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Excelcias
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Posted - 2007.06.15 17:15:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Excelcias on 15/06/2007 17:16:54 So, here's my question.
I'm fairly new, with 4.5mil SP scattered in Electronics, Engineering, Gunnery, Missiles, and Spaceship Command currently (Caldari).
Is it worth going for Interceptors now? I'm torn as to which way to go with my skill build. I want to PvP more and become useful enough to get into a 0.0 Corp. Right now I have enough SP to run L3 missions with a Drake and T2 parts.
For PvP "usefulness", should I:
(1) Train for EW warfare (a definite interest) (2) Interceptors/tackling (3) Push to Battleships and a long-range torp. boat?
Opinions please! :)
Drones - 3 Skills, 256750 Points Electronics - 13 Skills, 276405 Points Engineering - 11 Skills, 597398 Points Gunnery - 12 Skills, 518000 Points Industry - 3 Skills, 750 Points Leadership - 1 Skill, 8000 Points Learning - 9 Skills, 1572394 Points Mechanic - 5 Skills, 146810 Points Missile Launcher Operation - 12 Skills, 128106 Points Navigation - 7 Skills, 186522 Points Science - 3 Skills, 47420 Points Social - 2 Skills, 24000 Points Spaceship Command - 10 Skills, 445724 Points Trade - 3 Skills, 2665 Points
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Marcus Alkhaar
Conisor Excavations Syndicate Antagonistic Assembly
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Posted - 2007.06.15 17:20:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Marcus Alkhaar on 15/06/2007 17:19:28 get skills for a crow ASAP if you want to get into pvp
Originally by: Tanksmann just so you you know putting "Dev" or "Tux" in the topic probably lessens the dev attention your topic receives
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Aegis Osiris
Gallente Demonic Retribution Pure.
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Posted - 2007.06.15 17:24:00 -
[3]
In a nutshell...yes, definitely train for interceptors. Make sure your nav skills are in good shape (and keep working on them, they are always useful), and I'm assuming you'll be able to use T2 mods for whatever race you plan to train for. All the races have at least one very good inty, and they are some of the most fun ships to fly in the game.
Go for it, you won't be at all disappointed. ________________________________________________ This thread does not exist
Sig in process.... |
Kruel
Save our Souls
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Posted - 2007.06.15 17:41:00 -
[4]
Inty's might become even more useful now if the NOS change means Battleships won't be able to nos smaller ships into oblivion.
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Arx Impera
Amarr Umbra Congregatio Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.06.15 17:44:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Kruel Inty's might become even more useful now if the NOS change means Battleships won't be able to nos smaller ships into oblivion.
Which i hope it isnt the nerf, because Heavy nos is supposed to be frigate counter.
...who of course promptly went bat****, flipped out and killed some people. |
Laboratus
Gallente BGG League of Abnormal Gentlemen
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Posted - 2007.06.15 17:50:00 -
[6]
Everyone trains for interceptors and they do it for one reason. They are teh uber and are fun to fly as well...
So, you should train em too... ___ P.S. Post with your main. Mind control and tin hats |
Deschenus Maximus
Amarr Digital Fury Corporation Digital Renegades
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Posted - 2007.06.15 18:39:00 -
[7]
Inties are a great place to start for new PvPers, and are always welcome in a gang.
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Xanos Blackpaw
Amarr The Firestorm Cartel
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Posted - 2007.06.15 18:55:00 -
[8]
if it helps, go watch the old movie Top Gun to get in the mood before getting in that crow Playing minmatar is "like going down a flight of stairs in a office chair firing an Uzi". |
anillation
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Posted - 2007.06.15 18:58:00 -
[9]
stop training Caldari and move to another race if you wanna pvp. Gallante & Minmatar are good choices. I can fly a drake well and maybe a month of skill training to fly a raven and I stopped to train gallente. Caladari is not the race for pvp, better for missions.
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Scraqp
Advocates
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Posted - 2007.06.15 19:33:00 -
[10]
Originally by: anillation stop training Caldari and move to another race if you wanna pvp. Gallante & Minmatar are good choices. I can fly a drake well and maybe a month of skill training to fly a raven and I stopped to train gallente. Caladari is not the race for pvp, better for missions.
wtf? why has everyone to train gallente and minmatar to get the permission to pvp? its a game. its about fun. if he wants caldari pvp, let him.
btw: caldari in gang is pretty nice, which a lot of clever PVPers will confirm.
next...
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Liang Nuren
The Refugees
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Posted - 2007.06.15 19:47:00 -
[11]
Its true ... I know that I've seen lots of wonderful caldari action IN GANGS. Solo? Not so much - but its not a solo game, now is it?
Liang
Originally by: Dianabolic, of BOB, referring to MSN
the fact that many of us speak to the devs / gm's / employees of CCP on a regular basis as friends is already common knoweldge?
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LeMoose
The Collective Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2007.06.15 19:49:00 -
[12]
caldari maybe aint that super for solo pvp (but my mwd cerb is good at it) but they excel at gang pvp and eve is way more pppppppppppppp v ppppppppppppp game these days rather than pvp
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PartyVaN
Minmatar
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Posted - 2007.06.15 20:15:00 -
[13]
Edited by: PartyVaN on 15/06/2007 20:14:22 if you want to get into something in the mean time (having the basic skills to fly an inty does NOT mean you should be flying it at all), most fleet ops low sp pilots can be very effective with ewar ships. Even if its not fleet ops (small gang), ewar cruisers are very powerful.
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anillation
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Posted - 2007.06.15 20:17:00 -
[14]
What caldari crusiers do good in pvp? Even in a gang they are hurting. Yes you can do a 20 caracal gang but they are paper thin and don't have the speed behind it. Moa is okay but need gunnery skills which most caldari don't train. If you go to bc the ferox is okay but the drake is a beast. Only prob is now you have to rely on no web/scram and its slow and dps is okay but nothing special. In bs the Raven is more for missions and ratting. Rokh is very nice but again lots of gunnery skills which caldari don't normally train. Yes the af, covert ops, & scorpion are nice but why invest that many skills for just them. Unless you already are setup in another race that has better ships for pvp. Train gunnery skills and get into gallente or minmatar, even ammar then get the caldari ships you want. In either of those races pvp is great and you can do a lot in em. Thats is just my views you dont have to listen to me but thats my input.
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Daelin Blackleaf
No Joy Corp Pride - Honor - Duty
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Posted - 2007.06.15 20:33:00 -
[15]
Originally by: anillation What caldari crusiers do good in pvp? Even in a gang they are hurting. Yes you can do a 20 caracal gang but they are paper thin and don't have the speed behind it. Moa is okay but need gunnery skills which most caldari don't train. If you go to bc the ferox is okay but the drake is a beast. Only prob is now you have to rely on no web/scram and its slow and dps is okay but nothing special. In bs the Raven is more for missions and ratting. Rokh is very nice but again lots of gunnery skills which caldari don't normally train. Yes the af, covert ops, & scorpion are nice but why invest that many skills for just them. Unless you already are setup in another race that has better ships for pvp. Train gunnery skills and get into gallente or minmatar, even ammar then get the caldari ships you want. In either of those races pvp is great and you can do a lot in em. Thats is just my views you dont have to listen to me but thats my input.
Let me get this straight, your complaining Caldari are no good at PvP because it requires a degree of training? Your also complaining about having to train rails?
Can you say Minmatar
Hell even Gallente require excellent DPS and cap skills on their blaster boats to be able to melt their opponent before their paper thin tank gets eaten away.
And the ever nefarious Domi loses out on 20% to it's drone damage if you don't train Drone Interfacing V, not to mention Heavy Drones V.
On another note complete the Crow is an excellent interceptor, though their all good to fly, and no you do not need max skills to fly anything. Because of course you can afford to lose it if your contemplating flying it
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Excelcias
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Posted - 2007.06.15 20:35:00 -
[16]
I won't lie, I started Caldari cause I like how my dude looks, and for the PvE (I need isk, damnit!)
I also like the Caldari Cruiser for an EW setup, and think I will at least start in that direction for now, then work on interceptors.
Why Gallente/Minmattar for PvP though???
Either way, I actually have more drones SP than missiles SP, so going that route is no big woop, easily enough achieved :)
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Kelter Highfire
Caldari AirHawk Alliance Insomnia.
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Posted - 2007.06.15 20:44:00 -
[17]
Quote: For PvP "usefulness", should I:
(1) Train for EW warfare (a definite interest) (2) Interceptors/tackling (3) Push to Battleships and a long-range torp. boat?
For all intensive purposes, torp boats are tough to pvp in, unless you have tacklers with both warp scrams and webs on them. Anything smaller than a BC isn't gonna get hit too hard by a torp barrage. You're better off either training into cruise missiles, if you'd like to remain a missile-character, or training into a Rokh, which utilizes hybrid turrets quite well.
That being said, for your SP count, inties can be extremely fun. Crows are useful in gangs as tacklers, although they lack the dps of a taranis or wolf. If you're looking for a solo-pwnmobile, by all means train up into battleships and the like, but inties are pretty darned fun to fly. For the great majority of my pvp, I choose to fly my tackling crow, just because I know that the guy who I'm tackling hates me more than he hates the dps battleships and BC's
I'm not huge into EWar, but it has its uses on the battlefield. If you're really interested in heading that direction, I'd train for a scorpion and cruise missiles. You can keep 2-3 battleships completely deadened in a fight with good EWar skills and the proper fittings for a scorpion.
As to the comments above about races and PvP, certainly some races have an advantage when it comes to PvP, Gallente and Minmatar being two prominent ones because of both speed and weapons power, but you can be effective in any race's ships. Just play what you have fun playing.
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Kelter Highfire Rock Melter and WT Killer |
Excelcias
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Posted - 2007.06.15 21:31:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Kelter Highfire
That being said, for your SP count, inties can be extremely fun. Crows are useful in gangs as tacklers, although they lack the dps of a taranis or claw.
Do most people fly interceptors for the DPS or for their speed/mobility while tackling? Honestly not sure how to choose between the Crow (Caldari) and Tanaris (Gallente). I mean, the only difference is in the shield/armor ratio, the extra turret hardpoint, and sensor strength? What did I miss :)?
As to EW... my thought is just that it might be more in demand than a mediocre damage dealer; if I try and go for damage, I'm gonna' be behind lots of people who've spent years developing gunnery SP and T2 weapons, which I won't have. Kind of like picking the healer in WOW to be wanted...?
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Acinonyx Jubatus
International Multi-Player Consortium Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.06.15 21:52:00 -
[19]
Crow isn't bad for a ship to get into, if you up your missile skills they can be even more effective.
The real differences in crow and taranis though are as follows.
The crow can reach out to a fairly nice range with decently good skills, think if you had really good skills your missile can reach out to 45 or something km, been awhile so I've forgotten. Locking/scramming out to that far is a totally different story though. It also doesn't require any tracking to hit its target, as long as the missile reach the target and it's going slow enought he missile will hit for a static damage amount.
The Taranis on the other hand, has 3 turrets, yes... But you've also missed something it has over the other inties, 2 light drones(or one medium if you want)
You can go either dps with blasters which is pretty much suicide due to nos/web/smarties, or with rails. Turrets unlike missiles require tracking, so you can't orbit too fast or you'll miss. Hybrids also use cap unlike the missiles.
So it comes down to if you want missiles or turrets and two drones which usually don't get launched unless putting out max dps.
Witht hat said, get your navigational skils up, prop jamming skills ofcourse, some decent cap skills to help keep you alive, and either one of these paths for these two ships. There's also the Ares and Craptor if you need a cheaper often neglected inty(ies)
OH and the comment about dps, it's because people always gripe they can't fit the absolute best in their given ship... I don't know how many comments I've seen that boil down to it... seriously.
A lot of people want max tank, max gank, max speed, max survivability, max something else, and they seem to bring it up with almost anything.
"inties lack dps and tank" Well duh, they're fast and fragile, and their real strength is speed and lock time.
Soemthing like that.
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Shiela
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Posted - 2007.06.15 21:55:00 -
[20]
I thought the same thing when I started my character, I have been playing a few months now and am still training for better EW skills.
I can Solo, if I choose my opponents wisely. I can be an asset in fleet ops, if I was not a threat, then I wouldnt always get primaried
In the end you dont need uber DPS or a monster tank or a wtfubersolopwnmobile to be successful, just train into your spec and learn how to master it. I will quote something I read earlier today,
"Experience is worth much more than skillpoints"
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Kelter Highfire
Caldari AirHawk Alliance Insomnia.
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Posted - 2007.06.15 22:01:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Shiela
"Experience is worth much more than skillpoints"
Quoted for ultimate truth. There is a certain amount of difference that skillpoints will allow you to overcome, but nothing gives a better chance of winning than experience. Learning when to engage, when to disengage, how to burst your modules, etc. is the best thing that you can do. Just train up something that you find fun to fly and fly it until you're good in it.
Also, most people fly ceptors in 0.0 for their ability to tackle, not for their soloing ability. A properly fit inty will allow you the ability to evade most attacks or mitigate their damage down to 0, so long as you understand that the strength of an inty is in its speed.
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Kelter Highfire Rock Melter and WT Killer |
Marcus Davonsure
Fairlight Corp FOUNDATI0N
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Posted - 2007.06.15 22:56:00 -
[22]
Interceptors are nice to fly and will always have there place in gang warfare, in fact, you will be the one that gets the first lock on the target and you will be the one the stops him/her from getting away. So there is sometimes more responsibility as an interceptor pilot than a dps ship.
As far as Ewar goes, being caldari you will ultimately fly the falcon, and everyone on this forum will agree that being blanket jammed is the most depressing situation to be in when youÆre trying to fight for your life.
Don't worry about battleships, you will eventually get to them and will probably have better base skills (tanking, dps, cap regen) when you do. Most people that rush to get them, lose them in the first week and have to scrap together isk for the next month to get another one.
Join a good corp./alliance and the good FC's will find the role youÆre best suited for.
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Khyara
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Posted - 2007.06.15 23:19:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Khyara on 15/06/2007 23:19:03
Originally by: Marcus Davonsure Don't worry about battleships, you will eventually get to them and will probably have better base skills (tanking, dps, cap regen) when you do. Most people that rush to get them, lose them in the first week and have to scrap together isk for the next month to get another one.
Very true. I made that mistake, going for the BS. I lost 3 or 4 of them until I learned my lesson - and it was a very painful one. Cheaper, faster ships, can be as important or more important than a BS. Not to mention the fact that by training for the inty and assault frigates - you develop the proper base of skills to support a Battleship. If I had to do it again, I would not go for Battleships, but stick to Interceptors, and possibly Assault Frigates (which I think are fun personally) rather than dump my skills for months on end into a BS and have it cost me 100's of millions if isk.
I'd also rather have an Inty pilot in my corp/gang that can afford to replace their ship than some guy in a BS who doesnt really have the money, or the skils and experience to pilot it effectively.
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Gee Lok
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Posted - 2007.06.15 23:31:00 -
[24]
Basic skills for flying a crow (not including prerequisietes and fitting skills):
Energy Management and Energy Systems Operation - for cap
Propulsion Jamming - reduces scram cap usage
High Speed Maneouvering - reduces mwd cap usage
Acceleration Control and Navigation - makes you faster
Train as many of them to 5 as possible starting with the lower level ones.
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Maliber
Art of War Cult of War
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Posted - 2007.06.15 23:35:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Maliber on 15/06/2007 23:36:18 @the op: I'm also a caldari pilot with some experiance. Training for a interceptor might be a smart move. You will train skills you will need later on and i find them one of the most exciting shiptypes to fly. But as with all things in eve... excell in something dont be a jack of all trades. It might seem tempting to stop training for a ship once you can fly it but especially for inties you need those skills maxed. So train up those navigations skills. Get your speed maxed out. And then go for the missle skills... They are however t2 ships, so to fit em proberly you have to burn some isk. I found it very hard to finance my inty losses in the beginning. As caldari you can go for the crow. Its a nice ship. Altho its kinda hard to fit when you are a on a budget. When i started flying em i always put cheap stuff on it, Dont.... Fit it nicely and you will lose less of em. As for learing how to fly em well start with cheap frigs. once you get the hang of it switch.
For your skillplan: You could prob fit a drake so you can rat with it in 0.0, i dont know about lvl 4's tho but it'll prob take you a while to fly those solo. I would go for a inty first. Then EW and missle skills. EW ships are not solo pwn mobiles but with a few skills you'll make your gang mates very happy.
Maliber p.s. if you want a cheaper pvp ship go for a black bird.
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Hait
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Posted - 2007.06.15 23:36:00 -
[26]
As the guy above implied, why not..
All the inteceptor skills are transferable and applicable to every other ship you'll fly.
Who doesn't love their interceptor?
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Excelcias
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Posted - 2007.06.15 23:45:00 -
[27]
This has been an extremely helpful topic -- thanks to all of you for replying :)
I'm going to go the Caldari route -- work on my interceptor skills to get into a Crow, then do EW stuff. I can fly a Drake now so that should help me with L3 missions / some ratting with friends to make $$$.
I love missiles and EW. It may not be as DPS-heavy as other races but I've never enjoyed the brutal, DPS path in a MMORPG, so I think this is a good fit. In a few months I can start thinking about battleships and all that goodness!
Gracias!
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Marcus Davonsure
Fairlight Corp FOUNDATI0N
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Posted - 2007.06.15 23:58:00 -
[28]
Have fun and good luck.
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