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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
ShadowPewl
Angry Dragons Psychotic Tendencies.
3
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Posted - 2016.02.22 11:24:23 -
[1] - Quote
As a player of about 10 years my biggest complaint (ignoring the obvious as everyone who has ever played the game longer than 2 years hates Fozzy sov) is the Hictor focused point script.; at least as it applies to subcapitals. I realize the point is to hold caps, and super caps, on field but a 32km scram application to sub caps???? is just insane. It allows a player with very little skill, without links i might add, to sit zero on a gate with a ship with command ship tank and completely shut off any skirmish vessel within 32km. This is so broken that one defensive ship can basically defend an entire gang while their buddies dock up their mining vessels and reship to whatever crap they want. For gods sake change it to apply to only capitals. I realize that was your original intention but your coding was so bad you just basically made it a scram. ITS NOT A SCRAM SO DON'T FREAKING TREAT IT LIKE ONE. |
ChromeStriker
Out of Focus Odin's Call
1008
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Posted - 2016.02.22 12:25:12 -
[2] - Quote
I like it, therefore your argument is invalid....
No Worries
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Ralph King-Griffin
Devils Rejects 666 The Devil's Warrior Alliance
14256
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Posted - 2016.02.22 12:48:10 -
[3] - Quote
hahahaha kieting sissy tears like this are glorious
Better the Devil you know.
=]|[=
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Kalihira
Ultramar Independent Contracting
42
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Posted - 2016.02.22 12:58:04 -
[4] - Quote
37,5 km actually with T2. It gives hics a purpose outside capital tackle. You could ofc stay outside 40km when kiting... just an idea.. |
Linus Gorp
Ministry of Propaganda and Morale Black Marker
103
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Posted - 2016.02.22 15:21:26 -
[5] - Quote
ShadowPewl wrote:(ignoring the obvious as everyone who has ever played the game longer than 2 years hates Fozzy sov) Wrong.
When you don't know the difference between there, their, and they're, you come across as being so uneducated that your viewpoint can be safely dismissed. The literate is unlikely to learn much from the illiterate.
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Tung Yoggi
ElitistOps
130
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Posted - 2016.02.22 16:07:47 -
[6] - Quote
It's one of those things which come "pre-buffed". CCP has stated they will look how the thing fits into the current meta, because it is extremely strong as it is right now.
This leads me to put AB / oversized AB on most ships when i solo roam. My viewpoint would be that it's not really annoying right now only because every gang isn't fielding a HIC at the moment (yet). However, when people will start catching up, it might become quite overwhelming.
Therefore, I would like to see the range reduced by a bit, will it be just to avoid making the Lachesis / Arazu slightly obsolete.
I will live with it being a very strong buff to gatecamping and anti-nano shenanigans. |
elitatwo
Eve Minions The-Company
1094
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Posted - 2016.02.22 18:27:14 -
[7] - Quote
A solution is easy - only ever fly True Sansha.
Eve Minions is recruiting. Learn from about pvp, learn about ships and how to fly them correctly. Small gang and solo action in high, low and nullsec and w-space alike.
We will teach you everything you need and want to know.
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Jacob Holland
Weyland-Vulcan Industries
450
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Posted - 2016.02.23 08:21:20 -
[8] - Quote
ShadowPewl wrote:I realize that was your original intention but your coding was so bad you just basically made it a scram. ITS NOT A SCRAM SO DON'T FREAKING TREAT IT LIKE ONE.
Quote:It's one of those things which come "pre-buffed" You realise that the scram effect (shutting down MWDs...etc) is a recent - and very deliberate - buff right?
Adding the scram effect to the HIC's infini-point was supposed to give people reasons to fly a HIC outside supercap tackle and to make the choice between MWD, dual-prop and AB a little less binary... looks like mission accomplished. |
Sabriz Adoudel
Move along there is nothing here
5699
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Posted - 2016.02.23 08:52:18 -
[9] - Quote
Count me in as a fan of this change.
More people incidentally flying HICs = more supercapitals getting captured.
grr grr death to all supers grr grr
I support the New Order and CODE. alliance. www.minerbumping.com
Sabriz's Rule: "Any time someone argues for a game change claiming it is a quality of life change, the change is actually a game balance change".
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1113
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Posted - 2016.02.23 10:05:20 -
[10] - Quote
hics are useful again, thats right. |
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Garrett Osinov
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
29
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Posted - 2016.02.23 16:22:40 -
[11] - Quote
Lachesis can scramble with true sansha warp scrambler up to 27k without links. Huggin can double web up to 78k without links. Maybe those ships should be nerfed as well ? |
Tung Yoggi
ElitistOps
130
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Posted - 2016.02.23 17:26:38 -
[12] - Quote
The "pre-buff" i was mentioning was more the range rather than the new ability.
I could see CCP tweaking the range, but not the HIC's new ability itself. I haven't see that many angry comments if you except OP's. It is however something which is a new hurdle for solo pvp. Doesn't kill this playstyle though. |
Donnachadh
United Allegiance of Undesirables
754
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Posted - 2016.02.24 15:29:40 -
[13] - Quote
Linus Gorp wrote:ShadowPewl wrote:(ignoring the obvious as everyone who has ever played the game longer than 2 years hates Fozzy sov) Wrong. Could not have said it better so this ^^^ |
Stitch Kaneland
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
753
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Posted - 2016.02.24 16:19:55 -
[14] - Quote
Garrett Osinov wrote:Lachesis can scramble with true sansha warp scrambler up to 27k without links. Huggin can double web up to 78k without links. Maybe those ships should be nerfed as well ?
No. Those ships can barely break 70k EHP if fit fully tanked. You could kill a lach/arazu with a proper setup before his gang blobs the hell out of you (assuming he's alone initially and not sitting on a gate camp).
The other funny thing is you bring up a lach/arazu and say it can scram out 27km without links. With links, and heated, its at 33.4km range. Whats HIC scram range again for a meta HIC scram you ask? 32km? Oh well.. so a ship that sport 150-200k EHP also has a scram almost on par than a linked recon. Seems fair. So a ship is better at warp disruption than a ship specialized in warp disruption. Going for t2 or faction, and a HIC scram reaches 40km. PERFECT SENSE.
Bottom line is, things like this exist in gate camps, and will only get worse as more people train into them.
[Devoter, Scram all the things] 1600mm Steel Plates II 1600mm Steel Plates II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Armor Thermal Hardener II Internal Force Field Array I Energized Armor Layering Membrane II
Medium Capacitor Booster II, Navy Cap Booster 800 10MN Afterburner II Sensor Booster II, Scan Resolution Script
Warp Disruption Field Generator II, Focused Warp Disruption Script Warp Disruption Field Generator II, Focused Warp Disruption Script Warp Disruption Field Generator II, Focused Warp Disruption Script [empty high slot] [empty high slot] [empty high slot]
Medium Trimark Armor Pump I Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
In a fleet, before links, it has 184k EHP and can hold 3 dudes on a gate pretty easily for his friends to blap without risking anything.
Show me an arazu/lach that can scram 3 targets at once (from 32-40km away), and still sport that kind of tank. I'll wait.
Give Battlecruisers range to fullfil their Anti-Cruiser role - OP SUCCESS
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pushdogg
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
64
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Posted - 2016.02.25 06:07:50 -
[15] - Quote
Stitch Kaneland wrote:Garrett Osinov wrote:Lachesis can scramble with true sansha warp scrambler up to 27k without links. Huggin can double web up to 78k without links. Maybe those ships should be nerfed as well ? No. Those ships can barely break 70k EHP if fit fully tanked. You could kill a lach/arazu with a proper setup before his gang blobs the hell out of you (assuming he's alone initially and not sitting on a gate camp). A huggin webbing you at 78km is a non issue since he doesn't have you pointed. Just warp away, unless you want to die. The other funny thing is you bring up a lach/arazu and say it can scram out 27km without links. With links, and heated, its at 33.4km range. Whats HIC scram range again for a meta HIC scram you ask? 32km? Oh well.. so a ship that sports 150-200k EHP also has a scram almost on par than a linked recon. Seems fair. So a ship is better at warp disruption than a ship specialized in warp disruption. Going for t2 or faction, and a HIC scram reaches 40km. PERFECT SENSE. Bottom line is, things like this exist in gate camps, and will only get worse as more people train into them. [Devoter, Scram all the things] 1600mm Steel Plates II 1600mm Steel Plates II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Armor Thermal Hardener II Internal Force Field Array I Energized Armor Layering Membrane II Medium Capacitor Booster II, Navy Cap Booster 800 10MN Afterburner II Sensor Booster II, Scan Resolution Script Warp Disruption Field Generator II, Focused Warp Disruption Script Warp Disruption Field Generator II, Focused Warp Disruption Script Warp Disruption Field Generator II, Focused Warp Disruption Script [empty high slot] [empty high slot] [empty high slot] Medium Trimark Armor Pump I Medium Trimark Armor Pump I In a fleet, before links, it has 184k EHP and can hold 3 dudes on a gate pretty easily for his friends to blap without risking anything. Show me an arazu/lach that can scram 3 targets at once (from 32-40km away), and still sport that kind of tank. I'll wait.
I see no problem as that ship can't kill anything...
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Khan Wrenth
Ore Oppression Prevention and Salvation
464
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Posted - 2016.02.25 07:36:27 -
[16] - Quote
pushdogg wrote:I see no problem as that ship can't kill anything...
I have no horse in this race and I'm not taking a position on this argument, but that was an incredibly ignorant statement. 1: Your statement assumes a game where nobody flies cooperatively (just the opposite, flying cooperatively is the entire point of the game). So whether this individual ship can kill anything is irrelevant. He even made a direct statement to that effect.
Quote:...for his friends to blap
2: What the ship can or cannot kill wasn't the point of the poster you replied to. His stance was about the tank and range a HIC has, verses the tank and range of a dedicated recon cruiser. If you want to refute an argument he's trying to make, that's the area you need to focus on.
If you want to at least appear attentive, I'd advise you to refresh yourself in the old threads when this feature was introduced. This very topic was discussed at length, so you could at the very least get caught up to speed and be ready to debate the merits and consequences of this system and possible alternatives.
Let's discuss overhauling the way we get intel in EvE.
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W0lf Crendraven
Welfcorp The Tuskers Co.
405
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Posted - 2016.02.25 08:07:28 -
[17] - Quote
Afaik they know its too op and are nerfing it soon. |
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1113
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Posted - 2016.02.25 11:17:08 -
[18] - Quote
hics are fine. Gives people a reason to fly AB fits some more. |
Frank Pannon
184
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Posted - 2016.02.25 12:11:32 -
[19] - Quote
Good topic, must buy one or two, thanks! |
Adrian Maifeld
Nihilistic Disorder Just A Game.
44
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Posted - 2016.02.25 12:20:29 -
[20] - Quote
I must admit that I felt in love with these ships quite quick after I've started to play EVE. The imagination of a small ship which is able to stop even the biggest mofos was noice.
Even before the buff I wanted to fly these vessels. I had the idea of an HIC in a gate camp, which initiates the tackle with its infinite point to prevent ships from fleeing until a faster ship applies its scam and/or web as well to stop the MWD/AB.
You can imagine how happy I am now.
It's a strong ship now and I'm very glad to see it more often nowadays! But it is not op. With an activ WDFG they are very slow. So with an AB you can burn out of range. Or you neut its cap to shut off the WDFG. But yes, I guess it has an impact on the kiting-meta.
Me in person hope that CCP doesn't take the scram-ability away again. It's too interesting how things will develop.
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Zzzzleepyhead
Unsettled Unsettled.
16
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Posted - 2016.02.25 12:22:03 -
[21] - Quote
Stitch Kaneland wrote:Garrett Osinov wrote:Lachesis can scramble with true sansha warp scrambler up to 27k without links. Huggin can double web up to 78k without links. Maybe those ships should be nerfed as well ? No. Those ships can barely break 70k EHP if fit fully tanked. You could kill a lach/arazu with a proper setup before his gang blobs the hell out of you (assuming he's alone initially and not sitting on a gate camp). A huggin webbing you at 78km is a non issue since he doesn't have you pointed. Just warp away, unless you want to die. The other funny thing is you bring up a lach/arazu and say it can scram out 27km without links. With links, and heated, its at 33.4km range. Whats HIC scram range again for a meta HIC scram you ask? 32km? Oh well.. so a ship that sports 150-200k EHP also has a scram almost on par than a linked recon. Seems fair. So a ship is better at warp disruption than a ship specialized in warp disruption. Going for t2 or faction, and a HIC scram reaches 40km. PERFECT SENSE. Bottom line is, things like this exist in gate camps, and will only get worse as more people train into them. [Devoter, Scram all the things] 1600mm Steel Plates II 1600mm Steel Plates II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Armor Thermal Hardener II Internal Force Field Array I Energized Armor Layering Membrane II Medium Capacitor Booster II, Navy Cap Booster 800 10MN Afterburner II Sensor Booster II, Scan Resolution Script Warp Disruption Field Generator II, Focused Warp Disruption Script Warp Disruption Field Generator II, Focused Warp Disruption Script Warp Disruption Field Generator II, Focused Warp Disruption Script [empty high slot] [empty high slot] [empty high slot] Medium Trimark Armor Pump I Medium Trimark Armor Pump I In a fleet, before links, it has 184k EHP and can hold 3 dudes on a gate pretty easily for his friends to blap without risking anything. Show me an arazu/lach that can scram 3 targets at once (from 32-40km away), and still sport that kind of tank. I'll wait.
Super uneducted response: HICs can't be repped, and if you shoot it enough it will need to bring the points off you to get repped which gives you time to warp away. Lach/Huginn can be repped indefinitely while pointing/webbing you so can sport a much higher tank in the long run
Less QQ, more pew pew.
and may the longcat, decending with the holy light, cleanse the world with fire and lazor beams.
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Dom Arkaral
Gate Is Red Complaints Department
84
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Posted - 2016.02.25 12:36:18 -
[22] - Quote
ShadowPewl wrote:It allows a player with very little skill, without links i might add, to sit zero on a gate. No skill, nah It takes 71 days just to sit in it, and if you're a normal person you'll get experience on other ships during that minimum 71 days. And after that 71 days, you won't be even close to use a HIC to it's fullest potential (check mastery 4 for a good idea of what time it takes to be proficient).
Salty thread
Merc. Tear Gatherer. Quebecker
I have no Honer (truly)
Attache ta tuque avec d'la broche!
Ich bin krank! (I don't speak German don't bother)
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Stitch Kaneland
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
753
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Posted - 2016.02.25 15:11:15 -
[23] - Quote
Zzzzleepyhead wrote:Stitch Kaneland wrote:Garrett Osinov wrote:Lachesis can scramble with true sansha warp scrambler up to 27k without links. Huggin can double web up to 78k without links. Maybe those ships should be nerfed as well ? No. Those ships can barely break 70k EHP if fit fully tanked. You could kill a lach/arazu with a proper setup before his gang blobs the hell out of you (assuming he's alone initially and not sitting on a gate camp). A huggin webbing you at 78km is a non issue since he doesn't have you pointed. Just warp away, unless you want to die. The other funny thing is you bring up a lach/arazu and say it can scram out 27km without links. With links, and heated, its at 33.4km range. Whats HIC scram range again for a meta HIC scram you ask? 32km? Oh well.. so a ship that sports 150-200k EHP also has a scram almost on par than a linked recon. Seems fair. So a ship is better at warp disruption than a ship specialized in warp disruption. Going for t2 or faction, and a HIC scram reaches 40km. PERFECT SENSE. Bottom line is, things like this exist in gate camps, and will only get worse as more people train into them. [Devoter, Scram all the things] 1600mm Steel Plates II 1600mm Steel Plates II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Armor Thermal Hardener II Internal Force Field Array I Energized Armor Layering Membrane II Medium Capacitor Booster II, Navy Cap Booster 800 10MN Afterburner II Sensor Booster II, Scan Resolution Script Warp Disruption Field Generator II, Focused Warp Disruption Script Warp Disruption Field Generator II, Focused Warp Disruption Script Warp Disruption Field Generator II, Focused Warp Disruption Script [empty high slot] [empty high slot] [empty high slot] Medium Trimark Armor Pump I Medium Trimark Armor Pump I In a fleet, before links, it has 184k EHP and can hold 3 dudes on a gate pretty easily for his friends to blap without risking anything. Show me an arazu/lach that can scram 3 targets at once (from 32-40km away), and still sport that kind of tank. I'll wait. Super uneducted response: HICs can't be repped, and if you shoot it enough it will need to bring the points off you to get repped which gives you time to warp away. Lach/Huginn can be repped indefinitely while pointing/webbing you so can sport a much higher tank in the long run
There are very few if any ships in the game that could chew through 150-200k EHP while under fire from multiple opponents. Assuming a gate camp scenario. Maybe a nightmare. But it would be best to just burn back to gate instead of trying to wittle down a 180k EHP AB cruiser with battleship sized guns. On a battlecruiser or any other non-sansha ship once you uncloak youre dead unless you fit an oversized prop mod. Scram prevents me from mwding back to gate or from using my MJD, so i have 0 counterplay. At least with old HIC focused points or even instalock arazu with 70km points i could MJD away from and escape. Which i have done successfully in the past to get around gatecamps. Other more well prepared camps would still get me if they had multiple ships dedicated to scramming to cover the whole gate. Now they dont need multiple ships to cover a gate, they just need 1 HIC.
My main concern is not within fleet battles (where HICs are fairly balanced by not recieving reps) but gate camps. I have no problem with HICs being used as anti kiter. But i dont like the fact their range is extremely oppressive in gate camps and eliminates any counterplay, especially in ships larger than cruisers which really didnt need a nerf to movement/navigation. The one module that made roaming in a BS or BC managable just became useless when a HIC is on gate.
Give Battlecruisers range to fullfil their Anti-Cruiser role - OP SUCCESS
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C11H17NO3
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
9
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Posted - 2016.02.25 16:07:38 -
[24] - Quote
Orhruses easily kite outside of 40 km with faction long point. |
Loradan Illstari
Heretic Army I N F A M O U S
6
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Posted - 2016.02.25 17:42:05 -
[25] - Quote
Thank god something finally brought the kiting down. Get rekt, kiting meta. We need more ships with extra long scrams. L2AB. |
Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
1097
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Posted - 2016.02.26 05:47:47 -
[26] - Quote
Stitch Kaneland wrote:The other funny thing is you bring up a lach/arazu and say it can scram out 27km without links. With links, and heated, its at 33.4km range. Whats HIC scram range again for a meta HIC scram you ask? 32km? Oh well.. so a ship that sports 150-200k EHP also has a scram almost on par than a linked recon. Seems fair. So a ship is better at warp disruption than a ship specialized in warp disruption. Going for t2 or faction, and a HIC scram reaches 40km. PERFECT SENSE. Initially I was going to write this, but then I thought that while recons keep role of long pointing, HICs get to scram better. Kinda ensures that both have a role, although yeah, EHP difference, and sometimes damage, are quite different.
For the record, entire point of HICs is warp disruption as well.
Future of T3 cruisers - multi-tool they aspired to be instead of sledgehammer they have become
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pushdogg
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
69
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Posted - 2016.02.26 08:55:51 -
[27] - Quote
Khan Wrenth wrote:pushdogg wrote:I see no problem as that ship can't kill anything...
I have no horse in this race and I'm not taking a position on this argument, but that was an incredibly ignorant statement. 1: Your statement assumes a game where nobody flies cooperatively (just the opposite, flying cooperatively is the entire point of the game). So whether this individual ship can kill anything is irrelevant. He even made a direct statement to that effect. Quote:...for his friends to blap 2: What the ship can or cannot kill wasn't the point of the poster you replied to. His stance was about the tank and range a HIC has, verses the tank and range of a dedicated recon cruiser. If you want to refute an argument he's trying to make, that's the area you need to focus on. If you want to at least appear attentive, I'd advise you to refresh yourself in the old threads when this feature was introduced. This very topic was discussed at length, so you could at the very least get caught up to speed and be ready to debate the merits and consequences of this system and possible alternatives.
Ignorant is assuming that the person pointed doesn't have backup. This argument can go both ways over and over again, which leaves my point still standing.
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