatar be? They would still be slaves.
Midular must go. Before this event she would just need to stand down. Now, she must account for her actions. I was there, i saw him go down, i was patched into the comms between them. I am convinced of Midular's guilt to the point that she must move aside. If she does not then she must be forced. I see little problem with executing her for the damage she has done the republic.
|
Sapphrine
Kinda'Shujaa Ushra'Khan
|
Posted - 2007.02.03 20:10:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Elsebeth Rhiannon I do not advocate assasinations, deception, or cover-ups. Neither do I advocate threatening of other Matari with violence over an organization punishing a thief.
If you refuse to see the possibility of peace with the Amarr, try at least see the possibility of that with other Matari, will you?
Peace with the Amarr is impossible. Peace with the other Matari is not an issue. Stop trying to make this look like U'K wish to declare war on the Matari. As has been stated again and again, Midular must be removed as the heart of the corruption holding the Republic cowed. Stop trying to equate Midular to the Republic. Midular is one person, a person who's actions restrain a people who wish to free their brethren. Midular's cowardice in ordering the killing of a decorated war hero shows that there is no depths she will not sink to to cling on to the vestiges of power she has.
For evil to triumph, good people need only stand by. Midular may well be the head of the Republic but that does not make her infallible. We are not the Empire, we allow challenges to our leadership. When the leadership is weak it must be replaced and when it is not willing to leave it must be forced. If midular were to stand aside that would remove the need to kill her for the good of the Republic but she would still need to stand trial for Karishal's Murder.
Again, personally if i meet her i wont hesitate to kill her in revenge but that is just my honour to take revenge for the death of a fellow warrior speaking.
|
Sapphrine
Kinda'Shujaa Ushra'Khan
|
Posted - 2007.02.03 20:16:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Sapphrine on 03/02/2007 20:14:16 Edited by: Sapphrine on 03/02/2007 20:13:42
Originally by: Ikar Kaltin
I must say, it is very clear even to an Amarr paramilitary that this "decorated war hero" you speak of, who was stripped of his rank and declared an outlaw by the republic government, who stole from them and then waged a war that he was not allowed to by you republic. He was clearly NOT a member of the republic, it executed a THIEF, TERRORIST and TRAITOR. Would you not do the same? All Midular is guilty of is serving her nation and killing a traitor.
Just because this man was one you supported, you who do not support the republic anyway, does not mean that the Republic has betrayed its people. You mean it has killed a hero of those who do not serve it, and who commits acts of piracy and war against another nation in an attempt to drag the Republic and the Empire into a war.
Before you moan, think. Are you angry because you think the republic betrayed its people, or are you angry because the Republic did not support you, the people who do not support it.
I think i've made it fairly clear. Midular's actions exceeded her role as a head of state. Assassinating your people even if they are ones you brand as traitors might well be the barbarism of the Amarr but is not at the core of the Minmatar.
I am angry at Midular for betraying the Republic. The Republic is meant to represent the people and the people do not wish to see their brethren enslaved. There may well have been a case long ago for not waging a war to free the rest of the Minmatar people from the Amarrian because we would not have one at the time.... that is not longer the case. Midular is a coward who would rather live with the power she already holds and not ACT to SAVE the rest of the people.
|
Sapphrine
Kinda'Shujaa Ushra'Khan
|
Posted - 2007.02.04 01:41:00 -
[5]
Elsebeth, somewhere in this dialogue I recall requests that an investigation of Midular's activity take place. Who would you have run such an investigation given Midular's position and the suspected corruption and cronyism? Who do you feel has the power to run such an investigation?
|
Sapphrine
Kinda'Shujaa Ushra'Khan
|
Posted - 2007.02.05 05:05:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Elsebeth Rhiannon Edited by: Elsebeth Rhiannon on 05/02/2007 01:00:15
Originally by: Telemicus Thrace I support Malaetu Shakor for Prime Minister. I urge the free people of the Republic to do the same. We have 18 days.
What happens in 18 days, mm? Is the line now is "select as our leader who I want, or else!"? How very defender of freedom of you.
How very spinster of you to immediately insinuate that it is a threat when it simply continues a count down of 21 days for action. Don't try to twist this, the people see through these manipulations with ease.
|
Sapphrine
Kinda'Shujaa Ushra'Khan
|
Posted - 2007.02.05 05:07:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Nachshon Do not call me 'an enforcer of Midular's government'. I do not entirely support her actions. And if she is as weak as you claim, then she does not have my support as leader. Come next election, she and the Sebestiors will not recieve my vote.
I believe that peace is the way to solve this. Show the world - the Amarr especially - that the Matari can solve disputes with words and not weapons.
yes indeed, show an enemy willing to take the minmatar people back by force that all they are capable of is using words instead of decisive action. That will really make them back off wont it!
Will you still be asking for peace when they come for your sons and daughters?
|
|
|
|