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uoY delliK
Assassination Delivered
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Posted - 2007.10.04 17:12:00 -
[1]
Hi,
If a player logs out with a aggression timer, it renews. This is intended game mechanics.
From a GM, in response to my petition, that I waited 16 from my last combat action according to my in game log. Started warp to a new safespot I had just made, flashed scanner once for probes (saw none), then logged. Somehow I was probed down, killed and podded. In two years of playing, I've never heard, that an aggression timer renews if you log out... THAT IS INSANE. If anyone else has heard this unbelievable tale, please let me know.
On a side note, is anyone else getting fed up with cookie-cutter petition responses, that never answer your petition issue, and always end in "no"?
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Tar Ecthelion
Kryomek Industries
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Posted - 2007.10.04 17:17:00 -
[2]
no .....
"When you kill a man it costs nothing to be polite" Winston Churchill
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Lebowske
Nosferatu Security Foundation
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Posted - 2007.10.04 17:27:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Lebowske on 04/10/2007 17:27:10 Eh, that cant be right. If you log out *before* the timer runs out, yeah - it may reset. But you logged out *after* the timer ran out - it shouldnt have reset.
Just my 2 isk ... --------------------
- It's better to keep your mouth shut and let people believe you're an idiot, rather than opening it and removing all doubt.
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uoY delliK
Assassination Delivered
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Posted - 2007.10.04 17:39:00 -
[4]
Right, hes saying that my in-game log was incorrect. And I did infact log out with an aggression timer, which then reset to the full 15 minutes... That is mind boggling though, I've played for 2 years, and never heard of a timer reset if you log out mid timer... Its boggling.
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Eulalinda
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.10.04 17:39:00 -
[5]
Originally by: uoY delliK I've never heard, that an aggression timer renews if you log out...
Me neither. Sorry to hear about your loss.
Originally by: uoY delliK On a side note, is anyone else getting fed up with cookie-cutter petition responses, that never answer your petition issue, and always end in "no"?
Yes. It's as if the first response to any petition is merely to discourage you from petitioning at all.
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Detrol
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.10.04 19:16:00 -
[6]
Did you have wrecks lying around in some belts?
What will reset the aggression timer is if someone shoots the wreck you left behind. So 10 mins after you fired your last shot, someone found one of your wrecks, hits it one time and your timer is back to 15 mins. 6 mins later you log off, aggression timer resets and they have 15 minutes to find you.
If you can prove that it happened like that, you can petition it
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uoY delliK
Assassination Delivered
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Posted - 2007.10.04 19:20:00 -
[7]
There was a wreck in a belt, that I had just killed. Its very possible they abused this feature, to keep my ship from logging off. Either way, I'm getting unsatisfactory answers from the GM's... I'd love some sort of official response, as the "if you log out with 15 minute timer, you are susceptable to probes" over and over again isnt helping me in any way.
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Demarcus
Killjoy.
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Posted - 2007.10.04 19:21:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Detrol Did you have wrecks lying around in some belts?
What will reset the aggression timer is if someone shoots the wreck you left behind. So 10 mins after you fired your last shot, someone found one of your wrecks, hits it one time and your timer is back to 15 mins. 6 mins later you log off, aggression timer resets and they have 15 minutes to find you.
If you can prove that it happened like that, you can petition it
That is just really dumb. Kinda like the nos nerf, and a million other things ccp has f*cked up. ------------------------------------- You are all worthless, and weak.
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Captian Internet
Lead Bricks
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Posted - 2007.10.04 19:22:00 -
[9]
Try docking or warping to a pos next time
Changes to Local,War ,Navigation Shortcuts |
Demarcus
Killjoy.
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Posted - 2007.10.04 19:25:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Captian Internet Try docking or warping to a pos next time
That isn't an option a lot of the time. ------------------------------------- You are all worthless, and weak.
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Captian Internet
Lead Bricks
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Posted - 2007.10.04 19:38:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Demarcus
Originally by: Captian Internet Try docking or warping to a pos next time
That isn't an option a lot of the time.
Then accept the consequences?
or perhaps shoot/salvage your wrecks
Changes to Local,War ,Navigation Shortcuts |
Valeo Galaem
New Eden Advanced Reconnaissance Unit
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Posted - 2007.10.04 19:47:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Demarcus
Originally by: Detrol Did you have wrecks lying around in some belts?
What will reset the aggression timer is if someone shoots the wreck you left behind. So 10 mins after you fired your last shot, someone found one of your wrecks, hits it one time and your timer is back to 15 mins. 6 mins later you log off, aggression timer resets and they have 15 minutes to find you.
If you can prove that it happened like that, you can petition it
That is just really dumb. Kinda like the nos nerf, and a million other things ccp has f*cked up.
As far as I know, wreck aggression was fixed in an earlier Revelations patch.
Regarding the OP's issue, be aware that the clock on the client isn't always in sync with the server. I've actually seen two clients on the same computer (both connected to TQ) with clocks off by over a minute.
Best bet is to wait for longer than the 15 minutes next time.
Thar be Pirates
You are not authorised to hack into CONCORD's mainframe Your Wallet has been emptied!
CONCORD Encryption Methods |
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CCP Greyscale
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Posted - 2007.10.04 19:49:00 -
[13]
This particular mechanic has been documented in the knowledgebase for quite some time. Note that the timer updates every time you commit a hostile act against another player or another player commits a hostile act against you.
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benzss
The Knights Of Camelot Praesidium Libertatis
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Posted - 2007.10.04 19:50:00 -
[14]
The aggression timer seems to be broken anyway. The amount of times the criminal countdown has counted down past its 15 minutes, but the sentry guns have STILL shot at me at the gate...
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Tarminic
Black Flame Industries
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Posted - 2007.10.04 19:51:00 -
[15]
Originally by: CCP Greyscale This particular mechanic has been documented in the knowledgebase for quite some time. Note that the timer updates every time you commit a hostile act against another player or another player commits a hostile act against you.
Interesting... ------------ Whiners - Unite! | Posting and You Tarminic - Forum Warfare Specialist. |
uoY delliK
Assassination Delivered
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Posted - 2007.10.04 19:58:00 -
[16]
Originally by: CCP Greyscale This particular mechanic has been documented in the knowledgebase for quite some time. Note that the timer updates every time you commit a hostile act against another player or another player commits a hostile act against you.
While I appreciate your response, it still doesnt address the issue. According to my in-game log, it was 16 minutes, 30 seconds since my last combat action. For those 16 minutes, I was afk at a safespot. I then warped to a planet at 100, making a new bookmark mid-warp. I then started warp, to new safespot. During which time, I scanned for probes, and saw none. About 1/2 way through that warp, I logged off... Assuming, since it'd been nearly 17 or 18 minutes since I'd committed a combat action it would take me to an offgrid safe, and I'd log back in, to my ship. However, I was killed... and podded.
That is my issue... The timer had worn off, without a doubt in my mind.
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FuQue
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Posted - 2007.10.04 19:59:00 -
[17]
Quote: ...or another player commits a hostile act against you.
"well THERE'S your problem."
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uoY delliK
Assassination Delivered
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Posted - 2007.10.04 20:03:00 -
[18]
I interpret that to mean, if they lock and scramble/shoot/EW your ship in some way, it refreshes the timer... Once again, according to my log, the last combat action I committed, and/or was committed against me, was more than 15 minutes before I issued the log off command.
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Wild Rho
Amarr Endgame.
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Posted - 2007.10.04 20:06:00 -
[19]
Not sure if the "shoot wrecks to reset the killers flag" thing still works but that's the only thing I can viable think of. The GM response is just plain wrong which is a little worrying.
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Elmicker
Black Sea Industries Cult of War
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Posted - 2007.10.04 20:07:00 -
[20]
Originally by: uoY delliK the last combat action I committed, and/or was committed against me, was more than 15 minutes before I issued the log off command.
Then you shouldn't have had a timer. Show the GM your logs and poke him to actually check your logs instead of giving you the bog standard copy + paste answer.
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Major Dim
Caldari RUS HOLDING
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Posted - 2007.10.04 20:08:00 -
[21]
U know - the answer might be very easy - there was a covert ops in the system. As soon as u logged he threw a probe and scanned u down in 20 sec - and agressed u so your timer updated to 15 min. then u got killed. Lost a vaga that way a couple of months ago after sitting 25 mins on a ss. after u log u stay for 1 min at your spot - enough time for a good covertops pilot with luck to scan u and get agression
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MotoTsume
Gallente Clan Black Scorpion
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Posted - 2007.10.04 20:12:00 -
[22]
Originally by: CCP Greyscale This particular mechanic has been documented in the knowledgebase for quite some time. Note that the timer updates every time you commit a hostile act against another player or another player commits a hostile act against you.
Ummm going by this Greyscale, if I log out as a Safe Spot with no agression counter but have a wreck or a loot can in a belt, some one can steal from that an i get an agression counter and they can then probe me down - that is the dumbest thing I have ever seen in a game and should be at the top of the list of things CCP should be fixing. ---------- www.mototsume.ca It's just a game........Or is it?
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Mari Onette
Amarr GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.10.04 20:29:00 -
[23]
sounds like a good reason to run away instead of just logging out. --- I am in blood! Stepp'd in so far that, should I wade no more, it would be as tedious as going over. -MacBeth
At 20 dollars a month, Eve costs 2 cents an hour to play. Downtime is cheap. |
Eulalinda
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.10.04 20:37:00 -
[24]
Originally by: uoY delliK
Originally by: CCP Greyscale This particular mechanic has been documented in the knowledgebase for quite some time. Note that the timer updates every time you commit a hostile act against another player or another player commits a hostile act against you.
While I appreciate your response, it still doesnt address the issue.
Exactly! If the facts are as you say, then some mechanic of the game is clearly broken.
Can you post screenshots?
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James Lyrus
Lyrus Associates M. PIRE
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Posted - 2007.10.04 20:42:00 -
[25]
Originally by: MotoTsume
Originally by: CCP Greyscale This particular mechanic has been documented in the knowledgebase for quite some time. Note that the timer updates every time you commit a hostile act against another player or another player commits a hostile act against you.
Ummm going by this Greyscale, if I log out as a Safe Spot with no agression counter but have a wreck or a loot can in a belt, some one can steal from that an i get an agression counter and they can then probe me down - that is the dumbest thing I have ever seen in a game and should be at the top of the list of things CCP should be fixing.
Which is why you should tidy your stuff. Keep down lag, get loot, and don't get ganked when logged. What's not to like? -- Crane needs more grid 249km locking? GMP and TNP |
Taedrin
Gallente Magellan Exploration and Survey Rare Faction
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Posted - 2007.10.04 20:50:00 -
[26]
Your problem is that the client doesn't actually run the game. The client just gives you a graphical representation of the data. The actual EVE universe and game runs on the server. The server's data supersedes all data found on clients. IE, just because your client tells you something, doesn't necessarily mean that that's what the server thinks is happening.
If the client desyncs from the server (IE, the server thinks you have 12 minutes left on your aggression timer, but the client thinks you have 14 minutes left on your aggression timer), weird things can happen. And since the server is the thing which houses the actual universe, it's the server which is right, and your client which is wrong.
Simply put, you should have waited like 5 more minutes, while cycling safe spots.
Or as they say (where I'm from at least), "coulda, shoulda, woulda"
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Arana Tellen
Gallente The Blackguard Wolves Knights Of the Southerncross
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Posted - 2007.10.04 20:52:00 -
[27]
Originally by: benzss The aggression timer seems to be broken anyway. The amount of times the criminal countdown has counted down past its 15 minutes, but the sentry guns have STILL shot at me at the gate...
Guns have their own countdowns, duh ---------------------------------
Core 2 Duo E4300 1.8ghz @ 3ghz, 2GB Gskill DDR2 5400 @ 800mhh 4-4-4-12, Abit fatality mATX F-I90HD @ 334mhz, 8800GTS 320mb 2x250GB 7200.10s Raid 0, Vista 64 Home. |
Buyerr
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Posted - 2007.10.04 21:04:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Eulalinda
Originally by: uoY delliK I've never heard, that an aggression timer renews if you log out...
Me neither. Sorry to hear about your loss.
Originally by: uoY delliK On a side note, is anyone else getting fed up with cookie-cutter petition responses, that never answer your petition issue, and always end in "no"?
Yes. It's as if the first response to any petition is merely to discourage you from petitioning at all.
yup and it works... stopped partitioning anything that i am not 100% sure i get a polite yes from without them having to read it.. since it seems like they don's :S
sorry to hear about your loss, it's BULL**** that you can get probed and killed after logging out or crashing :S
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Buyerr
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Posted - 2007.10.04 21:07:00 -
[29]
Originally by: CCP Greyscale This particular mechanic has been documented in the knowledgebase for quite some time. Note that the timer updates every time you commit a hostile act against another player or another player commits a hostile act against you.
well the issue is not the timer, but the fact that it resets when you log of... why should it do that?! seem more then normally stupidity to make such a mechanic...
ow well player friendly has never been one of eve's trade marks ;)
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2007.10.05 03:51:00 -
[30]
The counter is supposed to reset ONLY if you have a counter to begin with. So if you disengage, warp to a SS, wait 15+ minutes, THEN logoff, there should be no PvP timer (15 min) renewal. _
Caldari N.V.T.F. is recruiting... |
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Dark Assassin15
Gallente Blackguard Brigade
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Posted - 2007.10.05 04:45:00 -
[31]
Edited by: Dark Assassin15 on 05/10/2007 04:46:21 I dont think the can agression works. Ive tried it b4. But ive also agressed someone who logged off then they werent on scan, they log back on, and logoff again before they warp back and get agression, i probe him and kill. Eve game mechanics FTW. ΞνΞ ΘΠLІΠΞ
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Xaen
Caldari Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2007.10.05 13:03:00 -
[32]
Quit logging to escape combat perhaps? ----------- Support fixing the EVE UI |
Shevar
Minmatar A.W.M Ka-Tet
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Posted - 2007.10.05 13:41:00 -
[33]
Quote: Note that your onscreen timer countdown may not take into account events that cause the timer to get refreshed.
Euhm? So there is a proper mechanic keeping by exactly how long it lasts but the one showing on your screen is faulty? So why show that timer at all?
--- -The only real drug problem is scoring real good drugs
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OneSock
Crown Industries
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Posted - 2007.10.05 13:56:00 -
[34]
I thought wreck shooting was classed as an exploit and fixed ?
They should make displaying the correct agro timer a priority.
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Stork DK
Synthetic Frontiers
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Posted - 2007.10.05 13:59:00 -
[35]
They might have shot your drones after you engaged. that would renew the timer. --------------
Originally by: omiNATION
Originally by: Triumdicta we're getting a new kind of ore?
CAREBEAR ALERT
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Inspiration
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Posted - 2007.10.05 14:04:00 -
[36]
Edited by: Inspiration on 05/10/2007 14:04:49
Originally by: CCP Greyscale This particular mechanic has been documented in the knowledgebase for quite some time. Note that the timer updates every time you commit a hostile act against another player or another player commits a hostile act against you.
Thats making an assumption on what actualy happened. I got it several times that even without wreck, logging off after the timer was gone, and stay ofline for another 30 or so minutes, then logging back on, would cause my timer to reset!!!!
After a while a GM moved me to another node, to see if that solved the issue. I could undock fine without timer, but after 1 jump I got concordoned and got a new global criminal flag timer. Random criminal flagging occurs, stuck criminal flagging occurs (as was in my case). But by assuming somethinh known caused the issue, you fail to see new ones occuring and subsequently they get ignore and not fixed.
This is what ****es players off, expect more of these kind of threats in the coming weeks. The whole issue is at least a month old, as it happened to a buddy of mine after some low sec op. Since then I had TWO cases of my own.
The problem goes away after downtime and no matter what you do before that (including folowing up all GM suggestions....they dont got a clue either) it will not go away! Ans everyone in EVE will have the RIGHT to kill you without repurcussions. And concord will happily help to make ur life miserable by poping you and giving every1 free loot that wont get reimbursed.
Your reply realy ****ed me off, let me make that crystal clear!
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Shaundra
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Posted - 2007.10.05 14:34:00 -
[37]
If a prober has a 20au probe out, there is a good chance you won't see it as your onboard scanner only sees about 12au.
When you log out, even when not aggressed, your ship stays in space for a minute or two before it disappears.
It takes me 30 seconds to probe a target down, then I warp the entire fleet in to attack the target. Takes even less time if I happen to have started a scan before the target logs off.
FYI if you drop a bubble on the target, the pod will not warp off and can be popped immediately once the surrounding vessel has been destroyed.
Offline targets seldom last longer than 15 or 20 seconds with a 5-6 man gang pounding on the hull.
My point is that even if you wait for your timer to expire, a hostile fleet still has a window (albeit very small) to find and destroy you. I suspect what happened is this:
Prober drops probe and starts scan. 15 seconds later, you log off. Prober gets hit, warps fleet to the location, interdictor bubble is deployed as the fleet destroys your ship, then they pod you. All of this occurs in 1 minute.
Regards,
Shaundra
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N1fty
Amarr Galactic Shipyards Inc HUZZAH FEDERATION
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Posted - 2007.10.05 14:54:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Shaundra If a prober has a 20au probe out, there is a good chance you won't see it as your onboard scanner only sees about 12au.
When you log out, even when not aggressed, your ship stays in space for a minute or two before it disappears.
It takes me 30 seconds to probe a target down, then I warp the entire fleet in to attack the target. Takes even less time if I happen to have started a scan before the target logs off.
FYI if you drop a bubble on the target, the pod will not warp off and can be popped immediately once the surrounding vessel has been destroyed.
Offline targets seldom last longer than 15 or 20 seconds with a 5-6 man gang pounding on the hull.
My point is that even if you wait for your timer to expire, a hostile fleet still has a window (albeit very small) to find and destroy you. I suspect what happened is this:
Prober drops probe and starts scan. 15 seconds later, you log off. Prober gets hit, warps fleet to the location, interdictor bubble is deployed as the fleet destroys your ship, then they pod you. All of this occurs in 1 minute.
Regards,
Shaundra
Welcome to Eve, logging off to avoid combat will not save you from determined foe ============================================
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Kruel
Blunt Force Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.10.05 15:02:00 -
[39]
Well that's just stupid. What if you gotta take a **** or go to bed and someone keeps taking pot-shots at your wrecks?
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uoY delliK
Assassination Delivered
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Posted - 2007.10.06 19:58:00 -
[40]
A) there was 6 pilots, none were in a dictor. B) all 6 pilots were on scan, when I did my final scan... None of them were in recon, or cov ops ships... All were BC/BS/HAC. C) i stand by my statement, there is no way they probed me in the minute or 2 it took for my ship to warp after i logged. Especially since I logged mid-warp... It initiates the "omg warp out" sequence before you come out of warp, and generally you immediately warp out when you come out of your initial warp.
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DeadProphet
Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.10.06 20:16:00 -
[41]
I've had this exact same thing. I was fighting in a fleet, warped to friendly POS, afk'd for more than an hour before deciding to log. I warped to a personal safe and logged (remember more than an hour since last action) Logged back in to find i had been killed 23 minutes after logging out (with no aggro anyway)
it took a long fight through the petition process and escalation to a senior GM, but i eventually got my ship back (and implants, which was a nice touch) back.
i recommend you file a petition also :)
DP
Originally by: uoY delliK
Originally by: CCP Greyscale This particular mechanic has been documented in the knowledgebase for quite some time. Note that the timer updates every time you commit a hostile act against another player or another player commits a hostile act against you.
While I appreciate your response, it still doesnt address the issue. According to my in-game log, it was 16 minutes, 30 seconds since my last combat action. For those 16 minutes, I was afk at a safespot. I then warped to a planet at 100, making a new bookmark mid-warp. I then started warp, to new safespot. During which time, I scanned for probes, and saw none. About 1/2 way through that warp, I logged off... Assuming, since it'd been nearly 17 or 18 minutes since I'd committed a combat action it would take me to an offgrid safe, and I'd log back in, to my ship. However, I was killed... and podded.
That is my issue... The timer had worn off, without a doubt in my mind.
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Dao2SKP
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Posted - 2007.10.06 20:19:00 -
[42]
yeah actually this is why cyvok lost the first titan ;p it became known right then ^^
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Arushia
Nova Labs Empire Research
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Posted - 2007.10.06 22:36:00 -
[43]
Originally by: uoY delliK A) there was 6 pilots, none were in a dictor. B) all 6 pilots were on scan, when I did my final scan... None of them were in recon, or cov ops ships... All were BC/BS/HAC. C) i stand by my statement, there is no way they probed me in the minute or 2 it took for my ship to warp after i logged. Especially since I logged mid-warp... It initiates the "omg warp out" sequence before you come out of warp, and generally you immediately warp out when you come out of your initial warp.
Were those the only 6 other pilots in local? Covops can probe while cloaked, and don't show up on scans when cloaked.
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ReaperOfSly
Gallente Lyrus Associates M. PIRE
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Posted - 2007.10.06 22:44:00 -
[44]
Originally by: uoY delliK Hi,
If a player logs out with a aggression timer, it renews. This is intended game mechanics.
From a GM, in response to my petition, that I waited 16 from my last combat action according to my in game log. Started warp to a new safespot I had just made, flashed scanner once for probes (saw none), then logged. Somehow I was probed down, killed and podded. In two years of playing, I've never heard, that an aggression timer renews if you log out... THAT IS INSANE. If anyone else has heard this unbelievable tale, please let me know.
On a side note, is anyone else getting fed up with cookie-cutter petition responses, that never answer your petition issue, and always end in "no"?
It's an extremely irritating game mechanic. I still don't know what is gained by it, but I guess CCP moves in mysterious ways.
Those cookie-cutter reesponses I think are meant to deal with the majority of petitions - the ones about trivial matters. If you have a non-trivial matter, just reply to their message and you might get to talk to a human being instead of a copy-paste machine. --------------------------------------------------------------------
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Mr Friendly
That it Should Come to This
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Posted - 2007.10.07 18:03:00 -
[45]
From the kbase section, "Note that your onscreen timer countdown may not take into account events that cause the timer to get refreshed."
Anyone else find this incredibly lame? How else are we to avoid being killed if we don't have the information needed?
Wow, that's just plain old crappy design on CCP's part, tbh. Why have a visible timer at all if it's not spot-on correct, 23/7? __________________________________________________ FOLD. The Ultimate PVP. It really is Us vs. Them. clicky |
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