Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 30 40 50 60 70 80 .. 86 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 5 post(s) |
Jeremiah Saken
The Fall of Leviathan
598
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 06:29:24 -
[2401] - Quote
Lavayar wrote: Just do it! We need you for PCU!
but I already here doing stuff I like. In fact thing like that disencourage me to log on, bad design.
I am the 85%
|
Ix Method
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
495
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 08:00:31 -
[2402] - Quote
sero Hita wrote:I would prefer if the timer was reset for everyone once a day at the same time. This 22 hour timer means you are kinda locked into logging in at the same time of the day you if want to do these recurring opportunities (I am aware you can potentially slide the time two hours backwards everyday so it fits you better, but it is still restricted). As the goal is more people logging in, I see no reason not to let people decide themselves when in a given day they want to be on. +1 to this, having timers all over the place feels janky, curious why they don't just reset at downtime?
Travelling at the speed of love.
|
Lugh Crow-Slave
2627
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 08:03:29 -
[2403] - Quote
Jeremiah Saken wrote:Lavayar wrote: Just do it! We need you for PCU!
but I already here doing stuff I like. In fact thing like that disencourage me to log on, bad design.
but we need to make sure you remember for next time
Citadel worm hole tax
|
Kaybella Hakaari
State War Academy Caldari State
14
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 08:15:51 -
[2404] - Quote
Jeremiah Saken wrote:Lavayar wrote: Just do it! We need you for PCU!
but I already here doing stuff I like. In fact thing like that disencourage me to log on, bad design. Maybe take a week or two off? You'll be helping them learn what this feature is really going to do. |
Caldari 5
D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F. S.A.S Affirmative.
454
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 10:02:19 -
[2405] - Quote
I still can't believe that they went ahead with the SP for Rats thing. If it was Bonus ISK/LP it would be fine, now you start loosing ground on everyone else if you don't login every day, and this makes it harder on the Casual/Weekend Warrior play-style that often puts in just as many hours into the game per week as other player, but they do it in lump sessions instead of consistently throughout the week.
Examples 2 people that know each other in RL, these players have different times that they can play at: Player A can login for an hour a day Player B can't play most of the week but can put in a 7 hour session every Saturday. Both are playing 7 hours a week, however Player A gets an advantage over Player B just because this new system favours his play times. |
Krevnos
Back Door Burglars The Otherworld
160
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 10:23:34 -
[2406] - Quote
Thank you CCP Rise for your generous reply. I am delighted to discover that you find your customers amusing. I would also like to report that I find it amusing that a company is paying for you to offer nothing original whatsoever.
The chief issue with dailies is two-fold:
1. It is aimed to generate a psyche whereby players feel obligated to log on in order to make their daily gain 'keeping up with the Joneses'. Attempts to deny this are futile - it's the very reason you're implementing the feature in the first place.
2. You are entirely avoiding the underlying issue of why players don't want to engage in PvE in the first place - because it's sh*t, CCP Rise. That's why people don't want to play it.
This initiative will fail because people don't like the PvE experience. Trying to push them into it is only going to cause angst.
So why not, instead of spending your time pi**ing us off, start work on something useful, like building a better, more challenging PvE experience?
|
Jeremiah Saken
The Fall of Leviathan
602
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 11:12:34 -
[2407] - Quote
Kaybella Hakaari wrote: Maybe take a week or two off? You'll be helping them learn what this feature is really going to do.
It doesn't matter. I'm already playing with interwals. Sometimes it's continued 2 weeks of everyday login sometimes it's 2 days in a week. That's the beauty of this game, I don't have to login for raid like in wow.
I am the 85%
|
sero Hita
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
170
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 11:58:28 -
[2408] - Quote
Krevnos wrote:Thank you CCP Rise for your generous reply. I am delighted to discover that you find your customers amusing. I would also like to report that I find it amusing that a company is paying for you to offer nothing original whatsoever.
The chief issue with dailies is two-fold:
1. It is aimed to generate a psyche whereby players feel obligated to log on in order to make their daily gain 'keeping up with the Joneses'. Attempts to deny this are futile - it's the very reason you're implementing the feature in the first place.
2. You are entirely avoiding the underlying issue of why players don't want to engage in PvE in the first place - because it's sh*t, CCP Rise. That's why people don't want to play it.
This initiative will fail because people don't like the PvE experience. Trying to push them into it is only going to cause angst.
So why not, instead of spending your time pi**ing us off, start work on something useful, like building a better, more challenging PvE experience?
Was the tone in this post really called for? And even more important, would you as CCP Rise reply to a post like this? I know I wouldn't
"I'm all for pvp, don't get me wrong. I've ganked in Empire, blobed in low sec. Got T-shirts from every which-where.. But to be forced into a pvp confrontation that I didn't want is wrong ccp." RealFlisker
|
sero Hita
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
170
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 12:11:32 -
[2409] - Quote
Caldari 5 wrote:I still can't believe that they went ahead with the SP for Rats thing. If it was Bonus ISK/LP it would be fine, now you start loosing ground on everyone else if you don't login every day, and this makes it harder on the Casual/Weekend Warrior play-style that often puts in just as many hours into the game per week as other player, but they do it in lump sessions instead of consistently throughout the week.
Examples 2 people that know each other in RL, these players have different times that they can play at: Player A can login for an hour a day Player B can't play most of the week but can put in a 7 hour session every Saturday. Both are playing 7 hours a week, however Player A gets an advantage over Player B just because this new system favours his play times.
And it is fine as Player A has a lifestyle that CCP want to reward, whereas player B has a playstyle they want to reward with 1/7 of player A. the thing is Player B only need to log in 2 min to kill a rat. If he choose not to, he has also chosen not to receive the bonus. It is okay to reward certain behavior, like clubs are theoretically available for everyone old enough, but have opening times that reward those who can stay out late clubbing (young people and the mittani), whereas those of us who have other obligations has to choose not to go, or go but go home earlier. CCP does not have to cather for people who have a busy RL, as the people made the choice of what is important for them and I am sure they are old enough to handle the consequences of their actions (Chosing RL over EVE, missing the bonus).
"I'm all for pvp, don't get me wrong. I've ganked in Empire, blobed in low sec. Got T-shirts from every which-where.. But to be forced into a pvp confrontation that I didn't want is wrong ccp." RealFlisker
|
Mandor M Sawall
Whiskey Tango Zulu
4
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 13:00:48 -
[2410] - Quote
Ok, now that this is live. What kid of a timer is implemented? once between DT? 24h? Because i got my SP yesterday and today i killed a rat and did not get it. |
|
Marcus Tedric
Zebra Corp Goonswarm Federation
74
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 13:34:54 -
[2411] - Quote
Mandor M Sawall wrote:Ok, now that this is live. What kid of a timer is implemented? once between DT? 24h? Because i got my SP yesterday and today i killed a rat and did not get it.
It's a 22 hr timer as planned. Open the 'Recurring Opportunities' dropdown and it even has a timer!
Don't soil your panties, you guys made a good point, we'll look at the numbers again. - CCP Ytterbium
|
Princess Morenta
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
5
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 13:43:19 -
[2412] - Quote
Aetran Molou wrote:Memnon Shepard wrote:Today I made it a point to log on, complete the daily, and immediately log off. I'll continue to do this as long as I don't have anything specific to do in Eve and the daily system is in place, if only because I'm too much of an addict to ignore free SP but don't want to reward CCP with an improved PCU for this lazy, boring, SP devaluing feature. That's not very good protesting... That's just ruining the game experience for yourself. Suit yourself, I guess.
Considering that is one of the metrics they are stated they are looking at, it would in fact be good protesting.
Did the same yesterday, was playing Total Warhammer - logged in to do my daily then logged off and back to it.
If CCP worked on more engaging content and systems in game then the logins and replayability would come naturally. |
HoboWithGuns
Uridium Inc.
0
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 14:08:27 -
[2413] - Quote
I started playing Eve about a month ago, and this greatly benefits me. However.... no, no, and NO! What part of NO you don't understand? nein nyet non ne nej f**k no!! I ***** hate daily/weekly crap, it's one of the things that's killings the MMOs.
|
Matt Faithbringer
Tax Services
31
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 14:19:46 -
[2414] - Quote
HoboWithGuns wrote:I started playing Eve about a month ago, and this greatly benefits me. However.... no, no, and NO! What part of NO you don't understand? nein nyet non ne nej f**k no!! I ***** hate daily/weekly crap, it's one of the things that's killings the MMOs.
than don't do them |
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2857
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 14:20:45 -
[2415] - Quote
Jeremiah Saken wrote:Kaybella Hakaari wrote: Maybe take a week or two off? You'll be helping them learn what this feature is really going to do.
It doesn't matter. I'm already playing with interwals. Sometimes it's continued 2 weeks of everyday login sometimes it's 2 days in a week. That's the beauty of this game, I don't have to login for raid like in wow.
Wow didn't force you to log-on to do raids and EVE does not force you to log-on to do this daily. |
Matt Faithbringer
Tax Services
31
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 14:24:40 -
[2416] - Quote
any dev feedback in regards to switching to resetting at downtime instead after 22 hours? |
HoboWithGuns
Uridium Inc.
1
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 14:43:03 -
[2417] - Quote
Matt Faithbringer wrote:than don't do them then*
And keep losing SP? Why should I log in every day at about the same time? Did I sign up to be a midless lemming? It's not even a 24h window (which shouldn't be hard to implement, hint: daily maintenance), it's kill time + 22h. Terrible implementation (of a terrible idea). At this point pve/missions is what I do, so this crap will auto-complete on a daily basis anyway. But how it's implemented it rewards you for being a good trained monkey. And if you can't see how that doesn't benefit you as a person in the long run, your loss.
But all this is irrelevant, because it shouldn't have been implemented in the first place. I don't want Eve to turn into McEve Lite.
|
HoboWithGuns
Uridium Inc.
1
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 14:45:05 -
[2418] - Quote
Matt Faithbringer wrote:any dev feedback in regards to switching to resetting at downtime instead after 22 hours?
Well, at least we can agree on that.
|
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2858
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 15:37:46 -
[2419] - Quote
HoboWithGuns wrote:Matt Faithbringer wrote:than don't do them then* And keep losing SP?
You don;t lose a single SP by skipping it. Just look at your character sheet and you will see skipping a day will not lower your SP total. |
Braden Fanguard
Dutch East Querious Company Asteria Concord.
35
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 15:42:00 -
[2420] - Quote
OK so my 0.02 ISK on the subject.
First, I'm OK with dailies if it is something I can see myself doing on a regular basis anyway. Killing 1 rat? I don't think a single day goes by in eve where I don't already do this, so i don't see it as demanding I log in. I am a bit uneasy about using SP as a reward. I was OK with skill injectors because the SP has to come from some character somewhere in Eve, but this 10,000 from the daily is just pulled out of the ether. On the other hand, I'm hard pressed to find something more motivating than SP to get me to do these little quests. So we will see where this goes for now. As long as these dailies don't become demanding of me (say battlestar galactica online levels) I think this will work out OK. However, I implore you CCP to find some other kind of reward besides SP. Perhaps CONCORD LP, or cosmetic items?
|
|
Edward Pierce
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
133
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 16:01:47 -
[2421] - Quote
It took us 6 years to move away from having to log in at a certain time a day to change skills. Now, years after the skill queue was introduced, I'm having to log in at a certain time every day once again to make sure I don't waste any SP.
Thanks CCP_Rise.
Seriously though, if these were to reset with downtime, we'd be able to get our daily kill in at any time of the day without running into the problem where I either lock myself in to doing it at the same time every day (-2 hours) or I am being a bit inefficient about my SP again.
And since we're talking about SP efficiency, why the hell are we still dealing with remaps and attributes? Get rid of attributes and make implants give a flat +SP/hr per slot, that way they keep their relative value and we can train what our hearts desire. |
Gardav
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
31
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 16:25:55 -
[2422] - Quote
Matt Faithbringer wrote:HoboWithGuns wrote:I started playing Eve about a month ago, and this greatly benefits me. However.... no, no, and NO! What part of NO you don't understand? nein nyet non ne nej f**k no!! I ***** hate daily/weekly crap, it's one of the things that's killings the MMOs.
than don't do them
Perhaps CCP can give us a way to remove the Recurring Opportunities "alarm clock" notification and the RO "switch" from the top left of our UI so we can blissfully forget this new content exists. Much better for all concerned overall. Less whining. Those of us that don't like this new feature will never have to see it again, and those who do like it can partake of it to their heart's content because they see it on their UIs as they wish to.
I think allowing players the option to turn this thing off on our UIs would go a long ways in cooling off the fires of discontent with this new feature.
And I'm going to keep suggesting this when it's appropriate because we have options to turn other things off on our UIs, why not this too? |
Duo Roman
Warp Nomads
14
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 16:45:10 -
[2423] - Quote
HoboWithGuns wrote: It's not even a 24h window (which shouldn't be hard to implement, hint: daily maintenance), it's kill time + 22h.
It's limited to once per day, so in effect it's a 24h window, but you get a chance to do it 2hours earlier in case your log-in time is different on the next day. |
Jeremiah Saken
The Fall of Leviathan
605
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 18:40:18 -
[2424] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote: Wow didn't force you to log-on to do raids and EVE does not force you to log-on to do this daily.
There are no game that is forcing us to do something. I had to be on certain hour 2,3 time per week online if I want to be in group for raid. If I didn't someone else was taking my spot. Was it by force? No But if i didn't choose to login I wasn't be able to see content that was not meant for solo player. Wow didn't force me to do them neither will eve with dailies, but they are completely different things. I choose to log on for fun content (raids) I won't login for something like dailies.
I am the 85%
|
NovaCat13
Seymourus and Co.
220
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 18:44:37 -
[2425] - Quote
sero Hita wrote:Krevnos wrote:Thank you CCP Rise for your generous reply. I am delighted to discover that you find your customers amusing. I would also like to report that I find it amusing that a company is paying for you to offer nothing original whatsoever.
The chief issue with dailies is two-fold:
1. It is aimed to generate a psyche whereby players feel obligated to log on in order to make their daily gain 'keeping up with the Joneses'. Attempts to deny this are futile - it's the very reason you're implementing the feature in the first place.
2. You are entirely avoiding the underlying issue of why players don't want to engage in PvE in the first place - because it's sh*t, CCP Rise. That's why people don't want to play it.
This initiative will fail because people don't like the PvE experience. Trying to push them into it is only going to cause angst.
So why not, instead of spending your time pi**ing us off, start work on something useful, like building a better, more challenging PvE experience?
Was the tone in this post really called for? And even more important, would you as CCP Rise reply to a post like this? I know I wouldn't Considering Rise has only posted 5 times in a thread of 2423 posts, I don't think the occasional sarcastic post is what's preventing him from talking to the players.
Just say NO to Dailies
|
KaarBaak
Squirrel Team
332
|
Posted - 2016.05.25 22:54:30 -
[2426] - Quote
Princess Morenta wrote:Aetran Molou wrote:Memnon Shepard wrote:Today I made it a point to log on, complete the daily, and immediately log off. I'll continue to do this as long as I don't have anything specific to do in Eve and the daily system is in place, if only because I'm too much of an addict to ignore free SP but don't want to reward CCP with an improved PCU for this lazy, boring, SP devaluing feature. That's not very good protesting... That's just ruining the game experience for yourself. Suit yourself, I guess. Considering that is one of the metrics they are stated they are looking at, it would in fact be good protesting. Did the same yesterday, was playing Total Warhammer - logged in to do my daily then logged off and back to it. If CCP worked on more engaging content and systems in game then the logins and replayability would come naturally. I don't understand the protest. You wouldn't have logged in at all. But, because of this new mechanic you DID login. So CCP gets credit for your login. Meanwhile, you're doing something you didn't plan to do...you took time away from something else you were doing...and you were upset about it enough to spend time posting.
Yeah...I can see how this is a victory for the masses. You go Cesar Chavez!
Dum Spiro Spero
Not getting SP for not killing a rat is like not getting ore for not mining an asteroid.
|
Memnon Shepard
Rifterlings Zero.Four Ops
30
|
Posted - 2016.05.26 03:44:32 -
[2427] - Quote
KaarBaak wrote:Princess Morenta wrote:Aetran Molou wrote:Memnon Shepard wrote:Today I made it a point to log on, complete the daily, and immediately log off. I'll continue to do this as long as I don't have anything specific to do in Eve and the daily system is in place, if only because I'm too much of an addict to ignore free SP but don't want to reward CCP with an improved PCU for this lazy, boring, SP devaluing feature. That's not very good protesting... That's just ruining the game experience for yourself. Suit yourself, I guess. Considering that is one of the metrics they are stated they are looking at, it would in fact be good protesting. Did the same yesterday, was playing Total Warhammer - logged in to do my daily then logged off and back to it. If CCP worked on more engaging content and systems in game then the logins and replayability would come naturally. I don't understand the protest. You wouldn't have logged in at all. But, because of this new mechanic you DID login. So CCP gets credit for your login. Meanwhile, you're doing something you didn't plan to do...you took time away from something else you were doing...and you were upset about it enough to spend time posting. Yeah...I can see how this is a victory for the masses. You go Cesar Chavez!
So many assumptions in so few letters!
I can only speak for myself, but I certainly don't think that people changing their playing habits think of themselves as Chavez or even necessarily as protesters. Is the effect the update had on our playing less valid than the player who dutifully starts setting alarms to max the silly 22 hour timer? Here's the best way I can sum up my behavior:
1) Prior to this update, I often kept the Eve client open in the background even when I wasn't actively playing to chat, trade, tinker with ship fits, etc.
2) I don't like the concept of daily quests to boost a number CCP needs to report on, especially with how this particular system was implemented with so few options for completing it. I loved the fact that Eve prior to this update had a single source of SP that was time based, and I believe that if dailies had to be implemented then LP or AUR would have made better rewards.
3) CCP will be looking at how player activity changes in response to this update, and said they would make modifications accordingly (I assume this includes potentially removing it entirely, but I'm obviously not getting my hopes up).
4) I recognize that a 5 minute task is worth 10k SP to me. Participating does not force me to also like that daily quests are a feature in the game, I still would rather have the option removed.
5) I saw an opportunity to change my behavior in hopes that I wouldn't contribute to an increased average online player count where prior to this update I assume I was logged in more frequently than the average player.
My breaks between Netflix, Reddit and Youtube are now filled with games other than Eve. It's not a civil rights protest, it's a legitimate effect the update had on me as a player. A lot of people are saying "you probably don't even like Eve," "then you shouldn't be playing this game anymore," or "if you are't going to play just quit." I love Eve, but I think it's important to point out that updates which lead to long time paying customers coming to these realizations aren't a good thing. Dailies, as far as I can tell, aren't meant to bring in new subscribers and more than a handful of players were put off by their introduction. Even those who like this system in it's current state must agree that it will be better for CCP to focus on new engaging content that people choose to participate in for fun rather than spending time tying carrots to activities players are known to tire of quickly. |
FoxFire Ayderan
222
|
Posted - 2016.05.26 05:06:23 -
[2428] - Quote
Fantastic idea!
Love you CCP. Especially when you ignore the incessant nay-sayers, who if you'd listened to them we'd be playing EVE as it was when it launched, and... few if any would be left playing it.
|
Gregor Kado
Vivum Mortem
0
|
Posted - 2016.05.26 05:20:40 -
[2429] - Quote
Brilliant. Gives players a reason to get out in space every day instead of treating the account like a skill horse to sit idle for training. Great idea. Just expand it and make it in depth so it does not turn into a grind everyday. Variety is the mother of all gaming success. Keep it up. |
Vash Bloodstone
The Chiaotzu Doctrine
2
|
Posted - 2016.05.26 06:36:06 -
[2430] - Quote
Hello, I'd like to take this moment to offer my humble opinion on this subject. After much thought and deliberation and seeing firsthand some of the results of this new mechanic, I have come to the conclusion that it is a bad idea and a failure.
First of all, it seems clear that this recurring opportunity is meant to incentivize log-ins and also as a way to get people to UN-dock. On both these accounts, it will fail. I am not privy to the log-in numbers and I wouldn't be surprised if for the short term, log-ins did increase, but it will be a false victory. First, we must understand a few basic things. In EvE online, we live in a sandbox, and there are "rewards" to be gained by completing tasks. But like real life, each reward in eve requires work and effort equal to that of the reward and sometimes you get no reward for a lot of work. Going further, many tasks in eve are done with the knowledge that the rewards will be meager or that it will even cost resources to engage in. I am sure that many here might say that the funniest things to do EvE often have no rewards at all. For example, many acts of PvP may end with no reward and may in fact result in great losses. So, why do people do those things than? If you don't know already, they do it because it's *FUN.*
If you can take anything away from what I say, let it be that the main reason people play EvE is to have Fun. Yes, people play EvE to have FUN and not to earn "rewards." Oh, but Vash, can't people have fun earning rewards by doing daily opportunities? You tell me, can they? When you set-up a reward system, you change how a person's brain works. In general, people will do things that they think are fun. They will make this decision on their own, often not not on the basis on how many rewards they will get, but on how much fun they will have. How else can you explain why so many people engage in PvP, or how many people in industry make stuff even though the profit margins are thin or non-existent? If people only did things based on rewards, than there would hardly be any PvP and we'd probably see a lot more PvE action.
One of the best things that I like about EvE is its unique reward system. Rewards are variable and getting better rewards require more risk and ingenuity. They are fun because it mirrors real life in that things are uncertain and you never know what your going to get. What this recurring opportunity does is fundamentally change all that.
Ask yourself this question: Why did you log in to eve today?
Before this abomination of recurring opportunities, most people would of gave very nice answers like: explore, pvp, mine, etc, etc. But now today, a growing number of people will now say: I logged in to get the 10k sp bro. This is the death bell of eve online. There is one thing you must understand about human motivation. Rewards do not foster creativity, and in fact they stifle it. Studies have shown this. If you pay people based on getting good test scores, they will do worse than those who just studied because they felt it, (with no incentive).
When people log in to get the 10ksp, that's exactly why they are logging in, to get 10ksp and NOT to play Eve online. This may seem like a odd statement, but this is what rewards do to our brain. They change our perspective. When we have rewards on the mind, that's all we can focus on. The thing is, by turning the task of logging in to eve and killing a single NPC into a reward, you've now turned that simple activity into a chore. Because inside people's brain's, what happens is that deep inside, people start thinking, if I have be incentivized to do this task, that means the task must not be worth doing in of itself.
So, whether CCP intended or not, they now just destroyed a certain number of their players. Its probably not many, but now some people are going to think that EvE online must not be worth playing because they have to give out rewards just to get people to log in.
Anyway, this recurring opportunities thing seems small, and many of you will probably just shrug your shoulders, but it is the spirit behind it that is so toxic and why it must be stopped. Please get rid of this abomination. Don't turn eve online into a chore. If you want people to play eve more, than let it be because its fun, and not because of some lousy reward. Ultimately, if you get players to play just because of rewards, you will just end up with a bunch of zombies and this game will end up in oblivion. End Daily tasks now.
Sorry if my post dragged on...may the force be with you....
|
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 30 40 50 60 70 80 .. 86 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |