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Dred'Pirate Jesus
Amarr Ministry of War
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Posted - 2007.11.17 08:30:00 -
[1]
I was having a discussion with an unhappy player in another thread about refused ship loss petitions and we kind of came to an impass over a bit of data.. I belive him and others on the forums about getting the shank about thier petitions getting refused but I'm not convinced its really a widespread issue as most posters are simply angry and need to vent plus the fact you don't really see that many of those topics in the GD due to the ban on posting details about GM responces.. So its kinda hard to gauge if its just a random oversite or a real lack service..
But..
It should be perfectly fine to post that you do or did in fact have a petition filed and tell us if it was accepted or refused..
So what I propose is that the community go out into the games chat channels and ask players to come to this link and post that they have a petition filed in the last 3 months with its current status or its result if completed.. No need for details just the basics and maybe a short desciption of what happened to your ship if you feel like it to see if any recurring loss scenarios stand out.. Please no flames or such as all that this thread is for is to get an idea of how many petitions are out there and what the average percent of accepted vs refused is..
And go..
Originally by: David Hackworth ò If you find yourself in a fair fight, you didn't plan your mission properly.
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Hazurr
Amarr Krell Korp
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Posted - 2007.11.17 09:01:00 -
[2]
My Prophecy once desynced, after a week i got offered a new one wich i declined because i used the insurance money already
Please resize image to a maximum of 400 x 120, not exceeding 24000 bytes, ty. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] - Cortes
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Valharu
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Posted - 2007.11.17 09:19:00 -
[3]
I have lost several ships and petitioned them when I thought it was lag or whatever besides a clean kill against me.
I have gotten them all back in a timely mannor.
So I have nothing bad to say about CCP on this subject but praise instead.
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Sicil Fioet
Minmatar
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Posted - 2007.11.17 09:26:00 -
[4]
Petitioned on two occasions where I lost ships during what I thought were weird lag spikes, not in a massive fleet fight or in a heavy populated system or anything of this kind. Got both of those ships back.
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Arvald
Caldari Sten Industries
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Posted - 2007.11.17 10:16:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Arvald on 17/11/2007 10:16:09
Originally by: Dred'Pirate Jesus I was having a discussion with an unhappy player in another thread about refused ship loss petitions and we kind of came to an impass over a bit of data.. I belive him and others on the forums about getting the shank about thier petitions getting refused but I'm not convinced its really a widespread issue as most posters are simply angry and need to vent plus the fact you don't really see that many of those topics in the GD due to the ban on posting details about GM responces.. So its kinda hard to gauge if its just a random oversite or a real lack service..
But..
It should be perfectly fine to post that you do or did in fact have a petition filed and tell us if it was accepted or refused..
So what I propose is that the community go out into the games chat channels and ask players to come to this link and post that they have a petition filed in the last 3 months with its current status or its result if completed.. No need for details just the basics and maybe a short desciption of what happened to your ship if you feel like it to see if any recurring loss scenarios stand out.. Please no flames or such as all that this thread is for is to get an idea of how many petitions are out there and what the average percent of accepted vs refused is..
And go..
1. LOST SHIPS
Please note that the insurance payout received when a ship is lost will be subtracted from a playerÆs wallet if the ship is reimbursed.
Ships may be lost during combat with non-player (NPC) pirates or police forces, player-vs-player (PVP) combat or by self-destruction.
1. Ships lost in NPC combat may be replaced in cases where a bug has been verified through GM investigation as the cause. Such reimbursement would only be done at the discretion of a GM. 2. Ships lost during PVP combat may be replaced only in cases where a bug has been verified as the cause of the loss. Such reimbursement would only be done after an investigation and at the discretion of a GM. 3. Losses caused due to disconnection as a direct result of a server node drop or an unannounced server downtime may be reimbursed pending investigation by, and at the discretion of, a GM. Ships lost due to lag or non-server related disconnection will not be reimbursed. 4. Ships destroyed by use of the "self destruct" feature, whether intentionally or accidentally, cannot be reimbursed.
NOTE: Items looted from a wreck following the destruction of a ship cannot be replaced. Should your ship be destroyed, we advise you to seek out and collect your belongings as quickly as possible.
--------------------------- Im in your forums derailing your threads |
Weaselfish
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Posted - 2007.11.17 10:20:00 -
[6]
I lost a thorax after a patch, I warped into a mission I new well and got more or less instapopped. I petitioned as I couldn't see how frigates had killed me that quickly, it turned out the patch had put level 4 rats in a level 2 mission, I got my ship back the day after.
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Tao Han
Synthetic Frontiers
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Posted - 2007.11.17 10:23:00 -
[7]
Never lost a ship to any kind of bug.
Lag? Perhaps, but that was in situations where I was most likely to lose it anyway, so not worth petitioning it.
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AetomHaert Mother
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Posted - 2007.11.17 10:33:00 -
[8]
i have lost 2 ships to desynch, and have recieved none back. i am not bitter or upset, it just sucks to be me i guess.
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2007.11.17 10:34:00 -
[9]
/me holds his hand up.
Only petitioned once in since I started. The petition has been open for 3 weeks now and has been escalted to a senior GM.
I petitioned my Pod loss, not the ship (which has just fighter bombed by a half dozen carriers) After my pod warped out it landed a few seconds later at its point of origin, scrambled by 3 ships including a carrier. slowly podded.
Sorted
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2007.11.17 10:44:00 -
[10]
Originally by: AetomHaert Mother i have lost 2 ships to desynch, and have recieved none back. i am not bitter or upset, it just sucks to be me i guess.
"Our logs show nothing wrong"? Well obvisouly, if you where loggin the correct data would would have fixed the desyncs by now..... I would like them to replace that copy/paste responce with:
"Our logs are not covering all neccessary data to highlight the issue you described, as such we have decided to pat you on the back and say tough luck buddy"
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Ava Baby
Rule of Three
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Posted - 2007.11.17 10:54:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Ava Baby on 17/11/2007 10:55:49 Lost a ship due to the trash option being right below the make active option. Didn't get my ship back & lost a few BPOs that were in it's cargo hold. Canceled 2 accounts because I was told do to the rules of game...(or something along those lines) that it was not in their power to replace my ship.
Poor menu design + trashed ship + poor customer service (all around) = 2 canceled accounts
Originally by: Loyal Servant Fail.
Whining about whiners.
Epic fail.
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Darken Two
Gallente Cruororis Consors Conlegium Ivy League
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Posted - 2007.11.17 10:55:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Sorted
Originally by: AetomHaert Mother i have lost 2 ships to desynch, and have recieved none back. i am not bitter or upset, it just sucks to be me i guess.
"Our logs show nothing wrong"? Well obvisouly, if you where loggin the correct data would would have fixed the desyncs by now..... I would like them to replace that copy/paste responce with:
"Our logs are not covering all neccessary data to highlight the issue you described, as such we have decided to pat you on the back and say tough luck buddy"
It is a legitimate response tho. If their log shows nothing and they givein to every sob story about lost ships, there will be people left, right and centre losing ships and petitioning immediately after claiming some sort of error or the other.
Originally by: Blind Fear Generally, when trying to be a puppetmaster, it is considered good form not to wrap the strings around your neck and choke yourself.
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2007.11.17 11:08:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Darken Two
It is a legitimate response tho. If their log shows nothing and they givein to every sob story about lost ships, there will be people left, right and centre losing ships and petitioning immediately after claiming some sort of error or the other.
I apprciate the plight of the GMS, they can only work with what tools they have available. I still stay if the logs dont show sync problems then they need to expand what they log. In the case of desyncs they could request a host of voulenteers to to run a slightly modified client designed to ping the servers incrementaly and monitor extra facets of traffic (increasing network load) in a hope to narrow down the search. I still stand by - if the logs dont show a problem the logging system needs addressing. And I understand that GMs can only work with what they are given.
Its just a shame its such a long running problem.
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Darken Two
Gallente Cruororis Consors Conlegium Ivy League
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Posted - 2007.11.17 11:26:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Sorted
Originally by: Darken Two
It is a legitimate response tho. If their log shows nothing and they givein to every sob story about lost ships, there will be people left, right and centre losing ships and petitioning immediately after claiming some sort of error or the other.
I apprciate the plight of the GMS, they can only work with what tools they have available. I still stay if the logs dont show sync problems then they need to expand what they log. In the case of desyncs they could request a host of voulenteers to to run a slightly modified client designed to ping the servers incrementaly and monitor extra facets of traffic (increasing network load) in a hope to narrow down the search. I still stand by - if the logs dont show a problem the logging system needs addressing. And I understand that GMs can only work with what they are given.
Its just a shame its such a long running problem.
Yea I think they were trying to identify the cause of Desynchs on SISI last week. Hopefully, they've found the reasons for it.
I think the reimburse people their ships if it's lost due to desynch. Also think they log the desychs. Don't know how it works tho so can't be sure.
Originally by: Blind Fear Generally, when trying to be a puppetmaster, it is considered good form not to wrap the strings around your neck and choke yourself.
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James Lyrus
Lyrus Associates Enuma Elish.
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Posted - 2007.11.17 11:30:00 -
[15]
Have petitioned a ship loss on two, or three occasions. Each time, I got them back, within a few days.
However I should note that these were where I had a high degree of confidence that there were server problems (e.g. node crashed about when my stuff died, that kind of thing) -- Crane needs more grid 249km locking? GMP and TNP |
Tiger313
313th Squadron
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Posted - 2007.11.17 11:32:00 -
[16]
Just lost my CNR last week in a lvl 4 mission: got pwned by my ISP (cable connection dropped). It's not getting reimbursed. Tough luck. Should go and slap some of my ISP's employees around a bit with a smelly ole carp.
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James Lyrus
Lyrus Associates Enuma Elish.
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Posted - 2007.11.17 11:32:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Ava Baby Edited by: Ava Baby on 17/11/2007 10:55:49 Lost a ship due to the trash option being right below the make active option. Didn't get my ship back & lost a few BPOs that were in it's cargo hold. Canceled 2 accounts because I was told do to the rules of game...(or something along those lines) that it was not in their power to replace my ship.
Poor menu design + trashed ship + poor customer service (all around) = 2 canceled accounts
This post amuses me. -- Crane needs more grid 249km locking? GMP and TNP |
northwesten
Amarr Trinity Corporate Services
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Posted - 2007.11.17 11:33:00 -
[18]
I lost a ship inside a POS! The Sheild was active and hostile fleet pop me ship. I never got my ship back because they said POS wasn't active 2 Password was not set. They were wrong Password was set and POS was active. In my eyes GM don't know crap. They also stated no lag or bugs they are ware of. Even tho alot of people were getting poped at one point inside POS.
Also I asked about shares on my corp to remove 9500 shares and i have seen 3 corp that only have 500 shares but the reply from GM saying cant remove them we dont have the tools. I mean .... how are these corps have 500 shares then and less than a year old?
Corporation Website
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Bulletproof Cupid
SPECTRE Ops
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Posted - 2007.11.17 11:36:00 -
[19]
People should state if petition was during pvp or pve, Ive had all my pve petioned ships replaced (2) and none of the ones I petitioned in pvp (also 2)
BP ------------- Lost Without a Clue |
northwesten
Amarr Trinity Corporate Services
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Posted - 2007.11.17 11:38:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Tiger313 Just lost my CNR last week in a lvl 4 mission: got pwned by my ISP (cable connection dropped). It's not getting reimbursed. Tough luck. Should go and slap some of my ISP's employees around a bit with a smelly ole carp. [/quote
speak to you ISP and see have they got that log. If so send it to CCP they wouldn't at first but when i spoken to my ISP and sent them the email they rein bust me.
Corporation Website
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2007.11.17 11:39:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Darken Two
I think the reimburse people their ships if it's lost due to desynch. Also think they log the desychs. Don't know how it works tho so can't be sure.
They, apparently, dont (from first hand expierence) and afaik they havent found out the cause or the soulution. They are just trying multiple "soloutions" in a hope that one of them is it.
Reminds me of modern doctors - they have a rough idea, a computer to enter the symptoms into: computer says- take these drugs, see how you get on.. they didnt cure it ?. ok,. try these? no?.. ok these.. no?.. .. it killed him?. damn, NEXT!
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Darken Two
Gallente Cruororis Consors Conlegium Ivy League
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Posted - 2007.11.17 11:40:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Ava Baby Edited by: Ava Baby on 17/11/2007 10:55:49 Lost a ship due to the trash option being right below the make active option. Didn't get my ship back & lost a few BPOs that were in it's cargo hold. Canceled 2 accounts because I was told do to the rules of game...(or something along those lines) that it was not in their power to replace my ship.
Poor menu design + trashed ship + poor customer service (all around) = 2 canceled accounts
You are asked for confirmation before you trash items.
If you go theorugh teh rules about ship reimbursement, it clearly states they will not reimburse ships lost due to trashing,
CCP has done nothing wrong in your case.
Originally by: Blind Fear Generally, when trying to be a puppetmaster, it is considered good form not to wrap the strings around your neck and choke yourself.
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VicturusTeSaluto
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Posted - 2007.11.17 11:54:00 -
[23]
CCP is only likely to give you back the ship if you were mission carebearing. If you were actually playing and some kind of huge technical ****-up occurs you are unlikely to get anything back.
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SiJira
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Posted - 2007.11.17 20:46:00 -
[24]
Edited by: SiJira on 17/11/2007 20:46:03 silly rabbit reimbursements are for bob ____ __ ________ _sig below_ devs and gms cant modify my sig if they tried! _lies above_ CCP Morpheus was here Morpheus Fails. You need colors!! -Kaemonn [yellow]Kaem |
Dramaticus
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.11.17 20:49:00 -
[25]
I dont even bother. When 200 people can lose a ship at the same place and none ever had control of their ship, yet logs "show nothing", whats the point.
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Stitcher
Caldari legion of qui Terra Incognita.
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Posted - 2007.11.17 21:26:00 -
[26]
Every time I've actually felt it worth petitioning a ship loss, I've received reimbursement. The last time was a Scorpion that I lost in Deklein because its smartbombs and ECM wouldn't activate despite the capacitor being nearly completely full, nor would the drones launch - with the result that a crappy tech 1 frigate managed to hold me down and let its HAC buddies end me.
I petitioned it, got my Scorp back. Went on to lose it fair and square in a real fight three days later.
The thing is, people think that the GMs suck because they never see "Thank you for reimbursing my ship" threads. If all the people who actually managed to get reimbursed properly came onto this board and posted about it, we'd be inundated. - The game is not the problem. The problem is that you are not adapting to the game.
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Minerva Vulcan
Caldari The Nexus Foundation
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Posted - 2007.11.17 22:06:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Ava Baby Edited by: Ava Baby on 17/11/2007 10:55:49 Lost a ship due to the trash option being right below the make active option. Didn't get my ship back & lost a few BPOs that were in it's cargo hold. Canceled 2 accounts because I was told do to the rules of game...(or something along those lines) that it was not in their power to replace my ship.
Poor menu design + trashed ship + poor customer service (all around) = 2 canceled accounts
Epic lulz.
It's not like there was a second:
"You are about to throw away one unit of (Ship).
Are you absolutely sure you want to do this?"
warning or anything that you clicked ok to instead of paying attention. It's not like that should have told you something since you *don't* get any popups when making another ship active.
Clearly CCP's fault.
In before "Can I have what's left of your stuff."
Actually... Can I? _______________________________ I need new voices in my head, To speak my secret evils with. I need new lovers in my bed, To be my friends and special pets. |
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