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Carrier question, Fighters 5 or Gallente Carrier 5 first?

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Kahrek Laume Gallente Mirage Industries	Posted - 2007.03.21 17:47:00 - [1] Edited by: Kahrek Laume on 21/03/2007 17:43:40 What skill should i train to 5 first. Fighters? Gallente Carrier? I am leaning towards carrier actualy but i think that overall fighters might be the bigger DPS boost, any expert care to enlighten me as to where the next 50 days of my EVE life should go? :) Many thanks, Kahrek Laume Mirage Industries.
Aramendel Amarr Queens of the Stone Age Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2007.03.21 18:02:00 - [2] Carrier. Fighters 4->5: 2/1.8 -> 1.111 -> 11.1% dps boost Carrier 4->5 without a DCU: 10/9 * 1.25/1.20 -> 1.157 -> 15.7% dps boost Carrier 4->5 with four DCU: 14/13 * 1.25/1.20 -> 1.122 -> 12.2% dps boost
Chronus26 Gallente Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.03.21 18:15:00 - [3] And Carrier 5 will increase the range of your Remote Reps too. Which is also very useful. -----
Kahrek Laume Gallente Mirage Industries	Posted - 2007.03.21 18:19:00 - [4] Sounds like a done deal to me, thank you for the mathematics =)
dalman Finite Horizon	Posted - 2007.03.21 19:02:00 - [5] Aramendel is correct. Although there are other issues you may want to consider. For example: If you're gonna asign fighter, and your 'carrier gang' can give away more fighters than your 'tackling gang' can use... or especially if your tackling gang start losing ships. Then you may end up in situations where you can't fully use all your fighters, and so fighters 5 would have been better. Further, I'm not 100% on if the damage bonus from carrier skill applies to assigned fighters or not. If it doesn't, you'll always be better off with fighters 5 when asigning them. Also, if you plan to lose fighters in for example a doomsday activation, it'll be better to have fewer but more powerful fighters out there... Just some examples... Am I forced to have any regret? I've become the lie, beautiful and free In my righteous own mind I adore and preach the insanity you gave to me
Tunajuice Convergent Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.03.21 19:05:00 - [6] gallente carrier bonus DOES apply when they are assigned
Chronus26 Gallente Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.03.22 13:20:00 - [7] Originally by: dalman Further, I'm not 100% on if the damage bonus from carrier skill applies to assigned fighters or not. If it doesn't, you'll always be better off with fighters 5 when asigning them. I did some testing on SiSi a while back, and at most there was a 9% deviation in the average damage per hit between fighters that were Carrier-controlled, Assigned (carrier on grid) and assigned (carrier off grid). Kinda leads me to belive that contrary to popular belief, the Carrier pilots skills are effective no matter where the fighters are. I'll post my results in full if anybody is interested. -----
Joshua Foiritain Gallente Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate	Posted - 2007.03.22 14:58:00 - [8] Originally by: Chronus26 Originally by: dalman Further, I'm not 100% on if the damage bonus from carrier skill applies to assigned fighters or not. If it doesn't, you'll always be better off with fighters 5 when asigning them. I did some testing on SiSi a while back, and at most there was a 9% deviation in the average damage per hit between fighters that were Carrier-controlled, Assigned (carrier on grid) and assigned (carrier off grid). Kinda leads me to belive that contrary to popular belief, the Carrier pilots skills are effective no matter where the fighters are. I'll post my results in full if anybody is interested. I am. ----- [Coreli Corporation Mainfrane]
Chronus26 Gallente Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.03.22 15:12:00 - [9] Originally by: Joshua Foiritain Originally by: Chronus26 Originally by: dalman Further, I'm not 100% on if the damage bonus from carrier skill applies to assigned fighters or not. If it doesn't, you'll always be better off with fighters 5 when asigning them. I did some testing on SiSi a while back, and at most there was a 9% deviation in the average damage per hit between fighters that were Carrier-controlled, Assigned (carrier on grid) and assigned (carrier off grid). Kinda leads me to belive that contrary to popular belief, the Carrier pilots skills are effective no matter where the fighters are. I'll post my results in full if anybody is interested. I am. Right, let me tidy up my spreadsheet a little and find a place to upload it (eve files wont take it)... -----
Sivona Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.03.22 16:37:00 - [10] please may i ask what level your appropriate skills are?

dalman Finite Horizon	Posted - 2007.03.22 16:43:00 - [11] Hmm, it shouldn't be necessary to do lots of testing and mean/deviation thingies. A wrecking hit from each of the situations should be enough. Am I forced to have any regret? I've become the lie, beautiful and free In my righteous own mind I adore and preach the insanity you gave to me
Chronus26 Gallente Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.03.22 16:45:00 - [12] Edited by: Chronus26 on 22/03/2007 16:46:08 Originally by: Sivona please may i ask what level your appropriate skills are? Because of sisi mirrors etc etc blah blah, my skills at the time were Carrier 4 and fighters 3. Originally by: dalman Hmm, it shouldn't be necessary to do lots of testing and mean/deviation thingies. A wrecking hit from each of the situations should be enough. Havent found the 'summon wrecking hit' button yet, but I did get a few, and they were all identical no matter what, I just have no idea how the game calcs wrecking hits so wasn't going to take that as 100% proof. -----
Sivona Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.03.22 16:54:00 - [13] ok theres a typo in there but i ran an ANOVA test for to compare the distribution (although describing hit distribution in eve as normal is dodgy ground) and the hits look consistent enough, so i would agree with you (i assume your using dragonflies if you get 1511 as a wrecking) that there is no difference between assigned and unassigned and skills transfer
dalman Finite Horizon	Posted - 2007.03.22 17:03:00 - [14] A wrecking hit is always just 3damagemodbasedamageresist (kinda the reason I've never understood those "what's the best hit you've ever had"-threads). So, in your case with a Firblog, that's 33.51.21.6751=1512 Note that shield might recharge a point or two between each shot, giving a slight modification... Am I forced to have any regret? I've become the lie, beautiful and free In my righteous own mind I adore and preach the insanity you gave to me
Chronus26 Gallente Infinitus Odium	Posted - 2007.03.22 17:07:00 - [15] Edited by: Chronus26 on 22/03/2007 17:07:29 Originally by: Sivona ok theres a typo in there but i ran an ANOVA test for to compare the distribution (although describing hit distribution in eve as normal is dodgy ground) and the hits look consistent enough, so i would agree with you (i assume your using dragonflies if you get 1511 as a wrecking) that there is no difference between assigned and unassigned and skills transfer Firbolgs actually. Tracking should have been consistent throughout the results as the test ship was stationary and I was sure that the fighter was in a proper orbit before I took results. Not sure what else migh have effected it but, it was definatly a firbolg i was using. Originally by: dalman A wrecking hit is always just 3damagemodbasedamageresist (kinda the reason I've never understood those "what's the best hit you've ever had"-threads). So, in your case with a Firblog, that's 33.51.21.6751=1512 Note that shield might recharge a point or two between each shot, giving a slight modification... Interesting, I didn't know that. I was aware of the issue with shield recharge, but I figured that it'd be so low it'd barely have an effect (the character that was flying the test BS (an armageddon) has no shield skills or mods fitted). I was also careful to let the fighter get a few shots into hull before taking results to allow it to establish a proper orbit and remove any shield thatr may have recharged between tests just to be consistant. -----
Saleia AFK Mining	Posted - 2007.04.04 04:10:00 - [16] Edited by: Saleia on 04/04/2007 04:07:19 What skills effect fighter damage and how do you add them up? I don't under stand the "damage mod" listed in the formula posted here.
Tunajuice Convergent Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.04.04 04:21:00 - [17] 2 things mod fighter damage 1) lvl of skill fighters 2) lvl of skill gallente carrier (if in thanatos or nyx)
Gor Kraon Minmatar Shadowclan	Posted - 2007.04.04 07:21:00 - [18] Edited by: Gor Kraon on 04/04/2007 07:18:12 Originally by: Saleia I don't under stand the "damage mod" listed in the formula posted here. All guns have a base damage (on ammo) and a damage mod (on gun), in the case of fighters/drones both are listed in their stats. Firbolg has a 3.5 x damage mod and 50 thermal, 25 kinetic base damage.
Saleia AFK Mining	Posted - 2007.04.04 12:08:00 - [19] Edited by: Saleia on 04/04/2007 12:10:06 Originally by: dalman A wrecking hit is always just 3damagemodbasedamageresist (kinda the reason I've never understood those "what's the best hit you've ever had"-threads). So, in your case with a Firblog, that's 33.51.21.6751=1512 Note that shield might recharge a point or two between each shot, giving a slight modification... oopps!My bad on the damagemod. I knew that. Must have been too tired last night when I posted. But anyways. Where do you get the "3" value in the begining? So according to your math there. With a Thanatos and carrier skill lvl 4 and fighters lvl 4. (33.51.21.875*1)=1701
Aramendel Amarr Queens of the Stone Age Anarchy Empire	Posted - 2007.04.04 20:55:00 - [20] The 3 is for wrecking hits. Those do always 3 times the base damage. It's just how the game is.



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