EVE Search - Abolish the CONCORD Assembly

All Channels

Intergalactic Summit

Abolish the CONCORD Assembly

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: 1 [2] 3 :: one page
Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Tablaren Kingdom of Kador Dark Matter Coalition	Posted - 2007.11.26 11:54:00 - [31] Edited by: Tablaren on 26/11/2007 12:03:04 Originally by: Confliktus As long as the Amarrians dictate the rules, trough royal councelors, by wich the amatars and khanid have to live by you cannot consider them sovereign states. So again there no such thing as 6 nations. You went to the State War Academy didn't you? The khanid have a king, not a governor. The highest amarr official stationed in their homeworlds is an ambassador. The Ambassador does not make khanid policy, Khanid makes Khanid policy. But this is off topic. The topic is that we need to rid ourselves of the DED vermin who infest our space.
Confliktus Caldari Black Motion Industries	Posted - 2007.11.26 14:43:00 - [32] Originally by: Tablaren Edited by: Tablaren on 26/11/2007 12:03:04 Originally by: Confliktus As long as the Amarrians dictate the rules, trough royal councelors, by wich the amatars and khanid have to live by you cannot consider them sovereign states. So again there no such thing as 6 nations. You went to the State War Academy didn't you? The khanid have a king, not a governor. The highest amarr official stationed in their homeworlds is an ambassador. The Ambassador does not make khanid policy, Khanid makes Khanid policy. But this is off topic. The topic is that we need to rid ourselves of the DED vermin who infest our space. The king that has heritage of the former heir to the throne of the Amarrian Empire and fled because he wouldn't comit to the rules. The king that must abide by the Amarrian rule or suffer the consequences, tell me, can the "kingdom" sustain an assault by the Amarrian armed forces? By the way, i happen to support the "vermin" you wish to erradicate, because those vermin are everyday on the frontline inspecting and apreending ships, criminals, suspects, in sum doing the job that the navys can't or won't do. The vermin that ensure high sec space is in fact a bit more safer than lowsec. Can you do the job that these vermin do in equall manner at least? Can you or your alliance garantee that innocent civilians are not harmed by outlaws? Can you prevent the contraband from entering or leaving empire borders? Can you perform extensive investigations on various atrocities and crimes comited troughout the cluster? I and many of the DED/Concord supporters honestly don't think so. If people would work together instead of against each other you'd have a better life in the cluster, but alas, life isn't perfect and its our job to assure that things improve one step at the time.
Wreth Saran Caldari The Star Wolves Aunni Ti Tsuun Consortium	Posted - 2007.11.26 18:51:00 - [33] Regardless of whoever is right or wrong CONCORD need to cooperate if they wish to gain the trust of the people again, there is no use in hiding behind a cloak regardless of whether you are innocent or guilty as even people who would otherwise support you will distrust you even more. If they show willingness to allow an investigation to prove that they are innocent of any crimes then they will have at least my respect, if not well, then that will be a matter that will need to be decided by our own empires and states.
Dr Grot Gallente Garoun Investment Bank	Posted - 2007.11.26 23:00:00 - [34] Edited by: Dr Grot on 26/11/2007 23:00:56 Just a few facts I feel need to be sorted out. The Khanid Kingdom is regarded as a sovereign state. The Khanid Kingdom stretches over some dozen systems near the fringe of the Amarr Empire. The kingdom was founded some 300 years ago and is in every respect a sovereign state, even if the connections with the Amarr Empire itself are strong. Source The Ammatar Mandate is considered a semi-sovereign state. The Ammatars have a semi-sovereign state bound to the Amarr Empire. The Ammatar Consulate is the highest governmental office for the Ammatars and takes care of the general running of the Ammatar state. It is manned by Ammatars, but they all bow to the Ammatar governor, which is an Amarrian. Source
Kirren D'marr	Posted - 2007.11.28 00:05:00 - [35] Some of those here seem to be under the mistaken impression that a "nation" and an "empire" are the same thing. They are not. By definition, an empire is comprised of multiple nations. So yes, there are 5 empires, and there are more nations within those empires. Too many capsuleers don't seem to bother learning a bit of politics and/or vocabulary these days. Pity.
Raznarok D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.11.28 00:42:00 - [36] I'd like to see the "mighty" Amarr Empire take out CONCORD, tbh. Surely with God as backup, they can't fail.
Maya Hitomi	Posted - 2007.11.28 02:56:00 - [37] Not this again... groans.
Confliktus Caldari Black Motion Industries	Posted - 2007.11.29 13:07:00 - [38] Originally by: Kirren D'marr Some of those here seem to be under the mistaken impression that a "nation" and an "empire" are the same thing. They are not. By definition, an empire is comprised of multiple nations. So yes, there are 5 empires, and there are more nations within those empires. Too many capsuleers don't seem to bother learning a bit of politics and/or vocabulary these days. Pity. That is the reason i stoped arguing wether Khanid and the Amatar responded to the Amarrians or not. Most people seem to confuse the meaning of Nation and Empire. But alas, your response Mrs.D'marr is clear enough over the subject.
Redpants Gallente Dark Star LTD Atrocitas	Posted - 2007.11.29 18:24:00 - [39] Originally by: marieclaude alt im not certain abolishing concord is a good idea as without them all space would become unsafe.i propose that concord share some thier diabolicale ships and weapons with the law abiding public. say form a corp that citzens could do trade and missions for? hand out blueprint copies to the concord commander battleships perhaps? maybe a liaison between concord and the public to sort out when citizens make honest mistakes rather than just blow up your ship and ask questions at the funeral. It is the perpetuation of this misconception that has led CONCORD to become as powerful as they are and will continue to hold them there. NO. They are not a neccesity. All of space as you say will not become unsafe. As if it's safe by any definition now. Keeping spacelanes "safer" should be the responsibility of the governments. They already fly side by side with CONCORD in many of the higher high security systems as it is, I don't see why the CONCORD ships need to be there along side of them. All they do is encourage conflict with their laws and regulations, not to mention extremely shifty if not flawed to its core bounty system. Some can argue it was designed to be corrupt from the beginning. I agree that the CONCORD Assembly should be absorbed into the local governmental law enforcement bodies/navies or dissolved in its entirety. "My once immaculate white pants are now stained from the weak and innocent. I don't wear red."
Daelin Blackleaf Aliastra	Posted - 2007.12.03 23:07:00 - [40] There is no misconception. The only empire with a police force is the State. The Navy is not a police force, they don't have the training, the numbers, or the inclination to be one. We do not need navy vessels blowing up convoys because they suspect a pick-pocket may be on-board. In short the navies are not precision implements and not something that should be turned on their own people. Another problem is us. With all the funding and advanced technology from all five empires the DED still has trouble dealing with capsuleers. The navies would be at far greater risk, they certainly don't fare too well at seeing off those who are not welcome in their space. Lastly we yet again face the issue of a pilot who doesn't understand that CONCORD is not only the DED but also the SCC, the ISD, STAR, AURORA, the CRC, and more. Each department providing an essential service from trade regulation to maintaining this very forum of communication. This is without considering the primary purpose of CONCORD, that of providing a means for the other empires to improve relations, smooth over incidents, and better co-ordinate efforts that benefit two or more of them. Without doubt CONCORD has settled many disputes that would otherwise have led to a cluster-wide war. Without CONCORD this is no concordance. -------- EVE Trinity: THE SKY IS FALLING!
Kirren D'marr	Posted - 2007.12.04 21:02:00 - [41] It is easy to see why certain capsuleers would favor the dissolution of CONCORD. As Mr. Blackleaf points out, CONCORD has difficulty dealing with pod pilots. We are difficult to control, and difficult to discipline, as we refuse to stay dead. If the time comes that we become more trouble than we are worth, then it is conceiveable that in the future individual empires or CONCORD may choose to abolish pod pilots, through the removal of cloning technology, freezing of our accounts, or even imprisonment. However, without the presence of CONCORD to facilitate relations between the empires, open conflict would become a very real possibility. Do not deceive yourselves, there are deep differences between the empires, and if communication were to break down, it would only be a matter of time before a war broke out. In such a conflict, capsuleers quickly become a valuable asset, and each empire would desire as many as possible fighting for their side. The status of pod pilot would be one of prestige, even greater than it is now, and our power would grow. And so the reasoning is simple: abolish CONCORD, improve the status of the pod pilots. These are the thoughts of the selfish, the callous who care not for what happens to the rest of humanity, so long as they themselves want for nothing. So what is the solution for the conscientous capsuleer, who seeks not his own glory above the wellbeing of all? If we are to avoid the first scenario, we must avoid becoming a nusiance to the people and the governments. To do this, we must police ourselves. We must take action against those of us who seek to harm others, as our survival depends upon us being a greater benefit to humanity than we are a problem. Capsuleers who wantonly attack and destroy civilians and openly defy CONCORD put us all at risk of extinction; and if they refuse to end their actions, it is the duty of each and every pod pilot to stop them.
Gaven Lok'ri Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2007.12.06 04:25:00 - [42] Quote: They are there to protect the five empires assets, interests, and safety in space from threats both external and internal. They are not there to protect us. It's more often a case of them defending the empires from us. Which is why a terrorist can destroy convoys in Amarr without any penalty from CONCORD, but when I fire on that terrorist CONCORD will destroy me in seconds. Oh right, that would imply the exact opposite. Deus Vult! PIE Website Public Channel: 'PIE Public'
Tahti Gaikoukan Caldari Lai Dai Infinity Systems	Posted - 2007.12.06 13:15:00 - [43] Quote: The only empire with a police force is the State. I think you have mistaken either CBD's or Sukuuvestaa's police and security arms - Peace and Order Unit and Spacelane Patrol, for State police forces. Each of the Mega corporations has a police and security arm. At the moment no megacorp owns the gates and thus would not have a reason to police them. The Megacorps can not claim an asteroid belt and so would have little reason to police them unless they are working them. These police do not police the entirety of the State. Traditional Navies deal with piracy. Chief of Public Relations, Lai Dai Infinity Systems
Daelin Blackleaf Aliastra	Posted - 2007.12.06 18:59:00 - [44] Originally by: Tahti Gaikoukan Quote: The only empire with a police force is the State. I think you have mistaken either CBD's or Sukuuvestaa's police and security arms - Peace and Order Unit and Spacelane Patrol, for State police forces. Not at all, Ms Gaikoukan. I consider the security forces to be entities that police and secure the interests of their parent corporation. They do not concern themselves with unoccupied belts or gates. Doing so would be a gross waste of resources. They do not deal with capsuleer piracy, nor does the navy, this is a task covered by the DED even in Caldari space. The implication was however that were CONCORD to be closed down then the State would be the only empire capable of making a smooth transition from CONCORD and DED policing to handling it internally. The only empire not forced to turn military forces not accustomed to dealing with civilian affairs on their own people. Of course the issues of jurisdiction and hostile capsuleer alliances would still make such a change highly disagreeable, costly, and inefficient. -------- EVE Trinity: THE SKY IS FALLING!
Tahti Gaikoukan Caldari Lai Dai Infinity Systems	Posted - 2007.12.06 20:15:00 - [45] Thank you for clearing up what you meant. Chief of Public Relations, Lai Dai Infinity Systems
Gaven Lok'ri Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2007.12.06 21:29:00 - [46] Oh, we don't have a police force. Right. I'll have to tell the Ministry of Internal Order that they are out of their jobs. Deus Vult! PIE Website Public Channel: 'PIE Public'
Andreus Ixiris Gallente Dichotomy Total Comfort	Posted - 2007.12.06 21:35:00 - [47] Yeah, best do that Gaven. Wasn't exactly like they were doing a very good job anyway ¼_¼ ----- The views expressed in these posts, while inarguably correct, are not neccessarily the views of my corporation or alliance. I never sleep. I wait.
Daelin Blackleaf Aliastra	Posted - 2007.12.07 03:50:00 - [48] The Ministry is very different from a police force. The purpose of the MoIO is weeding out those who do not belong within Amarr society and monitoring the actions of foreigners within the Empires borders. A police force does not eradicate people for not fitting in. A police force is not a tool of God, being guided by the Theology council I imagine many Amarrians consider the Ministry to be just that. -------- EVE Trinity: THE SKY IS FALLING!
Gaven Lok'ri Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2007.12.07 04:00:00 - [49] Edited by: Gaven Lok''ri on 07/12/2007 04:00:18 No. A police force is an entity whose job it is to enforce the laws of a State. No more and no less. That is exactly what the ministry does, as was evidenced by its involvement early last year. It would enforce Amarrian Laws in Amarrian Space, if CONCORD wasnt enforcing CONCORD laws in Amarrian space instead. The worst part is that CONCORD doesnt protect the Empires. It merely keeps pod pilots from shooting each other without first bribing them. Please explain to me why CONCORD is not stepping in right now to protect Amarrian Sovereignty from the Defiants? Or why it allows pod pilots to kill whatever they want in Amarrian space, as long as its not pod pilots, without allowing the empires to respond in force to the pod pilots themselves? Either CONCORD needs to enforce absolute peace, and that means crushing pilots from entities such as the Ushra'Khan when they destroy convoys in Amarr or extralegal forces like the Defiants, or it needs to be abolished and allow the Empires to use the resources currently being spent on CONCORD to defend themselves in their own manner. Deus Vult! PIE Website Public Channel: 'PIE Public'
Daelin Blackleaf Aliastra	Posted - 2007.12.07 13:36:00 - [50] I stand corrected, the Ministry is just a police force and nothing more. The Ministry evidently also has a fleet able to match the DED in size and power. The Ministry is also free to act within other empires, to deal with criminals who base themselves there or who flee abroad. The Ministry is even capable of striking outlaw faction targets across the cluster, including in their own space. Meanwhile CONCORD's sole purpose is to appear when pod pilots shoot at each other in secure space without sanctions and destroy the offender. Already the Ministry has the issue of outlaw factions and pirate capsuleers well in hand. Truly the Amarrian Empire is blessed with peace. CONCORD has not intervened regarding the Defiants most likely because either the Empire hasn't motioned for it to do so or such a motion has been turned down. But fear not, the mighty fleets of the Ministry, who's abilities outstrip any fleet using the combined expertise and technology of the five empires, will deal with them soon enough. Or could it be the case that the Ministry has less resources than the Amarrian Navy, a fleet that is incapable of its assigned tasks of stopping capsuleer smugglers or enemies of the Empires from rampaging through your space? -------- EVE Trinity: THE SKY IS FALLING!
Gaven Lok'ri Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2007.12.07 18:02:00 - [51] You know, if you werent being such a sarcastic fool, you might have noticed a couple key phrases: Quote: if CONCORD wasnt enforcing CONCORD laws in Amarrian space instead. And Quote: allow the Empires to use the resources currently being spent on CONCORD to defend themselves in their own manner. Maybe you should consider what all of the Empires putting their resources into CONCORD, an entity which for some strange reason does not actually protect them from pod pilot aggression, actually means. If CONCORD can do all these amazing things, the empires could do exactly the same in their own right. After all, they are funding CONCORD. Or CONCORD could start actually keeping the peace, instead of actually aiding the cause for chaos and war the way their allowing of pod pilot aggression against the empires and their failed investigation into the demise of Doriam II does. Deus Vult! PIE Website Public Channel: 'PIE Public'
Nachshon Caldari Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2007.12.07 18:27:00 - [52] Gaven, while I do approve of the actions of the Defiants in particular, I can sympathize regarding the general issue with pirates. We have issues with the Angel Cartel similar to you and the Blood Raiders. Capsuleers are forced to form paramilitaries to defend their space where CONCORD will not lift a finger. ____________________________________ Caldari by birth, Minmatar by citizenship. The True Meaning of Freedom
Erasma Dynami Astropolitan Front	Posted - 2007.12.08 07:19:00 - [53] Originally by: Gaven Lok'ri You know, if you werent being such a sarcastic fool, you might have noticed a couple key phrases: Quote: if CONCORD wasnt enforcing CONCORD laws in Amarrian space instead. And Quote: allow the Empires to use the resources currently being spent on CONCORD to defend themselves in their own manner. Maybe you should consider what all of the Empires putting their resources into CONCORD, an entity which for some strange reason does not actually protect them from pod pilot aggression, actually means. If CONCORD can do all these amazing things, the empires could do exactly the same in their own right. After all, they are funding CONCORD. Or CONCORD could start actually keeping the peace, instead of actually aiding the cause for chaos and war the way their allowing of pod pilot aggression against the empires and their failed investigation into the demise of Doriam II does. I would disagree here. If CONCORD allows the seperate Nations build up their navies to regulate and control piracy and combat in as effective a manner, tensions between them would escalate due to the larger amount of firepower present at the borders. History has shown us what can happen when two seperate governments, rather than a mediator, have armed ships at the ready in the same location. ____________________________
Gaven Lok'ri Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2007.12.08 07:45:00 - [54] Then CONCORD needs to start actually keeping the peace. Its not. So I fail to see how they are succeeding in mediating anything. Deus Vult! PIE Website Public Channel: 'PIE Public'
Confliktus Caldari Black Motion Industries	Posted - 2007.12.08 10:35:00 - [55] Originally by: Gaven Lok'ri Oh, we don't have a police force. Right. I'll have to tell the Ministry of Internal Order that they are out of their jobs. You could tell them that Mr.Gaven, while Concord deals with multiple regions all across the empires your Ministry of Internal Order seems to be failing at keeping the peace in one single region, The Bleak Lands. Seems that in the overall Concord isn't doing such a bad job.
Daelin Blackleaf Aliastra	Posted - 2007.12.08 20:26:00 - [56] Gaven, as numerous as CONCORD ships are they cannot be everywhere at once. CONCORD does not enforce CONCORD laws, the only laws and directives CONCORD does enforce are those put forward by the assembly. These are therefore inter-empire laws agreed upon by all governments. If one government, for example, refuses to make slavery or small arms illegal then CONCORD will not interfere with slavers or arms dealers. In short, CONCORD policy, from war decs and sales taxes to levels of protection and security status is either mandated by or agreed upon by the member empires. If you have a problem with such things perhaps you should look to the representatives. Also, while at the highest levels largely run democratically by all of the empires, the empires do not fund CONCORD anywhere near as much as they used to. The organization is approaching complete fiscal independence. As for your other statements, the Ministry of Internal Order isn't doing a whole lot to protect Ammarian convoys or defend against terrorists operating in space. As far as I'm aware the MoIO doesn't even have a presence in space and is reliant solely upon capsuleers in this regard. I hardly see how an organization that has no fleet and operates planet-side can take over as a space based police force. Even if they could the aforementioned issues facing any Caldari security force would lead them to remain a less favorable option than the current situation. -------- EVE Trinity: THE SKY IS FALLING!
Kaleigh Doyle Heavenly Bodies	Posted - 2007.12.09 20:54:00 - [57] Oh, how adorable! You can tell CONCORD is doing its job when all the warmongers are up in arms and agreeing with one another. Thankfully, none of you can actually do anything beyond flailing your arms and turn red in the face. I wonder how many of you would beg for their return if CONCORD suddenly disappeared one lonely night, and all the real wolves came out to play...
Darth Revanant Amarr 1st Praetorian Guard Vigilia Valeria	Posted - 2007.12.10 04:54:00 - [58] Originally by: Kaleigh Doyle Oh, how adorable! You can tell CONCORD is doing its job when all the warmongers are up in arms and agreeing with one another. Thankfully, none of you can actually do anything beyond flailing your arms and turn red in the face. I wonder how many of you would beg for their return if CONCORD suddenly disappeared one lonely night, and all the real wolves came out to play... First, CONCORD being dissolved does not mean all space becomes lawless. It means the Imperial Navies would be doing the work of CONCORD, as it should be. Secondly, you apparently haven't paid too much attention to those times when many of those posting here have gone up against those "real wolves". _______________ Recruitment Office
Kaleigh Doyle Heavenly Bodies	Posted - 2007.12.10 17:04:00 - [59] There's always a bigger fish, Darth Revenant. Be lucky it's CONCORD and not some Warlord grasping for universal power.
Daelin Blackleaf Aliastra	Posted - 2007.12.11 04:22:00 - [60] I suppose the navies are doing an admirable job of keeping space considered lo-sec secure at the moment? No, they are not, either they don't have the man power, can't act in that capacity, or the empires simply don't give a damn about the space around the backwater worlds. I doubt the latter is true, but it does seem evident that if the navies were capable of replacing the DED they could at least be securing those sectors not covered by regular DED patrols. -------- Idling until the Virgin Media crisis is over.

Pages: 1 [2] 3 :: one page
First page \| Previous page \| Next page \| Last page

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online, the EVE logo, EVE and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to EVE-Search.com to use EVE Online and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, EVE-Search.com. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.