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BobFromMarketing
ElitistOps Pandemic Legion
81
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Posted - 2016.05.13 03:26:10 -
[1] - Quote
So as it stands interceptors are pretty widely accepted as broken. The fact I re-purposed all of my cov ops to interceptors because the ceptors are actually harder to kill is absurd. At the same time battleships sort of lack a purpose in general doctrines. So I propose a fix to both problems without causing one to become overpowered or the other to become useless.
Give battleships a high or mid slot module that in a specific limited range(10-20km) around them completely negates interediction nuliffication system. It does not provide any warp disruption past that, you would still need a hictor/dictor working in tandem with them, you would still need teamwork. But interceptors would have a viable counter and BS would be given a role. |
Globby
ElitistOps Pandemic Legion
328
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Posted - 2016.05.13 03:47:08 -
[2] - Quote
just remove interdiction nullification it's a garbage special snowflake mechanic that completely changed the meta for worse
also remove 100% safe JF travel, also |
Rendering
Ten Dollar Bond GoonSwarm
1
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Posted - 2016.05.13 04:14:01 -
[3] - Quote
In before Querns, Weaselior, et al rush in to scream loudly about how its totally OK. |
Iain Cariaba
2991
|
Posted - 2016.05.13 04:17:33 -
[4] - Quote
Anti-interdiction nullification already exists. It's called a point.
EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid.
I couldn't have said it better.
Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
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BobFromMarketing
ElitistOps Pandemic Legion
81
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Posted - 2016.05.13 04:20:02 -
[5] - Quote
Iain Cariaba wrote:Anti-interdiction nullification already exists. It's called a point. A decently fit interceptor can attain warp before anyone with over 40 ping can lock them regardless of your scan res. Because of how server ticks work. Someone shouldn't be unable to tackle an interceptor because they live on the wrong side of the pond. |
Rivr Luzade
Kenshin. DARKNESS.
2496
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Posted - 2016.05.13 06:36:41 -
[6] - Quote
BobFromMarketing wrote:Iain Cariaba wrote:Anti-interdiction nullification already exists. It's called a point. A decently fit interceptor can attain warp before anyone with over 40 ping can lock them regardless of your scan res. Because of how server ticks work. Someone shouldn't be unable to tackle an interceptor because they live on the wrong side of the pond. Smartbombs
Globby wrote:also remove 100% safe JF travel, also The number of dying JF suggests that JF travel is far from "100% save".
UI Improvement Collective
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Celthric Kanerian
Ascendance Of New Eden Workers Trade Federation
759
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Posted - 2016.05.13 09:51:16 -
[7] - Quote
This post seems more like a rant than an actual idea. |
BobFromMarketing
ElitistOps Pandemic Legion
82
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Posted - 2016.05.13 11:47:43 -
[8] - Quote
Celthric Kanerian wrote:This post seems more like a rant than an actual idea. You're free to think that. However it's not. |
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1137
|
Posted - 2016.05.13 12:17:12 -
[9] - Quote
agreed. interdiction nullified interceptors are aids of new eve. Remove it all together or leave it to T3 only. |
Morrigan LeSante
Black Omega Security The OSS
1404
|
Posted - 2016.05.13 13:03:41 -
[10] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:agreed. interdiction nullified interceptors are aids of new eve.
I'd say that crown actually belongs to command destroyers, just not many people realise it yet
I don't actually mind a nullified taxi, the convenience is enough to make me not mad at the missed kills.
If it was going to be changed though, it should not be nullification but align time. People shouldn't be able to be safe via passive anchorables, we should reward active play - like camps. So if anything needs to happen, it needs to be align times. Imo. |
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1137
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Posted - 2016.05.13 13:06:06 -
[11] - Quote
or restrict bubble immunity to anchorable mobile bubbles only. so people who are actively playing the game can stop interceptors. |
BobFromMarketing
ElitistOps Pandemic Legion
83
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Posted - 2016.05.14 23:48:20 -
[12] - Quote
Morrigan LeSante wrote:Robert Caldera wrote:agreed. interdiction nullified interceptors are aids of new eve.
I'd say that crown actually belongs to command destroyers, just not many people realise it yet I don't actually mind a nullified taxi, the convenience is enough to make me not mad at the missed kills. If it was going to be changed though, it should not be nullification but align time. People shouldn't be able to be safe via passive anchorables, we should reward active play - like camps. So if anything needs to happen, it needs to be align times. Imo.
I would find it incredibly acceptable if the module did not remove nullification, but instead increased ships mass or agility to increase align time. |
Malcaz
Corostatos
44
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Posted - 2016.05.15 13:59:29 -
[13] - Quote
There is already a counter to interdiction nullified interceptors. Smartbombs. |
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1138
|
Posted - 2016.05.15 15:40:51 -
[14] - Quote
Malcaz wrote:There is already a counter to interdiction nullified interceptors. Smartbombs. Yet very few gatecamps do it.
its not a counter |
Zimmer Jones
Lightspeed Enterprises Goonswarm Federation
470
|
Posted - 2016.05.15 19:17:41 -
[15] - Quote
Yes, it is indeed a counter, well timed smartbombs will take out many if not most small ships, in particular travel fit ones. Just because you can't fit enough of them on your sabre in order for them to be effective does not discount them as a counter.
Sabres also have very little counter, bubble and hide, they are just as risk adverse and get kills for whatever dies in their interdiction sphere when others do the job of attacking the prey and it tries to escape. Interceptors are meant as scouts and initial tackle. even heavily tanked 'ceptors do not last long against anything.
Just as a sabre pilot irritates an entire fleet, an interceptor irritates gatecampers, game mechanic working as intended
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1138
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Posted - 2016.05.15 20:23:47 -
[16] - Quote
the theoretical possibility to achieve something does not mean its well balanced.
noone uses smartbombs because its way too impractical and implicates way too much effort, the fact that smartbombing gatecamps are basically absent in the game indicates very well that smartbombs are not a balanced "counter". People would rather give up and accept uncatchable interceptor taxi as given absurdity. |
Malcaz
Corostatos
44
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Posted - 2016.05.15 23:01:23 -
[17] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:the theoretical possibility to achieve something does not mean its well balanced.
noone uses smartbombs because its way too impractical and implicates way too much effort, the fact that smartbombing gatecamps are basically absent in the game indicates very well that smartbombs are not a balanced "counter". People would rather give up and accept uncatchable interceptor taxi as given absurdity.
its all because of lazy and risk averse people you could say, yet the game and its (bad) mechanics should always be measured and evaluated by how its played, not by theory. Using smartbombs does not require a lot of effort and is not impractical. It is not that hard. |
Lucy Callagan
V0LTA WE FORM V0LTA
180
|
Posted - 2016.05.15 23:33:37 -
[18] - Quote
BobFromMarketing wrote:So as it stands interceptors are pretty widely accepted as broken.
No.
Frugu.net
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Arya Regnar
Darwins Right Hand
1009
|
Posted - 2016.05.15 23:51:20 -
[19] - Quote
This whole thread:
Quote:*Oh no I can't rat with my bastioned marauder 100% safely.*
Nullbears crying.
EvE-Mail me if you need anything.
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Rivr Luzade
Kenshin. DARKNESS.
2508
|
Posted - 2016.05.16 06:31:22 -
[20] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:the theoretical possibility to achieve something does not mean its well balanced.
noone uses smartbombs because its way too impractical and implicates way too much effort, the fact that smartbombing gatecamps are basically absent in the game indicates very well that smartbombs are not a balanced "counter". People would rather give up and accept uncatchable interceptor taxi as given absurdity.
its all because of lazy and risk averse people you could say, yet the game and its (bad) mechanics should always be measured and evaluated by how its played, not by theory. The theoretical possibility is very much active and alive in systems like Hakonen, Jan and the notorious Rancer/Miroitem, Messoya and even Tama. People use smartbomb camps to great effect. While there can be some adjustments to ceptors, a blanket nerf to nullification or agility hurts other ships more than the ceptors. A Blocakde Runner in a bubble would be a sitting duck instead of being able to maneuver back to the gate or out of the way of a dictor/ceptor trying to decloak it (as one example).
UI Improvement Collective
My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.
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Iain Cariaba
3001
|
Posted - 2016.05.16 07:08:14 -
[21] - Quote
Rivr Luzade wrote:The theoretical possibility is very much active and alive in systems like Hakonen, Jan and the notorious Rancer/Miroitem, Messoya and even Tama. People use smartbomb camps to great effect. I couldn't tell you how many times I've had to bounce between safes in those systems, in an insta-warp interceptor, because someone was sitting on the gate I wanted to go through with smartbombs going off.
Just because people are unwilling to use the methods provided to counter a particular mechanic doesn't mean the mechanic is broken.
EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid.
I couldn't have said it better.
Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1138
|
Posted - 2016.05.16 11:53:56 -
[22] - Quote
Iain Cariaba wrote: Just because people are unwilling to use the methods provided to counter a particular mechanic doesn't mean the mechanic is broken.
"Just because people are unwilling to form a 200 titan counterblob, doesnt mean titans are broken" Ian Cariaba (c) 2012
hardly anyone except of hardcore lowsec pipe campers (where they cant be bubbled and can easily get out because 8x stabbed) is using sb battleships. Shows how impractical and pain in the ass this tactic is. |
Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
2036
|
Posted - 2016.05.16 12:55:54 -
[23] - Quote
This idea opens the door to my anti-nullification bubble nullification module. It's a high slot mod I've been working on. You could activate it to nullify an anti nullification bubbles. It would have a side effect of starbursting any ships stationary on the gate (53.6km range - unskilled). Balancing factor would be that in only starbursts ships if there is an anti-nullification bubble active in it's range. |
Nana Skalski
Poseidaon
10699
|
Posted - 2016.05.16 12:57:25 -
[24] - Quote
Some interceptors bother you when tech 3 can do it also? Are interceptors a lot more scarier? I just wonder...
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Planetary Interaction 2.1
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Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
2867
|
Posted - 2016.05.16 13:13:03 -
[25] - Quote
so long a a sabre can sit on a gate cloaked then bubble anything coming through with pretty much no risk then interdiction nullification should exist.
Smartbombs work fine, not a solo one but more than one is great and around my area which has been mentioned is very common for sb camps (they are fun).
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Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2822
|
Posted - 2016.05.16 13:13:45 -
[26] - Quote
How about a new script for Hictors that generate a smaller (actual size to balance) bubble that counter nullification. You'd need to man the gate to get a good coverage of the gate and build an actual camp since inty can probably burn back in the time it takes for a Hictor to lock them, let alone kill them. |
Iain Cariaba
3001
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Posted - 2016.05.16 15:29:55 -
[27] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:hardly anyone except of few hardcore lowsec pipe campers (where they cant be bubbled and can easily get out because 8x stabbed) is using sb battleships. Shows how impractical, bad, ineffective and pain in the ass this only tactic of catching interceptors is and why we need a better solution. You need to get out more if you think that's the case. I run across pipe bombs and smartbomb gate camps rather often while roaming nullsec for relic sites.
EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid.
I couldn't have said it better.
Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
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Rivr Luzade
Kenshin. DARKNESS.
2509
|
Posted - 2016.05.16 15:48:28 -
[28] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:what? how does nerf to interceptors hurt other ships? I dont quite understand. How are blockade runners related to this topic? If there is a good gatecamp of few skilled people, there shouldnt be an easy way out as per clicking warp button as if there were no gatecamp at all - at least not with an entry level 15m ship type. This from page 1:
Morrigan LeSante wrote:If it was going to be changed though, it should not be nullification but align time. People shouldn't be able to be safe via passive anchorables, we should reward active play - like camps. So if anything needs to happen, it needs to be align times. Imo.
UI Improvement Collective
My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1138
|
Posted - 2016.05.16 16:10:42 -
[29] - Quote
Nana Skalski wrote:Some interceptors bother you when tech 3 can do it also? Are interceptors a lot more scarier? I just wonder...
scary is not the issue. they are just too cheap, they are entry level skill wise and are accessible to anyone after 2 weeks playing, you dont need to risk 600m + SP loss when flying one unlike T3 whilst negating pretty much everything in your route aside of rare SB camps.
Lan Wang wrote:so long a a sabre can sit on a gate cloaked then bubble anything coming through with pretty much no risk then interdiction nullification should exist. no risk? Sabre is easily killed. further, cloaky sabre cant even target anything in the next 20 seconds! just burn off and warp.
Nana Skalski wrote:Smartbombs work fine, not a solo one but more than one is great and around my area which has been mentioned is very common for sb camps (they are fun). if they would work fine, everyone wouldnt fly interceptors. Fact is, they dont and thats why they are so rare and thats the reason why they work fine for you - because there is virtually no chance to run into a smartbombing BS, especially if you know the usual places. |
Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
2037
|
Posted - 2016.05.16 16:20:33 -
[30] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:Nana Skalski wrote:Some interceptors bother you when tech 3 can do it also? Are interceptors a lot more scarier? I just wonder... scary is not the issue. they are just too cheap, they are entry level skill wise and are accessible to anyone after 2 weeks playing, you dont need to risk 600m + SP loss when flying one unlike T3 whilst negating pretty much everything in your route aside of rare SB camps. Lan Wang wrote:so long a a sabre can sit on a gate cloaked then bubble anything coming through with pretty much no risk then interdiction nullification should exist. no risk? Sabre is easily killed. further, cloaky sabre cant even target anything in the next 20 seconds! just burn off and warp. Nana Skalski wrote:Smartbombs work fine, not a solo one but more than one is great and around my area which has been mentioned is very common for sb camps (they are fun). if they would work fine, everyone wouldnt fly interceptors. Fact is, they dont and thats why they are so rare and thats the reason why they work fine for you - because there is virtually no chance to run into a smartbombing BS, especially if you know the usual places.
I think the 20 sec uncloaking delay is a little long. Isn't it more like 9?? |
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Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2822
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Posted - 2016.05.16 16:28:16 -
[31] - Quote
Serendipity Lost wrote:
I think the 20 sec uncloaking delay is a little long. Isn't it more like 9??
It's 10 seconds unless you bling the cloak. Then you can get to 9 with bling. |
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1138
|
Posted - 2016.05.16 16:28:42 -
[32] - Quote
Serendipity Lost wrote: I think the 20 sec uncloaking delay is a little long. Isn't it more like 9??
ok 20 sec. is for unskilled cloak. with cloaking 4 its 12 seconds for improved cloak (which is still a LOT) a,d 18 seconds f++r prototype. What I'm saying is cloaky sabre is gimped and kills just total noobs. |
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
2868
|
Posted - 2016.05.16 18:07:58 -
[33] - Quote
you do know how smartbombing works yeah? nothing to do with interdiction nullification or align time, and if smartbombing wasnt effective then you wouldnt have smartbombing camps in nearly every pipeline in lowsec, it works for me because doesnt matter how many people you kill in rancer they just keep coming and its super funny
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1138
|
Posted - 2016.05.16 18:23:13 -
[34] - Quote
smartbombs arent an effective counter to nullified interceptors. Stop asking to bring a slowest subcap ship class in game for hunting the fastest ships. |
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
2868
|
Posted - 2016.05.16 18:32:46 -
[35] - Quote
doesnt matter how fast a ship is, the smartbombs kill them when landing and they have bad tank, so they die, you just want them removed so you can get easier kills in your sabre.
so what about the cloaky mwd trick, i suppose you are agaisnt that which is pretty much on every ship you come across now
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1138
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Posted - 2016.05.16 18:54:48 -
[36] - Quote
no, I'm not against cloak-mwd trick, since bubbles help. im against entry level, 15m ships which negate 99.9% of the whole eve universe and offer safe travel across null/WH by just repeatedely clicking the jump button. |
Iain Cariaba
3003
|
Posted - 2016.05.16 18:58:03 -
[37] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:you just want them removed so you can get easier kills in your sabre. More likely he wants them removed because they're the only things he's not afraid to fight in his sabre. Not sure he even flies an interdictor, though, considering the lack of awareness he has about the mechanics behind it. After all, you supposedly need 20s to lock someone after decloaking in order to keep them from warping off with your bubbles.
EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid.
I couldn't have said it better.
Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
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Rivr Luzade
Kenshin. DARKNESS.
2509
|
Posted - 2016.05.16 19:20:09 -
[38] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:smartbombs arent an effective counter to nullified interceptors. Stop asking to bring a slowest subcap ship class in game for hunting the fastest ships. Like I said there are lowsec some people doing sb camps yet they have done them forever, they have nothing to do with interceptor hunting specifically. In null sec hardly anyone is doing it. The good thing is that the smartbomb BS do not need to move at all to intercept ceptors. They just need to be in the right spot between gates.
UI Improvement Collective
My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.
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elitatwo
Eve Minions O.U.Z.O. Alliance
1216
|
Posted - 2016.05.16 19:36:34 -
[39] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:How about a new script for Hictors that generate a smaller (actual size to balance) bubble that counter nullification. You'd need to man the gate to get a good coverage of the gate and build an actual camp since inty can probably burn back in the time it takes for a Hictor to lock them, let alone kill them.
As long a Hictors will get a nerf to only fit one..
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Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2822
|
Posted - 2016.05.16 19:50:56 -
[40] - Quote
elitatwo wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:How about a new script for Hictors that generate a smaller (actual size to balance) bubble that counter nullification. You'd need to man the gate to get a good coverage of the gate and build an actual camp since inty can probably burn back in the time it takes for a Hictor to lock them, let alone kill them. As long a Hictors will get a nerf to only fit one..
My guess is people would be against that limit. |
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Tabyll Altol
Breaking.Bad Circle-Of-Two
163
|
Posted - 2016.05.16 23:45:31 -
[41] - Quote
Rivr Luzade wrote:BobFromMarketing wrote:Iain Cariaba wrote:Anti-interdiction nullification already exists. It's called a point. A decently fit interceptor can attain warp before anyone with over 40 ping can lock them regardless of your scan res. Because of how server ticks work. Someone shouldn't be unable to tackle an interceptor because they live on the wrong side of the pond. Smartbombs Globby wrote:also remove 100% safe JF travel, also The number of dying JF suggests that JF travel is far from "100% save".
/ sign |
Nana Skalski
Poseidaon
10739
|
Posted - 2016.05.18 12:56:06 -
[42] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote: scary is not the issue. they are just too cheap, they are entry level skill wise and are accessible to anyone after 2 weeks playing, you dont need to risk 600m + SP loss when flying one unlike T3 whilst negating pretty much everything in your route aside of rare SB camps.
If scary is not the issue than what is? Looks like a lot of accessible fun! Fun is the issue here? Accessible is the issue? Or that someone else is having it?
Robert Caldera wrote:Nana Skalski wrote:Smartbombs work fine, not a solo one but more than one is great and around my area which has been mentioned is very common for sb camps (they are fun). if they would work fine, everyone wouldnt fly interceptors. Fact is, they dont and thats why they are so rare and thats the reason why they work fine for you - because there is virtually no chance to run into a smartbombing BS, especially if you know the usual places. That is not my post.
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Davian Thule Pirkibo
Absolute Massive Destruction Test Alliance Please Ignore
40
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Posted - 2016.05.18 20:32:29 -
[43] - Quote
- 1, would wreck balance for solo roamers who can slip past large gate camps. Also why are ceptors "aids" they are easy as hell to kill in frig pvp and are not a threat to most ships, unless they pack a cyno. Smart bomb camps are more common then you think. The fact a ship is low sp/entry level has little to do with its balance. Interdiction nullification is important otherwise you will shift balance to people who are there for easy as hell kills or will force the solo roamer into small gangs or larger. |
Iain Cariaba
3011
|
Posted - 2016.05.18 21:22:40 -
[44] - Quote
Davian Thule Pirkibo wrote:- 1, would wreck balance for solo roamers who can slip past large gate camps. Also why are ceptors "aids" they are easy as hell to kill in frig pvp and are not a threat to most ships, unless they pack a cyno. Smart bomb camps are more common then you think. The fact a ship is low sp/entry level has little to do with its balance. Interdiction nullification is important otherwise you will shift balance to people who are there for easy as hell kills or will force the solo roamer into small gangs or larger. Also, prior to interdiction nullification, you couldn't fly five jumps through nullsec without running into at least three gate bubbles, usually unmanned and there for no other reason than to slow you down (Anyone else remember the 100km radius bubble array on the EC- gate to highsec? ). Now, you don't see this as much.
EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid.
I couldn't have said it better.
Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
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Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2826
|
Posted - 2016.05.18 23:16:47 -
[45] - Quote
Iain Cariaba wrote:Davian Thule Pirkibo wrote:- 1, would wreck balance for solo roamers who can slip past large gate camps. Also why are ceptors "aids" they are easy as hell to kill in frig pvp and are not a threat to most ships, unless they pack a cyno. Smart bomb camps are more common then you think. The fact a ship is low sp/entry level has little to do with its balance. Interdiction nullification is important otherwise you will shift balance to people who are there for easy as hell kills or will force the solo roamer into small gangs or larger. Also, prior to interdiction nullification, you couldn't fly five jumps through nullsec without running into at least three gate bubbles, usually unmanned and there for no other reason than to slow you down (Anyone else remember the 100km radius bubble array on the EC- gate to highsec? ). Now, you don't see this as much.
They could of solved the stupidity of un-manny bubble by changing bubbles instead of giving a class of ship the ability to force a comp on any camp willing to stop them. It's smartbomb or bust to catch these now. |
Iain Cariaba
3013
|
Posted - 2016.05.19 01:26:09 -
[46] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Iain Cariaba wrote:Davian Thule Pirkibo wrote:- 1, would wreck balance for solo roamers who can slip past large gate camps. Also why are ceptors "aids" they are easy as hell to kill in frig pvp and are not a threat to most ships, unless they pack a cyno. Smart bomb camps are more common then you think. The fact a ship is low sp/entry level has little to do with its balance. Interdiction nullification is important otherwise you will shift balance to people who are there for easy as hell kills or will force the solo roamer into small gangs or larger. Also, prior to interdiction nullification, you couldn't fly five jumps through nullsec without running into at least three gate bubbles, usually unmanned and there for no other reason than to slow you down (Anyone else remember the 100km radius bubble array on the EC- gate to highsec? ). Now, you don't see this as much. They could of solved the stupidity of un-manny bubble by changing bubbles instead of giving a class of ship the ability to force a comp on any camp willing to stop them. It's smartbomb or bust to catch these now. Pretty certain adding nullification was easier. IIRC, bubble code is mixed in with POS code, or something like that.
EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid.
I couldn't have said it better.
Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
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Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2826
|
Posted - 2016.05.19 12:12:15 -
[47] - Quote
Iain Cariaba wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:Iain Cariaba wrote:Davian Thule Pirkibo wrote:- 1, would wreck balance for solo roamers who can slip past large gate camps. Also why are ceptors "aids" they are easy as hell to kill in frig pvp and are not a threat to most ships, unless they pack a cyno. Smart bomb camps are more common then you think. The fact a ship is low sp/entry level has little to do with its balance. Interdiction nullification is important otherwise you will shift balance to people who are there for easy as hell kills or will force the solo roamer into small gangs or larger. Also, prior to interdiction nullification, you couldn't fly five jumps through nullsec without running into at least three gate bubbles, usually unmanned and there for no other reason than to slow you down (Anyone else remember the 100km radius bubble array on the EC- gate to highsec? ). Now, you don't see this as much. They could of solved the stupidity of un-manny bubble by changing bubbles instead of giving a class of ship the ability to force a comp on any camp willing to stop them. It's smartbomb or bust to catch these now. Pretty certain adding nullification was easier. IIRC, bubble code is mixed in with POS code, or something like that.
Of course giving immunity to inties was easier but that does not mean it's the best way to deal with the issue.
Making bubbles de-activate based on a timer would of done it. It would of required a minimal manning of those bubbles at least on an interval instead of the state they were where you could bubble a gate and leave it like that for days unless someone did the hard work of shooting them. |
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1142
|
Posted - 2016.05.19 13:13:54 -
[48] - Quote
also, CCP could at least give them immunity only to anchorable bubbles, so players had a chance to stop them without resorting to something ridiculous as smartbomb battleship |
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
2889
|
Posted - 2016.05.19 13:22:56 -
[49] - Quote
why the hate for smartbombing battleships
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1145
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Posted - 2016.05.19 15:08:52 -
[50] - Quote
because bringing up a battleship for hunting interceptors an incredibly stupid idea, please stop. |
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1145
|
Posted - 2016.05.19 15:10:33 -
[51] - Quote
Nana Skalski wrote:If scary is not the issue than what is? Looks like a lot of accessible fun! Fun is the issue here? Accessible is the issue? Or that someone else is having it? its the cheap way to exclude themselves from pew pew and my lost fun of killing them when they had to move around in catchable ships.
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Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
2893
|
Posted - 2016.05.19 15:13:23 -
[52] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:because bringing up a battleship for hunting interceptors an incredibly stupid idea, please stop.
sitting on a gate cloaked like a sabre is hardly hunting
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1145
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Posted - 2016.05.19 15:19:28 -
[53] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:Robert Caldera wrote:because bringing up a battleship for hunting interceptors an incredibly stupid idea, please stop. sitting on a gate cloaked like a sabre is hardly hunting
what if I said, the sabre is not cloaked and even moving? Stop making empty assumptions. It also could be a hic, or another interceptor camping an anchorable bubble, or hac, or a caracal, maybe assault frigate or pirate faction frigate. Yet bubble nullification negates all those sorts of dangers. |
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2828
|
Posted - 2016.05.19 15:38:00 -
[54] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:Robert Caldera wrote:because bringing up a battleship for hunting interceptors an incredibly stupid idea, please stop. sitting on a gate cloaked like a sabre is hardly hunting
I still think it's a bad design to have the best tool to kill an interceptor be a battleship with a rack of smartbomb no matter how close or far from a definition of hunting this activity can be. |
Edward Olmops
Gunboat Commando
336
|
Posted - 2016.05.19 16:07:51 -
[55] - Quote
Please consider also a different thing: forcing people to jump through gates blindly is bad. |
Davian Thule Pirkibo
Absolute Massive Destruction Test Alliance Please Ignore
40
|
Posted - 2016.05.19 16:51:18 -
[56] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:Lan Wang wrote:Robert Caldera wrote:because bringing up a battleship for hunting interceptors an incredibly stupid idea, please stop. sitting on a gate cloaked like a sabre is hardly hunting what if I said, the sabre is not cloaked and even moving? Stop making empty assumptions. It also could be a hic, or another interceptor camping an anchorable bubble, or hac, or a caracal, maybe assault frigate or pirate faction frigate. Yet bubble nullification negates all those sorts of dangers. You do realise that your not meant to be able to stop all frigs right? Everything has its speciality, and a counter, if you remove interdiction nullification you must give a buff to Ceptors in another area, |
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
2894
|
Posted - 2016.05.19 17:30:45 -
[57] - Quote
Davian Thule Pirkibo wrote:Robert Caldera wrote:Lan Wang wrote:Robert Caldera wrote:because bringing up a battleship for hunting interceptors an incredibly stupid idea, please stop. sitting on a gate cloaked like a sabre is hardly hunting what if I said, the sabre is not cloaked and even moving? Stop making empty assumptions. It also could be a hic, or another interceptor camping an anchorable bubble, or hac, or a caracal, maybe assault frigate or pirate faction frigate. Yet bubble nullification negates all those sorts of dangers. You do realise that your not meant to be able to stop all frigs right? Everything has its speciality, and a counter, if you remove interdiction nullification you must give a buff to Ceptors in another area,
or nerf bubbles
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Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
2054
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Posted - 2016.05.19 17:45:36 -
[58] - Quote
Davian Thule Pirkibo wrote:Robert Caldera wrote:Lan Wang wrote:Robert Caldera wrote:because bringing up a battleship for hunting interceptors an incredibly stupid idea, please stop. sitting on a gate cloaked like a sabre is hardly hunting what if I said, the sabre is not cloaked and even moving? Stop making empty assumptions. It also could be a hic, or another interceptor camping an anchorable bubble, or hac, or a caracal, maybe assault frigate or pirate faction frigate. Yet bubble nullification negates all those sorts of dangers. You do realise that your not meant to be able to stop all frigs right? Everything has its speciality, and a counter, if you remove interdiction nullification you must give a buff to Ceptors in another area,
I'm missing something here. When they gave the nullification buff to interceptors.... remind me again of what they took away.
Since they didn't remove anything when giving the buff, per your above rules the nullification buff should be... nullified. You're making an 'empty assumption' that nerfs and buffs are balanced. In this case there was no balance.
TLDR you're argument makes no sense - SPECIFICALLY when talking about interceptors that got a nullification buff w/ no corresponding nerf. (picture yourself painted into a corner holding a brush and bucket of paint) |
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1145
|
Posted - 2016.05.19 20:16:23 -
[59] - Quote
Davian Thule Pirkibo wrote: You do realise that your not meant to be able to stop all frigs right? Everything has its speciality, and a counter, if you remove interdiction nullification you must give a buff to Ceptors in another area,
is this a self backing argument? That we cant stop them right now is exactly the topic here and worst game design. like others pointed out already. |
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2832
|
Posted - 2016.05.19 20:36:10 -
[60] - Quote
Serendipity Lost wrote:
TLDR you're argument makes no sense - SPECIFICALLY when talking about interceptors that got a nullification buff w/ no corresponding nerf. (picture yourself painted into a corner holding a brush and bucket of paint)
When you paint yourself that hard into a corner, you have at least a roller or even a paint gun in your hand. Not a lousy brush. |
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Davian Thule Pirkibo
Absolute Massive Destruction Test Alliance Please Ignore
44
|
Posted - 2016.05.19 22:52:09 -
[61] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:Davian Thule Pirkibo wrote: You do realise that your not meant to be able to stop all frigs right? Everything has its speciality, and a counter, if you remove interdiction nullification you must give a buff to Ceptors in another area,
is this a self backing argument? That we cant stop them right now is exactly the topic here and worst game design. like others pointed out already.
Can you explain why its bad game design ? Lets rethink the question, why is it bad that they can do it? What do they hurt in the game? You havent actually presented that other then you simply dont get easy kills. |
Davian Thule Pirkibo
Absolute Massive Destruction Test Alliance Please Ignore
44
|
Posted - 2016.05.19 23:01:29 -
[62] - Quote
Serendipity Lost wrote:Davian Thule Pirkibo wrote:Robert Caldera wrote:Lan Wang wrote:Robert Caldera wrote:because bringing up a battleship for hunting interceptors an incredibly stupid idea, please stop. sitting on a gate cloaked like a sabre is hardly hunting what if I said, the sabre is not cloaked and even moving? Stop making empty assumptions. It also could be a hic, or another interceptor camping an anchorable bubble, or hac, or a caracal, maybe assault frigate or pirate faction frigate. Yet bubble nullification negates all those sorts of dangers. You do realise that your not meant to be able to stop all frigs right? Everything has its speciality, and a counter, if you remove interdiction nullification you must give a buff to Ceptors in another area, I'm missing something here. When they gave the nullification buff to interceptors.... remind me again of what they took away. Since they didn't remove anything when giving the buff, per your above rules the nullification buff should be... nullified. You're making an 'empty assumption' that nerfs and buffs are balanced. In this case there was no balance. TLDR you're argument makes no sense - SPECIFICALLY when talking about interceptors that got a nullification buff w/ no corresponding nerf. (picture yourself painted into a corner holding a brush and bucket of paint)
oh, and a self backing argument doesnt fall under any logical fallacy, unless you want to make up new rules on the fly for your argument's deficits.
Now, if i remember correctly the interdiction nullification buff arrived before the full introduction of tiercide, when the simultaneous buff nerf dynamic came about. And you also make it as if i said ccp always follows this?, even though i didn't. Also, the slowest ship being able to defeat the fastest? i think thats great considering how many people complain about not being able to use that ship class so often.
(Imagine slipping on your own bullcrap after talking out of your ass) |
Iain Cariaba
3020
|
Posted - 2016.05.19 23:04:12 -
[63] - Quote
Davian Thule Pirkibo wrote:Robert Caldera wrote:Davian Thule Pirkibo wrote: You do realise that your not meant to be able to stop all frigs right? Everything has its speciality, and a counter, if you remove interdiction nullification you must give a buff to Ceptors in another area,
is this a self backing argument? That we cant stop them right now is exactly the topic here and worst game design. like others pointed out already. Can you explain why its bad game design ? Lets rethink the question, why is it bad that they can do it? What do they hurt in the game? You havent actually presented that other then you simply dont get easy kills. That's the sole reason, honestly.
Interceptors, specifically the travel fit ones they really want to stop, are extremely squishy and often are carrying high value pods. Sometimes they're often caught carrying blueprints, sleeper loot out of wormholes, even PLEX. The fact that they can't catch these and pad their killboards/wallets really irks them, so it must end.
EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid.
I couldn't have said it better.
Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
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Davian Thule Pirkibo
Absolute Massive Destruction Test Alliance Please Ignore
44
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Posted - 2016.05.19 23:08:45 -
[64] - Quote
So in other words "waaaaaaaaa, i cant shut down peoples travel easy enough, waaaaaaaaaaaa" |
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1145
|
Posted - 2016.05.20 07:33:20 -
[65] - Quote
Davian Thule Pirkibo wrote:Robert Caldera wrote:Davian Thule Pirkibo wrote: You do realise that your not meant to be able to stop all frigs right? Everything has its speciality, and a counter, if you remove interdiction nullification you must give a buff to Ceptors in another area,
is this a self backing argument? That we cant stop them right now is exactly the topic here and worst game design. like others pointed out already. Can you explain why its bad game design ? Lets rethink the question, why is it bad that they can do it? What do they hurt in the game? You havent actually presented that other then you simply dont get easy kills.
because moving with 99.9% safety doesnt seem to fit into the philosophy of dark and dangerous place called w-space or 0.0, where you should be able to move from A to B just by pressing the jump button x times and ignoring pretty much everything in your way.
Davian Thule Pirkibo wrote: oh, and a self backing argument doesnt fall under any logical fallacy, unless you want to make up new rules on the fly for your argument's deficits.
no, its just not an argument, its a statement. A bad one. |
Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2833
|
Posted - 2016.05.20 13:02:27 -
[66] - Quote
Davian Thule Pirkibo wrote:
oh, and a self backing argument doesnt fall under any logical fallacy, unless you want to make up new rules on the fly for your argument's deficits.
Now, if i remember correctly the interdiction nullification buff arrived before the full introduction of tiercide, when the simultaneous buff nerf dynamic came about. And you also make it as if i said ccp always follows this?, even though i didn't. Also, the slowest ship being able to defeat the fastest? i think thats great considering how many people complain about not being able to use that ship class so often.
(Imagine slipping on your own bullcrap after talking out of your ass)
There were never any dynamics of simultaneous nerf and buff unless CCP felt a change needed to be balanced against itself at the very same time. This has nothing to do with tiericide. CCP just decide what they think buffs and nerf should be and if they are required or not. They could flat out make interceptors not be immune to interdiction sphere and no rules would be broken at all. |
Serendipity Lost
Repo Industries
2057
|
Posted - 2016.05.20 13:54:09 -
[67] - Quote
Davian Thule Pirkibo wrote:So in other words "waaaaaaaaa, i cant shut down peoples travel easy enough, waaaaaaaaaaaa"
I think on a more mature tac.....
It's not really in the spirit of the risk reward concept that travelling through 'dangerous' space poses no real danger to someone utilizing a properly fit inty. It's not about an inty getting past me or anyone else specifically. It's about eve losing it's core ethos. When I first started eve null and LS were dangerous. If you lived and SURVIVED in null / LS you could conduct your eve life with a certain earned swagger.
Part of the game as a noob was logging in quickly after DT just as the servers came online and making that run through the entryway into null and hoping you make it past that first barrier to your new home. You did it then because it wasn't really possible during prime time for a noob to make it. Now anyone can pretty much go anywhere anytime. I can recall noobs on their first trip out having their new corp/alliance mates coaching them and routing for them on comms. I want that sense of accomplishing something back in the game.
It's ANOTHER drop in the risk that goes with the greater rewards of living in lawless space. Focus on the concept, not 1 dude slipping past a gate camp. This is big picture stuff. |
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
2927
|
Posted - 2016.05.20 13:58:13 -
[68] - Quote
maybe just remove bubbles, why should ratters be able to bubble the hell out of ratting systems so they can rat risk free, or null entry systems where they put bubbles up just to slow people down
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1146
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Posted - 2016.05.20 14:06:16 -
[69] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:maybe just remove bubbles, why should ratters be able to bubble the hell out of ratting systems so they can rat risk free, or null entry systems where they put bubbles up just to slow people down
remove bubbles? How are you supposed to catch cloakers and fast warpers then? How to keep a whole fleet of dudes in place, or even supercapitals? Bubbles have their purpose. Its just more and more ships being added to the game, which circumvent these fundamental mechanics and making them kinda worthless.
You can still use interdiction nullified T3 for getting past bubbles and tackle. no need for an interceptor. This argument is used a lot as excuse for keeping safe travel mobile for zero and WH space.
Other way would be interceptors being immune to anchorable bubbles only and not against interdictor or HIC bubbles; possibly by introduction of interdiction strength attribute or smth alike, with strength of 1 for mobile bubbles and 2-3 for interdictor and hic deployed spheres, coupled with some warp drive attribute given to ship types. |
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
2928
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Posted - 2016.05.20 14:19:50 -
[70] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:remove bubbles? How are you supposed to catch cloakers and fast warpers then?
same way they do in lowsec and highsec?
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
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Posted - 2016.05.20 14:24:12 -
[71] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:Robert Caldera wrote:remove bubbles? How are you supposed to catch cloakers and fast warpers then? same way they do in lowsec and highsec?
so basically, not at all?!? You must be f... kidding. Your posts might actually qualify as trolling by now.
In a thread about nullification nerf you simply request exact the opposite and giving this ability to basically any other ship in game by removing bubbles all together - so not only interceptors can be uncatchable but basically any other fast aligning ship too??! |
Sepheir Sepheron
The Congregation No Handlebars.
54
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Posted - 2016.05.20 14:25:34 -
[72] - Quote
I don't think interdiction immunity is bad at all. |
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
2928
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Posted - 2016.05.20 14:28:26 -
[73] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:Lan Wang wrote:Robert Caldera wrote:remove bubbles? How are you supposed to catch cloakers and fast warpers then? same way they do in lowsec and highsec? so basically, not at all?!? You must be f... kidding. In a thread about nullification nerf you simply request exact the contrary and giving this ability to basically any other ship in game by removing bubbles - so not only interceptor will be uncatchable but basically any other fast aligning ship too??!
tell you what, go look at my alliance killboard and check out the amount of stuff that gets killed on the gates without bubbles then have a think to yourself are these ships really uncatchable.
1 character has 27 interceptor kills since 15th of May, thats just interceptors jumping through rancer, thats not even smart bombs he flies a svipul
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1146
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Posted - 2016.05.20 14:52:13 -
[74] - Quote
27 out of how many thousands passing trough? Im fully aware that you can kill the fail fitted ones + I did rsebo camps myself I know how many of them are realictically vulnerable to instalock, you cant fool me with this bc |
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
2928
|
Posted - 2016.05.20 15:01:05 -
[75] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:27 out of how many thousands passing trough? Im fully aware that you can kill the fail fitted ones + I did rsebo camps myself I know how many of them are realictically vulnerable to instalock, you cant fool me with this bc
you're just sounding entitled now and trying to pick an argument when the killboard of 1 alliance shows multiple kills of these cloaky ships and ceptors, so we can confirm you are just looking for them to be nerfed so you can get the kills easier with your bubbler? if you done resbo camps then why are telling us there is no counter to them?
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Davian Thule Pirkibo
Absolute Massive Destruction Test Alliance Please Ignore
46
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Posted - 2016.05.20 15:33:37 -
[76] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:27 out of how many thousands passing trough? Im fully aware that you can kill the fail fitted ones + I did rsebo camps myself I know how many of them are realictically vulnerable to instalock, you cant fool me with this bc I understand your argument, from the grand scale of risk vs reward, your right in that sense, but here's an important part to remember and know what your getting at, however there are two major balance issues, that are grand scale ones, the risk reward factor and the convenience factor, the latter is difficult to deal with, which ccp actually is attempting to deal with under the npc tax changes, it's convenient for higher end players to do most of their business in highsec. If you end interdiction nullification for Ceptors nullsec looses as you pointed out a convenient way to travel, thus making low and high sec more appealing. I think it would hurt the game more if you gave people less reasons to live in null, considering that's were most of the content is happening in eve , you can see my point here. |
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1146
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Posted - 2016.05.20 16:12:59 -
[77] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote: if you done resbo camps then why are telling us there is no counter to them?
beceuse thats not working for 80-90% of them |
Davian Thule Pirkibo
Absolute Massive Destruction Test Alliance Please Ignore
46
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Posted - 2016.05.20 19:01:51 -
[78] - Quote
No it's still dark and dangerous, for those who don't own the space at least, however it would be logical that technology that is difficult to counter would arise to avoid the risk. |
Davian Thule Pirkibo
Absolute Massive Destruction Test Alliance Please Ignore
46
|
Posted - 2016.05.20 19:15:23 -
[79] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:Lan Wang wrote: if you done resbo camps then why are telling us there is no counter to them?
beceuse thats not working for 80-90% of them Davian Thule Pirkibo wrote:If you end interdiction nullification for Ceptors nullsec looses as you pointed out a convenient way to travel, thus making low and high sec more appealing. I think it would hurt the game more if you gave people less reasons to live in null, considering that's were most of the content is happening in eve , you can see my point here. so what you're saying is that dark and dangerous place in eve shouldnt be all too dark and dangerous, because noone would go there? And, in a way yes, I'd prefer to have an important area of the game more populated and lived in then an area that is not because of an absolute usage of the idea of risk reward, nullsec is arguably more risky then ever with the super coalitions now gone and the map is slowly turning into small nullsec empires warring with each other |
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
2933
|
Posted - 2016.05.20 19:16:37 -
[80] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:Lan Wang wrote: if you done resbo camps then why are telling us there is no counter to them?
beceuse thats not working for 80-90% of them Davian Thule Pirkibo wrote:If you end interdiction nullification for Ceptors nullsec looses as you pointed out a convenient way to travel, thus making low and high sec more appealing. I think it would hurt the game more if you gave people less reasons to live in null, considering that's were most of the content is happening in eve , you can see my point here. so what you're saying is that dark and dangerous place in eve shouldnt be all too dark and dangerous, because noone would go there?
no, its not working for you and this is just gettin pointless now, 80-90% is just a wild guess to make your argument seem valid. Davian has made a really valid point so ill leave it at that, ceptors are fine you just need to get better at catching them
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
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Posted - 2016.05.21 12:01:05 -
[81] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote: no, its not working for you and this is just gettin pointless now, 80-90% is just a wild guess to make your argument seem valid. Davian has made a really valid point so ill leave it at that, ceptors are fine you just need to get better at catching them
no its not a wild guess, its numbers from a real game. Most of them are so fast in warp, they arent even lockable when they appear on overview because already warping. 80-90% is a realistic number. Well maybe you have had different experience, because you live in an area where people generally dont know how to fit an interceptor, I dont know. |
Rivr Luzade
Kenshin. DARKNESS.
2512
|
Posted - 2016.05.21 12:43:20 -
[82] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:Lan Wang wrote: no, its not working for you and this is just gettin pointless now, 80-90% is just a wild guess to make your argument seem valid. Davian has made a really valid point so ill leave it at that, ceptors are fine you just need to get better at catching them
no its not a wild guess, its numbers from a real game. Most of them are so fast in warp, they arent even lockable when they appear on overview because already warping. 80-90% is a realistic number. Well maybe you have had different experience, because you live in an area where people generally dont know how to fit an interceptor, I dont know. Or use combat ceptors for fighting with have a significantly longer align time than 2 seconds? Wild guess, of course.
UI Improvement Collective
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Frostys Virpio
KarmaFleet Goonswarm Federation
2838
|
Posted - 2016.05.21 14:52:03 -
[83] - Quote
Rivr Luzade wrote:Robert Caldera wrote:Lan Wang wrote: no, its not working for you and this is just gettin pointless now, 80-90% is just a wild guess to make your argument seem valid. Davian has made a really valid point so ill leave it at that, ceptors are fine you just need to get better at catching them
no its not a wild guess, its numbers from a real game. Most of them are so fast in warp, they arent even lockable when they appear on overview because already warping. 80-90% is a realistic number. Well maybe you have had different experience, because you live in an area where people generally dont know how to fit an interceptor, I dont know. Or use combat ceptors for fighting/with fighting fittings, which have a significantly longer align time than 2 seconds? Wild guess, of course.
I checked the KB she mentioned and indeed, a lot of inty didn't ahve <2 second align which make it much more possible to tackle them on the gate. |
Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
2978
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Posted - 2016.05.21 14:53:58 -
[84] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Rivr Luzade wrote:Robert Caldera wrote:Lan Wang wrote: no, its not working for you and this is just gettin pointless now, 80-90% is just a wild guess to make your argument seem valid. Davian has made a really valid point so ill leave it at that, ceptors are fine you just need to get better at catching them
no its not a wild guess, its numbers from a real game. Most of them are so fast in warp, they arent even lockable when they appear on overview because already warping. 80-90% is a realistic number. Well maybe you have had different experience, because you live in an area where people generally dont know how to fit an interceptor, I dont know. Or use combat ceptors for fighting/with fighting fittings, which have a significantly longer align time than 2 seconds? Wild guess, of course. I checked the KB she mentioned and indeed, a lot of inty didn't ahve <2 second align which make it much more possible to tackle them on the gate.
so then the problem comes down to the modules and not the ship then? nerf rigs and inertia stabs? but this isnt what he wants, he wants his bubbler to be able to tackle ceptors so lock time and aligning has not much relevance
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1148
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Posted - 2016.05.21 16:12:05 -
[85] - Quote
its always a combination of modules fitted to a specific ship. modules themselves arent a problem with any other ship apparently, but with the interceptors, thus ship is a problem - bubble immunity and instawarp shouldnt be possible in same time. |
Iain Cariaba
3033
|
Posted - 2016.05.21 16:32:51 -
[86] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:its always a combination of modules fitted to a specific ship. modules themselves arent a problem with any other ship apparently, but with the interceptors, thus ship is a problem - bubble immunity and instawarp shouldnt be possible in same time. You've stated this over and over, but so far haven't provided a compelling reason why they shouldn't be possible at the same time.
EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid.
I couldn't have said it better.
Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
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Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
2979
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Posted - 2016.05.21 16:39:25 -
[87] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:its always a combination of modules fitted to a specific ship. modules themselves arent a problem with any other ship apparently, but with the interceptors, thus ship is a problem - bubble immunity and instawarp shouldnt be possible in same time.
i get salty too when every ship in the game can do the cloaky mwd trick, not salty enough to rant on the forums though
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1148
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Posted - 2016.05.21 16:44:42 -
[88] - Quote
Iain Cariaba wrote:Robert Caldera wrote:its always a combination of modules fitted to a specific ship. modules themselves arent a problem with any other ship apparently, but with the interceptors, thus ship is a problem - bubble immunity and instawarp shouldnt be possible in same time. You've stated this over and over, but so far haven't provided a compelling reason why they shouldn't be possible at the same time.
I did |
Iain Cariaba
3033
|
Posted - 2016.05.21 17:44:27 -
[89] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:Iain Cariaba wrote:Robert Caldera wrote:its always a combination of modules fitted to a specific ship. modules themselves arent a problem with any other ship apparently, but with the interceptors, thus ship is a problem - bubble immunity and instawarp shouldnt be possible in same time. You've stated this over and over, but so far haven't provided a compelling reason why they shouldn't be possible at the same time. I did No. All you've done is whine and complain about how you cannot shoot them. This is not a compelling reason.
EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid.
I couldn't have said it better.
Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1148
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Posted - 2016.05.21 18:14:26 -
[90] - Quote
if you cant read, its your fault, dude.
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Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
2981
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Posted - 2016.05.21 18:44:00 -
[91] - Quote
Iain Cariaba wrote:Robert Caldera wrote:Iain Cariaba wrote:Robert Caldera wrote:its always a combination of modules fitted to a specific ship. modules themselves arent a problem with any other ship apparently, but with the interceptors, thus ship is a problem - bubble immunity and instawarp shouldnt be possible in same time. You've stated this over and over, but so far haven't provided a compelling reason why they shouldn't be possible at the same time. I did No. All you've done is whine and complain about how you cannot shoot them. This is not a compelling reason.
basically he feels like he should be able to pop a bubble from a "destroyer" and be able to insta-point everything below a t3, he feels that a ship that can use 2 modules to get out of a bubble and warp is gamebreaking, yet we see ships using prototype cloaks and a mwd to basically avoid gatecamps, everything from vexors to battleships, id like to see his mains account so we can actually see what he kills on gates, rather than a forum alt.
you're right, there is no compelling reason.
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1148
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Posted - 2016.05.21 18:47:32 -
[92] - Quote
no thats simply plain wrong and absolutely not what I said. You seem to have dificulties understanding english language obviously, go back to school. your parents should be ashamed of you. And yeah, stop putting words into my mouth, I never said. |
Iain Cariaba
3034
|
Posted - 2016.05.21 19:00:00 -
[93] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:if you cant read, its your fault, dude.
Oh, I can read. Unfortunately all you've had to say on this, so far, can be summed up as: "Whaaaa!!!! I can't shoot pplz in ceptors! CCP fix this meow!!!!"
Nullified ceptors do a lot more than good for this game than not. The fact that they seem to irritate you is just a bonus.
What good do that do, I know you're going to ask?
Allow safer travel to and from nullsec, so that people who join nullsec corps aren't totally ****** over by CCP deciding to limit remote medical clone movement to once a ******* year. Keeps nullsec miners/ratters from hiding behind walls of warp bubbles placed on gates. You have either forgotten, or simply never learned, the ease of farming/mining behind a 50-100km thick wall of bubbles placed on every single gate in the pipes leading to where you're farming. Now a properly fit interceptor can burn in, light a cyno, and hope enough allies arrive before he dies in a fire to kill the target. Yes, other ships are capable of doing this as well, but at the risk of using the tripe "think of the children" argument, the interceptor has the lowest entry requirements.
EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid.
I couldn't have said it better.
Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
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Lan Wang
Knights of the Posing Meat FETID
2981
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Posted - 2016.05.21 19:04:02 -
[94] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:no thats simply plain wrong and absolutely not what I said. You seem to have dificulties understanding english language obviously, go back to school. your parents should be ashamed of you. And yeah, stop putting words into my mouth, I never said.
can we see your main accounts killboard just to see what you actually kill in your bubble camps
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1148
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Posted - 2016.05.21 19:22:18 -
[95] - Quote
Iain Cariaba wrote: Oh, I can read. Unfortunately all you've had to say on this, so far, can be summed up as: "Whaaaa!!!! I can't shoot pplz in ceptors! CCP fix this meow!!!!"
thats a lie again. stop lying.
Iain Cariaba wrote: Nullified ceptors do a lot more than good for this game than not.
I disagree. Game has largerly degraded to svipuls/interceptors online, thats anything but good IMO, on top what has already been said.
Iain Cariaba wrote: Allow safer travel to and from nullsec, so that people who join nullsec corps aren't totally ****** over by CCP deciding to limit remote medical clone movement to once a ******* year.
CCP decided to limit free teleporting by medclones, yet they allow safe, fast travel by nearly uncatchable 15m ships, seems weird and inconsistent to me. People abused medclones, now they abuse interceptors.
Iain Cariaba wrote: Keeps nullsec miners/ratters from hiding behind walls of warp bubbles placed on gates.
this still happens. The option of having nullified tackle existed long before nullified interceptors in shape of T3.
Iain Cariaba wrote:Yes, other ships are capable of doing this as well, but at the risk of using the tripe "think of the children" argument, the interceptor has the lowest entry requirements. so you are trying to advocate cyno play, being able to teleport a whole gang of people onto your victim at most possibly lowest cost, risk and entry requirements and in same time you call me a whiner who is out for easy kills? lmao |
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1148
|
Posted - 2016.05.21 19:23:26 -
[96] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote: can we see your main accounts killboard just to see what you actually kill in your bubble camps
all sorts of stuff, yet no interceptors usually. |
Iain Cariaba
3035
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Posted - 2016.05.22 00:55:45 -
[97] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:Iain Cariaba wrote: Oh, I can read. Unfortunately all you've had to say on this, so far, can be summed up as: "Whaaaa!!!! I can't shoot pplz in ceptors! CCP fix this meow!!!!"
thats a lie again. stop lying. Paraphrasing is not lying. If I was putting those words into a quote box, that would be lying. However, there is no possible way for me to be lying when I state what I see your entire argument is.
Robert Caldera wrote:CCP decided to limit free teleporting by medclones, yet they allow safe, fast travel by nearly uncatchable 15m ships, seems weird and inconsistent to me. People abused medclones, now they abuse interceptors. There's a difference here. With interceptors, you have a chance of actually killing them while traveling. Yes, there are few methods to catch a travel fit interceptor, but those methods are invariably 100% fatal for said interceptor. I see no problem with that.
Robert Caldera wrote:The option of having nullified tackle existed long before nullified interceptors in shape of T3. So basically **** everyone who wants to travel but doesn't want to dump 600+ million isk on a hull that takes months to train into and will make you lose SP if you lose it? All because the above option exists?
Yeah, no.
Robert Caldera wrote:so you are trying to advocate cyno play, being able to teleport a whole gang of people onto your victim at most possibly lowest cost, risk and entry requirements and in same time you call me a whiner who is out for easy kills? lmao
Being able to do this lame stuff should be very skill intensive and all but entry level, if at all. No, but I do advocate the ability for newer players to be able to have an impact on the game. Cyno ceptors give them that opportunity.
EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid.
I couldn't have said it better.
Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1149
|
Posted - 2016.05.22 03:34:05 -
[98] - Quote
Iain Cariaba wrote: There's a difference here. With interceptors, you have a chance of actually killing them while traveling. Yes, there are few methods to catch a travel fit interceptor, but those methods are invariably 100% fatal for said interceptor. I see no problem with that.
a very slim one. waaay to slim. Thats the reason why we see heavy use of these ships, this wouldnt be the case if there were a substantial danger of being killed
Iain Cariaba wrote: So basically **** everyone who wants to travel but doesn't want to dump 600+ million isk on a hull that takes months to train into and will make you lose SP if you lose it? All because the above option exists?
yes exactly. either invest sp and decent amount of isk for this level of safety or learn to fly and navigate a covert, its really not that hard. or well, die. At least put some little amount of effort into that instead of having a ship which requires you merely a number of clicks to warp button and negating 99% of eve universe surrounding you.
Iain Cariaba wrote: No, but I do advocate the ability for newer players to be able to have an impact on the game. Cyno ceptors give them that opportunity.
I disagree. These lame tactics should require a certain amount of training and skill as minimum, the underlying mechanics are powerful enough not to be trivial entry level stuff. Newbies can have influence if played right aside of lame cyno play tbh. Its nothing I would encourage for beginners from start on. |
Iain Cariaba
3035
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Posted - 2016.05.22 05:06:46 -
[99] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:stuff You spout off about tactics requiring a certain amount of training and skill as a minimum when you're complaining that you can't bubble them with a dictor. So, how much training and skill, exactly, does it take to sit at zero on a gate and click a button when the gate flashes?
How much risk are you putting yourself into when you're sitting on that gate, ready to jump through if the ship you bubbled isn't something you can handle?
Bit of a double standard you're supporting here.
FYI, hunting targets to cyno your friends onto takes more player skill and training than it does character skill. It certainly takes more player skill to get an interceptor on grid with an attentive ratter than it takes to dictor bubble someone blindly jumping a gate.
EvE is hard. It's harder if you're stupid.
I couldn't have said it better.
Hello, Mr Carebear. Would you like some cheese with that whine?
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1149
|
Posted - 2016.05.22 13:09:03 -
[100] - Quote
yo sabre bubble is no skil, so is escaping a sabre if you know what youre doing. almost any sabre prey can outrun a sabre, cloaker cloaks and pulses mwd, also virtually no chance to catch it or only with tons of luck. again, if you know what youre doing. on top its a pretty squishy ship which can be killed with basically everything bigger than a frigate, or even some frigates can do it. For me, scoring a kill on a competent pilot requires more sabreing skill than pressing warp button and plain simply ignoring everything people setup in your way. |
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Morrigan LeSante
Black Omega Security The OSS
1410
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Posted - 2016.05.22 15:23:43 -
[101] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:yo sabre bubble is no skil, so is escaping a sabre if you know what youre doing. almost any sabre prey can outrun a sabre, cloaker cloaks and pulses mwd, also virtually no chance to catch it or only with tons of luck. .
Easy to escape?
Luck?
lolwut? |
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1149
|
Posted - 2016.05.22 16:44:18 -
[102] - Quote
what are you trying to tell with your useless kb link? did you even understand the topic? |
Morrigan LeSante
Black Omega Security The OSS
1410
|
Posted - 2016.05.22 17:43:07 -
[103] - Quote
Examine the number of dead cloakers. Try claiming some more it is "luck" |
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1149
|
Posted - 2016.05.22 17:53:42 -
[104] - Quote
so what? did those cloakers all die when jumped into a solo sabre? I guess you left out an important part of my statement intentionally, to make your argument fit - I mean the "who knows what he's doing" part. Noobs due every day, I kill tons of them, all incompetent pilots whio dont know how the game they are playing works. This is how it should be btw, not letting those people win by giving them overpowered ships. |
Zimmer Jones
Lightspeed Enterprises Goonswarm Federation
472
|
Posted - 2016.05.22 18:16:16 -
[105] - Quote
Robert Caldera wrote:did you even understand the thread?
Start your own thread on the subject, this has nothing to do with the OP anymore. OP's post was about a battleship mod that can counter an interceptor. Not just ane fit of interceptor, but all interceptors. An answer of Smartbombs was provided, and your repeated claim that it is not a counter and not used was pointed out to be wrong and mocked by many, myself included.
In my mocking I accidentally touched a nerve with your solo leet sabre fetish which turned this thread into one not about countering all interceptors, but just travel fit interceptors, and not BS like the OP specifically stated or all ships, but just the Sabre, the SABRE(emphasis yours)!
Your brand of ships aside, if you are rabidly going after single type of ship with a single type of fit, you need to be using the right tool, which you do not want to do and claim no one uses. The tool in this case, is the OP's Battleship, with smartbombs. Kills inties that have given you "no fcks." This is how it should be, btw, not letting people like you win with overinflated egos. (ed* whoops, i meant overpowered ships, really)
Other peoples Killboards aside, please take your useless(for the purposes of this thread) Solo clueless noob killing sabre fetish with you and please leave the thread since you obviously have no clue about the topic posted.
mhkay?
Use the force without consent and the court wont acquit you even if you are a card carryin', robe wearin' Jedi.
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Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
1149
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Posted - 2016.05.22 19:12:16 -
[106] - Quote
im fine with OPs suggested feature, yet the thread evolved over pages like they tend to do usually, welcome on page 6.
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