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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
UKM Thorgrim
Caldari Black Lance Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:45:00 -
[421]
Fraud & Deseption, on a grand Scale..
Honour & Steel. |
Sgt Napalm
Synergy Evolved Serenity Fallen
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:45:00 -
[422]
Unban the whistle blower and this matter can be closed
Retired [ISSN]
[Video] Skool of Harpy - Da Blarpy |
Ascend Alt
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:45:00 -
[423]
CCP = Credibility Completely Pwnd?
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Gungankllr
Caldari STK Scientific INVICTUS.
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:46:00 -
[424]
I'm one of those few people that doesn't think T20 should be sent packing.
I've made some pretty heinous mistakes in my life, a few of those at work.
I know T20 has worked his ass off for this game, and I appreciate all the time and effort he has put into this passtime we call Eve.
That being said, the moniker T20 needs to disappear, because the masses have themselves a Frankenstein to be all worked up over.
I think it's none of our damn business how CCP disciplines its employees. I'm sure that there will be some repercussions to this.
I care more that everything else that was brought up is investigated and either proven or disproven, so we can all move on with our lives to something more important, like counting macrominers.
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Jacob Majestic
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:46:00 -
[425]
Edited by: Jacob Majestic on 09/02/2007 22:43:08
Originally by: Skooney I just hope that all of you that are being so critical of T20 and CCP remember this when one of you, makes a bad decision in life.
It was a mistake, it has been corrected, lets move on and play the game.
T20 - As far as I am concerned, it takes a real man/woman to stand up and "take it on the chin" - Forgiven!
Let's play EVE!
In my job, if I inadvertently leave the wrong CD in the wrong place accidentally and the wrong person picks it up, I'm fired and I might even go to jail.
t20 willfully subverted the system for his own personal gain, and then later for the gain of his friends in BoB.
He should be removed with extreme prejudice.
By the way, I still haven't heard about what's going to be done about that GM that was scouting our POS in 28Y.
-dbp
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Blacklight
Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:46:00 -
[426]
Very very difficult to post in this thread from my point of view. Not because I feel either myself or my mates that I play Eve with are cheats but because one man, an employee of CCP no less has let us all down, most of all he's let all of BoB down.
We play hard but I firmly believe we play fair and to have the rug pulled out from beneath us like this is a very bitter pill to swallow.
I'll blog about the issue from my perspective when I am done moving house and stuff so could be a week or so.
Not much more I can say really except that I am sickened and saddened to learn that a CCP employee in my alliance cheated.
Blog
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Gauwyn Morley
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:46:00 -
[427]
Edited by: Gauwyn Morley on 09/02/2007 22:45:38 Seriously, you people make me sick. Your acting like the world is coming to an end..we can never trust you blah blah blah.
One guy, made a mistake. If I thought his actions in anyway effected the outcome of anything BoB did, then I would be upset. However in my mind what he did was so small in comparision to what BoB does and will do, that at best he generated personal income for himself.
I am saddend that we lost a freind, and no, in over 2 years being in BoB I have never known anyone to be a dev. I for one pride myself in flying with a group of people who continually beat the odds, best groups of people and strive to complete a goal.
Your nothing better then a lynching mob. Asking for money in retribution from BoB is just sick. It is impossible, I would then demand that, anyone who bought said items from BoB be penalized as well and the people who dealt with them and so on.
Cheating cannot happen, it decreases the value of what BoB does. Records should be kept of everything that is generated into the game from an outside source and reviewed. Should characters have there game characters monitored....sure. But to stop them from playing the game? Impossible, the game would suffer..you had better believe there is a DEV and GM in EVERY COOL KID ALLIANCE. Any Alliance that pushes the boundries of the game and plays the game to the max is going to demand the attention of the people who created the game.
The policies CCP has in place..are sufficient. Assuming things like this are caught quicker.
Some of you are just ****ed off you feel left out. Especially that hacker kid, all of his actions scream..I want to be a cool kid..
Your fools being fed propaganda by someone with there own agenda.
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Popsikle
Caffeine Commodities Company
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:46:00 -
[428]
Please remain constructive - Serathu ([email protected]) __________________________________________ -= We Fly for our people =- -= I fly for Blood =- |
Skaz
Minmatar
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:46:00 -
[429]
As much as this is a confession it is also a request for your forgiveness for events of which IĈm truly sorry.
This sounds like a certain politician in Iceland who was convicted for abusing his position and now is a shoe-in for parliment again.
My first response as I read this : "Throw him out the airlock"
Barbaric but one that echoes the community response, as there will be no trust, no respect for t20 for a long long time, CCP would be wise to ship him off to China where is past won't be as much of a problem.
But I'm surpised as to how willingly CCP throws him to the wolves now as this happened in June and according to Hellmar took quite a time to gestate to this point.
Human nature suggests that there's more than meets the eye here. But this might be all...
Anyway he'll be punished and hopefully his coworkers look at him as dishonest rather than the one of them who got caught. - -
PINK PINK PINK PINK |
Tsanse Kinske
WeMeanYouKnowHarm
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:46:00 -
[430]
Originally by: Milena Marich Referee's don't play on a football team. Referee's don't play on a football team. How hard is to understand that?
Referees don't develop the game design of football. Both referees and the people who do make the rules should know how to play football though, even though it's a game far, far less complicated than EVE is. * * * In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move.
-Douglas Adams, writing about EVE |
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Cyberus
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:47:00 -
[431]
Please remain constructive - Serathu ([email protected])
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Nev Clavain
Wise Guys Rogue Method Alliance
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:47:00 -
[432]
A total disgrace.
Absolutely nothing has been resolved. Far more is waiting to be uncovered, and far too little punishment has been handed out, both to those willingly receiving the proceeds of actions they knew to be fraudulent, and to the person commiting these actions.
Is there some kind of higher subscription I can pay to get a Dev to help my alliance out? A few T2 bpos to profit off for a few years would be great. Having a Dev leading our fleets, that would be real handy too.
Your 'resolution' to these events is an absolute sham, and an insult to the people who have paid their hard earned money to finance the wages of a dishonest and dishonourable cheat. Like I said, a disgrace.
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Dyrn Zyr
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:47:00 -
[433]
Edited by: Dyrn Zyr on 09/02/2007 22:44:09 My 2 cents and a suggestion.
Internal checks and balances were supposedly in place before recent events and the more recent seemingly reluctant exposure of a corrupt dev. Your proposed go-forward solution--more formalized internal affairs checks--while leaving the source of potential future problems, continued developer-player presence, in place, i.e., trust us to get it right this time and you won't get porked again, leaves a lot to be desired.
A simple, but perhaps expensive counterproposal: create a new server environment to allow those who don't want to underwrite the corruption risk under the "trust us" regime and deny admission of dev-player characters to that server. Dev-players can still experience all of the first hand game content and frustrations on the tainted server and participate in alliances, politics, etc. to their heart's content there. Expensive? Probably. Would it leave TQ somewhat vacant due to the distrust and lack of confidence spurred by recent events? Maybe. Would it penalize the collateral beneficiaries of the misdeeds? Maybe. Would it give presently disillusioned players a plausible alternative to voting with their wallets? Yep.
I know you are hard core anti-shard design, but perhaps the time has come that this concept might make sense after what has happened. It could provide side benefits of thinning out the server populations out a bit.
Just a thought.
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Hamfast
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:47:00 -
[434]
How to reply... It bothers me that it took 6 months to "fix" this... but it is not a surprise, I deal with the same issue IRL... Everyone starts out pointing fingers and blaming others until the proof is laid in front of their faces... even then some still deny it.
T20 has showed an inherent flaw in the T-2 Lotto system, it needs to be revamped and revamped soon... his pilfered BPO's were returned... so what... the fix is to devalue them (the BPO's) and simply add them to the market (in any system that could in any way have them) so anyone that wants can buy them.
Should he lose his job? Yes he should, but I figure he is now the least likely to offend again because he will be watched like a hawk. So if he is allowed to remain employed, I hope he sees how lucky he is.
As I read the posts on this thread, I saw post after post about how bad CCP looks because of this... to those folks, vote with your bucks, go find another game... personally, I like Eve, so I am inclined to give CCP the benefit of the doubt.
Here is my next assignment for T20, not that I can assign anyone anything, design the T-2 BPO system as a reward for R&D, not as a lottery... lottery's can be fixed, instead, the R&D agents need to randomly award the T-2 BPO's that they "Control" to those who are working with them or (slightly higher chance) as a reward for the missions they request.
Fix the system so that this can never happen again...
Noob in training...
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Dravin Dread
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:47:00 -
[435]
Eve has wrought what it has sown. We all know that Eve supports corp theft, scheming other players, piracy and out right grief play, and many devs play pirates. Some would claim that Eve was created for pirates. We should not be surprised that it has lead to this level of meta-gaming. Even those that create and manage the game have fallen victim to the seduction of the dark side. Perhaps it is time, within the game world, to start treating criminals like criminals instead of coddling them. Change the paradigm slightly. Let players be pirates, let them be corp thieves, but don't just hand it to them with backwards security status rules and lacking corp security options. Stop giving the aggressor the majority of the advantages.
How does this relate to the current situation you ask. Well to say it again, change the paradigm slightly in the hopes that rewarding good behavior in game leads to good behavior out of game. I can see the asshatery crowd groaning now, well, I don't really care about your feelings since you sure as hell don't care about mine.
We have a situation where he motivation to cheat was so high that it was done. That motivation not only comes from we individuals, but also the environment in which we find our selves. If the environment promotes it, then players will do it. The out of game behaviors of some people, and abuse of in game powers by some people is out of hand. CCP will loose a slice of its net worth (Good Will) because of all of this and will probably loose some subscribers as well. Right now the game is generating web site hackers, liars, hacking accounts, CCP employees manipulating the game world, the volunteer program being used as scouts, the test server being abused for advanced knowledge of game mechanics. Some of these things are international crimes folks.
Eve is a good game, one of the things that makes it good is the fact that there is real risk. But who should bear the burden of the risk, the criminal or the victim?
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Popsikle
Caffeine Commodities Company
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:47:00 -
[436]
Please remain constructive - Serathu ([email protected]) __________________________________________ -= We Fly for our people =- -= I fly for Blood =- |
Ascend Alt
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:47:00 -
[437]
Edited by: Ascend Alt on 09/02/2007 22:50:21 off topic, and wasnt as funny as i thought when i read it :(
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Grez
Minmatar The Collective Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:48:00 -
[438]
Edited by: Grez on 09/02/2007 22:50:18
Originally by: Jonas O'Fall Since the BPOs were illegitimate, what is the fate of the profits that were gained from their use?
I'd love to know this as well. They've gained ISK/items through these BPO's for the time they've had them (including the ability to make runs). What's going to happen to the ISK made? I dare not even think about having to trawl through all those logs.
This effects more than just BoB. Since BPO runs can be sold on the market, which can be purchased by a new player, which in turn, means he produces that item, and uses it, or sells it.
Some sort of compensation to the playerbase would be nice.
I also agree that the whistleblower on all of this, should be unbanned. It's true, he went against the ToS, and went out of his way to un-spin this web and reveal Dev accounts, but a member of CCP's staff also abused some power. Two wrongs don't make a right, but I believe in this case, he's done the community a service in stopping this, and has also done you (CCP) a service in bringing this to light.
There also needs to be far, far, far more thorough checks in the future. Everytime a Dev creates an item, it should not be allowed to be traded, or put on market unless several other developers have allowed it via some in-house permissioning tool - this way, such a way of creating items in-game can be monitored and policed easier. ---
Cache Clearer |
nickky01
The Collective Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:48:00 -
[439]
Originally by: Blacklight Very very difficult to post in this thread from my point of view. Not because I feel either myself or my mates that I play Eve with are cheats but because one man, an employee of CCP no less has let us all down, most of all he's let all of BoB down.
We play hard but I firmly believe we play fair and to have the rug pulled out from beneath us like this is a very bitter pill to swallow.
I'll blog about the issue from my perspective when I am done moving house and stuff so could be a week or so.
Not much more I can say really except that I am sickened and saddened to learn that a CCP employee in my alliance cheated.
your actually saying that the entire BoB alliance is claiming ignorance when when HOW many people called you cheaters?
how many posts in the corp and alliances forums call you guys out? how many times in how many threads did people say that...and only NOW it "sickens and saddens" you?
pfft -------------------------------------------
Originally by: Tyrrax Thorrk
Oh and IAC's official response to ISS's offer is lollerskates.
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Margie Devilie
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:48:00 -
[440]
surely this accounts as insider trading which is a criminal offence being virtual or not
the game is greatly isk genarated and money = power and t2 bpo = money no matter what type they are
trust was abused
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Ghitza
Backup Squad
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:48:00 -
[441]
Edited by: Ghitza on 09/02/2007 22:45:47 This devblog convinces me only that there IS/WAS for sure something WRONG about devs/GMs abuse of power. Its a sad day in CCP/EVE history, its a shame, no mather what other 'SMART' ppl will say.
edit : smart -> 'smart'
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Orree
Gallente Shiva Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:48:00 -
[442]
There are no "logs" for the passing of inside information on game mechanics and events. No surprise nothing can be found there. Where there would be logs...something was found. Shocking.
That said...simply disgusting and totally not surprising.
These are my views, not those of my corporation or my alliance.
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Jane Spondogolo
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:49:00 -
[443]
Edited by: Jane Spondogolo on 09/02/2007 22:47:44 Good on you T20 for comeing clean. Im sure this isnt an easy time.
edit: Guys. Call off the hounds. Im sure CCP are pwning the **** out of him as we speak for this. No need to make it any harder. We got what we wanted, which was corruption exposed, now lets just work towards a better game by kicking the crap out of BOB
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Takahashi Arran
coracao ardente
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:49:00 -
[444]
personally my opinion is that t20 should be fired, rapidly He has proven to be an irresponsible developer and not a very good one at that. Seeing as he already had a second chance ( portraits by xmas) I cannot see how he is anything but a liability to CCP
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Raindrop
LittleHauling Daikoku Trade Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:49:00 -
[445]
And LOL at banning people for so called hacking a bob forum? Excuse me? Maybe he just had a spy account.
Ever since the start forums have been hacked and team speak servers etc. And not once have i ever seen ccp act against it. But now they do? Just in this case? Ouch the standard does get lowered then. Raindrop
It only takes a raindrop to cool the market.
100% Carebear and loving it. Trader. Hauler.
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Jacob Majestic
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:49:00 -
[446]
Originally by: Blacklight Very very difficult to post in this thread from my point of view. Not because I feel either myself or my mates that I play Eve with are cheats but because one man, an employee of CCP no less has let us all down, most of all he's let all of BoB down.
We play hard but I firmly believe we play fair and to have the rug pulled out from beneath us like this is a very bitter pill to swallow.
I'll blog about the issue from my perspective when I am done moving house and stuff so could be a week or so.
Not much more I can say really except that I am sickened and saddened to learn that a CCP employee in my alliance cheated.
Tell us more about account sharing, Blacklight.
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Lucre
STK Scientific
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:50:00 -
[447]
Originally by: Justicas Herror How easy would it be for CCP to cover up this incident to the players? Really, that's how.
I think that the apology and subsequent blog shows CCP's maturity as game devs.
Did you happen to miss Kieron's "We've looked into this and the event happened so long ago that we can't tell what happened /some devs have had their ids revealed so (sympathy plea) we'll have to delete their characters and all the in-game friendships that went with them / now can we put this behind us and move on" post?
They covered it up for 6 months. They tried covering it up even after the evidence was out there, and the community wouldn't accept it. Which is precisely why it's all but impossible now for people to accept that this list of (mostly) third-string T2 bpo's are all that was involved and that this is end of the cover-up. Total transparency really is the only way out here. And hope that we who love this game love it enough to let CCP start rebuilding that trust which they have so badly betrayed. |
PDoggy
Minmatar Valid Character Corporation
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:50:00 -
[448]
Originally by: Blacklight Very very difficult to post in this thread from my point of view. Not because I feel either myself or my mates that I play Eve with are cheats but because one man, an employee of CCP no less has let us all down, most of all he's let all of BoB down.
We play hard but I firmly believe we play fair and to have the rug pulled out from beneath us like this is a very bitter pill to swallow.
I'll blog about the issue from my perspective when I am done moving house and stuff so could be a week or so.
Not much more I can say really except that I am sickened and saddened to learn that a CCP employee in my alliance cheated.
No, one man did not let you and BoB down. One man got CAUGHT.
Please remain constructive - Serathu ([email protected]) - Wait for your email, do not put it back - Ductoris |
Speedy McWhizz
Significant Figures
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:50:00 -
[449]
Originally by: insolace CCP needs to do the following:
1) fire T20 to show they have a ZERO tolerance policy
2) unban "k" and all of his accounts
3) Fine BOB for the profits made from their BPOs, again demonstrating a ZERO tolerance policy
4) Remove all CCP staff's right to anonymity in the game.
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Plasticine Perfection
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Posted - 2007.02.09 22:51:00 -
[450]
Unban Kugustumen, penalise BoB *fairly*.
Then maybe there'll be some respect again. Until then CCP are heading for the dustbin of MMORPG history to serve as nothing other than yet another lesson on How Not To Run An MMO.
Oh, and I'm intrigued to see what the BoB leadership are going to do about this. A lot of your futures may depend on this too.
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