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Mar5hy
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Posted - 2007.04.19 18:44:00 -
[1]
The price for the wars going up will disrupt a lot of gameplay for many people, not just Privateers but for those other corporations who like to WarDec. Everyone in this game 'knows' if you do not want to be at war with anyone stay in a n00bcorp where it is technically safe.
Privateers is a fun Alliance, I have only been in it 10 days and I already have a bit more PvP experience. I believe it should be left as it is. The people we wardec are too "stupid" to not bother looking at who else we're at war with and counter-blobbing us, is frankly their own fault. Whereas instead they go around singly knowing they are at war, get caught by a few of us and then moan on the forums for their stupidity which then The Privateers are going to have to pay for it.
If you really want to change something to help them, put in options like this one for example, right click corporation "see all wars" Thus giving them the chance to communicate between corporations and fight back.
I had never had so much fun in this game until I joined The Privateers and now this is happening tbh I'm devastated. Please consider other options before releasing the patch.
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Emylissan
Gallente European Science Armada
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Posted - 2007.04.19 18:57:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Emylissan on 19/04/2007 18:56:07 So when i dont like to pvp, i have to remain alone isolated in a noob corp? Only those who accept to fight are allowed to start social contacts to other players?
War makes friends, peace makes lonely..intressting thought.
But on the other side when i see all the whining about players hiding in noob corps and "force players out of noob corps after 3 month" and such....your suggestion wont work..
so i stay in an noob corp to keep safe and 3 month later i am forced out and have to accept war or make a new char?
Dont think only of some players who made misstakes while in war with you and whats most important dont think only about your own win and losses when the war dec system becomes changed. One part of the "multi player thing" of multi player games is that you arent the only player around.
----------------------------------------------------- Everyone who finds a type error can keep it. ----------------------------------------------------- |
Yo Mofo
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Posted - 2007.04.19 19:08:00 -
[3]
Forced out of a noobcorp in 3 months?? There are people in the game that have never joined a corp and have stayed in noobcorps for over a year. If you are in a corp expect a war, everyone goes through it. I started playing this game and within a few weeks I was caught up in a war and I done my research and brought 4 corps together against 1, which caused a lot of trouble for the warring corp.
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Yamichi Wiggin
Caldari Rising Knights SMASH Alliance
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Posted - 2007.04.19 19:24:00 -
[4]
I think the Wardec thing needed to be fixed. And not just because of the privies- though y'all were the ones who found the best use of the old system. Wars should be a bigger deal. If you want to declare war, it should be worth it to you. In the current/old system, there was no reason not to wardecc somebody just for looting your can if your corp is big enough to foot the bill for a couple weeks. Too easy to turn empire into 0.0
The problem with the "see all wars" thing (though I think it's a good start) is that there's no way to "See everybody in local in one of the corps on this list." So yes- I can see that the privies are wardecced with 185 people in Jita. But without going through local and reading info on everybody, i can't throw together a quick gang to try fighting back. There are workarounds and my corp and alliance have used specially formed, limited-access channels to coordinate our wars and whatnot. There ARE workarounds. Just clunky and hard to use in the current setup. I think it should be pricey to declare 600billion wars but perhaps the new setup is too expensive... ------ Pain is weakness leaving the body.
There is no love in fear |
Sarf
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Posted - 2007.04.20 17:38:00 -
[5]
personally i think this was a good change.
Anyone with 70 wars on the go should pay for it. Wars was a way to have a grievance with someone, not a way to bypass the security of empire space.
http://codesmyth.net/eve-guide/ Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -Sahwoolo Etoophie ([email protected]) |
Tohmu Blackwing
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Posted - 2007.04.21 04:07:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Mar5hy The price for the wars going up will disrupt a lot of gameplay for many people, not just Privateers but for those other corporations who like to WarDec. Everyone in this game 'knows' if you do not want to be at war with anyone stay in a n00bcorp where it is technically safe.
Privateers is a fun Alliance, I have only been in it 10 days and I already have a bit more PvP experience. I believe it should be left as it is. The people we wardec are too "stupid" to not bother looking at who else we're at war with and counter-blobbing us, is frankly their own fault. Whereas instead they go around singly knowing they are at war, get caught by a few of us and then moan on the forums for their stupidity which then The Privateers are going to have to pay for it.
If you really want to change something to help them, put in options like this one for example, right click corporation "see all wars" Thus giving them the chance to communicate between corporations and fight back.
I had never had so much fun in this game until I joined The Privateers and now this is happening tbh I'm devastated. Please consider other options before releasing the patch.
So your enjoyment of the game is more important than anyone else's? Seriously, is that what you are saying?
The Privatards use the war dec rules to circumvent Empire security. They use a loophole in the rules to gank players in gate camps and station camps. That is the bottom line. That is also why it is changing.
You expect the rest of us to have to treat Empire space like it is 0.0 just for the sake of game play for the people in one alliance? Now ask yourself this question and see if you can still agree with it...
Empire is Empire. It has security. When the Privatards cast a wide net by war deccing 70 alliances all they are doing is trying to increase their chances of getting a gank. You want all other alliances in the game to have to change THEIR game play to suit YOURS.
You call us stupid because we don't band together with people from alliance we have never heard of before to make temporary gangs just to avoid your gate camps?? You put the responsibility for our own security in SAFE Empire space in the hands of people we don't know. You expect us to **** around and waste our time waiting to form a blob just so we can run around in SAFE Empire space. Seriously. That is such total nonsense!
If you want to play a ganker then you should have to pay thru the nose to do it. If you want to be a pirate, go to lowsec or 0.0. Grow some balls. Don't assume that the rest of us are simply here for your entertainment.
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Nyana
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Posted - 2007.04.21 09:42:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Sarf personally i think this was a good change.
Anyone with 70 wars on the go should pay for it. Wars was a way to have a grievance with someone, not a way to bypass the security of empire space.
You are aware that they paid like 4-6 billion a week BEFORE the changes, right? The new figures will be closer to 125 billion from what I've read. Quite a big hit.
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Del Narveux
Obsidian Angels Enterprises
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Posted - 2007.04.21 11:57:00 -
[8]
Then perhaps they will do a smaller number of *meaningful* wars, rather than pew pew everyone in sight. And 6bil isnt all that much for an alliance, just look at the .0 free for all where some alliances are losing 100B+ worth of capitals in single engagements. _________________ [SAK] Alumnus--And Proud Of It! -- aka Cpt Bogus Is that my torped sig cloaking your base?
Originally by: Wrangler Well, at least we have forum PvP..
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Aille Pluthrak
Caldari Privateers Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2007.04.21 17:38:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Tohmu Blackwing Grow some balls.
Learn to defend yourself. ---------------------- Boom goes the ship! Squish goes the pilot!
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NumberFour
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Posted - 2007.04.21 18:55:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Aille Pluthrak
Originally by: Tohmu Blackwing Grow some balls.
Learn to defend yourself.
Good one!
My experience with the Privateers has been that they attack only when they know they can win, and hide when they are out numbered. Very different from the game play that I've had in NoSec.
I'd like to see the Privateers go claim some dusty part of 0.0 like the pirates of old and see if they can defend that instead of ganking the usually defenseless. That would be interesting. But since they seem to be a collection of former LowSec gankers, I doubt they would do that. My thoughts anyways.
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Cythe Oman
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Posted - 2007.04.21 21:05:00 -
[11]
Griefing and PVP are two different concepts. declareing war on some penny anty mining corp for the sake of stroking your e-peen is a childish endevor. Personaly I agree with the refuse war ideas. That a corp should be aable to look tword their sovgrin empires for protection from asshats like PA
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Rod Blaine
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.04.21 22:57:00 -
[12]
The wardec spam a la privateers was never meant to exist. I think it was a good idea to nerf you guys like this.
I've never been bothered by you btw, not personally. But the whole idea of "lets wardec everyone so we can have some easy pvp in empire" is nothing but bad news for the game overall.
And no, I don't want to see empire be safe. But there's a difference between safe and the idiocy that was privateers.
[center] Old blog |
BigWhale
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.04.22 06:04:00 -
[13]
Originally by: NumberFour
I'd like to see the Privateers go claim some dusty part of 0.0 like the pirates of old and see if they can defend that instead of ganking the usually defenseless. That would be interesting. But since they seem to be a collection of former LowSec gankers, I doubt they would do that. My thoughts anyways.
Last time I checked their killboard, one of top ten killers had 5 frig kills and 5 pods.
:)
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John McDuff
Caldari Jovian Labs The Foundation.
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Posted - 2007.04.22 10:57:00 -
[14]
The entire 'whiner' consideration is lame as hell imo. I'm already engaged in a conflict in 0.0, i go to empire to wind down and raise some isk again. Looking over my shoulder all of the time and/or being camped so i simply can't is just a bother. At least it is when there is no meaning to the wardec. If a war has meaning i'm all for it, but not the senseless generation of empire targets over the backs of ppl that have their own business. The OP stated most are 'too stupid to team up and fight them'. This is simply not the case. We don't bother, because we don't care. As mentioned a lot of the ppl wardecced for target practice have conflicts in other places that actually do matter to them, and that is where they pay attention to. A privateer wardec is just an irritation which needs to be waited out in our perspective.
If you want to pvp well i'm very sorry but it won't be free anymore. Go to 0.0 like everybody else if you want to shoot at everyone, or get used to less targets.
--- SIG
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Min Seb
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Posted - 2007.04.24 03:17:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Aille Pluthrak
Originally by: Tohmu Blackwing Grow some balls.
Learn to defend yourself.
I love this. So just because I started playing Eve some months or years later than some of you, I can't have a safe place to train before I can deal with asses of your kind? The reality behind your wars are that you like to kill noobs like me. You are old players with t2 guns and ships but no @@ for real PvP. Litle cowards picking on new players as they are easily killed. If I could train fast then yeah I would have no problem dealing with you. But I can't. Training takes time. Also I must make the money for everything I will need before I have to face you. So let's hear it. You are just cowards with no balls for real PvP. Now it's time to pay for your "fun".
Finally let's not forget that not everyone joins this game for PvP fun. Some people like just to mine. That is what I liked in this game. The fact that you can be everything you want. A Corp/Alliance of your kind destroys that and it might take some hundrets of people leaving the game but I am sure that CCP would not allow their pockets striped so some arses can turn high sec in their PvP playground. After all what is better? 112 x 15$ per month or 200 x 15$ per month?
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Kylar Renpurs
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Posted - 2007.04.24 04:03:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Yo Mofo Forced out of a noobcorp in 3 months?? There are people in the game that have never joined a corp and have stayed in noobcorps for over a year. If you are in a corp expect a war, everyone goes through it. I started playing this game and within a few weeks I was caught up in a war and I done my research and brought 4 corps together against 1, which caused a lot of trouble for the warring corp.
I think you missed the point and the guy you responded to hit the nail on the head.
People say 'If you dont want pvp, join a noobcorp', meanwhile others (and sometimes the same people, not so in the case of the OP) say 'you should be heavily taxed for being in a noob corp', '100% tax if you're in a noobcorp', 'You should be forced into a player corp next time you dock at a station after x period of time'.
So to combine these ideas you basically end up with eve being a 'You must PVP or suffer',, which is *not* what eve is about. Since when is market trading, industrial careers (specifically manufacturing), science and other non-combat trades PvP, besides the competition of it? Improve Market Competition! |
Aille Pluthrak
Caldari Privateers Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2007.04.24 04:19:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Min Seb
Originally by: Aille Pluthrak
Originally by: Tohmu Blackwing Grow some balls.
Learn to defend yourself.
I love this. So just because I started playing Eve some months or years later than some of you, I can't have a safe place to train before I can deal with asses of your kind? The reality behind your wars are that you like to kill noobs like me. You are old players with t2 guns and ships but no @@ for real PvP. Litle cowards picking on new players as they are easily killed. If I could train fast then yeah I would have no problem dealing with you. But I can't. Training takes time. Also I must make the money for everything I will need before I have to face you. So let's hear it. You are just cowards with no balls for real PvP. Now it's time to pay for your "fun".
Finally let's not forget that not everyone joins this game for PvP fun. Some people like just to mine. That is what I liked in this game. The fact that you can be everything you want. A Corp/Alliance of your kind destroys that and it might take some hundrets of people leaving the game but I am sure that CCP would not allow their pockets striped so some arses can turn high sec in their PvP playground. After all what is better? 112 x 15$ per month or 200 x 15$ per month?
Your post is one of the reasons I blast people in Empire. It seems you are a little irritated with our actions. It doesn't take much to learn to fight. Team work, good communications, practice, and the willingness to loose ships whithout crying about it.
Don't worry. A lot of players that got a taste of Empire Carebear blood like the taste. Some just flew around the local systems that were within 10 or so jumps of where their ships were stationed. They just might break from The Privateers and form their own corporations, checking out the local fat and juicy Emipre corporations. Checking who would make a good war dec target. Their game play wont be effected all that much. But the game play of the fat and juicy targets just might be.
I'm having fun. Are you?
What I post are my own thoughts, no one elses. ---------------------- Boom goes the ship! Squish goes the pilot!
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Minigin
Ganja Labs Astral Wolves
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Posted - 2007.04.24 04:22:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Rod Blaine The wardec spam a la privateers was never meant to exist. I think it was a good idea to nerf you guys like this.
I've never been bothered by you btw, not personally. But the whole idea of "lets wardec everyone so we can have some easy pvp in empire" is nothing but bad news for the game overall.
And no, I don't want to see empire be safe. But there's a difference between safe and the idiocy that was privateers.
you make me so horney! i doubt they will listen to you though... i spent almost 4 different threads spamming this in as many different ways as possible and all i got from them was
"no we are so pro because we can do this... your just jelous noob!"
PRIVATEER NERF WAS NEEDED AND WILL NOT BE REVERSED! MOVE ON PEOPLE THERES NOTHING TO SEE HERE! Your signature <----- My awsome Sig
Real men PVP on the Forums. |
BigWhale
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.04.24 06:53:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Aille Pluthrak It doesn't take much to learn to fight.
Of course it doesn't but it does take 2-3 months to fly well equipped HAC.
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Karen Manaan
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Posted - 2007.04.24 08:37:00 -
[20]
a question that will prolly cause a torrent of flames but why not ply your pirate trade in lowsec, isn't that what it's for after all?
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Jawas
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.04.24 08:44:00 -
[21]
If privateers want to PVP, go to 0.0 where you can shoot anyone you see for free. You don't even have to wardec them and you don't have to pay billions to circumvent Concord security there.
Oh but I forgot, they are not soft targets in 0.0 are they? Silly me
-- Sig design in training: Remaining time 30 years 20 days, 4 hours, 10 mins, 15 seconds. |
Vimos Ziggy
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Posted - 2007.04.24 14:11:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Vimos Ziggy on 24/04/2007 14:07:16 wow you woulda thought I heard of them. I take it they are not a big influence in the universe?
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John McDuff
Caldari Jovian Labs
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Posted - 2007.04.24 14:22:00 -
[23]
Well they are but only when you are in one of the top 100 alliances or so :)
--- SIG
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Sicks
Caldari Beyond Divinity Inc Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2007.04.26 16:01:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Sicks on 26/04/2007 15:58:27
Originally by: NumberFour
Originally by: Aille Pluthrak
Originally by: Tohmu Blackwing Grow some balls.
Learn to defend yourself.
Good one!
My experience with the Privateers has been that they attack only when they know they can win, and hide when they are out numbered. Very different from the game play that I've had in NoSec.
I'd like to see the Privateers go claim some dusty part of 0.0 like the pirates of old and see if they can defend that instead of ganking the usually defenseless. That would be interesting. But since they seem to be a collection of former LowSec gankers, I doubt they would do that. My thoughts anyways.
First of all, the whole "only attack when they know they can win" flame works on everybody. Cuz who in their right mind is gonna be like "DUR MY KESTREL WILL KILL YOUR THREE BATTLESHIPS!! PEW PEW!" Noone ever fights unless they feel they have a chance at winning. Every pvp experience I've ever been in where both parties aggressed eachother, the odds have been even. If you know youre going to lose, you run, it makes sense, why lose however much isk in ships for no reason. Its called retreat. And everyone does it. Including you.
Originally by: Jawas If privateers want to PVP, go to 0.0 where you can shoot anyone you see for free. You don't even have to wardec them and you don't have to pay billions to circumvent Concord security there.
Oh but I forgot, they are not soft targets in 0.0 are they? Silly me
Sure, you can shoot anyone you see. IF you see anyone at all.
Its not the fact that targets are softer in empire than they are in 0.0. The whole point of the empire wardec system that privateers use is for the NUMBER of targets. Ive been in 0.0 corps before and sat for 6 hours on a gate without seeing a single activation. 0.0 is abso-****in-lutely boring when it comes to pvp. I know everything in eve takes time, but if theres anything that shouldnt it should be pvp. With the privateers last wardec frenzy before the patch, I've lost many ships. Privateers aren't invincible, were not flying around killing miners. I dont think Ive even seen a mining barge that was a wartarget yet, and we have quite a few wars going on right now. Many corps/alliances have been gathering together and counter-blobbing us quite well, Targets are no softer in Empire than they are in 0.0, apart from capital ships.
We dont wardec because "its easy to kill carebears". We wardec because empire space is the only place with enough people in local to make pvp fun, and not require 3 weeks of planning and 4 hours of organization before every op.
------------------------------------------------- - EverythingForum - SickThought |
NumberFour
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Posted - 2007.04.27 05:48:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Sicks Edited by: Sicks on 26/04/2007 15:58:27
Originally by: NumberFour
Originally by: Aille Pluthrak
Originally by: Tohmu Blackwing Grow some balls.
Learn to defend yourself.
Good one!.....
First of all, the whole "only attack when they know they can win" flame works on everybody. Cuz who in their right mind is gonna be like "DUR MY KESTREL WILL KILL YOUR THREE BATTLESHIPS!! PEW PEW!" Noone ever fights unless they feel they have a chance at winning. Every pvp experience I've ever been in where both parties aggressed eachother, the odds have been even. If you know youre going to lose, you run, it makes sense, why lose however much isk in ships for no reason. Its called retreat. And everyone does it. Including you.
You are right, You do need to choose your battles, and not needlessly loose your ship if you can help it, and yes, I do that. But, what I did a poor job in trying to say is that I've seen so many Privateers play the lame Undock/Dock game;... They undock, try to gank, dock, smack talk, wait, undock, try to gank, dock, smack talk routine. If they can gank someone easy, they do. If they can't they dock. They seem to be transplanted LowSec gankers who have little backbone for a real fight. Very different from many of the standup Alliance fleet battles that I've seen. I'm not saying that all the Privateers do that, but many are and is part of the reason why so many hate them as they do.
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Spectre80
Caldari The Dark Horses Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2007.05.02 11:10:00 -
[26]
Nerfing wardecks was really good decision from ccp. wars can be fun but what privateers do is just lame.. so i am very happy this new turn of events.
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Draconus Lofwyr
Eternal Guardians Celestial Frontier
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Posted - 2007.05.02 21:07:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Draconus Lofwyr on 02/05/2007 21:04:39 What surprises me is that no one has mentioned another more technical reason to nerf the wardec's. Server capacity and lag at the gates and systems. While I will admit to profiteering off the Privateer's on occasion and applaud the creative use of an in game mechanic to stir things up, but at the same time, I have heard of the lag induced kills and server issues of large amounts of ships at gates while blockading the choke points. In a way, they became the victims of their own success. CCP, may have done this to ease some of the empire conflicts in the main systems, easing Jita battle lag a bit. I for one hope (and fully expect them to) they come up with some other creative way to stay alive and keep people on their toes.
Draconus
revolution is good every now and then, keeps the blood flowing.
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