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Jenna Shame
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Posted - 2007.07.31 04:49:00 -
[31]
This is the Curse solution?
What are you smoking?
At best the curse is going to be about micro neut/nos management.
God I wish I trained for a vagabond or sabre instead, which are boosted tremendously by this patch.
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Xequecal
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Posted - 2007.07.31 05:00:00 -
[32]
The Curse is still an exceptional gang ship because you can shield tank it and use NOS to sustain your cap. In gangs, there is really no penalty at all to staying at close to zero cap and using the NOS as pseudo-cap injectors to run your mods. You can even miss a few disruptor cycles as warp disruptors have no graphic and your target is unlikely to stay aligned all the time, spamming warp.
However, it's seriously nerfed as a solo ship. You can't kill anyone. Your best bet now is to use launchers/neuts, and tracking disruptors to prevent your target from shooting your drones or you. You can't kill BC and BS sized missile ships at all anymore.
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Anubis Xian
Vertigo One E.A.R.T.H. Federation
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Posted - 2007.07.31 05:12:00 -
[33]
AutoTempest with Torps Buff tbh.
Originally by: CCP Oveur The client handles no logic, it is simply a dumb terminal.
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Gabriel Karade
Quam Singulari M. PIRE
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Posted - 2007.07.31 08:24:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Aaron Mirrorsaver
if your fighting (as per your post) a turret megathron for example, here are a few holes in see in your theory
1) the nos drain, your drain onyourself with your modules isn't going to go so fluidly, remembers its percentage, so 700 cap for you = 50%, 4000 cap for him = 50%. so no drain.
2) when you finally cap out, and you said turn off your neut. and hes capped out, you now have 8000+ armor to go through. as the tank wouldnt have been broken yet, and only now he can't repair the damage from your drones. So without your tank you have 8000 to go, he has 2000 to go on you.
Excuse me? Is there a problem here? or are you really complaining about the difficulty of solo'ing a Battleship in a Recon ship?...
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Video - 'War-Machine' |
General Apocalypse
Amarr The Merchant Marines
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Posted - 2007.07.31 08:27:00 -
[35]
Test the post Stupid
Say NO to the NOS nerf |
Rodj Blake
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2007.07.31 09:54:00 -
[36]
Edited by: Rodj Blake on 31/07/2007 09:57:29 Edited by: Rodj Blake on 31/07/2007 09:54:29
Originally by: Jenna Shame
This is the Curse solution?
What are you smoking?
At best the curse is going to be about micro neut/nos management.
God I wish I trained for a vagabond or sabre instead, which are boosted tremendously by this patch.
A Curse will still drain a Vaga.
Why?
The Recon Ships skill increases the amount of cap drained by a neutraliser by 20% per level. But it doesn't increase the activation cost. On top of that, the skill for neutralisers reduces their activation cost while keeping the amount drained the same. So you'll be draining far more cap from your enemy than it costs you to activate a neutraliser.
Additionally, the Curse has a higher base cap - 1250 against 1062 for the Vaga. So he'll be running out of cap long before you.
With the Curse bonuses to Nos range, tracking disruptors, and drones, you'll be able to run rings around him as long as you can get him within warp disrupting range.
Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori. |
N1fty
Amarr Galactic Shipyards Inc HUZZAH FEDERATION
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Posted - 2007.07.31 10:08:00 -
[37]
Edited by: N1fty on 31/07/2007 10:08:02
Originally by: Rodj Blake Edited by: Rodj Blake on 31/07/2007 09:57:29 Edited by: Rodj Blake on 31/07/2007 09:54:29
Originally by: Jenna Shame
This is the Curse solution?
What are you smoking?
At best the curse is going to be about micro neut/nos management.
God I wish I trained for a vagabond or sabre instead, which are boosted tremendously by this patch.
A Curse will still drain a Vaga.
Why?
The Recon Ships skill increases the amount of cap drained by a neutraliser by 20% per level. But it doesn't increase the activation cost. On top of that, the skill for neutralisers reduces their activation cost while keeping the amount drained the same. So you'll be draining far more cap from your enemy than it costs you to activate a neutraliser.
Additionally, the Curse has a higher base cap - 1250 against 1062 for the Vaga. So he'll be running out of cap long before you.
With the Curse bonuses to Nos range, tracking disruptors, and drones, you'll be able to run rings around him as long as you can get him within warp disrupting range.
Yes but that requires intellegence, something the FOTM huggers are lacking.
EDIT: Having been on the test server, I can say that the Curse is fine after these changes.
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Rodj Blake
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2007.07.31 10:25:00 -
[38]
Originally by: N1fty
Yes but that requires intellegence, something the FOTM huggers are lacking.
More kills for the rest of us then
Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori. |
Xequecal
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Posted - 2007.07.31 10:30:00 -
[39]
You could always just tracking disrupt the Vagabond and ignore it. A single TD on a Curse reduces tracking 70% with max skills, that will force the Vaga to slow down to a speed where it is easily killed if it wants to hit anything.
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N1fty
Amarr Galactic Shipyards Inc HUZZAH FEDERATION
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Posted - 2007.07.31 10:58:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Xequecal You could always just tracking disrupt the Vagabond and ignore it. A single TD on a Curse reduces tracking 70% with max skills, that will force the Vaga to slow down to a speed where it is easily killed if it wants to hit anything.
Targeting range on a vaga isnt too hot either [50k Base], I reckon a couple of Damps combined with Tracking disrupters will force him to come closer or warp away.
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djenghis jan
Amarr Debiloff's Vanguard
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Posted - 2007.07.31 11:21:00 -
[41]
If the cap of the curse drains, its not only the mwd that shuts off, but also the disruptor, the target might cancel his rep and warp off asap?
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N1fty
Amarr Galactic Shipyards Inc HUZZAH FEDERATION
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Posted - 2007.07.31 11:25:00 -
[42]
Originally by: djenghis jan If the cap of the curse drains, its not only the mwd that shuts off, but also the disruptor, the target might cancel his rep and warp off asap?
Not if you switch your MWD off before you hit 0%
On the test server I found nossing to start with and then waiting for my cap to drop to 40% [so his cap will also be at 40%] then using a neut to knock out the enemy cap before mine dropped below 30% worked very well.
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djenghis jan
Amarr Debiloff's Vanguard
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Posted - 2007.07.31 11:37:00 -
[43]
by the way, i have recon V and have fitted a heavy nos on on the curse using two rigs and a few rcu II's. That gives you a range of 75 km. Not really that useful but funny as hell :-)
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N1fty
Amarr Galactic Shipyards Inc HUZZAH FEDERATION
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Posted - 2007.07.31 11:41:00 -
[44]
Originally by: djenghis jan by the way, i have recon V and have fitted a heavy nos on on the curse using two rigs and a few rcu II's. That gives you a range of 75 km. Not really that useful but funny as hell :-)
I think its every Curse pilots first instinct to fit a Heavy NOS just for kicks and giggles. It might even be a semi-valid tactic in specific situations. What those situations would be eludes me at the moment though!
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djenghis jan
Amarr Debiloff's Vanguard
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Posted - 2007.07.31 12:05:00 -
[45]
Yeah its endles fun, it reminds me of the time that you could fit a torp on a sacriledge and use it as a divebommer because the torps would do 700 m/s. That was cool too
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Aramendel
Amarr Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.07.31 12:13:00 -
[46]
Edited by: Aramendel on 31/07/2007 12:13:14
Originally by: N1fty On the test server I found nossing to start with and then waiting for my cap to drop to 40% [so his cap will also be at 40%] then using a neut to knock out the enemy cap before mine dropped below 30% worked very well.
Works only vs small targets. Battleships and even BCs have some much more base cap than the curse/pilgrim that you need to use around the same or more % of your cap to kill the same % cap of your target.
For example:
Curse base cap 1250, harbing base cap 3125. This means the harb has 2.5 more cap than the curse. With maxxed recon & energy emission skills the best named neut kills 3.2 cap for every cap invested. This means if you use neuts and drain your cap from 40% to 30% you will drain its cap from 40% to 27.2%. Yay.
Or, with a geddon its 1250 vs 5312. Meaning it has 4.25 more cap. Meaning if you drain your cap from 40% to 30% with neuts you have drained his cap from 40% to 32.5%.
Solo the neut draining tactic do not really work. You can try to fuel them with a cap injector, but your target can use one to counter that, too, so its no real solution. You need a target to nos and another to neut for it to be effective.
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Xequecal
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Posted - 2007.07.31 12:30:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Aramendel Edited by: Aramendel on 31/07/2007 12:13:14
Originally by: N1fty On the test server I found nossing to start with and then waiting for my cap to drop to 40% [so his cap will also be at 40%] then using a neut to knock out the enemy cap before mine dropped below 30% worked very well.
Works only vs small targets. Battleships and even BCs have some much more base cap than the curse/pilgrim that you need to use around the same or more % of your cap to kill the same % cap of your target.
For example:
Curse base cap 1250, harbing base cap 3125. This means the harb has 2.5 more cap than the curse. With maxxed recon & energy emission skills the best named neut kills 3.2 cap for every cap invested. This means if you use neuts and drain your cap from 40% to 30% you will drain its cap from 40% to 27.2%. Yay.
Or, with a geddon its 1250 vs 5312. Meaning it has 4.25 more cap. Meaning if you drain your cap from 40% to 30% with neuts you have drained his cap from 40% to 32.5%.
Solo the neut draining tactic do not really work. You can try to fuel them with a cap injector, but your target can use one to counter that, too, so its no real solution. You need a target to nos and another to neut for it to be effective.
If you sit at 25% cap, just enough to fuel disruptor and damps, you can theoretically kill your target. They won't be able to out-rep/boost your drones when their maximum cap level is 25%, it just won't recharge fast enough. They boost once and they'll be at 10-15%.
The problem is they can just MWD away from you and you can't do anything about it.
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WildSide
Infinitus Odium The Church.
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Posted - 2007.07.31 12:32:00 -
[48]
Edited by: WildSide on 31/07/2007 12:32:28 good luck killing ravens and other missiles ship then. and good luck killing any decent drone ships. the only way I see the curse able to solo any of those is with damps...but damps recuire lots of cap. and u cant fit enough damps on a pilgrim as far as I know.
so either way I think u bether fit a cap injector or something.
buuuut...I dont fly amarr anyway...so know Im not thaaaaat afraid of enganging curses anymore in my ishtar.
Vids produced by me
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Rodj Blake
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2007.07.31 12:35:00 -
[49]
Originally by: WildSide Edited by: WildSide on 31/07/2007 12:32:28 good luck killing ravens and other missiles ship then.
As a matter of interest, how many of the other recon ships can solo-kill a Raven?
Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori. |
Feirik
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Posted - 2007.07.31 12:48:00 -
[50]
Have anyone of you figgured that the curse might not have to fit damps?
Curse needs cap for its neut/nos, thats it, damps and scrambs are just bonuses... it does what it do very well still, suck you dry. Meanest curse after the patch is a curse with 0 cap, ready to nos and neut the cap it nosses from you.
When you neut a BS with your curse as said in the OP, I think your own little recharge + the recharge you can nos from the BS will be enough to run the scramb, just not alot of damps or other ewar if you want to competly screw over another player's cap.
The day of mwding around in a curse getting cap on autopilot is over, you gotta use your brain now. Atleast I think I know how do go past these changes, but it will weaken the curse setup a little.
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Aramendel
Amarr Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.07.31 13:19:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Xequecal If you sit at 25% cap, just enough to fuel disruptor and damps, you can theoretically kill your target. They won't be able to out-rep/boost your drones when their maximum cap level is 25%, it just won't recharge fast enough. They boost once and they'll be at 10-15%.
The problem is they can just MWD away from you and you can't do anything about it.
And you have some problems if you get drone aggro. But, yes, a curse will be still workable.
The real problem is the pilgrim. It cannot use disableing EW like the curse and will have to tank at least some of the dps of its target. It cannot do that + ew + tackling and does not have the HP buffer to outlast anything but cruisers.
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Rennard
Aku Soku Zan
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Posted - 2007.07.31 13:37:00 -
[52]
Originally by: Arkios Odymei
Pilgrim: I run a Single rep + Plate setup with 2 Nos and 1 Neut.Due to the new Mechanics of Nos, I will probably Replace the plate with a second Rep, which will both Increase my own cap usage and Nos effectiveness.
I am a master pilgrim pilot and for last 1.5 years I only used pilgrim and nothing else, so trust me:
* If you take out plate and put a second repper, you'll become a paper ship and your 2000 armor will not be enough. With rep implant best time you can get it 8.50s on medium reppers. Considering you have 2x 15% repair amount rig, 2 repairers will never save you from anything. I don't even mention vs multiple enemies, in that case you'll die in an instant.
* You cannot take dominix in a million years, unless you use faction reppers or his drone skills are crap. Same goes with 1600mm fitted ishtar.
and yes I also use 1x neutralizer, 2x Nos setup and my recon ships 5. This patch will hurt us really bad. Beside everything, the nos amount bonus will be an absurd bonus which is useless.
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Rodj Blake
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2007.07.31 13:39:00 -
[53]
Originally by: Rennard
* You cannot take dominix in a million years, unless you use faction reppers or his drone skills are crap.
Name one other recon ship that can solo-kill a Dominix.
Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori. |
Aramendel
Amarr Coreli Corporation Corelum Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.07.31 13:46:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Rodj Blake Name one other recon ship that can solo-kill a Dominix.
Nano-damp curse ^^
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Rennard
Aku Soku Zan
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Posted - 2007.07.31 13:48:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Aramendel
Originally by: Rodj Blake Name one other recon ship that can solo-kill a Dominix.
Nano-damp curse ^^
He is right, I meant my post only for pilgrim.
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Jenna Shame
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Posted - 2007.07.31 22:08:00 -
[56]
Sorry but really a curse/pilgrim is now pretty well useless.
It has no gang uses like a arazu or falcon, and it can't solo for crap now. All this theory craft is fine, but this level of micromanaging is just not going to work in real pvp. You are far better off being in a vaga or sabre.
EOG for the curse really, as it was I never had much of an issue with them myself as I wasn't stupid enough to get caught in belts and it couldn't dps enough to stop me from getting to a gate.
I did train one for fun, and now thats a good deal down the drain.
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MOCC3
Labteck Corporation LTD. Libertas Fidelitas
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Posted - 2007.07.31 22:26:00 -
[57]
I say yes! Guess people forgot Neuts have a good boni and the Curse/Pilgram.. Cuz Neuts+Nos= Dead cap or target ship. The NOS fix makes things better in EVE if ask me. Now if the give the Curse a HAM/Hvy missile boni the would be just gravy.
THE AMMAR RECON SHIPS LIVES STRONG.
Arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr 0.0 Bring frends and alot of money (I love E-bay buyers) --NOT-- |
WildSide
Infinitus Odium The Church.
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Posted - 2007.07.31 22:41:00 -
[58]
Edited by: WildSide on 31/07/2007 22:42:00
Originally by: Rodj Blake
Originally by: WildSide Edited by: WildSide on 31/07/2007 12:32:28 good luck killing ravens and other missiles ship then.
As a matter of interest, how many of the other recon ships can solo-kill a Raven?
unless it got a crap tank or tanking npcs...I cant kill a raven solo in my arazu..even with max skills. But I can atleast hold it down for as long as I want untill I get backup or get my alt on him;) unlike the curse I can damp him down to 4.5km lock range and keep him scrammed forever. even if hes 50km away:p but maybe a curse can do the same with some damp rigs and cap relay in its low slots.
but the pilgrim...I cant see much of use for it...besides enganging t1 cruisers and such. its not a bether tacler than any of its counterpart besides falcon.
Vids produced by me
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Nicholas DW
Valiant Logistics Inc.
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Posted - 2007.07.31 23:02:00 -
[59]
If you're out of heavy NOS range like you say "I orbit at 27km (faction disruptor)" why do you fear NOS Domis? If it's not the heavy NOS that you fear about Domis then how does this nerf effect whether you fear them?
Passive Drakes are still the same after the nerf as well so... I don't know why you even made this post, the nerf doesn't seem to effect you at all. Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed dimensions of 400x120 pixels -Shufo ([email protected]) |
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