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Ha'Uler
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Posted - 2007.05.05 23:02:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Mogrin Dont worry when Goonfleet gets their titan and does this to BoB then it will officially be an exploit.
Not only will it be an exploit but their titan pilot will be permabanned and the titan never to be seen again.
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Mogrin
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Posted - 2007.05.05 23:08:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Peter Armstrong
Originally by: Mogrin Dont worry when Goonfleet gets their titan and does this to BoB then it will officially be an exploit.
Grow up
Easy there sparky. Its not like we don't have a precedent for this already. _______________ Rokh vs. Hyperion |
Dark Shikari
Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion
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Posted - 2007.05.05 23:24:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Mogrin
Originally by: Peter Armstrong
Originally by: Mogrin Dont worry when Goonfleet gets their titan and does this to BoB then it will officially be an exploit.
Grow up
Easy there sparky. Its not like we don't have a precedent for this already.
You mean the fact that the first alliance to do this was IAC, who is most certainly in BoB's pocket?
Its not any particular alliances' fault; its CCP's fault.
--23 Member--
Listen to EVE-Trance Radio! |
Shinigami
Gallente Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.05.05 23:34:00 -
[34]
I don't see any problems with POS bumping. Quit parking your ships there if you don't want them stolen. Quit hiding in the POS if you don't want to get bumped out. Honestly, I think getting bumped by a Titan should do as much damage as the doomsday. --- Help reduce lag in eve by supporting the Titans. Screenshots
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Marquis Dean
Energy.
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Posted - 2007.05.05 23:37:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Shinigami I don't see any problems with POS bumping. Quit parking your ships there if you don't want them stolen. Quit hiding in the POS if you don't want to get bumped out. Honestly, I think getting bumped by a Titan should do as much damage as the doomsday.
You forgot to post with your alt...
This is starting to look like CAOD.
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Cakeshop Cindy
Caldari Science and Trade Institute
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Posted - 2007.05.05 23:44:00 -
[36]
Originally by: Dark Shikari
Originally by: Mogrin
Originally by: Peter Armstrong
Originally by: Mogrin Dont worry when Goonfleet gets their titan and does this to BoB then it will officially be an exploit.
Grow up
Easy there sparky. Its not like we don't have a precedent for this already.
You mean the fact that the first alliance to do this was IAC, who is most certainly in BoB's pocket?
Its not any particular alliances' fault; its CCP's fault.
but the facts still stand, when the shoe is on the other foot it will suddenly be evil and bannable, based on said past precedents.
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Torm Ilmater
No Quarter. Vae Victis.
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Posted - 2007.05.06 00:23:00 -
[37]
If corporate hangar arrays didn't lock up when a POS was in reinforced mode I really wouldn't see a problem with this being a "feature." We all can acknowledge that all the junk people have sitting around POSes (ships, pos structures, cargo cans, corpses, etc) adds some lag when you're warping in. If the corporate hangar array were unlocked when it was in reinforced the only real reason to leave a ship outside the ship maintenance array would be to increase the lag upon entering the grid that POS is on.
As it stands keeping ships outside the various arrays with ammo, drones, modules, even POS fuel & stront is necessary in case all your POSes (total if you're small or just in that system if you're a larger entity) are put into reinforced.
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RedClaws
Amarr Dragon's Rage Intrepid Crossing
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Posted - 2007.05.06 00:47:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Torm Ilmater If corporate hangar arrays didn't lock up when a POS was in reinforced mode I really wouldn't see a problem with this being a "feature."
It would be fine if you don't use capital ships. Small ships aren't that easily bumped out but carriers & dreadnaughts will get bumped very fast.
This "pos bowling" leaves you without a safe place to stage your capitals at even if you have a couple of untouched posses in station.
Now I do notice quite a few IRC posts on this topic. Please note that we've been dealing with this issue for the last 5 hours and its got a few of us quite irritated. Not because they lost ships or something like that(we're used to that :) ) but just the fact its incredebly stupid to see ships as big as your pos warp in and get bumped away again at such speeds that they simply fall off the grid after 10 seconds.
BoB members say it's a good way to make people get out of their posses but against an overwhelming force why would anybody try to fight? Espescially if they mainly use motherships and titans to do the fighting.
Ahwell I guess it's the way EVE is heading right? Build so many titans that after a while you can just doomsday a fleet of dreads. At the current buildingrate it won't be much longer than 1 year before we get to that.
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Dal Thrax
Caldari Multiverse Corporation
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Posted - 2007.05.06 01:01:00 -
[39]
Originally by: gordon861 Just tried to ask a GM about this and was told it's not an exploit, and then one of our guys was told he could get a warning on hs account if he tried to escalate it to a Senior GM.
Eve-mail a copy to CCP Arkon. (Also see the Rev 1.3 patch notes which identify this as an exploit). You should not have been threatened for escalating what has been labeled in the past as an exploit.
Dal
Originally by: CCP Sharkbait we are screwed. delaying startup again. soon as i have time i will fill you in on the details
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Dal Thrax
Caldari Multiverse Corporation
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Posted - 2007.05.06 01:05:00 -
[40]
Originally by: lofty29 Dont be cheap and store ships in a ship main array - problem solved
If I recall correctly ships in a main array can't be accessed if the POS goes into reinforced. Not good unless it's a high sec POS (because lets face it you're most likely to need those ships when the POS is under attack).
Dal
Originally by: CCP Sharkbait we are screwed. delaying startup again. soon as i have time i will fill you in on the details
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Jas Dor
Minmatar
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Posted - 2007.05.06 01:13:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Shinigami I don't see any problems with POS bumping. Quit parking your ships there if you don't want them stolen. Quit hiding in the POS if you don't want to get bumped out. Honestly, I think getting bumped by a Titan should do as much damage as the doomsday.
If you can be bumped out then you can not be inside the POS FF with the "Starbase Tactical Officer" skill directing batteries that are outside the FF. While I'm not sure of if this skill has been fully implemented having both batteries outside the FF AND being able to kill the operator seem to be not working as intended.
Names, Dates, Times, Engagements, Losses, Op-Tempo or STFU! |
Shinigami
Gallente Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.05.06 01:26:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Dal Thrax
Originally by: lofty29 Dont be cheap and store ships in a ship main array - problem solved
If I recall correctly ships in a main array can't be accessed if the POS goes into reinforced. Not good unless it's a high sec POS (because lets face it you're most likely to need those ships when the POS is under attack).
Dal
That's just a risk you will have to take if you want to build a POS outside of your territory. A POS should not be a 100% secure remote ship storage container. And lets face it, that's exactly what they would be used for. Do you really want an enemy alliance to have a pos full of battleships 2 jumps from your home system? --- Help reduce lag in eve by supporting the Titans. Screenshots
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Neaokod Targaryen
Amarr Mirychu
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Posted - 2007.05.06 02:04:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Wild Rho
Originally by: SiJira
Originally by: Marquis Dean
Originally by: gordon861 and then one of our guys was told he could get a warning on hs account if he tried to escalate it to a Senior GM.
THAT does not sound right.
no it doesnt
That needs looking into tbh. Seriously out of order whichever GM said that.
It is part of their policy to give warnings if you escalate without reason. A copy of these rules can be found in the knowledge base under "Escalation to a senior game master" . Notice point four allows for warnings to be given for unjust escalation. Maybe this person has escalated this issue too many times or something.
I'm not saying this is the case, I mean I hate eve's support team as much as the next guy, just saying it is possible that the GM wasn't out of line.
"Escalation to a senior Game Master ...
* Please note that those who continually get their cases escalated to senior GM's without justified cause run the risk of getting official warnings applied to their accounts for wasting CS's time. ... " ----------------------------------- If I'm posting, then I'm drunk. |
Dal Thrax
Caldari Multiverse Corporation
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Posted - 2007.05.06 04:51:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Shinigami
Originally by: Dal Thrax
Originally by: lofty29 Dont be cheap and store ships in a ship main array - problem solved
If I recall correctly ships in a main array can't be accessed if the POS goes into reinforced. Not good unless it's a high sec POS (because lets face it you're most likely to need those ships when the POS is under attack).
Dal
That's just a risk you will have to take if you want to build a POS outside of your territory. A POS should not be a 100% secure remote ship storage container. And lets face it, that's exactly what they would be used for. Do you really want an enemy alliance to have a pos full of battleships 2 jumps from your home system?
I might be wrong on this but I believe you can't get ships out of the array of a POS in reinforced regardless of whether you hold sov on a system or not. As for the part about somebody putting up a POS with 20 BS's two jumps from home, let me do a little digging. I give it a 50/50 chance that there is a DB Preacher quote somewhere about kill the pos, kill the ships coming into the pos.
Dal
Originally by: CCP Sharkbait we are screwed. delaying startup again. soon as i have time i will fill you in on the details
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noranajimi
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Posted - 2007.05.06 04:51:00 -
[45]
Its not a bug, its not a exploit, itz a Gamefeature.
Quite simple: Statment from CCP, fixtime and so. After that Petition, warning, second time Account banned.
CCP gives no Statment? letz take a look what the biggest Gamemagazine to this vids says
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Chewan Mesa
coracao ardente Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2007.05.06 05:58:00 -
[46]
Edited by: Chewan Mesa on 06/05/2007 05:56:07
Originally by: Torm Ilmater If corporate hangar arrays didn't lock up when a POS was in reinforced mode I really wouldn't see a problem with this being a "feature." We all can acknowledge that all the junk people have sitting around POSes (ships, pos structures, cargo cans, corpses, etc) adds some lag when you're warping in. If the corporate hangar array were unlocked when it was in reinforced the only real reason to leave a ship outside the ship maintenance array would be to increase the lag upon entering the grid that POS is on.
As it stands keeping ships outside the various arrays with ammo, drones, modules, even POS fuel & stront is necessary in case all your POSes (total if you're small or just in that system if you're a larger entity) are put into reinforced.
I dont quite get why the corp hangar being locked up in reinforced stops you from storing ships in the Maint. array.
Have the ships fitted and stored, and ammo on someine piloting a hauler, or GSC, or stored in guns as well?
Originally by: Dal Thrax
I might be wrong on this but I believe you can't get ships out of the array of a POS in reinforced regardless of whether you hold sov on a system or not. Dal
If this wasnt changed in the last patch, you can access ship maint. arrays during a POS being in reinforced.
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Ishmael Hansen
No Quarter. Vae Victis.
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Posted - 2007.05.06 07:29:00 -
[47]
Happened to us 2 weeks ago, it's not an exploit, it's a feature, I screamed a bit on petitions and it's allowed :(. At least after BoB was caught doing it. Wonder what they meant about those patch notes tho.
The following exploits were addressed in the Revelations 1.3 Patch Deployment:
* It is no longer possible to steal from a Starbase using a Carrier / Mothership / Titan.
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Verite Rendition
Caldari AUS Corporation CORE.
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Posted - 2007.05.06 07:56:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Chewan Mesa Edited by: Chewan Mesa on 06/05/2007 05:56:07
Originally by: Torm Ilmater If corporate hangar arrays didn't lock up when a POS was in reinforced mode I really wouldn't see a problem with this being a "feature." We all can acknowledge that all the junk people have sitting around POSes (ships, pos structures, cargo cans, corpses, etc) adds some lag when you're warping in. If the corporate hangar array were unlocked when it was in reinforced the only real reason to leave a ship outside the ship maintenance array would be to increase the lag upon entering the grid that POS is on.
As it stands keeping ships outside the various arrays with ammo, drones, modules, even POS fuel & stront is necessary in case all your POSes (total if you're small or just in that system if you're a larger entity) are put into reinforced.
I dont quite get why the corp hangar being locked up in reinforced stops you from storing ships in the Maint. array.
Have the ships fitted and stored, and ammo on someine piloting a hauler, or GSC, or stored in guns as well?
Originally by: Dal Thrax
I might be wrong on this but I believe you can't get ships out of the array of a POS in reinforced regardless of whether you hold sov on a system or not. Dal
If this wasnt changed in the last patch, you can access ship maint. arrays during a POS being in reinforced.
It's not the corp hangar array that's the problem, it's the ship maintenance array. When it's offline, not only can you not fit/store stuff(as you'd expect), but you can't launch ship either. It needs to be like every other array in the game and allow removal of items when it's offline. ---- AUS Corp Lead Megalomanic |
SiJira
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Posted - 2007.05.06 07:56:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Ishmael Hansen Happened to us 2 weeks ago, it's not an exploit, it's a feature, I screamed a bit on petitions and it's allowed :(. At least after BoB was caught doing it. Wonder what they meant about those patch notes tho.
The following exploits were addressed in the Revelations 1.3 Patch Deployment:
* It is no longer possible to steal from a Starbase using a Carrier / Mothership / Titan.
possible standing just outside pos shields and putting into cargoholds?
____ __ ________ _sig below_ the jet cans are made so that people that dont mine can get free ore
miners ritually donate the ore to anyone wishing to take some |
Cursed Ascendent
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Posted - 2007.05.06 08:47:00 -
[50]
So let me get this straight. People expect to be able to remove items (Ships etc) from storage when a tower goes into reinforced. That to me doesn't sound right. If your tower is'nt fully functional you shouldn't be able to use all the modules anchored to it. As for leaving ships lying around there are ways to deal with this. Put them away in the modules designed for that purpose. If you worry about not being able to get ammo and drones put some in a GSC for emergencies. You could put some cans out around your system also to provide undefended but emergency reload points... As for bowling maybe its being left as is to force people to use the modules. As has been said to reduce lag.
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Sokratesz
Paradox v2.0 1 Shot 1 Kill
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Posted - 2007.05.06 09:05:00 -
[51]
The fix for this issue would be SOFA KING easy.
If the POS isnt yours or has you +10, you land on the edge of the bubble just like with warp bubbles..
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Altar Mei
Solstice Systems Development Concourse SMASH Alliance
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Posted - 2007.05.06 09:37:00 -
[52]
Originally by: Dark Shikari
Originally by: Mogrin
Originally by: Peter Armstrong
Originally by: Mogrin Dont worry when Goonfleet gets their titan and does this to BoB then it will officially be an exploit.
Grow up
Easy there sparky. Its not like we don't have a precedent for this already.
You mean the fact that the first alliance to do this was IAC, who is most certainly in BoB's pocket?
Its not any particular alliances' fault; its CCP's fault.
Granted, but you have to laugh at the irony of the post immeditatly following yours.
Originally by: CCP Arkanon We're a company of professionals, not some LAN party gone bad.
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Wild Rho
Amarr GoonFleet
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Posted - 2007.05.06 09:51:00 -
[53]
Originally by: Neaokod Targaryen
Originally by: Wild Rho
Originally by: SiJira
Originally by: Marquis Dean
Originally by: gordon861 and then one of our guys was told he could get a warning on hs account if he tried to escalate it to a Senior GM.
THAT does not sound right.
no it doesnt
That needs looking into tbh. Seriously out of order whichever GM said that.
It is part of their policy to give warnings if you escalate without reason. A copy of these rules can be found in the knowledge base under "Escalation to a senior game master" . Notice point four allows for warnings to be given for unjust escalation. Maybe this person has escalated this issue too many times or something.
I'm not saying this is the case, I mean I hate eve's support team as much as the next guy, just saying it is possible that the GM wasn't out of line.
"Escalation to a senior Game Master ...
* Please note that those who continually get their cases escalated to senior GM's without justified cause run the risk of getting official warnings applied to their accounts for wasting CS's time. ... "
Granted but you can't deny this is a minor thing, especially given the constantly conflicting answers coming from GMs. This needs a definite answer one way or another because I can guarantee sooner or later we're going to see someone get banned when they shouldn't have and another bought of conspiracy theories and general ****ed off players.
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Royaldo
KVA Noble Inc. Sylph Alliance
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Posted - 2007.05.06 09:55:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Dark Shikari
Originally by: Mogrin
Originally by: Peter Armstrong
Originally by: Mogrin Dont worry when Goonfleet gets their titan and does this to BoB then it will officially be an exploit.
Grow up
Easy there sparky. Its not like we don't have a precedent for this already.
You mean the fact that the first alliance to do this was IAC, who is most certainly in BoB's pocket?
Its not any particular alliances' fault; its CCP's fault.
iac did this with which supercap again?
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w0rmy
Pringles Inc. YouWhat
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Posted - 2007.05.06 10:02:00 -
[55]
Edited by: w0rmy on 06/05/2007 10:01:08
Originally by: Shinigami Do you really want an enemy alliance to have a pos full of battleships 2 jumps from your home system?
They dont need to, Jump Bridges and NPC stations remove the need.
Originally by: Shinigami I don't see any problems with POS bumping. Quit parking your ships there if you don't want them stolen.
Yes, and I shouldnt park my car inside my garage, lock the door and turn the alarm on, if I didnt want it stolen right?
Id have a sig, but you guys keep growling me for them
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Digioso
Caldari BGG League of Abnormal Gentlemen
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Posted - 2007.05.06 11:03:00 -
[56]
Originally by: Mogrin Dont worry when Goonfleet gets their titan and does this to BoB then it will officially be an exploit.
I lol'd.
Also its sad because its true
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Venkul Mul
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.05.06 11:26:00 -
[57]
Originally by: Bozse When a question like this is deemed exploit / not allowed or allowed by a senior GM there shuld be a section on the website (like known issues) that shows that, would reduce the petition load and make people more aware of whats ok and not.
This is assuming that a senior GM's decission is policy for all petitions concerning the same matter.
At least the GM must have access to a list of consistent ruling to use. I know that the reply can be very different depending on how the question is worded, but we aren't Gesuites* to nitpick the word every time we speak.
Note: to explain the point about Gesuites (they are very good at debate), it is a old joke about smoking while praying:
the Benedictine ask to the abbot if he can smoke while prayng and his reply is no
the Gesuite ask if he can pray while smoking and the reply is yes.
So the question generate the answer.
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Astro Fizzicks
Gallente Synergy. Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2007.05.06 11:51:00 -
[58]
Simple Answer to problem if it was a BOB cap ship that got killed:
Deploy a Dev.
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Fubear
Vogon Heavy Industries
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Posted - 2007.05.06 13:10:00 -
[59]
Originally by: Kw4h Bump attempts earlier today Capital gang warping in to bump
After watching those videos, I have to say that this tactic is complete bullcrap. They are obviously abusing the game mechanics in a way that was not intended for personal gain, which is the very definition of an exploit as defined in the knowledgebase.
The fact that CCP allows gameplay like this to continue is sickening. I there is a gameplay issue that negatively affects other people, then it should be bumped to the top of CCP's priority list and fixed immediately. Other MMO's clamp down on exploits like this, fixing them within days or issuing a statement telling people not to do it if the fix will take longer than that - CCP takes weeks to even acknowledge and issue, takes months to fix it, and does nothing to stop it from being abused in the mean-time.
What makes matters worse is the terrible customer service this game has, one day something is an exploit, the next it is a feature and there is nowhere for us to check what is and is not allowed withing the game mechanics (except for those alliances I am sure receive their weekly lists of questionable activities they can get away with from under the table from their pet GM). When you hear of exchanges like the following, you know know there is a problem:
* Player1 takes advantage of game mechanics. * GM1 calls it an exploit and threatens Player1 with a ban. * Player2 performs exploit against Player3 Player3: Hey Player2 is exploiting GM2: This is not an exploit (closes petition) Player3: I think you must be mistaken, Player1 got threatened with a ban by GM1 last week for doing this. GM2: This is not an exploit, if you open any more petitions on the topic we will ban you. (closes petition) * GM2 bans Player1 for sharing GM communication
The bottom line is that this tactic should be addressed and fixed ASAP by CCP. If it is not an exploit, it should be made one TODAY and anyone taking advantage of it should be appropriately punished. CCP should start taking responsibility for their game, and policing it's gameplay because right now they are anything but on the ball when it comes to fixing core gameplay issues/bugs.
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Malachon Draco
eXceed Inc. INVICTUS.
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Posted - 2007.05.06 13:36:00 -
[60]
Tactic of 'bowling' is of course an exploit, doesn't surprise me to see who is using it.
As for counters, can you put up a mobile warp disruptor in the POS?
Since those stop warpins dead cold at the edge, it appears it would be a better shield vs 'bowling' than a POS shield would be.
signature removed - please contact us to find out why (include the URL of your sig) - Jacques([email protected]) |
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