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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Eternum Praetorian
Black Ops Trade Group
435
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 04:47:00 -
[181] - Quote
RubyPorto. Actually, eye witness testimony from enough people tends to equal investigation, indictment and eventual prosecution in a court of law. So when enough people say that someone or something is breaking the law, it then falls upon the authorities to provide the lions share of evidence for prosecution, and then to enforce that prosecution.
The player base have already done all that we can do, and all that we are required to do. CCP has acknowledged the existence of bots in instances like unholy rage and the inclusion of the report bot button. That, and multiple instances of RMT can be found reported on common sites like EVE news. You can google Buy isk and find dozens of illegal ISK selling sites, and illegal ship selling sites all over the internet. So there is ample proof all over the place, you are just posting in such a way to defend/support your own agenda.
Conclusion... you're acting like a stereotypical Red Legion guy. Congratulations, you have fed the stereotype. Reallocate funds for Icelandic air fare to developing an integrated player input function in the UI. Then talk directly to the customers with polls to collect demographics and game preferences
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Eternum Praetorian
Black Ops Trade Group
435
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Posted - 2012.01.30 04:51:00 -
[182] - Quote
Selinate wrote:Eternum Praetorian wrote:Proud to make an impression on you, Selinate. Tears from weak trolls like you makes it worth posting here. Getting even less witty. Not even trying any more.
I think I have a fan.
Reallocate funds for Icelandic air fare to developing an integrated player input function in the UI. Then talk directly to the customers with polls to collect demographics and game preferences
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Selinate
631
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Posted - 2012.01.30 04:51:00 -
[183] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:RubyPorto. Actually, eye witness testimony from enough people tends to equal investigation, indictment and eventual prosecution in a court of law. So when enough people say that someone or something is breaking the law, it then falls upon the authorities to provide the lions share of evidence for prosecution, and to enforce that prosecution.
The player base has already done all that we can do, and all that we are required to do. CCP has acknowledged the existence of bots in unholy rage, and multiple instances of RMT can be found on common sites like EVE news. You can google Buy isk and find dozens of illegal ISK selling sites, and illegal ship selling sites. So there is ample proof all over the place, you are just posting in such a way to defend/support your own agenda.
Conclusion... you acting like a stereotypical Red Legion guy. Congratulations, you have fed the stereotype.
Do you even know the difference between an eye witness and a couple of people who walk into a bar, see a pair of lesbians in the entry way, and assume that the entire bar must be a gay bar?
Apparently not. But apparently you are still butthurt and without a valid argument. |
Eternum Praetorian
Black Ops Trade Group
435
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 04:59:00 -
[184] - Quote
I was going to post something more lengthy here but I elected not to. Reason being, Selinate, you are just talking out of your ass at this point. Google "Buy isk online" and anyone will have all the evidence they will ever need.
Search About 3,690,000 results (0.31 seconds)
I don't need to bother with your kind of stupidity, nor do I need to justify an opinion that is supported by what is readily available on google. So, just keep on parroting butthurt memes. your willful stupidity amuses me. Reallocate funds for Icelandic air fare to developing an integrated player input function in the UI. Then talk directly to the customers with polls to collect demographics and game preferences
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Selinate
631
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Posted - 2012.01.30 05:02:00 -
[185] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:I was going to post something more lengthy here but I elected not to. Reason being, Selinate, you are just talking out of your ass at this point. Google "Buy isk online" and anyone will have all the evidence they will ever need.
Search About 3,690,000 results (0.31 seconds)
I don't need to bother with your kind of stupidity, nor do I need to justify an opinion that is supported by what is readily available on google. So, just keep on parroting butthurt memes. your willful stupidity amuses me.
So now, because there are websites that advertise selling isk, botting is rampant in DRF space, and also, DRF space is botting central, obviously. Failing logic still.
Now we're definitely seeing the butthurt, though. |
RubyPorto
Profoundly Disturbed RED.Legion
1316
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 05:05:00 -
[186] - Quote
Selinate wrote:RubyPorto wrote:
You don't have to, but you are. Since you're ... uh... posting here... uh ... on the forums where... uh... debate happens.
The reason why the courts have consistently rejected hearsay evidence is because of the rapidity that information gets distorted, altered, muddled, etc (without need for any conscious malice). Ever play the phone game? Everyone whispers to the next person and what comes out after 10-15 people is barely recognizable as what went in. That's why hearsay evidence is worthless.
If you can quote someone who has direct knowledge of botting and/or RMT, that would be Evidence. "We simply know better" isn't even hearsay, it's fluff.
So, please link, quote, list, etc a tiny shred of Evidence to prop up your argument. So far the only evidence in this thread is my testimony.
I think this thread deserves a picture of an eiffel tower. Guess who's in the middle.
They clearly locked eyes moments before. Single-Shard, Player Driven Sandbox.
5 words. That's what makes it special in my eyes. |
Eternum Praetorian
Black Ops Trade Group
435
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 05:06:00 -
[187] - Quote
Now remember kids, water isn't wet. And drone regions don't have bots. Reallocate funds for Icelandic air fare to developing an integrated player input function in the UI. Then talk directly to the customers with polls to collect demographics and game preferences
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RubyPorto
Profoundly Disturbed RED.Legion
1316
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 05:06:00 -
[188] - Quote
Selinate wrote:Eternum Praetorian wrote:I was going to post something more lengthy here but I elected not to. Reason being, Selinate, you are just talking out of your ass at this point. Google "Buy isk online" and anyone will have all the evidence they will ever need.
Search About 3,690,000 results (0.31 seconds)
I don't need to bother with your kind of stupidity, nor do I need to justify an opinion that is supported by what is readily available on google. So, just keep on parroting butthurt memes. your willful stupidity amuses me. So now, because there are websites that advertise selling isk, botting is rampant in DRF space, and also, DRF space is botting central, obviously. Failing logic still. Now we're definitely seeing the butthurt, though. This. Eternum, you are still making argumentative leaps unsupported by evidence. Single-Shard, Player Driven Sandbox.
5 words. That's what makes it special in my eyes. |
RubyPorto
Profoundly Disturbed RED.Legion
1316
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 05:08:00 -
[189] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:Now remember kids, water isn't wet. And drone regions don't have bots.
1) I already pointed out, water being wet is tautologically true.
2) I live in Detorid. Angel space.
3) You would need evidence to back that assertion up anyway. Single-Shard, Player Driven Sandbox.
5 words. That's what makes it special in my eyes. |
Eternum Praetorian
Black Ops Trade Group
435
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 05:09:00 -
[190] - Quote
Search About 3,690,000 results (0.31 seconds)
Seems fine to me. Reallocate funds for Icelandic air fare to developing an integrated player input function in the UI. Then talk directly to the customers with polls to collect demographics and game preferences
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RubyPorto
Profoundly Disturbed RED.Legion
1322
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 05:15:00 -
[191] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:Search About 3,690,000 results (0.31 seconds)
Seems fine to me. Who cares what region has the most of them? That is nearly four million hits for a SINGLE internet video game and that means it is running rampant.
You searched isk sellers. Did you insted search "Isk Sellers who operate within the DRF"? Cause that's what you're arguing. Single-Shard, Player Driven Sandbox.
5 words. That's what makes it special in my eyes. |
Eternum Praetorian
Black Ops Trade Group
435
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 05:17:00 -
[192] - Quote
RubyPorto wrote:Eternum Praetorian wrote:Search About 3,690,000 results (0.31 seconds)
Seems fine to me. Who cares what region has the most of them? That is nearly four million hits for a SINGLE internet video game and that means it is running rampant. You searched isk sellers. Did you insted search "Isk Sellers who operate within the DRF"? Cause that's what you're arguing.
No I am not, that is what you're arguing. To say that drone regions is botting central is not to say that it is the only one in the game. Reallocate funds for Icelandic air fare to developing an integrated player input function in the UI. Then talk directly to the customers with polls to collect demographics and game preferences
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Selinate
638
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Posted - 2012.01.30 05:17:00 -
[193] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:Search About 3,690,000 results (0.31 seconds)
Seems fine to me. Who cares what region has the most of them? That is nearly four million hits for a SINGLE internet video game and that means it is running rampant. That is all the evidence anyone could ever ask for... so... that is that. Continue to argue that water isn't wet if you must, the facts are right there in black and white pasted all over google.
Are you one of those people who see an article with something like this in the title, "Night lights at home linked with myopia in children", and instantly assume that the night lights cause myopia?
Just because you find a bunch of websites that advertise that they sell isk online does not mean that botting is rampant in DRF space, nor that DRF space is bottling central.
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Selinate
638
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Posted - 2012.01.30 05:19:00 -
[194] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:RubyPorto wrote:Eternum Praetorian wrote:Search About 3,690,000 results (0.31 seconds)
Seems fine to me. Who cares what region has the most of them? That is nearly four million hits for a SINGLE internet video game and that means it is running rampant. You searched isk sellers. Did you insted search "Isk Sellers who operate within the DRF"? Cause that's what you're arguing. No I am not, that is what you're arguing. To say that drone regions is botting central is not to say that it is the only one in the game.
Memory impaired also now? Can't remember your own poor attempt at making points?
Or is that more indicative of an inability to read your own posts?
I can't decide which. |
Eternum Praetorian
Black Ops Trade Group
435
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 05:19:00 -
[195] - Quote
Selinate wrote: Just because you find a bunch of websites that advertise that they sell isk online does not mean that botting is rampant in DRF space, nor that DRF space is bottling central.
You're right, I am sure DRF space is bot free. Reallocate funds for Icelandic air fare to developing an integrated player input function in the UI. Then talk directly to the customers with polls to collect demographics and game preferences
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Eternum Praetorian
Black Ops Trade Group
435
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 05:23:00 -
[196] - Quote
RubyPorto wrote:Eternum Praetorian wrote:Search About 3,690,000 results (0.31 seconds)
Seems fine to me. Who cares what region has the most of them? That is nearly four million hits for a SINGLE internet video game and that means it is running rampant. You searched isk sellers. Did you insted search "Isk Sellers who operate within the DRF"? Cause that's what you're arguing.
Thx I actually did just that LOL This was an interesting read. Reallocate funds for Icelandic air fare to developing an integrated player input function in the UI. Then talk directly to the customers with polls to collect demographics and game preferences
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Alphea Abbra
Project Promethion
4
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 05:25:00 -
[197] - Quote
Selinate & RubyPorto debates, while Eternum makes ad hominems and other sorts of faulty argumentation.
Also, adding my testimony that Drone Lands necessarily must be a comparatively hard region to bot/RMT in since you need minimum twice the number of accounts to do so (Since you don't get ISK straight away, but need to first salvage and second refine). In any other region you can "just" do the Sanctum and then get the ISK. Furthermore, I didn't seen any bots in Cobalt Edge while I was there. I didn't look for them, but if they are as rampant as you (Eternum) would make us think ... well, I should have seen them by just being there.
So in conclusion, I'd like to ask the same question as RubyPorto:
1) What is your evidence that DRF RMT's (OR RMT's more than any other null alliance in general). 2) If you have this evidence, why do you not report it to CCP to get the bots banned? 3) What evidence do you have that the DRF or former DRF bloc members in this thread wilfully close their eyes to RMT in DRF?
Gé¼: + several Important Spaceship Game Forum Likes for Selinate & RubyPorto. Continue working for sanity and a fact-based debate. ^^ |
RubyPorto
Profoundly Disturbed RED.Legion
1322
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 05:25:00 -
[198] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote: No I am not, that is what you're arguing. To say that drone regions is botting central is not to say that it is the only one in the game.
Eternum Praetorian wrote: To you I can only say that you live in the very heart of RMT/ Botting central. I don't feel like debating this with you, because your stance is one that requires everyone else to believe that what people are saying about drone space is completely unwarranted and baseless hearsay. We simply know better, and if you don't that is fine. Have fun out there.
But, your taking a stance that directly contradicts the observations of many others.[who?]
Eternum Praetorian wrote:
Meaning that if you have not seen said things for yourself by now, then you must be living under a rock out there.
So, uh, sounds like you're arguing a few things: 1) RED.Legion lives in drone space (demonstrably false, look at a map) 2) Botting occurs in drone space (Citation needed) 3) That botting results in RMT (Citation needed) 4) I have actively avoided seeing evidence of 2) and 3) (Citation needed) Single-Shard, Player Driven Sandbox.
5 words. That's what makes it special in my eyes. |
RubyPorto
Profoundly Disturbed RED.Legion
1322
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 05:29:00 -
[199] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:RubyPorto wrote:Eternum Praetorian wrote:Search About 3,690,000 results (0.31 seconds)
Seems fine to me. Who cares what region has the most of them? That is nearly four million hits for a SINGLE internet video game and that means it is running rampant. You searched isk sellers. Did you insted search "Isk Sellers who operate within the DRF"? Cause that's what you're arguing. Thx I actually did just that LOL This was an interesting read.
Took you a while to find that. Now you have some solid evidence that botting/RMT was going on 3 years ago. Your argument is that it is going on today (or within the last ~6 months since I moved there). Single-Shard, Player Driven Sandbox.
5 words. That's what makes it special in my eyes. |
Eternum Praetorian
Black Ops Trade Group
435
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 05:29:00 -
[200] - Quote
I am actually, and you should also read my link.
Quote: When you dealt with the brokers and customers, you must have stumbled into other isk sellers as well. What alliance have highest count of bots in them / rmt players?
I am 1 man but if a group of ppl with 5 bot each x 20, can pretty much after 1 month equip 50 ms, and steamroll entire eve. It is hard to say who rmt, and who use isk for supercaps, but for sure, the drone regions have the biggest % of botters in eve. Mainly in their renter outlets.
From single alliance, white noise-rol-stain empire-goonswarm have the highest %.
But I am sure eve news made up that entire interview in order to smear the poor null sec alliances. Reallocate funds for Icelandic air fare to developing an integrated player input function in the UI. Then talk directly to the customers with polls to collect demographics and game preferences
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Eternum Praetorian
Black Ops Trade Group
435
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 05:31:00 -
[201] - Quote
RubyPorto wrote:Eternum Praetorian wrote:RubyPorto wrote:Eternum Praetorian wrote:Search About 3,690,000 results (0.31 seconds)
Seems fine to me. Who cares what region has the most of them? That is nearly four million hits for a SINGLE internet video game and that means it is running rampant. You searched isk sellers. Did you insted search "Isk Sellers who operate within the DRF"? Cause that's what you're arguing. Thx I actually did just that LOL This was an interesting read. Took you a while to find that. Now you have some solid evidence that botting/RMT was going on 3 years ago. Your argument is that it is going on today (or within the last ~6 months since I moved there).
And yours is... I guess... that since then things have gotten noticeably better? Reallocate funds for Icelandic air fare to developing an integrated player input function in the UI. Then talk directly to the customers with polls to collect demographics and game preferences
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RubyPorto
Profoundly Disturbed RED.Legion
1323
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 05:36:00 -
[202] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:RubyPorto wrote:Eternum Praetorian wrote:RubyPorto wrote:Eternum Praetorian wrote:Search About 3,690,000 results (0.31 seconds)
Seems fine to me. Who cares what region has the most of them? That is nearly four million hits for a SINGLE internet video game and that means it is running rampant. You searched isk sellers. Did you insted search "Isk Sellers who operate within the DRF"? Cause that's what you're arguing. Thx I actually did just that LOL This was an interesting read. Took you a while to find that. Now you have some solid evidence that botting/RMT was going on 3 years ago. Your argument is that it is going on today (or within the last ~6 months since I moved there). And yours is... I guess... that since then things have gotten noticeably better?
I need make no argument until you prove your case. Single-Shard, Player Driven Sandbox.
5 words. That's what makes it special in my eyes. |
Eternum Praetorian
Black Ops Trade Group
435
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 05:38:00 -
[203] - Quote
RubyPorto wrote:I need make no argument until you prove your case.
According to you I made a legitimate case that botting and RMT was a major issue 3 years ago, and was so in the drone regions among other places. I have also provided evidence as required. So... are you now going to pretend that I did not?
I ask you, do you believe that the situation has significantly improved since the publishing of that article? That is a simple enough of a question to ask, and it only requires a yes or a no. Unless ofc you want to play more debate team word games with me. Reallocate funds for Icelandic air fare to developing an integrated player input function in the UI. Then talk directly to the customers with polls to collect demographics and game preferences
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Alphea Abbra
Project Promethion
4
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 05:45:00 -
[204] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:RubyPorto wrote:I need make no argument until you prove your case. According to you I made a legitimate case that botting and RMT was a major issue 3 years ago, and was so in the drone regions among other places. I have also provided evidence as required. So... are you now going to pretend that I did not? I ask you, do you believe that the situation has significantly improved since the publishing of that article? One should assume so, yes. http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=687 + the others since then.
I like how you assume that the guy interviewed in the article is the ultimate truth on all things RMT in DRF land. The article has about the same level of trust from me as a Wikipedia article with only one source. Since that is what this guy is: One source, one opinion. If you can get, say, 50+ opinions or sources from clearly different people or parties, you can start making statistics. |
RubyPorto
Profoundly Disturbed RED.Legion
1323
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 05:50:00 -
[205] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:RubyPorto wrote:I need make no argument until you prove your case. According to you I made a legitimate case that botting and RMT was a major issue 3 years ago, and was so in the drone regions among other places. I have also provided evidence as required. So... are you now going to pretend that I did not? I ask you, do you believe that the situation has significantly improved since the publishing of that article? That is a simple enough of a question to ask, and it only requires a yes or a no. Unless ofc you want to play more debate team word games with me.
You provided one piece of evidence that RMT was a major issue 3 years ago. Unfortunately, your argument was that botting/RMT are a serious issue at present.
My answer to your question is:
I have absolutely no direct (or indirect) knowledge of the state of this area of space 3 years ago. At present, I have seen no direct evidence that botting occurs, and the only indirect evidence I see is of the ruthless persecution of what bots might exist. Like I said, I live in Detorid.
So as far as a yes or no; I don't know, as that would require knowledge of both states, and I only have knowledge of one state. Single-Shard, Player Driven Sandbox.
5 words. That's what makes it special in my eyes. |
Eternum Praetorian
Black Ops Trade Group
435
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 05:54:00 -
[206] - Quote
Alphea Abbra wrote:Eternum Praetorian wrote:RubyPorto wrote:I need make no argument until you prove your case. According to you I made a legitimate case that botting and RMT was a major issue 3 years ago, and was so in the drone regions among other places. I have also provided evidence as required. So... are you now going to pretend that I did not? I ask you, do you believe that the situation has significantly improved since the publishing of that article? One should assume so, yes. http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=687 + the others since then. I like how you assume that the guy interviewed in the article is the ultimate truth on all things RMT in DRF land. The article has about the same level of trust from me as a Wikipedia article with only one source. Since that is what this guy is: One source, one opinion. If you can get, say, 50+ opinions or sources from clearly different people or parties, you can start making statistics.
And here i was looking forward to RubyPorto's retort. Sigh...
I guess I am done here. I will just leave the readers with one last commentary before I turn in for the night. What exactly are these nay naysayers arguing? That there is not nearly 4M hits for RMT/botting mined isk on Google? That the CSM's do not game the voting system? That the drone regions do not have bots in their belts? That these things to not impact the game environment?
Is that what they are trying to argue?
Can you possibly believe that? Given the great wealth of player testimonials and both direct and circumstantial evidence presented over years of game play, are you to believe people when they make claims like these?
The only gain that I can see by them doing so, is the gain of self interest in order to protect their illegal activities, friends and assets. I hope you all enjoyed the show. That is all. Reallocate funds for Icelandic air fare to developing an integrated player input function in the UI. Then talk directly to the customers with polls to collect demographics and game preferences
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Eternum Praetorian
Black Ops Trade Group
435
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 06:00:00 -
[207] - Quote
RubyPorto wrote:Oh there you are...
So you don't know then. Well that was a waste of over an hour of my life. Gn! Reallocate funds for Icelandic air fare to developing an integrated player input function in the UI. Then talk directly to the customers with polls to collect demographics and game preferences
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RubyPorto
Profoundly Disturbed RED.Legion
1323
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 06:05:00 -
[208] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:
And here i was looking forward to RubyPorto's retort. Sigh...
I guess I am done here. I will just leave the readers with one last question before I turn in for the night. What exactly are these nay naysayers arguing? That there is not nearly 4M hits for RMT/botting mined isk on Google? That the CSM's do not game the voting system? That the drone regions do not have bots in their belts? That these things to not impact the game environment?
Is that what they are trying to argue? Can you possibly believe that? Given the great wealth of player testimonials and direct and circumstantial evidence presented over years of game play, are we really to believe people when they make claims like these?
The only gain that I can see by them doing so, is the gain of self interest in order to protect their illegal activities, friends and assets. I hope you all enjoyed the show. That is all.
Main reason I'm here is because you annoyed me with an unprovoked ad hominem attack. The fact that your argument does not line up with my experiences was a secondary concern.
As for the rest of this post. Aaron Sorkin (either on drugs or post rehab) you ain't. He gets to write impassioned pleas to win the argument via loquaciousness (he also usually lays out some evidence). You're not that good at writing.
1) We never denied the number of hits you got, just the wild inferences you made from that number. 2) The CSM voting system works by the number of accounts who support a candidate. The only way to game that would be via 4hr reactivations or Buddy invite chains >1month beforehand 3) I just said I have seen no direct evidence of bots in Detorid, and no evidence whatsoever of bots being tolerated in my Alliance. 4) Please stop, once again putting words in my mouth. I never said anything about any sort of effect on the game. 5) Per above, no that's not what we're arguing. 6) I like to think all of my statements are pretty defensible. 7) If you have such a wealth to draw upon, why have you not presented it? Single-Shard, Player Driven Sandbox.
5 words. That's what makes it special in my eyes. |
RubyPorto
Profoundly Disturbed RED.Legion
1323
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 06:08:00 -
[209] - Quote
Eternum Praetorian wrote:RubyPorto wrote:Oh there you are... So you don't know then. Well that was a waste of over an hour of my life. Gn!
You asked a question that cannot be possibly answered simply. You asked for a simple answer. "I don't know" is the closest approximation. Read above that, and you'll see what we like to call "context." Quoting somebody's statement's out of "context" is considered rude. Single-Shard, Player Driven Sandbox.
5 words. That's what makes it special in my eyes. |
bilingi
Ghosts of the Storm
23
|
Posted - 2012.01.30 08:18:00 -
[210] - Quote
no DIRECT EVIDENCE? HHAHAAHHAa so whos creating isk and super caps and such for these rmt sites.. SOme of those ships can only be done with allaince resources.....
Thats funny. No direct evidence.....SO which RMT site is yours? |
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