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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Jotan Veer
HUN Corp. HUN Reloaded
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Posted - 2007.11.22 20:17:00 -
[1]
After the latest test patch, the Onyx (HIC) is no longer a variant of the Caracal but instead a variant of the Moa from the invention point of view.
Apart from the ship model and the invention BPC requirement nothing else seems to have changed (someone who has the previous version's screenshot can look into that), it is still a missileboat.
So, what is the reason for this change? (Other than forcing the prospective Onyx inventors to buy a Moa BPO).
HUN Corp. recruitment info (Hungarian players only) |
Sviatoslav KillJoy
The Templars Knights Edge Of Sanity
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Posted - 2007.11.22 20:20:00 -
[2]
Maybe the change made things a bit simpler for them. Remember that CCP said that everything is subjected to changed. Nothing was promiced except for the release of new ships and trinity graphics engine m8.
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Mastin Dragonfly
Bloodthorn Voyages
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Posted - 2007.11.22 20:22:00 -
[3]
Cause all the other HICS are based on tier 3 cruisers?
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Arkady Sadik
Gradient Electus Matari
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Posted - 2007.11.22 20:24:00 -
[4]
The other HICs are all tech 2 variants from the tier 3 cruisers. The Caracal is the Caldari tier 2 cruiser, while the Moa is the tier 3 cruiser. So this change brought it all in line.
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Tradesman Mcgee
Caldari Derek Knows Us
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Posted - 2007.11.22 20:33:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Tradesman Mcgee on 22/11/2007 20:37:30 The change sure as heck screw over those that plan ahead and try to stock up on caracal blueprints. Way to go. Cheap caracal bpcs anyone? -------------------------- Research & Trade |
Ral Ulgur
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2007.11.22 20:37:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Mastin Dragonfly Cause all the other HICS are based on tier 3 cruisers?
This!
Thanks CCP for listening (or just for doing the right thing :))
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Ina Mina
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Posted - 2007.11.22 20:42:00 -
[7]
Wow...stupid mistakes for sure, if you wanted it to be the damn MOA model, why didnt you use that in the first place? Guess its time to try to dump some bloody caracal prints and make Moa. Thanks for nothing.
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James Lyrus
Lyrus Associates Enuma Elish.
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Posted - 2007.11.22 21:17:00 -
[8]
I actually rather liked the fact that the Onyx was Caracal based. I mean, it's not like tiers should actually be relevant anyway.
*shrug*. 's long as it's the right colours (e.g. Kaalakiota black and orange) I may cope) -- Crane needs more grid 249km locking? GMP and TNP |
Merin Ryskin
FinFleet Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.11.22 21:32:00 -
[9]
Hell no! CCP, put it back. This is insane. Not only is it absurd that the Moa, a railboat, suddenly turns into a missile-armed HIC, but the Onyx actually looked good as a Caracal variant! Now it's the ugliest ship in the game. Now either:
1) Put it back to the Caracal model ASAP, and screw the whiners who want it to be a tier-3 like the others.
2) Give it a massive boost to compensate for the nerf to its appearance, or nobody will fly it. Something like 8 turret slots, 10% optimal/level x2, 5% shield resists/level, and the shield HP of a capital ship (with cruiser recharge time, of course). This would be the absolute minimum, I think, anything less and anyone accidentally undocking one will have to immediately self destruct in shame.
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Verx Interis
Amarr Aurora Security
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Posted - 2007.11.22 21:42:00 -
[10]
Think of it this way: You can force them to have to look at the ugly Moa model because they can't warp
-----sig-starts-here------ I survived Armageddon Day. I'm just too lazy to put a picture of a nuke in here. |
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Gecko O'Bac
Aquilae Stellaris Talon Alliance
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Posted - 2007.11.22 21:46:00 -
[11]
Now, I will fly the Onyx no matter what...
But... PRETTY PLEAAAAAAAAAASEEEE gimme back my caracal model =( Moa simply looks like the illegitimate son of "The Blob" and a trodden over horse crap =(
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Abn Matar
Minmatar Genco Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.11.22 22:10:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Merin Ryskin Hell no! CCP, put it back. This is insane. Not only is it absurd that the Moa, a railboat, suddenly turns into a missile-armed HIC, but the Onyx actually looked good as a Caracal variant! Now it's the ugliest ship in the game. Now either:
1) Put it back to the Caracal model ASAP, and screw the whiners who want it to be a tier-3 like the others.
2) Give it a massive boost to compensate for the nerf to its appearance, or nobody will fly it. Something like 8 turret slots, 10% optimal/level x2, 5% shield resists/level, and the shield HP of a capital ship (with cruiser recharge time, of course). This would be the absolute minimum, I think, anything less and anyone accidentally undocking one will have to immediately self destruct in shame.
Are you serious? LOL, i think its strange that you say that. Ever seen the Sacrilege? It has missile bonuses but its a LASERBOAT?!?!?!? WHAT IN THE WORLD? CCP, NERF!!!... or not Sig removed, lacks Eve-related content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] - Cortes |
Merin Ryskin
FinFleet Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2007.11.22 22:28:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Abn Matar
Originally by: Merin Ryskin Hell no! CCP, put it back. This is insane. Not only is it absurd that the Moa, a railboat, suddenly turns into a missile-armed HIC, but the Onyx actually looked good as a Caracal variant! Now it's the ugliest ship in the game. Now either:
1) Put it back to the Caracal model ASAP, and screw the whiners who want it to be a tier-3 like the others.
2) Give it a massive boost to compensate for the nerf to its appearance, or nobody will fly it. Something like 8 turret slots, 10% optimal/level x2, 5% shield resists/level, and the shield HP of a capital ship (with cruiser recharge time, of course). This would be the absolute minimum, I think, anything less and anyone accidentally undocking one will have to immediately self destruct in shame.
Are you serious? LOL, i think its strange that you say that. Ever seen the Sacrilege? It has missile bonuses but its a LASERBOAT?!?!?!? WHAT IN THE WORLD? CCP, NERF!!!... or not
1) The Maller is not an ugly abomination, so the Sacrilege does not have this issue.
2) There is no perfectly good Amarr T1 missile cruiser to copy. On the other hand, there IS a Caldari missile hull already, so there is no reason to use the Moa.
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James Lyrus
Lyrus Associates Enuma Elish.
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Posted - 2007.11.22 22:43:00 -
[14]
I think I would wager beer, that the person doing the ship designs of the new ones, just kinda worked down the 'obvious' combat cruisers of each race, and came up with maller/thorax/rupture/caracal, and didn't notice that actually the Moa is the tier 3, despite it really being sub-standard compared to the Caracal (and all the rest TBH). -- Crane needs more grid 249km locking? GMP and TNP |
Lord DarkStar
Gallente Mobile Alcohol Processing Units United Freemen Alliance
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Posted - 2007.11.22 22:44:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Ina Mina Wow...stupid mistakes for sure, if you wanted it to be the damn MOA model, why didnt you use that in the first place? Guess its time to try to dump some bloody caracal prints and make Moa. Thanks for nothing.
lol,you are a fool,the test server can change 100 times a day,you should know better then to believe anything thats not live
We of the Unicorn clan are the best horsemen in the land,our horses are our lives and brothers,we fight as one,we live as one,we die as one. |
Exlegion
Caldari New Light Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2007.11.22 23:18:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Exlegion on 22/11/2007 23:20:41
Originally by: Tradesman Mcgee Edited by: Tradesman Mcgee on 22/11/2007 20:37:30 The change sure as heck screw over those that plan ahead and try to stock up on caracal blueprints. Way to go. Cheap caracal bpcs anyone?
In all fairness, you're not supposed to be investing based on (or profitting off of) Sisi information. The devs have made it very clear that Sisi changes are *never* set in stone. Needless to say trying to manipulate market prices on Tranquility from Sisi information isn't fair to those players not logging into Sisi. Remember, Sisi is a *testing* server, not a crystal ball into TQ's future.
One of us equals many of us. Disrespect one of us, you'll see plenty of us. - Guru |
ExcellciuM
Exair Industries United Connection's
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Posted - 2007.11.22 23:32:00 -
[17]
Great, i was going to get the onyx but now, no thanks.
I prefer not to look at something that looks like it was half finished and rushed out to the public via a 5th storey window and as it hit the floor was crushed.
Who cares which tier the others are based on? at least they are decent enough to look at (and have decent uses unlike the Moa).
Changing it to missiles is a little weird though, if its a Moa hull shouldn't it at least be a turret ship, of course it wouldn't be a sniper ship as it has to be close enough to use the interdiction sphere, but maybe instead or range bonus it could have a damage bonus instead.
Then again it could just be a Caracal hull again and all will be right with the world.
Also a little of topic but they took of the space camo from the widow aswell
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Abn Matar
Minmatar Genco Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.11.22 23:40:00 -
[18]
Originally by: ExcellciuM Great, i was going to get the onyx but now, no thanks.
I prefer not to look at something that looks like it was half finished and rushed out to the public via a 5th storey window and as it hit the floor was crushed.
Who cares which tier the others are based on? at least they are decent enough to look at (and have decent uses unlike the Moa).
Changing it to missiles is a little weird though, if its a Moa hull shouldn't it at least be a turret ship, of course it wouldn't be a sniper ship as it has to be close enough to use the interdiction sphere, but maybe instead or range bonus it could have a damage bonus instead.
Then again it could just be a Caracal hull again and all will be right with the world.
Also a little of topic but they took of the space camo from the widow aswell
I think its hillarious that people are not gonna fly a ship depending on its looks... Just look at the tempest, its ugly as hell but its used alot since it IS A GOOD SHIP!!! I prefer the Moa hull AND the fact that they are tier 3 ships, all of them... so HA :P Sig removed, lacks Eve-related content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] - Cortes |
Ral Ulgur
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2007.11.23 00:26:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Abn Matar
Originally by: ExcellciuM Great, i was going to get the onyx but now, no thanks.
I prefer not to look at something that looks like it was half finished and rushed out to the public via a 5th storey window and as it hit the floor was crushed.
Who cares which tier the others are based on? at least they are decent enough to look at (and have decent uses unlike the Moa).
Changing it to missiles is a little weird though, if its a Moa hull shouldn't it at least be a turret ship, of course it wouldn't be a sniper ship as it has to be close enough to use the interdiction sphere, but maybe instead or range bonus it could have a damage bonus instead.
Then again it could just be a Caracal hull again and all will be right with the world.
Also a little of topic but they took of the space camo from the widow aswell
I think its hillarious that people are not gonna fly a ship depending on its looks... Just look at the tempest, its ugly as hell but its used alot since it IS A GOOD SHIP!!! I prefer the Moa hull AND the fact that they are tier 3 ships, all of them... so HA :P
tbh, I think that "Onoes, now it looks crap, I'm not gonna fly it" is more of an excuse for "Wargh! I produced 1000BPCs for invention based on speculative information and have to pay for my gamble :(".
I think having the Onyx in line with the other Hactors was a good design decision. It gives the game a more consistent feel.
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Berrik Radhok
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.11.23 00:29:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Tradesman Mcgee Edited by: Tradesman Mcgee on 22/11/2007 20:37:30 The change sure as heck screw over those that plan ahead and try to stock up on caracal blueprints. Way to go. Cheap caracal bpcs anyone?
Well, that sounds like a personal problem to me.
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Jerppu
Minmatar Brotherhood of Polar Equation Insurgency
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Posted - 2007.11.23 06:58:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Jotan Veer
So, what is the reason for this change? (Other than forcing the prospective Onyx inventors to buy a Moa BPO).
Ah what a hell... there goes 2 months Caracal copies x 4. Should have know not to trust CCP. Thank you CCP! _____________________________ BPQ Recruitment |
Dapanman1
Amarr Beets and Gravy Syndicate Axiom Empire
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Posted - 2007.11.23 07:03:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Merin Ryskin Hell no! CCP, put it back. This is insane. Not only is it absurd that the Moa, a railboat, suddenly turns into a missile-armed HIC, but the Onyx actually looked good as a Caracal variant! Now it's the ugliest ship in the game. Now either:
1) Put it back to the Caracal model ASAP, and screw the whiners who want it to be a tier-3 like the others.
2) Give it a massive boost to compensate for the nerf to its appearance, or nobody will fly it. Something like 8 turret slots, 10% optimal/level x2, 5% shield resists/level, and the shield HP of a capital ship (with cruiser recharge time, of course). This would be the absolute minimum, I think, anything less and anyone accidentally undocking one will have to immediately self destruct in shame.
Is it really that ugly? All I ever see of a Moa is a white box and then an explosion. Beets, you're among friends. |
James Lyrus
Lyrus Associates Enuma Elish.
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Posted - 2007.11.23 07:48:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Ral Ulgur
tbh, I think that "Onoes, now it looks crap, I'm not gonna fly it" is more of an excuse for "Wargh! I produced 1000BPCs for invention based on speculative information and have to pay for my gamble :(".
I think having the Onyx in line with the other Hactors was a good design decision. It gives the game a more consistent feel.
Why do you think that consistancy is important? Personally, I rather liked the consistancy of missile cruiser -> missile hactor, far more than I liked the 'well, the _others_ have a tier 3 hull'. Personally, I _still_ think all this 'tiering' thing is silly anyway though.
*shrug* I'll fly it, because it'll be the tool for a job, but I'd _much_ rather they'd stuck with the Caracal hull. -- Crane needs more grid 249km locking? GMP and TNP |
Cerina Natal
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Posted - 2007.11.23 08:10:00 -
[24]
I will give you that the Moa model is an abomination of nature. But insted of discussing wether or not to change this ship back to its original model (Caracal) shouldnt we be discussing or petitioning CCP to change the Moa model, i mean they could atleast streatch it out a little bit in such a way that it no longer looked like a metal box with a head and exhaust vents
As for the people who are disapointed that they didnt get to earn obsean ammounts of isk on investing in patch changes. Well it have already been sayed, nothing is scerten before it hits TQ and even then its not scerten (carriers/MS )....insted of trying to earn isk from this changes you should see it as a previlige to actually be able to see and test the changes and coment on how they work before they actually hit TQ....
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Hayman Wakefield
Caldari Guerilla Tactics
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Posted - 2007.11.23 09:36:00 -
[25]
It's a shame that the model will change as the Caracal has always been one of my favourite ships, but the tier 3 progression makes sense so fine.
The whiners in the caracal bpc camp, what's that about? It's not like they can't be used to invent any other ship.
And one final point about the Moa model, has anyone seen the Trinty version yet and able to link to it?
Originally by: Capt Harlock "I have a mouse with a green tail". It's tail may or may not be green. The car however is mating with a monkey".
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08891
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Posted - 2007.11.23 09:42:00 -
[26]
There aren't any pics of the trinity moa as far as I know, but they did release some nice looking screens of the new caracal.
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Bellum Eternus
Gallente Death of Virtue
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Posted - 2007.11.23 09:51:00 -
[27]
What is really a shame is that the HiCs are based on the Tier3 cruisers. The Vexor would be a much cooler HiC than the Thorax.
Bellum Eternus [Vid] L E G E N D A R Y [Vid] L E G E N D A R Y I I |
Arana Tellen
Gallente The Blackguard Wolves Knights Of the Southerncross
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Posted - 2007.11.23 09:55:00 -
[28]
"Wah it looks ugly"
So does the raven, but have you SEEN the new model? There is that minor graphics update coming ---------------------------------
Oh noes! |
El'essar Viocragh
Minmatar FSK23
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Posted - 2007.11.23 09:57:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Jotan Veer So, what is the reason for this change? (Other than forcing the prospective Onyx inventors to buy a Moa BPO).
1a) all other HICs are based on tier 3 cruisers
1b) tier 3 cruisers (and their tech 2 counterpart usually) use significantly more materials to build. Making the caldari version considerably cheaper just to avoid a shipmodel many players dislike wouldn't have been nice. -- [17:47] <Mephysto> its dead, jim |
08891
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Posted - 2007.11.23 10:02:00 -
[30]
Edited by: 08891 on 23/11/2007 10:02:19
Originally by: El'essar Viocragh 1a) all other HICs are based on tier 3 cruisers
1b) tier 3 cruisers (and their tech 2 counterpart usually) use significantly more materials to build. Making the caldari version considerably cheaper just to avoid a shipmodel many players dislike wouldn't have been nice.
1a)That's purely an aesthetic thing. And it happens the Moa is UGLY.
1b)Lol wut? Check the build reqs on sisi they haven't changed with the hull. And there was no reason for them to...
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