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Dom Arkaral
Axios
342
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Posted - 2016.05.03 18:02:12 -
[61] - Quote
Gahh.. stupid cellphone Will make proper reply tonight
Merc. Tear Gatherer. Quebecker. Has no Honer. Salt Harvester. #b4r
Gł+Montreal EVE Meet Organiser
Gł+Come talk in the ingame chan "EVE Montreal" for more info or just to chill!
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Tengu Grib
Rabble Inc. Rabble Alliance
1476
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Posted - 2016.05.03 19:21:11 -
[62] - Quote
Dom Arkaral wrote:Gahh.. stupid cellphone Will make proper reply tonight
You have no honer.
Rabble Rabble Rabble
Praise James, Supreme Protector of High Sec.
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Tengu Grib
Rabble Inc. Rabble Alliance
1477
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Posted - 2016.05.03 19:27:45 -
[63] - Quote
As far as I'm concerned, a 3 minute timer is perfectly reasonable.
As a ganker the idea of holding a freighter bumped for 15 minutes or even more was hilariously ridiculous. It was only done because it was explicitly legal. From my perspective it was a deliberate abuse of a stupid mechanic. The fact that it took this long to change it is surprising.
Bumping isn't only used in HS btw, bumping titans out of alignment is a time honored tradition across the vast reaches of null sec. Don't have a dictor? Just bump him. Oh and cap drain him so he can't jump.
Is a 3 minute timer a great solution? Personally no, I don't think it is. Is it a quick to implement solution? Yes.
We'll have to see exactly what the mechanic is when they do release it, and see how well the gank fleets are able to adapt to the new mechanics. Worst case, they'll have to be more selective of their targets. (not really a bad thing honestly)
Rabble Rabble Rabble
Praise James, Supreme Protector of High Sec.
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Dom Arkaral
Axios
348
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Posted - 2016.05.03 22:43:19 -
[64] - Quote
Okayyy here goes the bomb.
Can you tell me, how does RFF succeed on such a large scale?
I mean, they only failed 382 contract in 2015, despite completing 139 758? They also only lost 185 freighter in all areas of space (that's one freighter per 2 days) Can you tell me how I don't see them crying about CODE. or bumping?
Maybe they take precautions instead of crying rivers to CCP because you guys are idiots. They use every tool at their disposal to not die to CODE.
If only half of freighter pilots were as precautious.
Your arguments mean nothing if the biggest hauling company in New Eden only failed 0.27% of all their contracts.
Adapt or die
Source
Merc. Tear Gatherer. Quebecker. Has no Honer. Salt Harvester. #b4r
Gł+Montreal EVE Meet Organiser
Gł+Come talk in the ingame chan "EVE Montreal" for more info or just to chill!
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Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
7625
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Posted - 2016.05.03 23:51:50 -
[65] - Quote
Ima Wreckyou wrote:Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:same idiotic crap as usual Why are you even quoting my post if you don't adress the content. I don't care what your problem with understanding the game mechanics of ganking and bumping is, maybe try to understand how the game works or something.
I'll post different crap when you start posting different crap.
Bring back DEEEEP Space!
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Sarah Flynt
Federation Interstellar Resources Silent Infinity
184
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Posted - 2016.05.04 21:34:30 -
[66] - Quote
Dom Arkaral wrote:Can you tell me, how does RFF succeed on such a large scale?
I mean, they only failed 382 contract in 2015, despite completing 139 758? They also only lost 185 freighter in all areas of space (that's one freighter per 2 days) That's only highsec. Black Frog uses jump freighters. For a highly specialised group that "uses every tool at their disposal to not die to CODE." that number is actually quite high.
Dom Arkaral wrote:Can you tell me how I don't see them crying about CODE. or bumping? Ever heard of the concept of "alts"?
Dom Arkaral wrote:Maybe they take precautions instead of crying rivers to CCP because you guys are idiots. Are you seriously trying to tell us that a highly specialised group should be used as baseline for balancing? On a further note: insults don't make you look very credible. Consider this discussion to be over from my end if you feel you have to continue to go down that road.
Dom Arkaral wrote:Okayyy here goes the bomb. I'm still waiting for it
Sick of High-Sec gankers? Join the public channel Anti-ganking and the dedicated intel channel Gank-Intel !
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Dom Arkaral
Axios
354
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Posted - 2016.05.05 01:34:19 -
[67] - Quote
Sarah Flynt wrote:Dom Arkaral wrote:Can you tell me, how does RFF succeed on such a large scale?
I mean, they only failed 382 contract in 2015, despite completing 139 758? They also only lost 185 freighter in all areas of space (that's one freighter per 2 days) That's only highsec. Black Frog uses jump freighters. For a highly specialised group that "uses every tool at their disposal to not die to CODE." that number is actually quite high. 185 is the total of their losses (Red Frog, Black Frog and Blue Frog) otherwise they would have mentionned that 185 is for RFF only.
You're a speshul snowflake ain't ya?
Merc. Tear Gatherer. Quebecker. Has no Honer. Salt Harvester. #b4r
Gł+Montreal EVE Meet Organiser
Gł+Come talk in the ingame chan "EVE Montreal" for more info or just to chill!
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Nitshe Razvedka
627
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Posted - 2016.05.05 03:19:07 -
[68] - Quote
Enough Dom, you have had your 5cents worth. Move on or you will not leave the thread with your dignity.......
Listened to enough of your meerd whilst burning your last corps poco's, wished you had of all the drop kicks come to def.
Thieving pirates discuss INTEGRITY; Anarchist gankers give us LAWS; and Whoring merc's cry then blow off clients with INSULTS.
Up is down and down is up in the C&P Forum.
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Sarah Flynt
Federation Interstellar Resources Silent Infinity
184
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Posted - 2016.05.05 09:26:03 -
[69] - Quote
Dom Arkaral wrote:185 is the total of their losses (Red Frog, Black Frog and Blue Frog) otherwise they would have mentionned that 185 is for RFF only. Look, it's really not that hard: Red Frog and Blue Frog are both highsec only and Black Frog only uses jump freighters outside of highsec. As there were no jump freighters reimbursed, where we indeed could not tell where they were lost, all of those T1 freighter losses must have been in highsec as none of their corps use T1 freighters outside of highsec.
Sick of High-Sec gankers? Join the public channel Anti-ganking and the dedicated intel channel Gank-Intel !
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Dom Arkaral
Axios
354
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Posted - 2016.05.05 12:03:43 -
[70] - Quote
Thanks for noticing I never owned any POCOs.. They don't seem viable enough to be worth the trouble
Merc. Tear Gatherer. Quebecker. Has no Honer. Salt Harvester. #b4r
Gł+Montreal EVE Meet Organiser
Gł+Come talk in the ingame chan "EVE Montreal" for more info or just to chill!
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Dom Arkaral
Axios
354
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Posted - 2016.05.05 12:05:25 -
[71] - Quote
Sarah Flynt wrote:Dom Arkaral wrote:185 is the total of their losses (Red Frog, Black Frog and Blue Frog) otherwise they would have mentionned that 185 is for RFF only. Look, it's really not that hard: Red Frog and Blue Frog are both highsec only and Black Frog only uses jump freighters outside of highsec. As there were no jump freighters reimbursed, where we indeed could not tell where they were lost, all of those T1 freighter losses must have been in highsec as none of their corps use T1 freighters outside of highsec. Who says they use t1 exclusively in HS? Logic would say so, but there are always more adventurous folks
Merc. Tear Gatherer. Quebecker. Has no Honer. Salt Harvester. #b4r
Gł+Montreal EVE Meet Organiser
Gł+Come talk in the ingame chan "EVE Montreal" for more info or just to chill!
|
Sarah Flynt
Federation Interstellar Resources Silent Infinity
184
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Posted - 2016.05.05 14:02:50 -
[72] - Quote
Dom Arkaral wrote:Sarah Flynt wrote:Dom Arkaral wrote:185 is the total of their losses (Red Frog, Black Frog and Blue Frog) otherwise they would have mentionned that 185 is for RFF only. Look, it's really not that hard: Red Frog and Blue Frog are both highsec only and Black Frog only uses jump freighters outside of highsec. As there were no jump freighters reimbursed, where we indeed could not tell where they were lost, all of those T1 freighter losses must have been in highsec as none of their corps use T1 freighters outside of highsec. Who says they use t1 exclusively in HS? Logic would say so, but there are always more adventurous folks White Frog Insurance only covers losses to ganks in continuous highsec (no highsec islands, no duels, no wardec losses) and only under certain conditions: https://sites.google.com/site/redfrogfreightmanual/conditions
The statistic you quoted is only about what White Frog Insurance reimbursed, not even about how many freighters they actually lost.
Sick of High-Sec gankers? Join the public channel Anti-ganking and the dedicated intel channel Gank-Intel !
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Dom Arkaral
Axios
354
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Posted - 2016.05.05 15:11:32 -
[73] - Quote
Sarah Flynt wrote:Dom Arkaral wrote:Sarah Flynt wrote:Dom Arkaral wrote:185 is the total of their losses (Red Frog, Black Frog and Blue Frog) otherwise they would have mentionned that 185 is for RFF only. Look, it's really not that hard: Red Frog and Blue Frog are both highsec only and Black Frog only uses jump freighters outside of highsec. As there were no jump freighters reimbursed, where we indeed could not tell where they were lost, all of those T1 freighter losses must have been in highsec as none of their corps use T1 freighters outside of highsec. Who says they use t1 exclusively in HS? Logic would say so, but there are always more adventurous folks White Frog Insurance only covers losses to ganks in continuous highsec (no highsec islands, no duels, no wardec losses) and only under certain conditions: https://sites.google.com/site/redfrogfreightmanual/conditions The statistic you quoted is only about what White Frog Insurance reimbursed, not even about how many freighters they actually lost. My point of them still running efficiently even with CODE. still stands. There is no ccounter-argument to that, no matter how hard you try.
And since there is nothing left to argue about here, I can confirm once more that CODE. Always Wins
Merc. Tear Gatherer. Quebecker. Has no Honer. Salt Harvester. #b4r
Gł+Montreal EVE Meet Organiser
Gł+Come talk in the ingame chan "EVE Montreal" for more info or just to chill!
|
Sarah Flynt
Federation Interstellar Resources Silent Infinity
188
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Posted - 2016.05.05 17:18:27 -
[74] - Quote
Dom Arkaral wrote:My point of them still running efficiently even with CODE. still stands. There is no ccounter-argument to that, no matter how hard you try. So, your point is that only when the biggest and highly specialised hauling group that "uses every tool at their disposal to not die to CODE.", that already had to implement an insurance program due to risen ganking activity (individual haulers don't have that option) and already had to more than double their fees while citing "considerably risen ganking activity" as one of the reasons, losing ~25% of their customers and ~37% contracts issued to them in the process, becomes unprofitable, only then you're going to admit that there might be something wrong.
Good thing CCP doesn't operate like that, otherwise there would be nobody left to adjust the mechanics for as all other haulers would have stopped long before this would have happened.
Dom Arkaral wrote:And since there is nothing left to argue about here I agree. There really isn't anything left to discuss with you.
Sick of High-Sec gankers? Join the public channel Anti-ganking and the dedicated intel channel Gank-Intel !
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John E Normus
New Order Logistics CODE.
791
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Posted - 2016.05.06 01:52:48 -
[75] - Quote
And yet Red Frog is making more isk than ever according to what they've told us at eve-meets in Amsterdam and Germany.
Are they lying to us Sarah?
Between Ignorance and Wisdom
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Tyyler DURden
Mordechai and Sons Distribution Co.
255
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Posted - 2016.05.06 02:41:57 -
[76] - Quote
Dom Arkaral wrote:Sarah Flynt wrote:Dom Arkaral wrote:Sarah Flynt wrote:Dom Arkaral wrote:185 is the total of their losses (Red Frog, Black Frog and Blue Frog) otherwise they would have mentionned that 185 is for RFF only. Look, it's really not that hard: Red Frog and Blue Frog are both highsec only and Black Frog only uses jump freighters outside of highsec. As there were no jump freighters reimbursed, where we indeed could not tell where they were lost, all of those T1 freighter losses must have been in highsec as none of their corps use T1 freighters outside of highsec. Who says they use t1 exclusively in HS? Logic would say so, but there are always more adventurous folks White Frog Insurance only covers losses to ganks in continuous highsec (no highsec islands, no duels, no wardec losses) and only under certain conditions: https://sites.google.com/site/redfrogfreightmanual/conditions The statistic you quoted is only about what White Frog Insurance reimbursed, not even about how many freighters they actually lost. My point of them still running efficiently even with CODE. still stands. There is no ccounter-argument to that, no matter how hard you try. And since there is nothing left to argue about here, I can confirm once more that CODE. Always Wins I never thought this day would come, but it has. I am in absolute agreement with Dom on this one. The biggest, most efficient, most non-compliant hauling corporation in eve online with not a new order permit in sight, is still running efficiently despite the fact that code has been dunking freighters in unprecedented numbers in the trade pipes for quite awhile now. There is no counter-argument to that, no matter how hard you try.
Somehow, in some weirdly pyrrhic way, the code is always winning.......
Tyyler DURden says "use soap"
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Tengu Grib
Rabble Inc. Rabble Alliance
1495
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Posted - 2016.05.06 17:47:27 -
[77] - Quote
John E Normus wrote:And yet Red Frog is making more isk than ever according to what they've told us at eve-meets in Amsterdam and Germany.
Are they lying to us Sarah?
Wait so if I go to Evesterdam I'll get to shake your hand and buy you a drink?
Rabble Rabble Rabble
Praise James, Supreme Protector of High Sec.
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John E Normus
New Order Logistics CODE.
798
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Posted - 2016.05.06 18:33:12 -
[78] - Quote
Tengu Grib wrote:John E Normus wrote:And yet Red Frog is making more isk than ever according to what they've told us at eve-meets in Amsterdam and Germany.
Are they lying to us Sarah? Wait so if I go to Evesterdam I'll get to shake your hand and buy you a drink?
Sure, if you don't mind watching Mildron leg-humping me while he sings softly in my ear...
Between Ignorance and Wisdom
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Tengu Grib
Rabble Inc. Rabble Alliance
1496
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Posted - 2016.05.06 18:36:51 -
[79] - Quote
John E Normus wrote:Tengu Grib wrote:John E Normus wrote:And yet Red Frog is making more isk than ever according to what they've told us at eve-meets in Amsterdam and Germany.
Are they lying to us Sarah? Wait so if I go to Evesterdam I'll get to shake your hand and buy you a drink? Sure, if you don't mind watching Mildron leg-humping me while he sings softly in my ear...
Why would I mind that?
Rabble Rabble Rabble
Praise James, Supreme Protector of High Sec.
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John E Normus
New Order Logistics CODE.
798
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Posted - 2016.05.06 19:02:29 -
[80] - Quote
Tengu Grib wrote:John E Normus wrote:Tengu Grib wrote:John E Normus wrote:And yet Red Frog is making more isk than ever according to what they've told us at eve-meets in Amsterdam and Germany.
Are they lying to us Sarah? Wait so if I go to Evesterdam I'll get to shake your hand and buy you a drink? Sure, if you don't mind watching Mildron leg-humping me while he sings softly in my ear... Why would I mind that?
LOL, just full disclosure and all that!
Between Ignorance and Wisdom
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Galaxy Pig
New Order Logistics CODE.
945
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Posted - 2016.05.07 14:19:12 -
[81] - Quote
John, who let you out of your cage?
[u]Highsec is owned by players now.[/u] Systems 0.5-1.0 are New Order Territory.-į**All miners and other residents of Highsec must obey **The Code.-įMining without a permit is dangerous and harmful to the EVE community. See www.MinerBumping.com to learn more.
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Sarah Flynt
Federation Interstellar Resources Silent Infinity
192
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Posted - 2016.05.07 18:46:15 -
[82] - Quote
John E Normus wrote:And yet Red Frog is making more isk than ever according to what they've told us at eve-meets in Amsterdam and Germany.
Are they lying to us Sarah? They don't publish their full finances, so that's hard to determine as an outsider. They publish the revenue situation but barely anything on the cost side. The only 2 corps that are relevant for this discussion are Red Frog Freight and Blue Frog Freight as they are their highsec wings (low collateral and high collateral contracts). Black Frog Freight is lowsec/nullsec, so it doesn't matter in our context here.
If you look at the revenue numbers, especially when comparing them to the growth rates of previous years, you see that 2015 put a handbreak on their growth compared to the growth rates of previous years. Blue Frog Freight revenue even declined in 2015 for the first time. Red Frog Freight only showed tiny growth compared to previous years.
Now, with more or less stagnating revenue but vastly increased cost according to their press releases about their massively increased fees, to what conclusion do you come?
Sick of High-Sec gankers? Join the public channel Anti-ganking and the dedicated intel channel Gank-Intel !
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John E Normus
New Order Logistics CODE.
803
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Posted - 2016.05.07 21:48:34 -
[83] - Quote
That hauling is a business and business is good.
Between Ignorance and Wisdom
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Galaxy Pig
New Order Logistics CODE.
945
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Posted - 2016.05.08 05:52:15 -
[84] - Quote
I would conclude that the Code always wins. Always. Especially arguments with Sarah Flynt.
[u]Highsec is owned by players now.[/u] Systems 0.5-1.0 are New Order Territory.-į**All miners and other residents of Highsec must obey **The Code.-įMining without a permit is dangerous and harmful to the EVE community. See www.MinerBumping.com to learn more.
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eddie valvetino
Snuff Box Snuffed Out
175
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Posted - 2016.05.09 12:53:01 -
[85] - Quote
Galaxy Pig wrote:I realize that CCP aims to nerf highsec freighter ganking, but do they intend to end it all-together?
When the nerf to Awoxing was on the horizon, a desperate plea was made by the players and CCP had the good judgement to implement the toggle-switch, thus saving awoxing from total death.
Now, a nerf to freighter suicide ganking comes in the form of a 3-minute warp timer, and we need to try and reason with CCP to allow us more than just 3 measly minutes.
Just making it 5 minutes would make a world of difference.
I implore you, noble Devs, reconsider the practicality of recently proposed mechanics changes to bumping/warping.
Thank you.
If you had more mates you would have more deeps and this wouldn't be a problem
this sounds a lot like the age old Carebear whine "CCP there is something I don't like change the game to suit me" |
Dom Arkaral
Axios
389
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Posted - 2016.05.10 00:27:54 -
[86] - Quote
John E Normus wrote:That hauling is a business and business is good. Is that what you do nowadays? been awhile since I saw you gank something bigger than a diner
Merc. Tear Gatherer. Quebecker. Has no Honer. Salt Harvester. #b4r
Gł+Montreal EVE Meet Organiser
Gł+Come talk in the ingame chan "EVE Montreal" for more info or just to chill!
|
PhantomMajor
High Flyers Northern Coalition.
58
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Posted - 2016.06.15 07:11:01 -
[87] - Quote
Sasha Cohenberg wrote:Ozzie Udan wrote:Tyyler DURden wrote:Perhaps you should have consulted with your peers before you started this thread. The majority of code affiliated opinions expressed in the previously locked thread indicated that this nerf to bumping wasn't much to be concerned about.
Of course there is the possibility that you're trying to be............. what's that word............. oh got it........... Facetious. It's only a nerf to ransoming scum pirates , sorry you need to work a bit harder. Tyyler DURden is right Facetious is a word that fits well here. Getting donations from other haulers is a time honored tradition in highsec
Demanding a ransom requires thought, some planning and effort, where as mashing the function keys after you lock a freighter doesn't. ...hence why ransoming is a dying/dead art form imo |
Ima Wreckyou
The Conference Elite CODE.
2598
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Posted - 2016.06.15 11:03:03 -
[88] - Quote
Why would you even use Red Frog if Freighters where completely save in Highsec? You just load your Freighter and some (thanks to skill injectors free2play) NPC corp alt ships the stuff AFK-AP to the location. There is no opportunity cost anymore if you can get free freighter alts and zero attention is needed.
The Red Frog business model in Higshec is only alive because there is a healthy amount of ganking. It creates an environment where you may lose your stuff and paying someone to ship your stuff for a fee with a collateral is a great way to mitigate that risk. If that risk goes away, so will Red Frogs customers.
It is really quite simple. The more risk there is the more money there will be for enterprises who specialize in shipping your goods and who know how to mitigate their own risk.
the Code ALWAYS wins
Elite PvPer, #74 in 2014
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Crinnfika
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
1
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Posted - 2016.06.15 21:53:39 -
[89] - Quote
Ima Wreckyou wrote:Why would you even use Red Frog if Freighters where completely save in Highsec? You just load your Freighter and some (thanks to skill injectors free2play) NPC corp alt ships the stuff AFK-AP to the location. There is no opportunity cost anymore if you can get free freighter alts and zero attention is needed.
The Red Frog business model in Higshec is only alive because there is a healthy amount of ganking. It creates an environment where you may lose your stuff and paying someone to ship your stuff for a fee with a collateral is a great way to mitigate that risk. If that risk goes away, so will Red Frogs customers.
It is really quite simple. The more risk there is the more money there will be for enterprises who specialize in shipping your goods and who know how to mitigate their own risk.
Freight contracts have never been about risk or safety. Freight contracts exist for the same reason FedEx exists in the real world: Paying someone else to haul my stuff is infinitely more convenient than hauling the stuff myself.
Every person in the game has the power to haul their own goods and no you don't need a freighter either. People pay Red Frog because they don't want to have to spend the time to haul it. |
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine Second-Dawn
1764
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Posted - 2016.06.16 08:40:15 -
[90] - Quote
Crinnfika wrote:Ima Wreckyou wrote:Why would you even use Red Frog if Freighters where completely save in Highsec? You just load your Freighter and some (thanks to skill injectors free2play) NPC corp alt ships the stuff AFK-AP to the location. There is no opportunity cost anymore if you can get free freighter alts and zero attention is needed.
The Red Frog business model in Higshec is only alive because there is a healthy amount of ganking. It creates an environment where you may lose your stuff and paying someone to ship your stuff for a fee with a collateral is a great way to mitigate that risk. If that risk goes away, so will Red Frogs customers.
It is really quite simple. The more risk there is the more money there will be for enterprises who specialize in shipping your goods and who know how to mitigate their own risk. Freight contracts have never been about risk or safety. Freight contracts exist for the same reason FedEx exists in the real world: Paying someone else to haul my stuff is infinitely more convenient than hauling the stuff myself. Every person in the game has the power to haul their own goods and no you don't need a freighter either. People pay Red Frog because they don't want to have to spend the time to haul it.
Absolutely this...
COHE, the Coalition of Hisec Entities is now in operation, time to make hisec work for people who operate there.
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