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Mistae
Resurrection R i s e
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Posted - 2007.07.10 02:16:00 -
[1]
From COAD Forum "Remedial steals goonswarm's Titan fund It seams I am in a minority but I don't find these large scale rip offs or the infiltration of high level spy/imposters to be "just part of the game" or "a reflection of real life". In real life spies are executed and thieves go to prison.
I think CCP's hands off attitude in general is a good thing but in some cases it is an excuse for laziness and unwllingness to pay for staff time. One thing that was critical to Everquest's long successful run was their committment to protecting the integrity of the game. At the very least their should be a serious effort to try and block the movement of the ISK and banning the account involved. I find it hard to believe that CCP lacks the tools to ***** down on the more blatent ISK selling perpetrators.
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Washell Olivaw
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Posted - 2007.07.10 02:26:00 -
[2]
The players have the tools to lock down blueprints, cash, hangars, etc. Next to that it's possible to transfer stuff into personal property of the CEO, directors and their alts.
If with all the available tools you still manage to become the victim of a major scam, then you have the admire the ingenuity and persistance of the scammer/corpthief and accept your losses.
If you didn't use all the tools, then you've just learned an expensive lesson.
CCP isn't lazy and they don't lack the tools. They want the game to be a sandbox in which everything goes, including scams and corptheft.
As to real life, you might want to look up the statistics of how many thefts and burglaries are really solved. It's not at all that high.
Quote: Everybody has a photographic memory, some people just don't have film.
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CrestoftheStars
Perkone
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Posted - 2007.07.10 04:03:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Washell Olivaw The players have the tools to lock down blueprints, cash, hangars, etc. Next to that it's possible to transfer stuff into personal property of the CEO, directors and their alts.
If with all the available tools you still manage to become the victim of a major scam, then you have the admire the ingenuity and persistance of the scammer/corpthief and accept your losses.
If you didn't use all the tools, then you've just learned an expensive lesson.
CCP isn't lazy and they don't lack the tools. They want the game to be a sandbox in which everything goes, including scams and corptheft.
As to real life, you might want to look up the statistics of how many thefts and burglaries are really solved. It's not at all that high.
no they don't this is harashment and against the eula. so players can't do *diip*!.
yer ccp seriusly need to the the finger out and do something about this kind of bad attitude, i mean seriusly i can't say "F.U.C.K this guy" without getting a warning, but they can harash over ts/vent, steal, spy, and do whatever the freak the please to provoke and be a constant annoying factor (not to talk about scammers) ___________________________________________ Whoever appeals to the law against his fellow man is either a fool or a coward. Whoever cannot take care of himself without that law is both. For a wounded |
syphurous
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.07.10 05:18:00 -
[4]
If I had a Lamborghini and left it with the keys in the iginition & the doors unlocked and in the middle of a public place, how long do you think it'd take before someone atleast hoped in and had a fiddle with it ( Or in it? ) ?
Your Corp is the same thing, if its not nailed down, or locked away, someone is going to touch its assets or worse, take them.
Corp theft is your issue, not CCP's, get smart. ______________________________
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Del Narveux
Obsidian Angels Enterprises
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Posted - 2007.07.10 07:50:00 -
[5]
But you cant ban someone for being a jerk. They can be banned for selling isk, and CCP tries to track that stuff down but its often hard to have absolute proof that particular isk transfers match up to out of game activities. _________________ [SAK] Alumnus--And Proud Of It! -- aka Cpt Bogus Is that my torped sig cloaking your base?
Originally by: Wrangler Well, at least we have forum PvP..
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Trak Cranker
Serenity Inc
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Posted - 2007.07.10 10:30:00 -
[6]
Originally by: CrestoftheStars
no they don't this is harashment and against the eula.
Yes they do, and it isnt. Welcome to Eve.
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Washell Olivaw
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Posted - 2007.07.10 11:15:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Mistae From COAD Forum "Remedial steals goonswarm's Titan fund
Put another way:
It's ok to blow up a titan and destroy the billions invested.
It's ok to blow up a titan under construction along with the POS, destroying the billions invested in both.
But suddenly it's not ok to strike at the earliest stage? The hoard of cash that's going to be used to build the titan?
If all methods are used to lock things down, it's infinitely harder to get access to the cash than to set up a strikefleet and kill it that way. This was a pre-emptive strike. Best kind of strike there is.
Quote: Everybody has a photographic memory, some people just don't have film.
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Bein Glorious
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.07.10 12:17:00 -
[8]
meh, its just ISK |
Wendat Huron
Stellar Solutions
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Posted - 2007.07.10 19:16:00 -
[9]
Power corrupts and all that, I'd be plenty worried if I was in BoB.
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Raiiden
Gallente Lucky Flight
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Posted - 2007.07.10 19:20:00 -
[10]
Originally by: syphurous If I had a Lamborghini and left it with the keys in the iginition & the doors unlocked and in the middle of a public place, how long do you think it'd take before someone atleast hoped in and had a fiddle with it ( Or in it? ) ?
Your Corp is the same thing, if its not nailed down, or locked away, someone is going to touch its assets or worse, take them.
Corp theft is your issue, not CCP's, get smart.
^^^ PREACH!@
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Trih`Xeem from TDZK |
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Yamichi Wiggin
Caldari Rising Knights SMASH Alliance
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Posted - 2007.07.10 19:52:00 -
[11]
your /cry button is stuck.
There are dozens of tools and methods you can use to lock down funding and assets. If you trust somebody and they break that trust, you're screwed. That's life. No it's not against EULA. No it's not against the rules. And no it's not unfair. Mean? yes. messed up? totally. If you would screw over that many people who trust you and call you a friend, you probably have some deep-seated moral issues to deal with on your own. But it's not against the rules and it won't ruin the game. And it's DEFINITELY not CCP's fault. ------ Pain is weakness leaving the body.
There is no love in fear |
syphurous
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.07.10 22:39:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Yamichi Wiggin If you would screw over that many people who trust you and call you a friend, you probably have some deep-seated moral issues to deal with on your own.
I run the hookers over after getting extra health in GTA, what does that say about me ? Am I crazy or just using the games rules to my advantage ? :p
Games are places where you can do things that would otherwise see you getting in trouble, the problem comes when you forget, "Its just a game".
Sandbox FTW. ______________________________
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Stahlregen
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.07.11 05:35:00 -
[13]
The extremely unfriendly nature of eve and the fact it seems like every individual is only looking out for themselves means that when you do find yourself in a situation where you can trust someone with multiple billions of isk, you end up having a truly unique advantage through your trust.
An advantage that other alliances and corporations might not have to take advantage of. The risk of being ripped off encourages CEOs and directors to establish a tight knit community in order to limit betrayals and thefts.
If you were to limit scamming in any way it would be detrimental to Eve. In the sense that we wouldn't have any good drama from big scams and thefts nor would players grow up believing that everyone else is out to screw you out of isk (Which they are).
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Mnengli Noiliffe
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Posted - 2007.07.11 06:39:00 -
[14]
sure the honest people won't like this, but in our society there are lots of people that would enjoy robbing, killing and scamming if only there were no laws an their enforcers.
a lot of this kind of people are attacted by eve in-game crime and scam stories and constitute the huge part of CCP's player base.
you can see a lot of evidence of the above on these forums really so I am surprised by the OP's blindness.
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Grey Area
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.07.11 12:37:00 -
[15]
Originally by: syphurous If I had a Lamborghini and left it with the keys in the iginition & the doors unlocked and in the middle of a public place, how long do you think it'd take before someone atleast hoped in and had a fiddle with it ( Or in it? ) ?
Your Corp is the same thing, if its not nailed down, or locked away, someone is going to touch its assets or worse, take them.
Corp theft is your issue, not CCP's, get smart.
If your lamborghini was in the garage, and you invited your best friend for tea and they took the keys from your kitchen and stole it, it is STILL theft, and the police would STILL be involved. That's a better comparison to what happened than you making up an artificial set of circumstances to make the victim seem stupid. ---
I don't mind you disagreeing with me. Just don't say I don't have the SKILLS to comment. |
Fingapup
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Posted - 2007.07.11 15:29:00 -
[16]
The real point here is that theft is theft. Whether it is in game or in RL the activity is the same, the misappropriation of another's possessions. How it is permitted in game I still have yet to figure out.
Isk selling is a form of theft that CP does not tolerate... Money and possessions have value because of the time and effort required to accrue them. Isk is the same. When theft occurs it is the victim's time and effort that is being stolen; whether Isk or money. Don't forget that playing time is paid for with real money and thus isk is a real money product. Stealing isk is stealing the time and effort that the player has paid for to accrue it. It comes down to the acceptable means of expending/losing that time and effort... acceptable is consciously risking your ships... unacceptable I would say, is keeping your isk stored/invested in projects and having it taken from you without you deliberately exposing that isk to risk. Never liked Goons much, but I sympathise.
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Spoon Thumb
Khanid Aerospace Group Khanid Provincial Authority
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Posted - 2007.07.11 16:04:00 -
[17]
The problem is CEO's and Director theft. Shares in Eve don't work because CEO's can steal stuff owned by the shareholders, and a single shareholder can install a corp thief as CEO by ninja voting.
I think we need a system of "Corp ownership" and "Majority Vote share system"
Khaldari KPA are recruiting In-game channel: khanidpublic |
Fate Amen
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.07.13 04:55:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Fate Amen on 13/07/2007 04:55:18
Originally by: Mistae From COAD Forum "Remedial steals goonswarm's Titan fund It seams I am in a minority but I don't find these large scale rip offs or the infiltration of high level spy/imposters to be "just part of the game" or "a reflection of real life". In real life spies are executed and thieves go to prison.
As a member of the affected corp I'd like to state that it's incidents like Remedial's corptheft that keep me playing.
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Waterfowl Democracy
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.07.13 05:02:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Fingapup The real point here is that theft is theft. Whether it is in game or in RL the activity is the same, the misappropriation of another's possessions. How it is permitted in game I still have yet to figure out.
Isk selling is a form of theft that CP does not tolerate... Money and possessions have value because of the time and effort required to accrue them. Isk is the same. When theft occurs it is the victim's time and effort that is being stolen; whether Isk or money. Don't forget that playing time is paid for with real money and thus isk is a real money product. Stealing isk is stealing the time and effort that the player has paid for to accrue it. It comes down to the acceptable means of expending/losing that time and effort... acceptable is consciously risking your ships... unacceptable I would say, is keeping your isk stored/invested in projects and having it taken from you without you deliberately exposing that isk to risk. Never liked Goons much, but I sympathise.
Blowing up someone's car with them in it isn't acceptable either but shooting their ship to pieces is. Games aren't real life and you can't apply real life moral judgements to ingame situations and ingame actions. And yes you did risk your isk when you put it in a project. It's at risk whenever it isn't safely in your personal wallet.
Goons don't need your sympathy, isk comes, isk goes. Ask BoB how we're doing right now.
PS. Rise is whining because someone stole 3 corp Battlecruiser BPOs. They're pretty torn up about it too. Maybe they are bankrupt now.
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Alias11
Gallente GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.07.13 05:14:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Grey Area
Originally by: syphurous If I had a Lamborghini and left it with the keys in the iginition & the doors unlocked and in the middle of a public place, how long do you think it'd take before someone atleast hoped in and had a fiddle with it ( Or in it? ) ?
Your Corp is the same thing, if its not nailed down, or locked away, someone is going to touch its assets or worse, take them.
Corp theft is your issue, not CCP's, get smart.
If your lamborghini was in the garage, and you invited your best friend for tea and they took the keys from your kitchen and stole it, it is STILL theft, and the police would STILL be involved. That's a better comparison to what happened than you making up an artificial set of circumstances to make the victim seem stupid.
No, reality has the artificial circumstances in the police. Eve is a pseudo lolbertarian anarcho-capitalist paradise with zero to no laws in some kind of rigidly enforced state of nature. If your buddy stole your car and there's no police, you've made a poor choice in friends and he's taken an opportunity
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Bein Glorious
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.07.13 05:34:00 -
[21]
hey, i didn't link this thread on goonfleet.com so you guys could **** in it
get out of here you idiots |
James Duar
Merch Industrial We Are Nice Guys
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Posted - 2007.07.13 07:40:00 -
[22]
EVE needs non-alt bank accounts. Not really to prevent theft, just to make it so that thefts are larger and more crippling when someone swings the director vote their way and then robs people blind.
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