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Motokko
Minmatar
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Posted - 2007.10.24 15:58:00 -
[91]
Phew, thanks for that, the Vexor is my current ratting ship of choice. The Vexor buff is pretty awesome actualy since now I'll be able to pack 3 heavies for anti-BS work and 5 lights for anti-frig.
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Futher Bezluden
Minmatar ORIGIN SYSTEMS Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2007.10.24 15:59:00 -
[92]
Originally by: Aramendel Edited by: Aramendel on 23/10/2007 20:15:54
Ishkur: 25mbit, 25m¦, same bonus (50m¦ at lvl 5 compared to 40m¦ now) Vexor: 75mbit, 100m¦ Navy Vexor: 100mbit, 100m¦ Myr: 75 mbit, 150m¦ Eos: 75 mbit, 150m¦ and as dronebay bonus +15m¦/lvl (225m¦ at lvl 5 compared to 300m¦ at lvl5 now) and for the sake of completeness: reduction to 5 turret hardpoints.
Arbi: 50mbit, 150m¦ Curse: 50mbit, 150m¦ Pilg: 50mbit, 150m¦
Ishtar unchanged, dominix unchanged
25mbit = being able to control drones with a total volume of 25m¦, meaning 5 lights or 1 heavy, for example.
To the post about mrym being gimped, you still have a phenomenal armor tank for durability, you can fit the nos/neut system with med injector to drain out the enemy, fit 5-6 220mm vulcan II's and do good drone damage, or fit 6 ion blaster II's to it. Ship wasn't meant to do battleship level damage. EOS totally outclassed all other commandships in terms of gank and tank, so why complain? It had it's day of glory and now being leveled out.
Has CCP considered giving a few drone ships a bonus to drone mwd speed to catch enemy easier/faster or better sentry tracking? THUKKER -Be Paranoid
Skeet Skeet L33t |
Alex Harumichi
Gallente Gradient Electus Matari
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Posted - 2007.10.24 16:05:00 -
[93]
Originally by: Futher Bezluden
EOS totally outclassed all other commandships in terms of gank despite a so-so tank, so why complain? It had it's day of glory and is now being made totally useless in any role.
Fixed it for you.
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Futher Bezluden
Minmatar ORIGIN SYSTEMS Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2007.10.24 16:31:00 -
[94]
Originally by: Alex Harumichi
Originally by: Futher Bezluden
EOS totally outclassed all other commandships in terms of gank despite a so-so tank, so why complain? It had it's day of glory and is now being made totally useless in any role.
Fixed it for you.
Thanks THUKKER -Be Paranoid
Skeet Skeet L33t |
rafaman
New European Regiment Pax Atlantis
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Posted - 2007.10.24 18:52:00 -
[95]
I'm one of those players that dont take it very well when after spending huge amounts of time specializing on skills to max the usage of the ships I prefer to fly, I get to see that investment being nerfed.
I went gallente for 2 reasons. Race description and the type of warfare. Gallente are all about drones. So what do I do? I spend months training drones, gunnery and ships... and when I got enought ISK spend it on ships where drones are a plus. Vexor, Dominix, Myrmidom, etc.
In this past 1.5 years I saw strange things heppening. I've saw for example a new BS that cant even take 5 heavy drones - Hyperion. Sure its a blaster boat... but does it makes sense at all that a Gallente Battleship with no Drone Bonus, can only carry 4 heavy drones? We are talking about a race where drones are one of the main skills trained by the players. I also say a nerf to the EAN II. Gallente are all about armor tanking. Again a nerf to that. So we have already a hard time fitting a decent armor on a Myrmidon and now we also get a nerf on our dps by nerfing the drones. Great. Whats next?
I must say I'm starting to feel that I'm paying for a game where I'm subject on each new patch new nerfs to my race and to my ships, that took me so long to train for. At some point we have to consider if this makes any sense at all. For me, it does not. It starts to seem to me that when CCP first designed the game, it was not balanced and now we are getting patches to reduce here, increase there... at the expense or our gameplay. This is pure bad PR IMHO. If I had to write a review today, it would not be as good as it was 6 months ago even tho a lot of "improvements" where put in place.
Some say.. dont use that ship... use the other. Dont use heavys... use mediums ... give me a break. This is not about a change and how it affects some ships and not the others. This is a change that affects directly my game experience and makes me have to change the way I use my ships in a negative way. I do like to use my Myr with 5 Ogre II. I do like to use my Mega with 5 OGRE II. I do hate to be able to use only 4 OGRE II on my Hyperion, but then again when I spent 140M on the ship I knew that in advance. Are other races in disavantage when it comes to gallente? I dont think so. Take a look at the BC Drake that can tank more then some BS.
In fact... why do gallente have bonus for Drones anyway? Could it be that its a race that depends a lot on cap for weapons and trusts and keep the optimal range for hybrids? If CCP is nerfing gallente by nerfing drones and ships that makes use of them, then perhaps changes to the hybrid PG and CAP are in order. And be able to fit more guns perhaps?
And as a final note this bandwith thing is to me something in the line of heat. Its nice to have but on the field its just another level of complexity that eventually will make this game just too complex and just too dificult to learn. It will keep on increasing the learning curve of it... that in turn will make it less attractive for someone that just wants to spend a few hours a week having fun and not having to worry about so many details.
From someone that plays this game for over 1.5 years, its just something new to deal with. For a new gammer is one more thing to learn... When it comes to marketing, its a good thing to have as many players as possible to upgrade from trial to paying customer... I wonder if eventually the tendency to increase complexity of the game will not be a turn-off for most people. I would be much better to invest time and resources on new ships, new items, optimizations to be able to actually login on Jita even when there are 700 in local and to improve the game experience overral.
My 0.4 cent
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Xiong Yoshi
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Posted - 2007.10.24 19:24:00 -
[96]
I hope that they atleast up the Myrm Dronebay to 175m3.... that way a player COULD have 2 waves of mediums and a "wave" of heavies...
now I'm hoping that they lower sentry Bandwidth to 15Mhz - not likely but sentries need some loving.
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Veng3ance
Prophets Of a Damned Universe
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Posted - 2007.10.24 19:35:00 -
[97]
I suggest changing both the Eos and Myrm drone bandwidth, that Nerf is just a bit much.
Either change them to 80mbit or 100mbit.
4 heavy drones might be a bit much, but 80mbit is a lot more reasonable then 75mbit bandwidth. With 75mbit your deploying 3 different drones types if you want to fill your complete DPS potential..... no one does that, and no one will.
Give us 80mbit so we can at least launch 2 Heavies + 3 Mediums. I don't think this is unreasonable.
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Zitheral
Species 5618 R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.10.24 19:44:00 -
[98]
Originally by: rafaman I'm one of those players that dont take it very well when after spending huge amounts of time specializing on skills to max the usage of the ships I prefer to fly, I get to see that investment being nerfed.
.... BLAH BLAH BLAH ....
My 0.4 cent
WALL OF TEXT
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Luke Lamarr
Infinitus Morti R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2007.10.24 19:45:00 -
[99]
Ouch... goodbye drone boats...
Not only they nerf the numbers of max drones you can field, but they do so at the same time at they 'fix' drones. Once they make it so that shields do not insta-regen when you scoop drones, it will become really easy to pop drones of any droneboat (even if the droneboat wants to remote rep)
So not only the top DPS you can reach gets nerfed, but it also becomes real easy to drop a ships DPS during combat... The scoop nerf was imo the only nerf needed. I'm looking forward to see how these nerfs combined will really affect drone boats, but my hopes aren't very high
###### <-- Box'o'cookies for the mods #MOD-# #Chow# ######
Yep, I suck at sigs, fix me!
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Julius Romanus
Amarr Bloodmoney Incorporated
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Posted - 2007.10.24 19:55:00 -
[100]
My arbitrator got buffed. I never used the "mix in heavies meds and lights for maxxxiums dps"
Looks like I can carry 5x warrior II's, 5x Hammer II's, and a bunch of ewar drones. Or spares for my combats.
-- All these graphs show is how bad the apocalypse is with different kinds of weapons. -Dr Jigglez |
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Seringol
Gallente The Graduates Brutally Clever Empire
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Posted - 2007.10.24 19:56:00 -
[101]
As mostly a user of Drones for DPS, im feeling pretty shafted right now.
Especially on my precious little Ishkur, a ship that already had enough ****ing problems as it was.
Gallente should have more bandwith, period. Or start saying that hey, Gallente is no longer the main drone race.
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Atsuko Ratu
Caldari VSP Corp.
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Posted - 2007.10.24 20:28:00 -
[102]
Edited by: Atsuko Ratu on 24/10/2007 20:30:16
Originally by: rafaman I'm one of those players that dont take it very well when after spending huge amounts of time specializing on skills to max the usage of the ships I prefer to fly, I get to see that investment being nerfed.
*stuff*
My 0.4 cent
And yet with your insanely gimped armor tank, dps, everything, the mym still totally outmatches the drake and hurricane (cept maybe speed?)
The Eos-nerf is the only gimp I don't really understand; it's a dps command ship and it should be able to field 5 heavies. 80 on the mym would make more sense, but oh well, it will still out dps 95% of caldari ships
Only 4 heavies on a blaster boat? Oh noes... my tier 3 bs doesn't even USE missles. Be glad yours has a drone bay at all.
A nerf doesn't happen because 5 people whined on a forum. A nerf doesn't happen JUST to **** you off. A nerf happens when something is broken or unbalanced and CCP trys to fix it. There doesn't need to be any "compensation". If this turns out to be to heavy a nerf, I'm sure they'll make it all better for you in a few months.
Finally, people that can't understand Eve play WoW. Making it so you can only use X drone band width at the same time won't make it any harder to understand that it already is.
Edit: Grammer
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Dzajic
Gallente
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Posted - 2007.10.24 20:52:00 -
[103]
You dear folks do know that nos nerf, damp nerf and no more drone shields recharging on scoop directly nerf drone boats?
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Tarron Sarek
Gallente Endica Enterprises
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Posted - 2007.10.24 21:33:00 -
[104]
I definitely don't say things like this very often, but.. Cry me a river!
Adapt people. It's not like Gallente usually gets the short end of the stick.
Or do as I do and choose your ships by looks instead of stats. It's far less likely to change, and if so (graphics update) hopefully to the better.
_________________________________ - Balance is power, guard it well - |
Justice Bringer
Minmatar Space-Bar FOUNDATI0N
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Posted - 2007.10.24 21:40:00 -
[105]
Look the whole thing on SISI is nonesense pure and simple. Sure bring things into line with other ships but don't change their fundamental reason for being just because.
Look:
Megathron Drone Bay - 125m3 Bandwidth - 125m3 = 5 Heavies
Eos Drone Bay - 225m5 (at lvl 5) Bandwidth - 75m3 = 3 Heavies
Now which of these two ships is a 'drone boat' ???
Even the Hyperion is in on the act:
Drone Bay - 100m3 Bandwidth - 100m3 = 4 Heavies
Can anyone understand this in the slightest because I don't. Sure remove 2 turrets from the Eos and so allow people to use the ship in its pre designated role as a Fleet Command ship and therefore actually fit gang modules there. But to also do the following is too much:
A) Reduce the drone bay bonus fom 50m3 to 15m3 B) Remove the auto shield regen on drone dock
By increasing the base drone bay from 50m3 on Tranq to 150m3 on SISI and then messing with the drone bandwidth is analagous to shops raising the price of their goods just before the put them in a sale.
It may look like an attractive proposition but people always know when they're being stiffed and this is a case in point CCP.
You're stiffing the public (those that own an Eos in any case) and we don't like it one bit.
Justice
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Acinonyx Jubatus
Minmatar Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.10.24 23:15:00 -
[106]
Edited by: Acinonyx Jubatus on 24/10/2007 23:20:06 That comment on the EANM change nerfing gallente was amusing tbh, you do know that it's the mod being changed, not "this module gets an increase on cpu fitting requirements when fitted onto gallente racial ships" type of deal, it goes to anyone who fits the mod.
Then the one somewhere above me, asking which of the two is a drone ship(hyperion/mega/eos) Yeah, the Eos is technically a drone ship, but all it gets is a dronebay size increase, as does the ishkur... it doesn't get a drone damage bonus, though it probably should instead of the hybrid one, I'm not gonna go into it really as it's "fine". But the mega and hype being able to launch a full wave of their class sized drones isn't bad. If you look at it like that, then the Rupture is a droneship, as is the Thorax, and Brutix, and Moa, and Catalyst, so on and so forth for any ship that can field all of their dronebay.
Why the Hype can field only 4 Heavies, who knows, guess it's supposed to fit a better tank than the mega, personally I don't care because I don't like the hype, looks weird, costs more, and performs roughly the same as the mega with differences.
What I find hilarious is people misunderstanding things like the vexor/arbitrator changes and screaming "run for the hill it's a nerf!!"Yeah arbi got a bit of a change as to available loadout but got more variation aswell. what I find funny is the people panicing in this thread will wind up finding things to be "ok" and fine after awhile int he future, these aren't 100% final and even if they're final they still get adjusted, Eos pilots have a fair bit of adjustment to go through, heck everyone does, namely carrier pilots.
Forgot what Iwas going to say now :|
Edit: oh right... there's a saying I've seen in the past... if it's too good to be true, then it probably is, don't spend months or years training on one race just because it's good at something, then cry when some changes occur after 10 months. Gallente haven't been touched in awhile anyways. I predict Minmatar will get an eventual change aswell, then caldari, then Gallente in a circle(see how I skipped Amarr?), who cares, we'll all eventually be equally nerfed into extinction and resort to typing each other to death.
Post belonging to Acinonyx Jubatus scratches you causing 7.3 damage
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Corphus
The NewOrder BORG Alliance
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Posted - 2007.10.24 23:22:00 -
[107]
well apart from the myrmidon the bandwidth thing seems ok.
i think that the myrmidon suffers too much since its main arsenal consists of drones. the 6 guns the myrm can use arent bonused, which is kind of disapointing. the effective dps advantage over the vexor is only the dps output ability of one single gun taking ship bonuses into account. i dont know how this pays out but ill coment on this once i had the chance testing it.
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Danjira Ryuujin
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.10.24 23:30:00 -
[108]
Edited by: Danjira Ryuujin on 24/10/2007 23:30:10 It's alright guys. Give gallente posters a break. They're not used to having people actually balance their ships.
Amarr - Annoying the Eve Community since 2005 |
Vulsutyr
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Posted - 2007.10.24 23:55:00 -
[109]
not sure if this has been mentioned anywhere but ccp didn't really increase the amount of waves/drones gallentes have in ships they just made it so you can use less of them at once which in the end gives you more waves which is pointless i would much rather be able to launch all 5 ogres then 2 waves of 3
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rafaman
New European Regiment Pax Atlantis
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Posted - 2007.10.25 00:15:00 -
[110]
Originally by: Acinonyx Jubatus Edited by: Acinonyx Jubatus on 24/10/2007 23:20:06 That comment on the EANM change nerfing gallente was amusing tbh, you do know that it's the mod being changed, not "this module gets an increase on cpu fitting requirements when fitted onto gallente racial ships" type of deal, it goes to anyone who fits the mod.
First, Gallente are in fact Armor tanking. So this means that EAN2 are in fact a very important modules for us. EAN2 nerf was a big deal for us.
Let me take sides here and compare my ex-beloved-before-drone-nerfs-Myrmidon and compare it with the over-tanked-bc Drake that can tank like hell and has... guess what... 8 fitting slots for lauchers. Myr has 6 for rails that need cap and relied on Drones for the extra dps. Why would I use a Myr now? There is no point in doing so. I may as well sell mines.
Cheers
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Danjira Ryuujin
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.10.25 00:41:00 -
[111]
Edited by: Danjira Ryuujin on 25/10/2007 00:41:07
Originally by: rafaman
Let me take sides here and compare my ex-beloved-before-drone-nerfs-Myrmidon and compare it with the over-tanked-bc Drake that can tank like hell and has... guess what... 8 fitting slots for lauchers. Myr has 6 for rails that need cap and relied on Drones for the extra dps. Why would I use a Myr now? There is no point in doing so. I may as well sell mines.
WTB 8 launcher drake.
Amarr - Annoying the Eve Community since 2005 |
Keithos
Caldari
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Posted - 2007.10.25 02:24:00 -
[112]
Originally by: rafaman Edited by: rafaman on 25/10/2007 00:17:25
Originally by: Acinonyx Jubatus Edited by: Acinonyx Jubatus on 24/10/2007 23:20:06 That comment on the EANM change nerfing gallente was amusing tbh, you do know that it's the mod being changed, not "this module gets an increase on cpu fitting requirements when fitted onto gallente racial ships" type of deal, it goes to anyone who fits the mod.
First, Gallente are in fact Armor tanking. So this means that EAN2 are in fact a very important modules for us. EAN2 nerf was a big deal for us.
Let me take sides here and compare my ex-beloved-before-drone-nerfs-Myrmidon and compare it with the over-tanked-bc Drake that can tank like hell and has... guess what... 8 fitting slots for lauchers. Myr has 6 for rails that need cap and relied on Drones for the extra dps. Why would I use a Myr now? There is no point in doing so. I may as well sell mines.
Cheers
Edit: Not to mention that drake has more CPU... when it was Armor tanking races that got their CPU nerfed by nerfing EAN2. I must stop writing nerfed... :)
You do realize that launcers use cpu more and grid less, (the opposite of turrets they use more grid then cpu) thus almost all missile ships tend to have more cpu (as it gets used).
Further I think the whole chicken little the sky is falling cause my myri no longer so outrageously out dpses just about every bc by a sizeable margin is amusing.
If you really didn't think the myri was going to lose mediums when bandwidth was announced or that CCP was never going to some how nerf the myri's damage, well can I have what you're smoking cause it seems like it's quality stuff.
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port22
The IMorral MAjority
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Posted - 2007.10.25 02:35:00 -
[113]
EOS should be changed to 100mbit not 75mbit. Either that or give it back its turret slots for christ's sake. Im all about balance in the game but this is a ******** move. Its not like it gets bonus's on its drones damage.
GG CCP - Can you nerf the **** out of anyone else today? o_0
Originally by: Temp Boi Port FTMFW Period.
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Atsuko Ratu
Caldari VSP Corp.
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Posted - 2007.10.25 03:41:00 -
[114]
Originally by: rafaman Edited by: rafaman on 25/10/2007 00:17:25 First, Gallente are in fact Armor tanking. So this means that EAN2 are in fact a very important modules for us. EAN2 nerf was a big deal for us.
Let me take sides here and compare my ex-beloved-before-drone-nerfs-Myrmidon and compare it with the over-tanked-bc Drake that can tank like hell and has... guess what... 8 fitting slots for lauchers. Myr has 6 for rails that need cap and relied on Drones for the extra dps. Why would I use a Myr now? There is no point in doing so. I may as well sell mines.
Cheers
Edit: Not to mention that drake has more CPU... when it was Armor tanking races that got their CPU nerfed by nerfing EAN2. I must stop writing nerfed... :)
Drake uses 7 launchers. Myrm out tanks the drake (myrms passive shield tank is greater than it's armor tank, and it can actually cause damage with said tank using drones, while the drake becomes a useless-heavy-missle-modless-firing-stuck-boat)
Amarr armor tank as well, it wasn't a "gal nerf." It's your first major nerf I understand; I know it hurts now but you'll be walking fine in a few days I promise. If Caldari can deal with their mass-nerf then you can deal with having your myrm dragged in line with the other bcs.
Myrm will still outdps and outtank a drake post-patch. Give my drake 5 mediums please
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Aaron Mirrorsaver
R.E.C.O.N.
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Posted - 2007.10.25 05:34:00 -
[115]
The drone boats in general should have larger mbit bandwidth, not gallente ships alone.
So an Arby should have a bigger bay at least, than a EOS which isn't even a drone boat, (no bonus to drones period)
R.E.C.O.N. is recruiting
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Reto
The Last Resort
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Posted - 2007.10.25 06:45:00 -
[116]
Originally by: Aaron Mirrorsaver The drone boats in general should have larger mbit bandwidth, not gallente ships alone.
So an Arby should have a bigger bay at least, than a EOS which isn't even a drone boat, (no bonus to drones period)
the eos IS a droneboat. its build by creodron and it has a drone bay size bonus. and combat recons are only able to use medsized or light drones due to their dronebay limitations. after the patch u might be able to use up to 5 meds iff ccp decidec that the recons get 50M/bit and more dronebay. imo this is more than u can ask for.
Originally by: s4mp3r0r "Hey man, you're mom has a cruise missile".
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Testosterone Bomb
Red Ballz
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Posted - 2007.10.25 06:51:00 -
[117]
Actually with the EOS , they should give it a bandwith of 95 so that it can field 3 heavies and 2 mediums, that would at least make sense.
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rafaman
New European Regiment Pax Atlantis
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Posted - 2007.10.25 08:53:00 -
[118]
Originally by: Danjira Ryuujin Edited by: Danjira Ryuujin on 25/10/2007 00:41:07
Originally by: rafaman
Let me take sides here and compare my ex-beloved-before-drone-nerfs-Myrmidon and compare it with the over-tanked-bc Drake that can tank like hell and has... guess what... 8 fitting slots for lauchers. Myr has 6 for rails that need cap and relied on Drones for the extra dps. Why would I use a Myr now? There is no point in doing so. I may as well sell mines.
WTB 8 launcher drake.
LOL.... My bad.... :)
Cheers
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Winston Farrel
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Posted - 2007.12.07 15:17:00 -
[119]
Ouch!
Heh, the myrm was pretty much my combat bread and butter ship... I'll miss being able to field five heavies.
Quite honestly, I think I fall in the camp of myrm users here generally... The myrm is supposedly a drone boat, if it's overpowered, why are they cutting it's drones?
I think it could stand to take it's DPS hit elsewhere, lose a couple of slots for fitting other kit, perhaps.
I dunno... I don't have experience of other races ships, honestly. I found myself liking the Myrm a lot in comparaison to other ships I'd flown, maybe that is indication of it having been too powerful.
I'll adapt. I generally PVE anyhow, so it's not so bad for me.
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Haniblecter Teg
F.R.E.E. Explorer Atrum Tempestas Foedus
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Posted - 2007.12.07 16:22:00 -
[120]
I actually regret suiciding my Mrymidon a month ago.
Its not to bad being able to fly two flights of mediums. Sure, the damage aint too hot, but it is still pretty wtfpwn for slot layout...unless they've chopped into those too (cant remember, still reeling from my Eos nerf) ----------------- Friends Forever
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