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Giaus Felix Hedion University Amarr Empire 245	Posted - 2016.09.23 21:17:34 - [91] - Quote KaarBaak wrote: I read through this thread and certainly less qualified than most of the people posting regarding the legalities. However, I'm unsure what parallel universe some of the people posting live in wherein in-game isk is not convertible to real-world money? I understand it's not sanctioned by CCP, but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen. It's fairly common and easy. I have no doubt that folks that are very active within the game-isk gambling community are also active in the RMT community. Pure speculation, I admit. But it's happened before and I'm sure it's happening now. It's just a bit difficult to wrap my head around some of the very well thought-out arguments in this thread when they also contain phrases regarding the isk-cash trade as a one-way transaction. That's demonstrably false and any argument based on that seems faulty at it's base. KB I think that's more a case of staying within the rules of the forums than a denial that it happens TBH EVE is a place of greed and danger, alliances and betrayals, risk and paranoia. It is not, and it should not be, a happy place of unicorns and rainbows.
Lucas Kell Solitude Trading 8030	Posted - 2016.09.24 10:44:33 - [92] - Quote Cade Windstalker wrote: Not at all. Linking to the RMT/cash out site is sufficient to prove that the gambling site intends the FIFA point thingies to be a money stand-in, the same way poker chips are used in a casino. I can gamble with poker chips at home (and have done so before) but they have no value if I can't exchange them for money. Sadly for younger-me no matter how much I asked my mom refused to let me cash out. Irrelevant. Either the currency has value or it doesn't. Linking to a site to sell it doesn't magically change that . You can't sell your poker chips on ebay? Cade Windstalker wrote: No, because CCP is the one paying for the tour, with real money, and they allow you to take an in-game chit that someone else paid CCP money for and say "I would like to exchange this funny-money for this other service you have offered." This is all still internal to CCP and just shuffling numbers around on their balance sheet, and it doesn't change that ISK does not have value in a legal sense. See, again: taxes. Taxes have nothing to do with it. Gambling legislation isn't based on tax law, it's pretty damn simple, if you gamble for something you could pay money for instead it has value and thus needs to be regulated. If you set up a gambling site to gamble for the tour tickets directly it would absolutely need to be regulated. Cade Windstalker wrote: Is not relevant or related to your original point. We stop kids from doing lots of things because we judge that they're physiologically unlikely to make good decisions. After a certain age we let people make all the bad decisions they want. Sure it is, because you're of the opinion there is no reason behind the laws than the simple act of havign the laws in place, which is ridiculous. They are there to protect the vulnerable. Trying to get around that won;t work forever. Cade Windstalker wrote: ISK does not have value, you are assuming your conclusion and then throwing up things you think lead to that conclusion. That's arguing in bad faith and poor logic. No, I'm simply debunking all of your reasons that ISK has no value. I mean you'e gone from saying that ISK has no value because it' amounts isn't stated in dollars to ISK has no value because IWI haven't linked to sites to sell it yet. Your entire argument has bben on a wander and changes almost constatnly. The reason fro that is you dont; have an argument, you just have a preconceived conclusion based on your like of EVE gambling sites and you're sticking to it. Hell, you were even incorrectly comparing it to CS:GO skins because you hadn't even look at the case this thread is talking about. Cade Windstalker wrote: Personally I don't care about ISK gambling, I've never used any ISK gambling sites nor do I care if they disappear or not. I just hate bad logic and your logic is terrible, as are your claims that 'CCP should be looking into this!' Yeah right, you totally don't love IWI My logic is sound. Fifa Coins and ISK both have a value and gambling for value needs to be regulated thus EVE gambling site would need to be regulated. In the long run law will catch up with them. You're "logic" is to go "nope!" and they make up some random reason why these two are drastically different. At no point have I said CCP need to do something. It would be better in the long run if they did, since they are directly linked to these gambling site but I couldn't really care less if they did or not. If they want to roll the dice (pun intended) with the legal system of the country they are setting up a new major office in, that's up to them. I just think it's an interesting topic and shows how legals systems are slowly catching up with the modern day world were the lines have been getting pretty blurry for a while. The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog. Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Lucas Kell Solitude Trading 8031	Posted - 2016.09.24 10:48:28 - [93] - Quote Giaus Felix wrote: KaarBaak wrote: I read through this thread and certainly less qualified than most of the people posting regarding the legalities. However, I'm unsure what parallel universe some of the people posting live in wherein in-game isk is not convertible to real-world money? I understand it's not sanctioned by CCP, but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen. It's fairly common and easy. I have no doubt that folks that are very active within the game-isk gambling community are also active in the RMT community. Pure speculation, I admit. But it's happened before and I'm sure it's happening now. It's just a bit difficult to wrap my head around some of the very well thought-out arguments in this thread when they also contain phrases regarding the isk-cash trade as a one-way transaction. That's demonstrably false and any argument based on that seems faulty at it's base. KB TBH I think that's more a case of staying within the forum rules than a denial that it happens. Pretty much this. Noizy has a pretty good article over on Nosy Gamer and he knows a good deal about these things. The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog. Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Judaa K'Marr Power-Hug Training Bootcamp 42	Posted - 2016.10.12 15:56:57 - [94] - Quote It's all over. https://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/end-user-license-agreement-changes-coming-with-eve-online-ascension/
ISD Max Trix isd community communications liaisons 382	Posted - 2016.10.12 16:02:57 - [95] - Quote Closed for thread necromancy. ISD Max Trix Lieutenant Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department *I do not respond to Evemails.*

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