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CCP Turtlepower
C C P C C P Alliance
334
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Posted - 2016.03.01 16:50:08 -
[1] - Quote
Greetings all mass-testing spaceship pilots!
We would like to ask you all to utilize the new camera in todayGÇÿs mass test, so that we can gather some feedback on the changes we have made for the March release. Please file bug reports for any issues you encounter (press F12 in game), and leave your feedback on generally how it feels to use the camera in this thread. Here is a list of camera features we have been working on recently:
-Tracking camera movement has been tweaked in various ways -Camera bobbing has been tweaked to make it feel more natural -Zoom level should persist through session changes -Zoom movement has been tweaked and made more linear -Chase camera functionality has been improved (press the orbit camera button twice to activate the chase cam) -ESC Menu: Camera Speed setting has been replaced with Camera Inertia -ESC Menu: Ship Speed Offset setting has been renamed to Center Offset and can now also toggle off the tracking camera ship offset -Various defect and bug fixes
We would also like to ask you all to play a bit with the Camera settings in the ESC menu and give us some feedback on those. Are the defaults reasonable? Is there any setting you would like to see added?
Thanks in advance! CCP Turtlepower // Team Psycho Sisters |
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moimambo
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
1
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Posted - 2016.03.01 17:09:56 -
[2] - Quote
Please put the right click to look around then both click to zoom feature back. |
Rivr Luzade
Kenshin. DARKNESS.
2349
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Posted - 2016.03.01 17:10:23 -
[3] - Quote
Can I get my aspirin consumption reimbursed by CCP? I yet again had a nasty pinch behind my forehead when I /moveme'd around and the warping camera was painfully lagging behind the ship and the zoom/position awfully off center. Yes, yes, I turned off dynamic view and pushed the camera spe... inertia to max to fix that problem.
You need to move the buttons around in the Hud.
For some reason, when I was on the pos beacon and in Orbit camera mode, when I moved my camera around it would spin and jerk around uncontrollably and chaotically.
UI Improvement Collective
My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.
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Amielia Evangelon
Wyvern Training Inc.
0
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Posted - 2016.03.01 17:46:43 -
[4] - Quote
I do like the new camera modes, BUT i miss the target track function on the old camera. My only complaint. |
Vincent Athena
V.I.C.E.
3773
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Posted - 2016.03.01 17:48:23 -
[5] - Quote
I just did the mass test. There is still one issue: When looking as close as one can to "straight down" the camera bobbing turns into a full screen rotation, which is rather annoying.
Know a Frozen fan? Check this out
Frozen fanfiction
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ACH1LL35
Run and Gun Mercenary Corps FETID
0
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Posted - 2016.03.01 18:02:38 -
[6] - Quote
i really hated the camera shakes there was no way to turn that off |
Tchubb
Zia industrial Specialists
0
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Posted - 2016.03.01 18:15:01 -
[7] - Quote
New camera seems good to me. It would be good to enable rotation to the first person cam, even if its not full 360 degrees. |
Raphendyr Nardieu
Unpublished Chapter Suddenly Content
75
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Posted - 2016.03.01 18:17:14 -
[8] - Quote
Zoom:
* You can get a bit stuck near your ship (or other structures) when zooming too close (maybe some minimal zoom speed) * You can't get very far with zoom in orbit camera and not specially in tactical mode. As you can get back selecting tactical mode again, this shouldn't be a problem * the zoom otherwise feels better than on TQ
Settings:
* Inertia slider seems to have good range of values and default * Inertia overall feels pretty good. Not sure why, but feels better than current TQ * camera bobbing seems nicer for sure. * Dynamic field of view seems (might be wrong here) better than on TQ * Offset seems to be better working. props for that
Orbit camera:
* When starting to rate the camera from tacking, It takes at least 5 seconds for camera to get back to your ship (making "untrack" action) only at that point the game starts to take the mouse movement as rotation command. This brakes what I expect when I rapidly try to rate a camera a bit. * I still would like to see the pan feature from old camera. Helps to look your and others killmarks and especially what weapons they have
FPS camera:
* maybe the same pan that should be with the orbit camera. * way to manually pilot your ship with the mouse
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Worf McGregor
EVE University Ivy League
0
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Posted - 2016.03.01 18:20:52 -
[9] - Quote
When tracking, why use shift c, c was preferred as before. also, when a target is selected, & with track off, you then turn on camera tracking and it does not follow. I had to re-select the target. It defaulted to the selected target before and that again is preferred. Can we again create a default camera position?
First Person Camera; what is it for, why do we need it? We have to look around, quickly. can't do it with 1st person! Need to zoom far out to see the overall field, can't do that with 1st person. I know, shift to alt-2 and zoom out- too many buttons. In a fight, fingers are flying already, mind is racing and you are dead a second later.
I would rather keep the old camera. |
Raphendyr Nardieu
Unpublished Chapter Suddenly Content
75
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Posted - 2016.03.01 18:25:13 -
[10] - Quote
Amielia Evangelon wrote:.. BUT i miss the target track function on the old camera. ..
Right click the orbit mode button or press shift+c to enable autotracking
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Raphendyr Nardieu
Unpublished Chapter Suddenly Content
75
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Posted - 2016.03.01 18:27:49 -
[11] - Quote
Worf McGregor wrote:First Person Camera; what is it for, why do we need it? We have to look around, quickly. can't do it with 1st person! Need to zoom far out to see the overall field, can't do that with 1st person. I know, shift to alt-2 and zoom out- too many buttons. In a fight, fingers are flying already, mind is racing and you are dead a second later..
No need to use it..
Any vase, I have used it to bumping moving targets. Seems to help a bit. |
Miss 'Assassination' Cayman
CK-0FF Bad Intention
17
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Posted - 2016.03.02 12:02:00 -
[12] - Quote
I couldn't make the mass test but after using the new camera for a while I do have some feedback.
The new inertia system is vastly better than before. It still feels a little off, but that may just be because it's different. Removing that acceleration time at the start of camera movements is a vast improvement over the last version. It used to give me a headache even at max speed, but now it's quite usable at just a bit above default speed.
The option to remove the ship offset when tracking an object is also quite welcome. We do still need custom tracking positions, but it's a very big step in the right direction.
I haven't been able to see the default settings for the checkbox options, but Dynamic Field Of View (why is "of" capitalized?) needs to be off by default because it seems to make most people sick when it's on. As for the Inertia default, it seems a little too sluggish. A good default would be 1-2 ticks faster than it is currently.
The tactical camera seems to be working a bit better too, but it's uncomfortable how the camera rotates around its own center. The fact that the camera simply turns instead of orbiting a point also makes it hard to look at an area from another angle because the camera needs to be moved so far that the focal point is out of view before turning to look at it again. It's also annoying that tracking an object makes the camera detach from the object it was set to look at.
There is still one big thing that makes the new camera uncomfortable compared to the old one though: The difference between the horizontal and vertical sensitivity. Adjusting the camera vertically still feels extremely slow and tedious because it requires more mouse movement for the same change in angle compared to horizontal adjustment.
Overall the new camera feels much better than it did a couple weeks ago. I look forward to to using it more. |
Daemun Khanid
Apollo Defence Industries
471
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Posted - 2016.03.02 16:31:16 -
[13] - Quote
Haven't had a chance to test yet but I like what I see in that list.
Only issue I'm hoping was fixed right now that I didnt see there is the way zooming gets a little out of whack when you use tracking cam. (you start tracking and object and zoom in and out and the scale/speed is really fast. Manually moving the camera shuts off the ship offset and then the zoom starts working properly again. Thinking that simply turning off tracking camera offset will fix this but I don't know if that's actually fixing the problem or just obscuring it.(on live server ofc))
Daemun of Khanid
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Daemun Khanid
Apollo Defence Industries
471
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Posted - 2016.03.02 17:21:05 -
[14] - Quote
Hopped on and gave it a quick test.
Camera offset during tracking camera use...+1 thank you. Ship constantly bobbing up and down in station...-1 really annoying. I expected the "camera bobbing" to continue to disable that effect in station which I believe it does on TQ but it isn't working on the test server. It's really unnatural looking the way it just goes....^^^^^ STOP vvvvv STOP ^^^^^^ STOP vvvvv, you get the point. (The effect is much more exagerated on smaller ships. Watching my crusader bob up and down makes me feel like I'm in a roller coaster just sitting in station)
Otherwise the only comment/complain I have is that when using tracking camera it moves from target to target too slowly. One of the things I do like about the new camera on TQ is how fast the tracking camera shifts targets. Just sitting outside station and pointing the camera at things I feel like "....come on... you can do it....MOVE ALREADY" (Edit: This seems to be because I've gotten accustomed to the new camera on TQ and now I'm stuck with old camera when in space on test server)
ummmm I think I just noticed why it seems weird and perhaps why the bobbing in station isn't working. I noticed that the "inertia" setting didn't seem to be doing anything so I turned offset on ... nothing happened. Tried turning all the other options on and off... no effect. The option for try the new camera is removed and I seem to be stuck using the old camera in space and the new camera in station.... sooooo..... kinda broke.
(Turning camera bobbing on and off in station does nothing to stop the ship bobbing up and down btw)
Also this testing is done on 2 different client logins. Both clients experiencing the same thing.
Daemun of Khanid
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Manfred Mann
Death Row inc
12
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Posted - 2016.03.02 19:13:06 -
[15] - Quote
Daemun Khanid wrote:Hopped on and gave it a quick test.
Camera offset during tracking camera use...+1 thank you. Ship constantly bobbing up and down in station...-1 really annoying. I expected the "camera bobbing" to continue to disable that effect in station which I believe it does on TQ but it isn't working on the test server. It's really unnatural looking the way it just goes....^^^^^ STOP vvvvv STOP ^^^^^^ STOP vvvvv, you get the point. (The effect is much more exagerated on smaller ships. Watching my crusader bob up and down makes me feel like I'm in a roller coaster just sitting in station) Edit: I assume once the bug I'm experiencing with camera settings not working and being stuck with old camera in space is fixed it will fix this issue as well.
Otherwise the only comment/complain I have is that when using tracking camera it moves from target to target too slowly. One of the things I do like about the new camera on TQ is how fast the tracking camera shifts targets. Just sitting outside station and pointing the camera at things I feel like "....come on... you can do it....MOVE ALREADY" (Edit: This seems to be because I've gotten accustomed to the new camera on TQ and now I'm stuck with old camera when in space on test server)
ummmm I think I just noticed why it seems weird and perhaps why the bobbing in station isn't working. I noticed that the "inertia" setting didn't seem to be doing anything so I turned offset on ... nothing happened. Tried turning all the other options on and off... no effect. The option for try the new camera is removed and I seem to be stuck using the old camera in space and the new camera in station.... sooooo..... kinda broke.
(Turning camera bobbing on and off in station does nothing to stop the ship bobbing up and down btw)
Also this testing is done on 2 different client logins. Both clients experiencing the same thing.
Edit: Just to confirm this. It definitely is the old camera I'm stuck with in space. All the new buttons and controls are unavailable.
Edit: Bug report submitted along with screen shot showing the old camera controls on the UI.
Same for me as well
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Daemun Khanid
Apollo Defence Industries
473
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Posted - 2016.03.03 17:22:55 -
[16] - Quote
Logged in today to check for changes. I see now that the "try the new camera" box is back. Undocked and all seemed well. I'm now able to use the new camera. Options are now working as expected and WOW with inertia set all the way left that thing just goes and goes and goes and goes. lol Works just fine for my tastes set all the way to the right though so no complaints there.
With camera offset turned off and using tracking camera the camera doesn't make a direct line to the selected target. It kind shoots over as if it wants the camera to be offset and then drifts the ship back into the center of the screen. As opposed to before when it would shoot to center then drift the ship out of center. Is this necessary? It's really visually unpleasing. It's not a functional problem ofc so not a priority but it's (imo) just not ideal aesthetically and creates a slight woozy sensation.
Only other niggle is that when in station you still can't turn off the ship bobbing up and down. I can't say how nauseating it is for my ship to keep bobbing like that when I'm supposed to be sitting still in station. Of all the camera effects so far that is the one the gives me the greatest sensation of sea sickness. It really tricks the brain into feeling like riding over waves. Please make it so that disabling camera bobbing also disables that effect otherwise I'll personally just be forced..... wait a second.... you removed the option to not load station environment! UBER not good. So not only does the wave riding ship in the hanger make me sea sick but I can't even turn off station environment to make it go away. If this goes live I guess I'll just have to make my inventory window block out my entire ship... can't say that's a step in the right direction.
Daemun of Khanid
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Nana Skalski
Poseidaon
6110
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Posted - 2016.03.03 23:34:18 -
[17] - Quote
No pan?
No fun.
( -á° -ƒ-û -í°)/ =ƒÅ¦ - my sandcastle
Every part of a game helps to tell a story. =ƒôò
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Miss 'Assassination' Cayman
CK-0FF Bad Intention
25
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Posted - 2016.03.04 06:00:59 -
[18] - Quote
Daemun Khanid wrote:Logged in today to check for changes. I see now that the "try the new camera" box is back. Undocked and all seemed well. I'm now able to use the new camera. Options are now working as expected and WOW with inertia set all the way left that thing just goes and goes and goes and goes. lol Works just fine for my tastes set all the way to the right though so no complaints there.
With camera offset turned off and using tracking camera the camera doesn't make a direct line to the selected target. It kind shoots over as if it wants the camera to be offset and then drifts the ship back into the center of the screen. As opposed to before when it would shoot to center then drift the ship out of center. Is this necessary? It's really visually unpleasing. It's not a functional problem ofc so not a priority but it's (imo) just not ideal aesthetically and creates a slight woozy sensation.
Only other niggle is that when in station you still can't turn off the ship bobbing up and down. I can't say how nauseating it is for my ship to keep bobbing like that when I'm supposed to be sitting still in station. Of all the camera effects so far that is the one the gives me the greatest sensation of sea sickness. It really tricks the brain into feeling like riding over waves. Please make it so that disabling camera bobbing also disables that effect otherwise I'll personally just be forced..... wait a second.... you removed the option to not load station environment! UBER not good. So not only does the wave riding ship in the hanger make me sea sick but I can't even turn off station environment to make it go away. If this goes live I guess I'll just have to make my inventory window block out my entire ship... can't say that's a step in the right direction.
Edit: Just to add. The camera bobbing option does stop the camera moving up and down in station but it's the ship that keeps moving.
Agreed. The ship bouncing in station is sickening and needs to go away or be covered with windows. Also the lack of static background option is a huge concern for performance reasons as well as aesthetics. Not everyone cares about ship spinning and those of us who don't can get a vast performance improvement by having the static background. I did a test on TQ and checked Load Station Environment on all my characters for a day. Normally I have 3-4 docked and 2-4 in space, so my average framerate went way down to render the station scenes I never look at. |
Altrue
Exploration Frontier inc
2001
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Posted - 2016.03.04 14:27:41 -
[19] - Quote
Please fix the non-linear zoom speed when closely zoomed in, in station view (when docked). It is absolutely infuriating to have to scroll the same amount to go from full zoom(100%) to 95% zoom, than to go from 95% to minimum (0%) zoom.
You should also reduce the amount of camera offset we get from ship speed, decelerating is quite disturbing.
The right clic to move the camera around on the point of view axis should be restored to the orbit view, just like in the old camera. Including the right click + left click for zoom after you've started doing the right click thing.
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Ghaustyl Kathix
Quantum Singularities Half Massed
76
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Posted - 2016.03.04 19:13:55 -
[20] - Quote
Thought I posted about this already, but apparently not.
The orbit camera is still missing two features that were very helpful. In the old camera, you could right-click+drag to turn the camera away from what it was centered on. It was very nice for taking screenshots and generally looking around. Also, while holding right-click after dragging, you could hold left-click and drag to zoom in further than you could with the mousewheel. It was very useful for checking what guns were on battleships, for example.
Besides those, I think the orbit camera is feature-complete, just needs some tweaks like to the previously mentioned offset from speed. |
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Paula Myok
Prime Forces The Methodical Alliance
2
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Posted - 2016.03.10 19:49:51 -
[21] - Quote
Miss 'Assassination' Cayman wrote:Daemun Khanid wrote:Logged in today to check for changes. I see now that the "try the new camera" box is back. Undocked and all seemed well. I'm now able to use the new camera. Options are now working as expected and WOW with inertia set all the way left that thing just goes and goes and goes and goes. lol Works just fine for my tastes set all the way to the right though so no complaints there.
With camera offset turned off and using tracking camera the camera doesn't make a direct line to the selected target. It kind shoots over as if it wants the camera to be offset and then drifts the ship back into the center of the screen. As opposed to before when it would shoot to center then drift the ship out of center. Is this necessary? It's really visually unpleasing. It's not a functional problem ofc so not a priority but it's (imo) just not ideal aesthetically and creates a slight woozy sensation.
Only other niggle is that when in station you still can't turn off the ship bobbing up and down. I can't say how nauseating it is for my ship to keep bobbing like that when I'm supposed to be sitting still in station. Of all the camera effects so far that is the one the gives me the greatest sensation of sea sickness. It really tricks the brain into feeling like riding over waves. Please make it so that disabling camera bobbing also disables that effect otherwise I'll personally just be forced..... wait a second.... you removed the option to not load station environment! UBER not good. So not only does the wave riding ship in the hanger make me sea sick but I can't even turn off station environment to make it go away. If this goes live I guess I'll just have to make my inventory window block out my entire ship... can't say that's a step in the right direction.
Edit: Just to add. The camera bobbing option does stop the camera moving up and down in station but it's the ship that keeps moving. Agreed. The ship bouncing in station is sickening and needs to go away or be covered with windows. Also the lack of static background option is a huge concern for performance reasons as well as aesthetics. Not everyone cares about ship spinning and those of us who don't can get a vast performance improvement by having the static background. I did a test on TQ and checked Load Station Environment on all my characters for a day. Normally I have 3-4 docked and 2-4 in space, so my average framerate went way down to render the station scenes I never look at.
See Above Why would a ship bob around in a station in the first place?????
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Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
1810
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Posted - 2016.03.12 03:38:10 -
[22] - Quote
First thing, assume i have all options turned off (to simulate current camera performance as per dev advice).
Why do i have to move my mouse 4x more distance to look up and down than i do for left or right?
Why, when i stop providing left/right input does my screen keep moving quite some distance?
I like the new smooth zoom but why cant it respond in a controllable way? i have a ratchet-less mouse (Logitech g502), and with small flicks of the wheel it hardly zooms and with very slightly larger flicks it zooms to the extremities with little hope of control.
There seems to be a response delay to zooming that, along with the other new camera behavior, makes it feel like im wrestling with it for control of the screen.
How have to got every sing facet of a single feature fractally wrong? This is the PRIMARY INPUT METHOD for manually piloting and it doesnt work very well in comparison to the existing camera!
Solution.
All stupid bobbin/etc options should be turned off by default.
X and Y axis movement should be at the same rate.
Dampening of camera movement should be stronger (on x and y, with z to match), test it to find a damping rate that matches current camera.
If you adopt this advice, hardly anyone would notice if you changed the camera, i have no idea what you are playing at by making the game harder to control on such a fundamental level?
Along with other terrible recent decisions, some of which you guys have back peddled on, this new camera will be the end of my time with eve. Its tiresome watching you guys make mistake after mistake with no idea if you will fix them.
If i undock after this camera is introduced and im less effective in pvp just because the guys who coded the new camera have priorities/objectives other than making it as functional as the old camera, then im done.
EDIT - After reading the thread i noticed the inertia option. That works well to dampen the movement. But i simply demand that x,y and z axis move at the same speed. I go up and down as much as i go left and right. |
Hugh Jorgan
Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
0
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Posted - 2016.04.07 15:46:50 -
[23] - Quote
The camera offset feature doesn't seem to work on my dual-screen when set to fixed window size. The ship remains centred right between the two monitors, which is suboptimal. |
Feilamya
24
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Posted - 2016.04.07 19:42:36 -
[24] - Quote
Hugh Jorgan wrote:The camera offset feature doesn't seem to work on my dual-screen when set to fixed window size. The ship remains centred right between the two monitors, which is suboptimal. Same here. Seems to be broken, which significantly impairs anyone playing with two monitors.
While you're fiddling with it: Not everyone who plays with 2 monitors needs the extended camera view on the second monitor. Some of us use the second monitor mainly for ingame windows that always have to be opened, such as overview, local, dscan, etc. Maybe add an option to reduce the camera view to one monitor, as rendering space on two monitors only unnecessarily generates heat on the GPU. |
Miss 'Assassination' Cayman
CK-0FF Violence of Action.
67
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Posted - 2016.04.07 21:25:21 -
[25] - Quote
Feilamya wrote:Hugh Jorgan wrote:The camera offset feature doesn't seem to work on my dual-screen when set to fixed window size. The ship remains centred right between the two monitors, which is suboptimal. Same here. Seems to be broken, which significantly impairs anyone playing with two monitors. While you're fiddling with it: Not everyone who plays with 2 monitors needs the extended camera view on the second monitor. Some of us use the second monitor mainly for ingame windows that always have to be opened, such as overview, local, dscan, etc. Maybe add an option to reduce the camera view to one monitor, as rendering space on two monitors only unnecessarily generates heat on the GPU. If they can't even let us turn off the unnecessary rendering in stations I doubt that will happen. |
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