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d026
THE LEGION OF STEEL WARRIORS.... R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.09.25 08:01:00 -
[1501]
Originally by: Goumindong Lets put it this way. when the muninn first shoots, the Eagle will have already dont more damage than the Muninns first volley.
do you ever shoot or just loading ammo ?
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MailFan
Stormlord Battleforce Dark Matter Coalition
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Posted - 2007.09.25 08:16:00 -
[1502]
Edited by: MailFan on 25/09/2007 08:16:20
Originally by: d026
Originally by: Goumindong Lets put it this way. when the muninn first shoots, the Eagle will have already dont more damage than the Muninns first volley.
do you ever shoot or just loading ammo ?
Yea I have no idea what he's on about either. But that's probably because we're mentally disabled and god damn liars --
I'm in this mood because of scorn. I'm in a mood for total war
Boost the Eagle |
Goumindong
Amarr Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.09.25 08:59:00 -
[1503]
Edited by: Goumindong on 25/09/2007 08:59:47
Originally by: MailFan Edited by: MailFan on 25/09/2007 08:12:14
Originally by: Goumindong
No, it requires best navy ammo. Which is readily available.
Also, a Muninn cannot alpha cruisers. I just showed you, how a Muninn would never catch up in DPS against a HAC. HACs have on average more hit points than cruisers. This means that the extra damage the Muninn does while the eagle is changing ammo is more important. Lets put it this way. when the muninn first shoots, the Eagle will have already dont more damage than the Muninns first volley.
So you're saying the Muninn is better of sticking to its ammo instead of switching it?
Yes. Which means that the Muninn doesnt out-dps the Eagle that fits for the shorter range.
You will say "ahh, but the Eagle has to change ammos" and i will reply that "no, it does not and i have already outlined times in which loading the 100km ammo is more advantagious than loading the 180km ammo. If you have loaded 180km ammo it may or may not be advantagious to change[probably is for the eagle, since it gains so much more DPS in the change than the muninn does]. But that is the tradeoff you experience for fitting the long range ammo and extracting the advantage from that.
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Larshus Magrus
Elite Storm Enterprises Storm Armada
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Posted - 2007.09.25 13:04:00 -
[1504]
Add a 5th turret slot. :)
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KD.Fluffy
The Refugees
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Posted - 2007.09.25 16:03:00 -
[1505]
Quote: Also, a Muninn cannot alpha cruisers. I just showed you, how a Muninn would never catch up in DPS against a HAC. HACs have on average more hit points than cruisers. This means that the extra damage the Muninn does while the eagle is changing ammo is more important. Lets put it this way. when the muninn first shoots, the Eagle will have already dont more damage than the Muninns first volley.
the muninn CAN alpha cruisers though sheesh. Who says the muninn is required to switch ammo before it shoots cruisers? It may have t2 ammo loaded to start with....... lol. Boost The Eagle! |
Elmicker
Black Sea Industries Cult of War
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Posted - 2007.09.25 16:07:00 -
[1506]
Originally by: KD.Fluffy the muninn CAN alpha cruisers though sheesh. Who says the muninn is required to switch ammo before it shoots cruisers? It may have t2 ammo loaded to start with....... lol.
Alpha with max skills and RF EMP is a little under 2300. Base effective HP with 0 fitting and 0 skills on a rupture is over 6,000.
Stop posting ****e.
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Yuki Li
Caldari Omerta Syndicate Exuro Mortis
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Posted - 2007.09.25 16:19:00 -
[1507]
This has been thus far an incredibly stupid argument, fought mainly with moot points and statistics that really don't matter.
While the Eagle holds a very specific role, and performs quite well at it, what does it have over say, a Muninn in a fleet battle.
Range, and range only.
The Muninn has over twice the volley damage (while, while targetting light ships is important - it's the difference between a warp-out and a kill) and the Muninn does more DPS, even with 2x Assault Launcher IIs factored in on the Eagle's side.
This is with both ships fitting 3 damage mods.
The real surprise here, though, is that if you fit the same tracking mods on both ships, 720mm's have a higher tracking speed than 250mm's do. Now, this is a somewhat unrealistic scenario due to the slot layout on either ship, but the fact is there - Artillery tracks better.
In actual practice, the Muninn is more likely to rely on Enhancers than Computers due to a lack of Medslots, and thus will have a slightly lower tracking speed.
What this says to me, is that the ridiculous tanking Eagle idea is a complete joke (No offense but just... no). 250mm Railguns have awful tracking, fact. If you're not balancing that with Tracking Computers then you're flying a waste of time.
While, as I said, I think most of the arguments that are pro-Eagle so far have been very weak, I think it would benefit from at least one more turret (I'd like 2, because I have an Eagle, but I think that's unlikely ).
Currently the DPS is under-par, even for a Sniper, and it's only advantage over anything is Range, pure and simple.
You see alot of Eagle's in BoB fleets, there's all kinds of influencing factors there, and you have to consider even the social factors. Flying an Eagle in a BoB fleet is a killmail *****'s dream (trust me, I used to fly an Eagle in a BoB fleet ). You get on just about every killmail that ever occurs, because you have a ridiculous lockrange, lockspeed and weapon range. It's also fun to pilot in that scenario.
The lack of Muninn's in the same boat I think is mainly down to... Why would a Minmatar HAC capable character get a Muninn over a Vagabond? Whereas there are plenty of reasons to get an Eagle over a Cerberus (I'll save my opinion of the Cerberus for another thread, but to summarise, It's bloody useless).
I think the fact that the Vulture has been dragged kicking and screaming into the discussion also, highlights that the problem is less the ships, and more the guns, imho. You might say, boost 250mm Railguns, instead, if you're worried about turning the Eagle into a potential blaster-rape-boat with 5 guns.
Anyway, that's my two, I'm done rambling now.
Website Recruiting |
KD.Fluffy
The Refugees
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Posted - 2007.09.25 17:02:00 -
[1508]
Quote: Alpha with max skills and RF EMP is a little under 2300. Base effective HP with 0 fitting and 0 skills on a rupture is over 6,000.
Stop posting ****e.
I never said insta pop, i just said a much more effective alpha. At sniping ranges the muninn's alpha is over double the eagles. That has to count for something. Boost The Eagle! |
Elmicker
Black Sea Industries Cult of War
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Posted - 2007.09.25 17:53:00 -
[1509]
Originally by: KD.Fluffy I never said insta pop, i just said a much more effective alpha.
Originally by: KD.Fluffy the muninn CAN alpha cruisers though sheesh....
Again, i ask you to stop posting ****e. I don't see the word "effectively" there. All i say is you saying a muninn can alpha cruisers. To alpha something is to kill it with your alpha strike. Mk?
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KD.Fluffy
The Refugees
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Posted - 2007.09.25 19:19:00 -
[1510]
Quote: Again, i ask you to stop posting ****e. I don't see the word "effectively" there. All i say is you saying a muninn can alpha cruisers. To alpha something is to kill it with your alpha strike. Mk?
so your telling me the alpha advantage the muninn gets is useless and has no bearing on game balance? Boost The Eagle! |
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Goumindong
Amarr Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.09.25 19:36:00 -
[1511]
Originally by: KD.Fluffy
Quote: Alpha with max skills and RF EMP is a little under 2300. Base effective HP with 0 fitting and 0 skills on a rupture is over 6,000.
Stop posting ****e.
I never said insta pop, i just said a much more effective alpha. At sniping ranges the muninn's alpha is over double the eagles. That has to count for something.
Not when it has to change ammo to get the 1500 alpha, since it loses nearly 2000 damage in that time to the eagle. It does when it doesnt change ammo, but by that point the dps has probably come to about even, though i wont say it has no effect.
Comparing it in the short range is a bit iffy, since in the short range you expect ships to both have more hit points and to be more resiliant. As well you need speed more than range. Doing a big volley with Fusion/emp isnt usefull in fleets because you pretty much wont ever catch a cruiser there.[Also, damage types on EMP]
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Goumindong
Amarr Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.09.25 19:37:00 -
[1512]
Originally by: Yuki Li
What this says to me, is that the ridiculous tanking Eagle idea is a complete joke (No offense but just... no). 250mm Railguns have awful tracking, fact. If you're not balancing that with Tracking Computers then you're flying a waste of time.
Dont fit tech 2 ammo and complain about your tracking, you track just fine with tech 1/faction ammo. You track as well or better than a Zealot and Muninn, the two highest tracking ships in the cruiser class aside from terribly fit Harbingers which dont have the range to hit things usefully
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KD.Fluffy
The Refugees
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Posted - 2007.09.25 19:48:00 -
[1513]
Quote: Not when it has to change ammo to get the 1500 alpha, since it loses nearly 2000 damage in that time to the eagle. It does when it doesnt change ammo, but by that point the dps has probably come to about even, though i wont say it has no effect.
Comparing it in the short range is a bit iffy, since in the short range you expect ships to both have more hit points and to be more resiliant. As well you need speed more than range. Doing a big volley with Fusion/emp isnt usefull in fleets because you pretty much wont ever catch a cruiser there.[Also, damage types on EMP]
yeah but who says your going to be changing ammo? If eagle has spike loaded and enemy is 100km away it will run into the same problem. So that argument trying to discount the alpha edge the muninn has doenst relaly hold up. ITs still a clear advantage the muninn has over the eagle. Boost The Eagle! |
Goumindong
Amarr Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.09.25 20:00:00 -
[1514]
Originally by: KD.Fluffy
Quote: Not when it has to change ammo to get the 1500 alpha, since it loses nearly 2000 damage in that time to the eagle. It does when it doesnt change ammo, but by that point the dps has probably come to about even, though i wont say it has no effect.
Comparing it in the short range is a bit iffy, since in the short range you expect ships to both have more hit points and to be more resiliant. As well you need speed more than range. Doing a big volley with Fusion/emp isnt usefull in fleets because you pretty much wont ever catch a cruiser there.[Also, damage types on EMP]
yeah but who says your going to be changing ammo? If eagle has spike loaded and enemy is 100km away it will run into the same problem. So that argument trying to discount the alpha edge the muninn has doenst relaly hold up. ITs still a clear advantage the muninn has over the eagle.
The eagle shouldnt have spike loaded. And yea, if the eagle has long range ammo loaded and needs to change it will suffer a 10 second penalty compared to the Muninn.
Anyway, i have layed out situations where its advantagious for the eagle to enter the fight with Thorium loaded. The same doesnt exist of the Muninn since it shold have that range of ammo loaded initially.
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Yuki Li
Caldari Omerta Syndicate Exuro Mortis
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Posted - 2007.09.25 20:12:00 -
[1515]
Originally by: Goumindong
Dont fit tech 2 ammo and complain about your tracking,
Seen as you took the time to highlight all this in bold just for me, I'm going to take the time to make you look stupid. None of my calculations are using T2 Ammo, and nowhere above did I mention T2 ammo, please don't put words in my mouth.
Originally by: Goumindong
You track as well or better than a Zealot
Is that so? Okay, lets look at the stats shall we?
Without factoring in any tracking mods, if we fit a Heavy Beam Laser II on a Zealot, and a 250mm Railgun II on an Eagle, lets see what our tracking is.
This is with max gunnery support skills.
Neither of these ships have a tracking bonus.
250mm Railgun II with Antimatter Charge M loaded :- 0.02875 Heavy Beam Laser II with Multifrequency M loaded :- 0.04125
As you can see, there's a considerable difference in tracking, the Heavy Beam II tracks alot better than the railgun does. But we're not finished yet!
Originally by: Goumindong
and Muninn
Now this is the really entertaining one. Maybe you'd be right, if the Muninn didn't have a tracking bonus.
250mm Railgun II with Antimatter Charge M loaded :- 0.02875 720mm Howitzer II with EMP M loaded :- 0.03575
When fitted to the Muninn, even a 720mm Howitzer II tracks better than a 250 rail on an Eagle does! From this I conclude that everything you've come out with on this thread is baseless and you're simply spitting out assumptions.
You might have been right had you said "Artillery tracks worse than Railguns!", because it does! Let's compare stats without any bonuses at all, just for educations sake.
With skills factored in, but no ship bonuses, the three long range weapon stats are as follows:
250mm Railgun II with Antimatter Charge M loaded :- 0.02875 Heavy Beam Laser II with Multifrequency M loaded :- 0.04125 720mm Howitzer II with EMP M loaded :- 0.0275
So, when not strapped to a Muninn, the 720mm Howtizer II does track SLIGHTLY worse than a 250mm Railgun II.
Using T2 ammo as a scapegoat is also an entirely invalid argument, as all T2 weapon variants have poorer tracking when loaded with T2 ammo.
Nice try. Next time please take fact into consideration before you insist you're correct.
Stats taken from Eve Fitting Tool.
Website Recruiting |
KD.Fluffy
The Refugees
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Posted - 2007.09.25 20:14:00 -
[1516]
Quote: The eagle shouldnt have spike loaded. And yea, if the eagle has long range ammo loaded and needs to change it will suffer a 10 second penalty compared to the Muninn.
Anyway, i have layed out situations where its advantagious for the eagle to enter the fight with Thorium loaded. The same doesnt exist of the Muninn since it shold have that range of ammo loaded initially.
and there are situations where a muninn will enter the fight with t2 ammo loaded........... I promise the ammo exists. Boost The Eagle! |
Goumindong
Amarr Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.09.25 21:37:00 -
[1517]
Originally by: Yuki Li
Tracking
Protip: Fit tracking modules on to your snipers
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MailFan
Stormlord Battleforce Dark Matter Coalition
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Posted - 2007.09.25 21:49:00 -
[1518]
Originally by: Goumindong
The eagle shouldnt have spike loaded. And yea, if the eagle has long range ammo loaded and needs to change it will suffer a 10 second penalty compared to the Muninn.
Anyway, i have layed out situations where its advantagious for the eagle to enter the fight with Thorium loaded. The same doesnt exist of the Muninn since it shold have that range of ammo loaded initially.
Just for the record. A thorium fitted Eagle vs a Carbonized Lead fitted Muninn means:
- Almost same firing range for both ships (slight advantage for Muninn) - 2dps more for the Eagle - 2x bigger Alpha for the Muninn - Over 10% better tracking for the Muninn --
I'm in this mood because of scorn. I'm in a mood for total war
Boost the Eagle |
KD.Fluffy
The Refugees
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Posted - 2007.09.25 22:01:00 -
[1519]
Quote: Originally by: Goumindong The eagle shouldnt have spike loaded. And yea, if the eagle has long range ammo loaded and needs to change it will suffer a 10 second penalty compared to the Muninn.
Anyway, i have layed out situations where its advantagious for the eagle to enter the fight with Thorium loaded. The same doesnt exist of the Muninn since it shold have that range of ammo loaded initially.
Just for the record. A thorium fitted Eagle vs a Carbonized Lead fitted Muninn means:
- Almost same firing range for both ships (slight advantage for Muninn) - 2dps more for the Eagle - 2x bigger Alpha for the Muninn - Over 10% better tracking for the Muninn --
which just goes to show how badly the eagle is outperformed... Then when you factor the drone bay in too it starts to look really bad. Boost The Eagle! |
Ferocious FeAr
Eternity INC. Mercenary Coalition
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Posted - 2007.09.25 22:21:00 -
[1520]
If Eagle somehow gets a 5th slot that would require the vulture to get a 6th, otherwise there is no point in upgrading.
Don't hate me, learn to love me |
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Goumindong
Amarr Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.09.25 22:23:00 -
[1521]
Originally by: MailFan
Originally by: Goumindong
The eagle shouldnt have spike loaded. And yea, if the eagle has long range ammo loaded and needs to change it will suffer a 10 second penalty compared to the Muninn.
Anyway, i have layed out situations where its advantagious for the eagle to enter the fight with Thorium loaded. The same doesnt exist of the Muninn since it shold have that range of ammo loaded initially.
Just for the record. A thorium fitted Eagle vs a Carbonized Lead fitted Muninn means:
- Almost same firing range for both ships (slight advantage for Muninn) - 2dps more for the Eagle - 2x bigger Alpha for the Muninn - Over 10% better tracking for the Muninn
No, only when you overfit the Muninn compared to the Eagle. At HAC 4 the Eagle actually will track better, and the Muninn will track 1.8% better than the Eagle when fit similarly. As well either the Eagle gets more DPS on top of that[4th damage mod] or the more likly damage control for more hit points.[206 dps, or 197@ hac4]
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Zixxa
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Posted - 2007.09.25 23:24:00 -
[1522]
Originally by: Goumindong Man what? The Zealot does less dps at its optimal range than the Eagle does. How in the world is that "cutting through enemy fleets with striking ease"?
You lie. Zealot does more damage. --------------------------------- "Zealot is sniper, because Dominix has better tank" (c) Goumindong
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Zixxa
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Posted - 2007.09.25 23:25:00 -
[1523]
Originally by: Goumindong
Originally by: MailFan
Originally by: Goumindong
The eagle shouldnt have spike loaded. And yea, if the eagle has long range ammo loaded and needs to change it will suffer a 10 second penalty compared to the Muninn.
Anyway, i have layed out situations where its advantagious for the eagle to enter the fight with Thorium loaded. The same doesnt exist of the Muninn since it shold have that range of ammo loaded initially.
Just for the record. A thorium fitted Eagle vs a Carbonized Lead fitted Muninn means:
- Almost same firing range for both ships (slight advantage for Muninn) - 2dps more for the Eagle - 2x bigger Alpha for the Muninn - Over 10% better tracking for the Muninn
No, only when you overfit the Muninn compared to the Eagle. At HAC 4 the Eagle actually will track better, and the Muninn will track 1.8% better than the Eagle when fit similarly. As well either the Eagle gets more DPS on top of that[4th damage mod] or the more likly damage control for more hit points.[206 dps, or 197@ hac4]
you lie, you do not need to overfit Munnin to make them better than Eagle --------------------------------- "Zealot is sniper, because Dominix has better tank" (c) Goumindong
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Elmicker
Black Sea Industries Cult of War
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Posted - 2007.09.25 23:34:00 -
[1524]
Originally by: Zixxa you lie, you do not need to overfit Munnin to make them better than Eagle
Comparably, the munnin is overfit. The comparison made required max skills, and lacked several essential modules that the eagle had, which could have dropped to improve performance.
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Yuki Li
Caldari Omerta Syndicate Exuro Mortis
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Posted - 2007.09.26 01:03:00 -
[1525]
Originally by: Goumindong
Originally by: Yuki Li
Tracking
Protip: Fit tracking modules on to your snipers
Nice attempted out on what was posted as a fair comparison between weapon types. You said the Eagle tracks better than the Muninn and Zealot, which is utter trash.
Also, the part of my original post you quoted that prompted this comparison, was addressing the poor concept of an Eagle with a tank in its medslots.
Don't try and dodge the issue because you completely failed to utilize any actual facts in your previous post.
You're trashtalking to push your opinion, not arguing any actual point.
Website Recruiting |
Goumindong
Amarr Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.09.26 01:36:00 -
[1526]
Edited by: Goumindong on 26/09/2007 01:38:29
Originally by: Yuki Li
Originally by: Goumindong
Originally by: Yuki Li
Tracking
Protip: Fit tracking modules on to your snipers
Nice attempted out on what was posted as a fair comparison between weapon types. You said the Eagle tracks better than the Muninn and Zealot, which is utter trash.
Also, the part of my original post you quoted that prompted this comparison, was addressing the poor concept of an Eagle with a tank in its medslots.
Don't try and dodge the issue because you completely failed to utilize any actual facts in your previous post.
You're trashtalking to push your opinion, not arguing any actual point.
HAC 5 Tracking: Muninn Tracking: .0561 Eagle Tracking: .05519 Zealot Trackin: .05155
Now you could probably get the Zealot a bit higher with a tracking computer, and it isnt rigged whereas the Muninn and Eagle in this description are. However, if you unrig the Muninn and the Eagle, they both track around .49 with the eagle a bit higher. And frankly i have never seen a rigged Zealot for fleet warefare.[Or eagle or Muninn for that matter, though the Muninn gains the most out of the rigging, the eagle still remains on top]
ed: The Zealot does hit .612 with a TC and two rigs, but its still down at 177 dps[with 4 heat sinks, compared to 206 from the Eagle at the same range in the same fitting config]
So, i repeat fit tracking modules onto your snipers
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Yuki Li
Caldari Omerta Syndicate Exuro Mortis
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Posted - 2007.09.26 03:28:00 -
[1527]
Originally by: Goumindong Edited by: Goumindong on 26/09/2007 01:38:29
Originally by: Yuki Li
Originally by: Goumindong
Originally by: Yuki Li
Tracking
Protip: Fit tracking modules on to your snipers
Nice attempted out on what was posted as a fair comparison between weapon types. You said the Eagle tracks better than the Muninn and Zealot, which is utter trash.
Also, the part of my original post you quoted that prompted this comparison, was addressing the poor concept of an Eagle with a tank in its medslots.
Don't try and dodge the issue because you completely failed to utilize any actual facts in your previous post.
You're trashtalking to push your opinion, not arguing any actual point.
HAC 5 Tracking: Muninn Tracking: .0561 Eagle Tracking: .05519 Zealot Trackin: .05155
Now you could probably get the Zealot a bit higher with a tracking computer, and it isnt rigged whereas the Muninn and Eagle in this description are. However, if you unrig the Muninn and the Eagle, they both track around .49 with the eagle a bit higher. And frankly i have never seen a rigged Zealot for fleet warefare.[Or eagle or Muninn for that matter, though the Muninn gains the most out of the rigging, the eagle still remains on top]
ed: The Zealot does hit .612 with a TC and two rigs, but its still down at 177 dps[with 4 heat sinks, compared to 206 from the Eagle at the same range in the same fitting config]
So, i repeat fit tracking modules onto your snipers
lol, where are you getting these figures?
Lets try it with tracking mods, seen as you seem to think that me comparing the weapons WITHOUT tracking mods is going to make any difference whatsoever to the result WITH tracking mods.
The only possible deviation you could ever hope for would come from differing slot layouts, but I'm going to try to keep the quantity of tracking mods as balanced as possible.
My actual fleet fits would vary slightly, as I'd fit a Microwarpdrive, however, in the interest of a fair test as far as tracking is concerned, I want to keep the quantity of tracking mods equal across ships. This puts the Eagle at an advantage, due to medslots. TCs > TEs for tracking.
So please take into account that the Eagle has an edge over the other ships.
All of these stats use HAC level 4.
Eagle 4x 250mm Railgun II 2x Assault Missile Launcher II
1x Y-S8 AB 2x Sensor Booster II 2x Tracking Computer II
3x MFS II 1x Tracking Enhancer II
250mm Railgun II tracking speed: 0.04967
Muninn
5x 720mm Howitzer II 2x Assault Missile Launcher II
2x Sensor Booster II 1x Tracking Computer II
2x Tracking Enhancer II 3x Gyrostabilizer II
720mm Howitzer II Tracking Speed: 0.05304
And finally the Zealot, you'll have to bear with me if the fit seems off, I don't fly Zealots and I'm just looking for the stats with a similar fit.
Zealot
4x Heavy Beam Laser II
2x Sensor Booster II 1x Tracking Computer II
2x Tracking Enhancer II 3x Heat Sink II 1x Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II 1x Medium Armor Repairer II
Heavy Beam Laser II Tracking Speed: 0.0612
So to summarise, each ship has 3 tracking mods, 2 sensor boosters, and 3 damage mods. Those are constants throughout.
Summary:
250mm Railgun II tracking speed: 0.04967 (2x Tracking Computer II 1x Tracking Enhancer II) 720mm Howitzer II Tracking Speed: 0.05304 (1x Tracking Computer II 2x Tracking Enhancer II) Heavy Beam Laser II Tracking Speed: 0.0612 (1x Tracking Computer II 2x Tracking Enhancer II)
Now, considering the only one of the three that gets a tracking bonus is the Muninn, I don't know where you're getting information that the Eagle has better tracking than the other two.
Unless you're intentionally fitting less tracking mods to the others, and then trying to call that a balanced comparison, I have no idea where you're getting your figures from.
Website Recruiting |
Elenath
Gallente Aliastra
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Posted - 2007.09.26 05:59:00 -
[1528]
Edited by: Elenath on 26/09/2007 06:01:03
Originally by: Yuki Li lol, where are you getting these figures?
Lets try it with tracking mods, seen as you seem to think that me comparing the weapons WITHOUT tracking mods is going to make any difference whatsoever to the result WITH tracking mods.
The only possible deviation you could ever hope for would come from differing slot layouts, but I'm going to try to keep the quantity of tracking mods as balanced as possible.
My actual fleet fits would vary slightly, as I'd fit a Microwarpdrive, however, in the interest of a fair test as far as tracking is concerned, I want to keep the quantity of tracking mods equal across ships. This puts the Eagle at an advantage, due to medslots. TCs > TEs for tracking.
So please take into account that the Eagle has an edge over the other ships.
All of these stats use HAC level 4.
Eagle 4x 250mm Railgun II 2x Assault Missile Launcher II
1x Y-S8 AB 2x Sensor Booster II 2x Tracking Computer II
3x MFS II 1x Tracking Enhancer II
250mm Railgun II tracking speed: 0.04967
Muninn
5x 720mm Howitzer II 2x Assault Missile Launcher II
2x Sensor Booster II 1x Tracking Computer II
2x Tracking Enhancer II 3x Gyrostabilizer II
720mm Howitzer II Tracking Speed: 0.05304
And finally the Zealot, you'll have to bear with me if the fit seems off, I don't fly Zealots and I'm just looking for the stats with a similar fit.
Zealot
4x Heavy Beam Laser II
2x Sensor Booster II 1x Tracking Computer II
2x Tracking Enhancer II 3x Heat Sink II 1x Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II 1x Medium Armor Repairer II
Heavy Beam Laser II Tracking Speed: 0.0612
So to summarise, each ship has 3 tracking mods, 2 sensor boosters, and 3 damage mods. Those are constants throughout.
Summary:
250mm Railgun II tracking speed: 0.04967 (2x Tracking Computer II 1x Tracking Enhancer II) 720mm Howitzer II Tracking Speed: 0.05304 (1x Tracking Computer II 2x Tracking Enhancer II) Heavy Beam Laser II Tracking Speed: 0.0612 (1x Tracking Computer II 2x Tracking Enhancer II)
Now, considering the only one of the three that gets a tracking bonus is the Muninn, I don't know where you're getting information that the Eagle has better tracking than the other two.
Unless you're intentionally fitting less tracking mods to the others, and then trying to call that a balanced comparison, I have no idea where you're getting your figures from.
Goumindong gets pwned again.
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d026
THE LEGION OF STEEL WARRIORS.... R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.09.26 09:16:00 -
[1529]
Edited by: d026 on 26/09/2007 09:16:15
Originally by: Yuki Li
tracking
he will argue that you cant fit a tracking comp on a muninn because you wold have to sacrifice your mwd:)
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MailFan
Stormlord Battleforce Dark Matter Coalition
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Posted - 2007.09.26 09:37:00 -
[1530]
Originally by: d026
he will argue that you cant fit a tracking comp on a muninn because you wold have to sacrifice your mwd:)
Yep and he will ignore the fact that you can fit 1 sensor booster fine. And if you're still not happy buy a really cheap rig that increases your targetting range. Hell, I would be fitting the rig if I were a Muninn pilot.
Tracking for the Eagle: 0.04967 Tracking for the Muninn: 0.0561 Tracking for the Zealot: 0.06284 (Does do 15 dps less than the Eagle)
13% less tracking for the Eagle compared to the Muninn 26% less tracking for the Eagle compared to the Zealot
Im sorry, what huge advantages did the Eagle have to justify it only being able to fulfill one niche?
It's at least being matched by 'allrounders' and in some cases outperformed.
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I'm in this mood because of scorn. I'm in a mood for total war
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