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Statement on the recent engagement with ISS POS & MC.

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Viqer Fell Minmatar Trinity Nova	Posted - 2007.11.27 09:59:00 - [1] Edited by: Viqer Fell on 27/11/2007 10:00:40 Following our recent departure from our former Alliance less than a week ago, Trinity Nova Mercenary Sevrices has enjoyed a succesful few days of securing new contracts. Within the space of 48 hours three contracts had been finalised and having consumed the better part of a small distillery I agreed to start the third job immediately as it really shouldn't take too long. It had been a long time since we had undertaken a POS demolition job, however the job at hand shouldnt be too hard as we were being asked to destroy an anchored but offline Minmatar tower. Not really much to do but shoot and accept the security status erosion. I suspect that our client may well have consumed more alcohol than I though as when we arrived it was not only online but also a Gallente Tower. Being an honourable bunch though we agreed to attempt the task at hand and over a few hours we destroyed the Guns, Disruptor & shields and placed the Tower into Reinforced mode. The only interuption was when Veto popped through local but with reports of a 50-60 man mixed Veto/friends gang 3 jumps out we decided to simply hold off till their fleet moved on. With a days Strontium there was little we could do but sit and prepare. We knew ISS were having some issues in 0.0 and we hoped that they'd be a little too busy to come defend one of their member's POS's in empire. Cometh Monday, cometh the fleet. Last night as the Tower exited reinforced mode we assembled a fleet and once again began to pound its shields and then armour. As we got the armour to about 15% we had an ISS member enter local and as the Hull passed 30% another member. At this point we began to wonder if they were finally coming to defend their asset. As the Hull began to fall past 10, then 5 then 3% we decided not and that they must be simply unable to do anything. Then with the timing of the very devil himself the ISS vagabond that had been buzzing about local for 30 minutes appeared at 100km. The fleet was ordered to blast him however by the time we had managed to switch from the POS to the Vagabond he'd mwd'd onto the fleet and dropped a cyno field. The Vagabond died very swiftly however by then it was too late, the cyno had been up for almost a full 2 seconds. Local filled rapidly, doubling in size in those 2 swift seconds. With the POS's hull at <1% this couldn't have happened with worse timing. We estimate that literally another 1 minute at best and the POS would have been destroyed. There was nothing to do at this point but order the fleet to withdraw. As the first ships began to appear next to us and we had chance to assess the ID of the jumpers we noted a few conspicuous names in local. Seems ISS weren't going at this half measures and yep for the first time in its history TNT, a 40 odd man corp, had MC jump in it's capital fleet to engage us. In total we had 8 motherships and 23 Carriers jump in. Click here to visit our site
Viqer Fell Minmatar Trinity Nova	Posted - 2007.11.27 10:00:00 - [2] Edited by: Viqer Fell on 27/11/2007 10:01:09 As the multiple Motherships and Carriers began to lock people our ships were entering warp however at that point approximately 500 fighters and drones were launched and many people never saw another frame. As I said, the devil's own timing. <1% Hull. TNT lost 6 Battleships in the engagement although that's not a very fair description of what was to all intents and purposes a freeze frame slideshow. I think that if anyone is going to maybe stop you doing a job in EvE as a merc than surely MC has to be the primary contender and I found it quite satisfying that ISS felt the need to employ such entities as CONIN and BDCI etc. to protect their assets from us. Less than 45 miinutes later and the shield was at 25%, the armour at 100%. Amusingly the hull remained at its almost non-existent level. MC began to jump away and we were left to wonder what could have been. We learnt a lot from attempting the task including our first use of Dreadnaughts in a POS engagement and we feel that we are now in a much better position to undertake and plan these jobs in future. In this instance and in spite of the original misinformation on the contract and what it entailed we refunded the client. We may not have achieved the destruction of the POS but for the sake of a minute and a sliver of luck we would of. When it takes 31 Capitals including 8 super-capitals to ensure we didn't then I guess I can't be too unhappy with the result. It could potentially have been a lot, lot worse. The third job down and the first two contracts to go. First on the list; Our war vs Spectre Ops, begins this evening. Click here to visit our site
Dark Shikari Caldari Imperium Technologies Firmus Ixion	Posted - 2007.11.27 10:04:00 - [3] Sounds like a scary moment. "Hull's at 1%... OHCRAP" 23 Member EVE Video makers: save bandwidth! Use the H.264 AutoEncoder! (updated)
Viqer Fell Minmatar Trinity Nova	Posted - 2007.11.27 10:07:00 - [4] There was a certain element of "eeeep!" that's for sure. Click here to visit our site
Hardin Amarr Madison Industrial Co. Sylph Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.27 10:08:00 - [5] Originally by: Viqer Fell Seems ISS weren't going at this half measures and yep for the first time in its history TNT, a 40 odd man corp, had MC jump in it's capital fleet to engage us. In total we had 8 motherships and 23 Carriers jump in. Nothing like getting a job done properly As a former Minmatar terrorist you probably deserved it ------------------------------
Garia666 Amarr T.H.U.G L.I.F.E	Posted - 2007.11.27 10:08:00 - [6] :D nicely written ! ->My Vids<-
Phoenicia Black Sea Industries Cult of War	Posted - 2007.11.27 10:09:00 - [7] Offline tower < Fully armed & operational POS Props for attempting to follow through.
Awox Advanced Logistics	Posted - 2007.11.27 10:14:00 - [8] So basically you failed?
Zark Brassen Koshaku Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.11.27 10:16:00 - [9] "Fun Fight!" says the brave vagabond pilot. Hull reppers have an effective range of 15km - large towers have shields at 25km - i.e. we have to take the tower offline to repair the hull.
Angor The JORG Corporation Terra Incognita.	Posted - 2007.11.27 10:19:00 - [10] So what exactly was so good about this pos anyway that required such a force to defend it at the last second? _______________________________ [ 2007.06.07 21:07:22 ] FrankyWave > ransom me guys I am joining XElas !!!
Viqer Fell Minmatar Trinity Nova	Posted - 2007.11.27 10:19:00 - [11] Originally by: Awox So basically you failed? Hello Mr Troll! Click here to visit our site
Bran Stormer GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.11.27 10:21:00 - [12] Did Grimpak manage to keep everything together whilst this was going on, or did he lose it and start talking to himself in local?
Viqer Fell Minmatar Trinity Nova	Posted - 2007.11.27 10:23:00 - [13] To be fair I have no idea. I believe that the Moon is the only one in the entire region with the particular resource it has but as to what this is I couldn't say. There were certainly enough silo's there to back that idea up. Click here to visit our site
Viqer Fell Minmatar Trinity Nova	Posted - 2007.11.27 10:25:00 - [14] Originally by: Bran Stormer Did Grimpak manage to keep everything together whilst this was going on, or did he lose it and start talking to himself in local? We do not ever really talk in local when on a job barring some very few isolated cases so Grimpak has to satisfy himself on Ventrilo. Click here to visit our site
Slinktress Gallente legion of qui Terra Incognita.	Posted - 2007.11.27 10:27:00 - [15] Props to both sides! This thread speaks volumes. Welcome "home" ISS LONG Live Mercs! \o/
Robke Trinity Nova	Posted - 2007.11.27 10:42:00 - [16] Our gang chat is funny; "back" "and i didnt miss the pop! woot :)" "Its going to just dissapear I think. :-(" "run!" "wtf man" "who is safe?" --------- Do not follow the instructions in this signature.
Seleene Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.11.27 10:52:00 - [17] Nice write up. We had a little less than two hours notice on this from the time it was brought forth, payment hit the holding corp and the cynos started going up. We were expecting 15-25 BS, a few cap ships plus at least one mothership to be at the target. We were also expecting that we'd be defending a tower just coming out of reinforced. Turns out that the client screwed up the time so we had to hustle. When we jumped in the tower was completely red. All three bars. I have no idea if the thing even had 1% structure left. As for our numbers, well.. I said it on SHC - this is what happens when a bunch of animals haven't been fed in a while. - THIS FLEET FOR RENT!
Slinktress Gallente legion of qui Terra Incognita.	Posted - 2007.11.27 10:58:00 - [18] Edited by: Slinktress on 27/11/2007 11:00:13 Originally by: Seleene Nice write up. We had a little less than two hours notice on this from the time it was brought forth, payment hit the holding corp and the cynos started going up. We were expecting 15-25 BS, a few cap ships plus at least one mothership to be at the target. We were also expecting that we'd be defending a tower just coming out of reinforced. Turns out that the client screwed up the time so we had to hustle. When we jumped in the tower was completely red. All three bars. I have no idea if the thing even had 1% structure left. As for our numbers, well.. I said it on SHC - this is what happens when a bunch of animals haven't been fed in a while. So MC does after-hours emergency "plumbing" services now? Niiice... can't imagine the cost. Sounds like fun though! And, how are the rest of us mercs supposed to compete with that? Good job and good story! PS> Hi to my old buds in "TNT" o/
touchvill D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.11.27 11:11:00 - [19] I like you, you guys are my friend. You are not as cool now mr nekkid has left, but he is coolness personified. (Well he has to be cool he has no clothes ffs) Anyway nice try. It's always a pleasure when you see such an insane force come to stop you doing what is a boring mundane job. Oh yeah Imp, not been able to own you on tf2 lately as my pc has decided it doesn't like to run it, or any other game for that matter. Grimpak, keep spamming the forums mate. I love you long time. MC. Nice gang, noticed some Tri smack on SHC forums, won't get any from me. Sterling job as always from you. ---------- dot the dot then dot the dot then all you have done is dotted two dots. Amazing no?
McFly Path of Light R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.11.27 11:21:00 - [20] Damn those cynoing vagabonds... Props to TNT for getting out before the MC TOTALFIGHTERDRONEHELLDETH. -- --my opinions do not reflect that of my corp nor my alliance--
ZaKma Seraphin Technologies Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.11.27 11:24:00 - [21] Very nice write up, thanks for your perspective.
Aira Phlux Trinity Nova	Posted - 2007.11.27 12:03:00 - [22] Kinda frustrating to be literally within seconds of objective completion - one more dread volley? 30 secs more Battleship punishment? Who knows? At the end of the day, we accept the compliment and congratulate MC on a legendary "in the nick of time" save.
Cardassius Seraphin Technologies Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.11.27 12:26:00 - [23] Edited by: Cardassius on 27/11/2007 12:27:06 Originally by: McFly Damn those cynoing vagabonds... Props to TNT for getting out before the MC TOTALFIGHTERDRONEHELLDETH. Once the carriers started to deploy I think everyone had < 1fps so props to TNT being able to click the warpout button :) And very nice writeup indeed!!
shivan Rampage Eternal Ka-Tet	Posted - 2007.11.27 12:31:00 - [24] Originally by: Dark Shikari Sounds like a scary moment. "Hull's at 1%... OHCRAP" I remember a SGE pos being in this posistion once with FIX attacking it and us having an awesom fight in 5-NE2Y for over an hour. It started when you cought us when SGE were trying to anchour it. FIX secured the area before we could online and then spent a couple of hours hammering it with BS. SA formed up and came to defend it and I think we managed to eventually force you guys off it with about 50% hull or less left on the tower. Was one of the best fights I ever had against you guys and I managed to fight through about 50mins of it as well. Station Ping Pong
WildSide Spartan Industries Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.11.27 12:37:00 - [25] nice read:) Vids produced by me
James Peabody Gallente Freedom of Speach	Posted - 2007.11.27 12:38:00 - [26] Well the guy that said that basically you failed, was maybe trolling, but he was also right.... In fact I think having it removed as trolling is a bit over zealous really. You are a pretty small Merc force.. 20 ish members on at peak? You take on an ISS POS in empire, most players that this would take a decent sized force, props for trying of course, but really a little out of your league, luckily it would seem for you that MC were given the wrong time by their client, or you'd have lost your dreads and some. As a Merc Corp I would expect a realistic view of what you can and cannot achieve to be presented to your employer, failing as a Merc corp is never good, and by the grace of god you got away with his one, might not be so lucky next time, refunded your employer I should hope? Better to leave those sort of jobs to the bigger boys like MC, KIA, TRI etc, and stick to ganking Alliances in empire.. surely? Thanks for the story etc, but I could read a story anytime I want, what I'd like in COAD is a realistic view of the Eve world around me, and you making out your a force of any sort, is hardly realistic. Looking at your death mails, at least your ships were setup nicely, looks like your time with KIA Alliance has at least served some good, and there maybe hope for you yet if you realise what you are and are not capable of. Sorry for the tone of my post but I really am tired of all these little wannabee Mercs trying to make a name for themselves by spinning long stories on Coad, yes your out there having fun one would assume, but you attack a pos, you get owned, and you bring it here and try and spin it as if you did something worthwhile, when in fact all you did was waste your employers time and maybe money. His fault as much as yours I suppose, next time he should hire one of the bigger guys. meh. Yes I am an Alt, my Mains Alliance doesn't allow me to post here, but none the less I value my right of opinion, this is not trolling, I am not looking for an argument, I am simply stating how I feel about your, at best, flimsy "story".
Janu Hull Caldari Order of Z Industries	Posted - 2007.11.27 12:53:00 - [27] Originally by: James Peabody Well the guy that said that basically you failed, was maybe trolling, but he was also right.... In fact I think having it removed as trolling is a bit over zealous really. You are a pretty small Merc force.. 20 ish members on at peak? You take on an ISS POS in empire, most players that this would take a decent sized force, props for trying of course, but really a little out of your league, luckily it would seem for you that MC were given the wrong time by their client, or you'd have lost your dreads and some. As a Merc Corp I would expect a realistic view of what you can and cannot achieve to be presented to your employer, failing as a Merc corp is never good, and by the grace of god you got away with his one, might not be so lucky next time, refunded your employer I should hope? Better to leave those sort of jobs to the bigger boys like MC, KIA, TRI etc, and stick to ganking Alliances in empire.. surely? Thanks for the story etc, but I could read a story anytime I want, what I'd like in COAD is a realistic view of the Eve world around me, and you making out your a force of any sort, is hardly realistic. Looking at your death mails, at least your ships were setup nicely, looks like your time with KIA Alliance has at least served some good, and there maybe hope for you yet if you realise what you are and are not capable of. Sorry for the tone of my post but I really am tired of all these little wannabee Mercs trying to make a name for themselves by spinning long stories on Coad, yes your out there having fun one would assume, but you attack a pos, you get owned, and you bring it here and try and spin it as if you did something worthwhile, when in fact all you did was waste your employers time and maybe money. His fault as much as yours I suppose, next time he should hire one of the bigger guys. meh. Yes I am an Alt, my Mains Alliance doesn't allow me to post here, but none the less I value my right of opinion, this is not trolling, I am not looking for an argument, I am simply stating how I feel about your, at best, flimsy "story". Go ask mommy to give you your balls back and we'll review your trolling for content. Until then, stroke your epeen in private, please.
Seleene Body Count Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.11.27 12:56:00 - [28] Edited by: Seleene on 27/11/2007 12:56:07 Not that it probably matters, but the most lag I got was the jump in. Things cleared up after the first 15 seconds or so and my frame rates were pretty decent after. Here's the strange thing - a few mins later we decided to help rep a few of the POS mods and all started deploying heavy armor repair drones. While I experienced very little lag when there were hundreds of fighters out, the entire system slowed to a crawl when the maint drones went to work. crosses fingers for Trinity - THIS FLEET FOR RENT!
James Peabody Gallente Freedom of Speach	Posted - 2007.11.27 12:56:00 - [29] Originally by: Janu Hull Go ask mommy to give you your balls back and we'll review your trolling for content. Until then, stroke your epeen in private, please. Oh yes, what balls it takes to post here, I am respectful of my Alliances wishes, nothing more and nothing less.
Chrysalis D'lilth	Posted - 2007.11.27 13:01:00 - [30] Made an interesting read tbh, He doesn't claim anywhere to be one of the big merc corps and its good to hear from people that aren't top dogs every once in a while - even more so when he's posting as much about what nearly was than the normal e-peen contest. On the other hand, your post just makes you sound like an embittered ass.
Grimpak Gallente Trinity Nova	Posted - 2007.11.27 13:12:00 - [31] Originally by: James Peabody Trolling removed. Please stay on topic. While you may disagree with the OP and think his corp is a "wannabe" there are plenty of people interested in hearing a story - Valorem look man, I'm stretching to a bare thread here. And tbh I want to unleash all my voices on you, but I'll hold it down. We had a job. We atempted to do that job. We couldn't do that job. We returned the money we were payed for that job. Now stop trolling. EVE doesn't go arround the big alliances only, and if you don't want to read about it, simply don't post, or do you care enough to troll everything that doesn't fit on the bigger scheme? --- planetary interaction idea!
Kayleigh Lothian Minmatar KIA Corp KIA Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.27 13:13:00 - [32] Originally by: James Peabody His fault as much as yours I suppose, next time he should hire one of the bigger guys. meh. Or perhaps try to provide intel that are semi-close to the truth? Offlined Minmatar tower that became "fully ARMED and OPERATIONAL battle station" and a ***lente one too. Blah blah blah about wasting time, since your chickening out and alt posting, couldn't you have said that in a shorter way? Anyway, nice to see that you are out shooting stuff Viqer, you'll have those extra few seconds next time :) Just one thing, did alex need to clean out his pod? ;) ----------------------
Grimpak Gallente Trinity Nova	Posted - 2007.11.27 13:15:00 - [33] Originally by: Kayleigh Lothian did alex need to clean out his pod? ;) yes --- planetary interaction idea!
Mr Broker Amarr Station Gremlings	Posted - 2007.11.27 13:29:00 - [34] very nice report, like you rarely see around here
James Peabody Gallente Freedom of Speach	Posted - 2007.11.27 13:33:00 - [35] Originally by: Janu Hull Originally by: James Peabody Trolling removed. Please stay on topic. While you may disagree with the OP and think his corp is a "wannabe" there are plenty of people interested in hearing a story - Valorem Reply to moderated post removed - Valorem Please do not discuss moderator actions on the forum. Mail us at [email protected] if you have an issue - Valorem
Kayleigh Lothian Minmatar KIA Corp KIA Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.27 13:38:00 - [36] Originally by: James Peabody Your EDIT of my post is in fact a total disgrace, a petition is being filed as we speak. Not to be a smartass or anything, but isn't this the second time in this thread that you "discuss" moderation? ----------------------
Mr Broker Amarr Station Gremlings	Posted - 2007.11.27 13:53:00 - [37] Originally by: Kayleigh Lothian Originally by: James Peabody Your EDIT of my post is in fact a total disgrace, a petition is being filed as we speak. Not to be a smartass or anything, but isn't this the second time in this thread that you "discuss" moderation? aren't you doing it too? discussing about discussing moderation
General StarScream THE DECEPTIC0NS	Posted - 2007.11.27 14:08:00 - [38] So what the op is saying is that when you could have taken the tower out, you faild, and cryed like a littel girl and jumped out? omg its only like Mc, its not like they got any skill. they just blooob with caps, and think they are special. we will Deal with em after bob is dead, they will suffer. Sig Removed. Dont use inappropriate language in sigs -Kaemonn
Janu Hull Caldari Order of Z Industries	Posted - 2007.11.27 14:18:00 - [39] Actually, it sounded like someone had their head on straight to order the pullout when the cyno went up. Ego and glory is one thing, but completing the contract at the expense of your corporation's fighting force isn't much of a win either. Pyhrrus would have been proud.

ISD Valorem Amarr ISD STAR	Posted - 2007.11.27 14:24:00 - [40] Guys and Girls, Posts about discussing moderation have been removed. Please stay on topic and be respectful and courteous to each other. Trolling, flaming, ranting and spam will be dealt with accordingly. forum rules \| CAOD Rules \| [email protected] \| Our Website

Gnome Chomsky 26th of July Movement	Posted - 2007.11.27 14:27:00 - [41] Nice report, thanks
dhav kincaide Quantum Industries Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2007.11.27 15:07:00 - [42] Cool write up, and props for giving it a go. That said... Originally by: Grimpak Originally by: James Peabody Trolling removed. Please stay on topic. While you may disagree with the OP and think his corp is a "wannabe" there are plenty of people interested in hearing a story - Valorem look man, I'm stretching to a bare thread here. And tbh I want to unleash all my voices on you, but I'll hold it down. We had a job. We atempted to do that job. We couldn't do that job. We returned the money we were payed for that job. Now stop trolling. EVE doesn't go arround the big alliances only, and if you don't want to read about it, simply don't post, or do you care enough to troll everything that doesn't fit on the bigger scheme? Why? You did about 10x what you were originally asked/contracted to do, and because of that were put in a situation that you shouldn't have been in. Seems to me like a great time to pull one of the ever-so-common (and in this case, quite justifiable) movie plot twists out of the bag, and demand triple. Good stuff none the less.
James Peabody Gallente Freedom of Speach	Posted - 2007.11.27 15:23:00 - [43] I'll Try again. Well the guy that said that basically you failed, was maybe trolling, but he was also right..... You are a pretty small Merc force.. 20 ish members on at peak? You take on an ISS POS in empire, most players that this would take a decent sized force, props for trying of course, but really a little out of your league, luckily it would seem for you that MC were given the wrong time by their client, or you'd have lost your dreads and some. As a Merc Corp an employer should expect a realistic view of what you can and cannot achieve to be presented to him, failing as a Merc corp is never good (and you say thats your first contract also?), and by the grace of god you got away with his one, might not be so lucky next time, refunded your employer I should hope? Better to leave those sort of jobs to the bigger boys like MC, KIA, TRI etc, and stick to ganking Alliances in empire.. surely? A lot of "gratz boys" etc on this thread, nice when you can get that for a failed contract, shows the power of a well written story, but the reality remains, as Grimpak honourably admits, you essentially bit of way more than a Merc Group of your size can chew. Your employers fault as much as yours I suppose, next time he should hire one of the bigger guys. meh. Yes I am an Alt, my Mains Alliance doesn't allow me to post here, but none the less I value my right of opinion, this is not trolling, I am not looking for an argument, I am simply stating how I feel about your account of what happened
Wesley Baird Murder-Death-Kill	Posted - 2007.11.27 15:24:00 - [44] Originally by: Bran Stormer Did Grimpak manage to keep everything together whilst this was going on, or did he lose it and start talking to himself in local? Just pray MDK and Trinity never get contracted on the same job, as the forum whorage which Grimpak and myself would bring to the event would be mind-boggling!
Wesley Baird Murder-Death-Kill	Posted - 2007.11.27 15:25:00 - [45] Originally by: James Peabody I'll Try again. Well the guy that said that basically you failed, was maybe trolling, but he was also right..... You are a pretty small Merc force.. 20 ish members on at peak? You take on an ISS POS in empire, most players that this would take a decent sized force, props for trying of course, but really a little out of your league, luckily it would seem for you that MC were given the wrong time by their client, or you'd have lost your dreads and some. As a Merc Corp an employer should expect a realistic view of what you can and cannot achieve to be presented to him, failing as a Merc corp is never good (and you say thats your first contract also?), and by the grace of god you got away with his one, might not be so lucky next time, refunded your employer I should hope? Better to leave those sort of jobs to the bigger boys like MC, KIA, TRI etc, and stick to ganking Alliances in empire.. surely? A lot of "gratz boys" etc on this thread, nice when you can get that for a failed contract, shows the power of a well written story, but the reality remains, as Grimpak honourably admits, you essentially bit of way more than a Merc Group of your size can chew. Your employers fault as much as yours I suppose, next time he should hire one of the bigger guys. meh. Yes I am an Alt, my Mains Alliance doesn't allow me to post here, but none the less I value my right of opinion, this is not trolling, I am not looking for an argument, I am simply stating how I feel about your account of what happened I think you fail to understand the amount of firepower some "small merc corps" can bring to the table...some of these corps can field more caps and supercaps than many alliances... Or so I've heard!
Viqer Fell Minmatar Trinity Nova	Posted - 2007.11.27 15:28:00 - [46] I do understand your query regarding the payment. We returned the Isk because we have a sense of honour in that we are paid to do a job and we accepted the job even after we discovered the basis of the contract had changed. It was therefore felt right to return the money although I do believe that yes we could easily have argued otherwise. Click here to visit our site
Vespya Federal Enforcement of the Abyssal Realm Black Scope Project	Posted - 2007.11.27 15:37:00 - [47] Originally by: James Peabody I'll Try again. ... You really shouldn't have bothered. They were contracted for a specific job that they felt was within their ability to do so. When they arrived at the site they found that they had been given bad information by their client, and the job tasked was MUCH greater than that contracted for, many other Mercs in this position would have aligned and warped out right at this point and either negotitaed a part refund, or even kept the fee, or renegotiated based on the ACTUAL task at hand. I think it shows immense character to stay and attempt to complete the task regardless, let alone get the PoS down to <1% Structure. The props they are getting is not for what they failed to do, but for their handling of the situation and near victory, it deserves props. Bravo to Viqer & TN IMO, you showed class, wits and smart operations, above and beyond the task you were contracted for.
Janu Hull Caldari Order of Z Industries	Posted - 2007.11.27 15:46:00 - [48] Originally by: James Peabody I'll Try again. Well the guy that said that basically you failed, was maybe trolling, but he was also right..... You are a pretty small Merc force.. 20 ish members on at peak? You take on an ISS POS in empire, most players that this would take a decent sized force, props for trying of course, but really a little out of your league, luckily it would seem for you that MC were given the wrong time by their client, or you'd have lost your dreads and some. As a Merc Corp an employer should expect a realistic view of what you can and cannot achieve to be presented to him, failing as a Merc corp is never good (and you say thats your first contract also?), and by the grace of god you got away with his one, might not be so lucky next time, refunded your employer I should hope? Better to leave those sort of jobs to the bigger boys like MC, KIA, TRI etc, and stick to ganking Alliances in empire.. surely? A lot of "gratz boys" etc on this thread, nice when you can get that for a failed contract, shows the power of a well written story, but the reality remains, as Grimpak honourably admits, you essentially bit of way more than a Merc Group of your size can chew. Your employers fault as much as yours I suppose, next time he should hire one of the bigger guys. meh. Yes I am an Alt, my Mains Alliance doesn't allow me to post here, but none the less I value my right of opinion, this is not trolling, I am not looking for an argument, I am simply stating how I feel about your account of what happened From the terms of the original contract, the job they were hired to handle was well within the parameters of their capabilities. Popping an offline tower should have been a cakewalk. What they got was a professional grade nightmare that they rather impressively decided to take on, and came within a hairsbreadth of pulling off. Had they succeeded, it would have been something of a legend. However, they ended up being routed, but because of leadership intelligence, survived largely intact and capable of continued operations. You seem overly impressed by the power of the blob, in spite of the fact that this 40 man outfit gave a pretty staggering blob the slip. Run back to your shadow, alt-troll. The mercs in this op on both sides did their job and did it well, outcome aside. Some of us in this game play high stakes beyond the POS shields every now and again.
James Peabody Gallente Freedom of Speach	Posted - 2007.11.27 15:50:00 - [49] Edited by: James Peabody on 27/11/2007 15:52:28 Vespya/Janu Hull Your not helping their rep with your overly positive post. Any Merc Corp worth its salt does not negotiate costs etc without first scouting the intended contract mark, so either TnT were lazy, or inept. Secondly, once scouted, if somehow it magically changes in that time (a period very short by Viqers initial post details) then a re-negotiation (if necessary) and a harder look at the situation should be assessed. An ISS pos in lowsec, is not easy killing, maybe yes if not online then a quick strike would do it, but once scouted and situation assesed, to put into re enforced, then attempt to finish "hoping the client wasn't watching" with a couple of dreads, some battleships and a token Nyx, is hardly a well thought out plan, in fact its a bad plan. It was a plan that went very wrong, and if it wasn't for luck, could of been much worse, MC were an hour late because the client gave out the wrong time for POS entering re enforced. Yes the story is well written, Yes it makes for good reading, but for someone that values Mercs in this game, I don't like to see such ineptitude applauded. TnT will no doubt learn from that mistake, but a stringent sticking to the basics would of avoided that potential disaster, I would of thought TnT would of learnt those lessons when in KIA Alliance, obviously KIA aren't great teachers.
Janu Hull Caldari Order of Z Industries	Posted - 2007.11.27 15:54:00 - [50] Here's your word(s) for the day: "Learning Curve" From the sounds of it, they haven't been mercs very long. From the impression of their actions, they'll likely be around long enough to figure it out.
Viqer Fell Minmatar Trinity Nova	Posted - 2007.11.27 16:07:00 - [51] James, I fail to really get the point that you are clearly trying very hard to get across. We took on a job that we felt that we could do, even though the basis of the job changed. TNT has been a mercenary force of repute for the last 18 months in our chosen market place which predominantly was the small to medium sized contracts. We are quite used to engaging numbers drastically larger than our own and winning so size of the opponent isn't really a concern for us. Your argument is quite specious in that I honestly doubt that any company contracted to kill a large POS in empire would have taken sufficient forces to engage 8 Super-Caps and 21 Carriers. Using this logic you appear to be suggesting that no-one should take on a similar job unless they can field enough to kill "any" force that may come to defend it. I honestly doubt even TRI or KIA would have been able to do the job at hand on the same basis given the price that the client offered. I have every respect for those corps and in no way do i them a dis-service by saying that. I suppose whilst some people will say there is no difference in 1% hull or 100%, no point in trying with the slimmest hope of failure I prefer to think that there is some sense in trying. Did we kill the POS? No and we never ever inferered we did. Did we try to achieve beyond our ability though? No. The firepower arrayed against us during the last seconds of the job were well beyond what could reasonably have been expected. I think all we wanted to achieve here is to give everyone a brief idea of what we were up to and a fair account of what had happened. There were quite a few locals who wondered wtf had happened to their system with 50 odd ships blasting holes in each other. Look forward to seeing you again MC and thanks for the kind words MC, KIA, TERRA etc. much appreciated. Click here to visit our site
Tassi The Cruciform The Church.	Posted - 2007.11.27 16:11:00 - [52] You are probably looking at a quite decent moon if there are harvesters on it, promethium is good for your wallet The Cruciform recruitment
Ace Frehley Minmatar Fjortismaffian	Posted - 2007.11.27 16:12:00 - [53] Touchy, I have some stuff to fix in RL, then mr Nekkid while supply all the coolness people need. Yes free supply of nekkid-male hugs is included =) And kinda dissepointed that TNT wasent worth more then 8 moms
Viqer Fell Minmatar Trinity Nova	Posted - 2007.11.27 16:31:00 - [54] Edited by: Viqer Fell on 27/11/2007 16:33:25 Edited by: Viqer Fell on 27/11/2007 16:33:07 So now we're bashing KIA for not "teaching" TNT??? I guess I really should ask my starter agent for a refund too as I never learnt to fly my reaper very well either. Some people see the world through 20/20 hindsight and with a black and white perspective. No shades of grey but simply right and wrong and oddly enough they always "know" they are right and that they know more than anyone else. Never knowledgeable but always opinionated. Doesn't actually make you right I know motherships aren't that rare anymore but to describe a Nyx as " a token nyx " is to my mind a bit of a ludicrous comment. I sincerely wish we did have "token Nyx's" to chuck about. Perhaps you could chuck us a few of your throw-away mom's? Nope thought not. Click here to visit our site
Mynas Atoch Eternity INC. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.11.27 16:44:00 - [55] Originally by: Ace Frehley Touchy, I have some stuff to fix in RL, then mr Nekkid while supply all the coolness people need. Yes free supply of nekkid-male hugs is included =) And kinda dissepointed that TNT wasent worth more then 8 moms Sorry about that; no insult intended. It was all I could rustle up in the 30mins between the contract being accepted and lighting the first cynos on a Monday which most of our pilots had taken off. Myn Sir Molle says : Mynas is Dead!
Leo Balthur Koshaku Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.11.27 16:47:00 - [56] afaik there were 10 ms'es ISS-Fanboy
Gnulpie Minmatar Miner Tech	Posted - 2007.11.27 17:08:00 - [57] That's insane! Eve seems indeed to have its own life To answer the question how other merc corps can compete with such an force like MC? Well, they can! Those smaller merc corps surely don't have that high prices and more people can afford their 'service' while I would guess that only the really rich people can afford to hire MC, especially in an emergency case! I don't see why there isn't place for many merc corps in Eve.
Dol Amroth Contraband Inc. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.11.27 17:39:00 - [58] Originally by: Gnulpie That's insane! Eve seems indeed to have its own life To answer the question how other merc corps can compete with such an force like MC? Well, they can! Those smaller merc corps surely don't have that high prices and more people can afford their 'service' while I would guess that only the really rich people can afford to hire MC, especially in an emergency case! I don't see why there isn't place for many merc corps in Eve. We're pretty flexible on pricing because to put an isk-value on what we can bring isn't really fathomable but instead its the absolute shock value. It was an enjoyable stroll for a Monday afternoon when nothing else was planned although we had been discussing what could be there sieging instead of the what was... Viqer and crew, well played regardless. I've come to the realization (and yes it took me some time,) that the more time spent here is the less time in game killing targets and marks. Allow your actions there to rivet the playerbase and not worry too much about the opinions of those not involved. They tend to disappear or have a misfortunate run in with karma. Kindest Regards.
FubarSF Caldari Shiva Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.11.27 17:54:00 - [59] Good write up
sakana North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2007.11.27 17:56:00 - [60] Sounds like both mercenary groups (TNT and MC) didn't quite get what they expected with this fight
Jasese The Collective Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2007.11.27 18:13:00 - [61] Originally by: James Peabody Edited by: James Peabody on 27/11/2007 15:52:28 Vespya/Janu Hull Your not helping their rep with your overly positive post. Any Merc Corp worth its salt does not negotiate costs etc without first scouting the intended contract mark, so either TnT were lazy, or inept. Secondly, once scouted, if somehow it magically changes in that time (a period very short by Viqers initial post details) then a re-negotiation (if necessary) and a harder look at the situation should be assessed. An ISS pos in lowsec, is not easy killing, maybe yes if not online then a quick strike would do it, but once scouted and situation assesed, to put into re enforced, then attempt to finish "hoping the client wasn't watching" with a couple of dreads, some battleships and a token Nyx, is hardly a well thought out plan, in fact its a bad plan. It was a plan that went very wrong, and if it wasn't for luck, could of been much worse, MC were an hour late because the client gave out the wrong time for POS entering re enforced. Yes the story is well written, Yes it makes for good reading, but for someone that values Mercs in this game, I don't like to see such ineptitude applauded. TnT will no doubt learn from that mistake, but a stringent sticking to the basics would of avoided that potential disaster, I would of thought TnT would of learnt those lessons when in KIA Alliance, obviously KIA aren't great teachers. Who the **** are you?
Hast Applied Eugenics Cruel Intentions	Posted - 2007.11.27 18:19:00 - [62] also, adding to the previous poster: stop being an idiot Originally by: omeega PICTURE TOO BIG, KGB INCOMING HAVE FUN.
Grimpak Gallente Trinity Nova	Posted - 2007.11.27 18:29:00 - [63] Originally by: sakana Sounds like both mercenary groups (TNT and MC) didn't quite get what they expected with this fight one of those perks of being a merc I suppose --- planetary interaction idea!
Viqer Fell Minmatar Trinity Nova	Posted - 2007.11.27 18:45:00 - [64] Edited by: Viqer Fell on 27/11/2007 18:45:28 10 MS? more eeep Click here to visit our site
MaidMarion The SMITE Brotherhood	Posted - 2007.11.27 20:01:00 - [65] Originally by: Angor So what exactly was so good about this pos anyway that required such a force to defend it at the last second? MC isnt known for doing things half-assed.
7shining7one7 Quafe Paladins	Posted - 2007.11.27 22:25:00 - [66] urrr.. i can't quite wrap my head around why someone would whine about lack of op success when they took the pos to 1% structure and was stopped by a wtfbbq mc cap fleet. to the op, great read and seems like everyone had good fun. one could wish that others would learn from the beautiful smack free fight you guys seem to have had, so that many more eve battles/ops would be like these. happy pew pew'ing all
Devian 666 Igneus Auctorita GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.11.27 23:01:00 - [67] Good to hear some exceptional conflicts are going on. Especially where things are cut really fine. We almost won. [ 2007.11.17 08:26:19 ] (combat) <color=0xffbbbb00>Your 150mm Railgun II places an excellent hit on Shrike [EVOL]<BOB>(Avatar), inflicting 41.4 damage.
Kayleigh Lothian Minmatar KIA Corp KIA Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.27 23:02:00 - [68] Edited by: Kayleigh Lothian on 27/11/2007 23:05:45 Originally by: James Peabody Any Merc Corp worth its salt does not negotiate costs etc without first scouting the intended contract mark, so either TnT were lazy, or inept. So, now MC is inept? Crawl back to your rock, or do you know that the cynovaga is a MC alt? If you are not 100% sure, then you either say that MC is "not worth its salt" and/or "inept". The problem with your way of circumvicting your alliances ban to post in this thread rise a few questions. Eiter you are lying since your "main" is in State War Academy, or you do not really think that the decisions(sp) of your alliance is anything to bother about. It also raises questions about your agenda. For all we know you could have been asked about this pos-job but not gotten it because you belong to an inferior corp or you are just out to badmouth your oposition/arch emeny/guys that podded you in the past/someone who have the ingame name your mother had promised you could use. You could offcourse also be one of the lesser know voices of Grimpak... ;) When do we get to see the video? EditSpells worse then usual... ----------------------
Lowa Gallente North Star Networks Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.11.27 23:14:00 - [69] V Good write up there! And as usual, never mind the trolls, you probably hurt them bad in one way or the other. And I would feel good about that if I were you. /Lowa - FRAPS. And TS com's pls! What if the truth was something else?
Grimpak Gallente Trinity Nova	Posted - 2007.11.27 23:22:00 - [70] Originally by: Kayleigh Lothian You could offcourse also be one of the lesser know voices of Grimpak... ;) my voices at least have the decency of using the same vehicle (IE, me), for their notionless spam and talk. --- planetary interaction idea!
Wendat Huron Stellar Solutions	Posted - 2007.11.27 23:44:00 - [71] I can't wait for the day when someone hires MC to defend a POS and they warp in their entire cap fleet only to be doublecrossed and met with a superior force themselves. I wonder how much utter annihilation of said cap fleet would set them back? These forums are FUBAR, upgrade this decade!
Viqer Fell Minmatar Trinity Nova	Posted - 2007.11.27 23:48:00 - [72] Originally by: Zark Brassen "Fun Fight!" says the brave vagabond pilot. Hull reppers have an effective range of 15km - large towers have shields at 25km - i.e. we have to take the tower offline to repair the hull. If you wish to hire us to defend the moon at this vulnerable time...... Click here to visit our site
Setana Manoro Gallente Firefly Inc.	Posted - 2007.11.28 00:00:00 - [73] Edited by: Setana Manoro on 28/11/2007 00:00:05 Originally by: Viqer Fell Edited by: Viqer Fell on 27/11/2007 10:01:09 As the multiple Motherships and Carriers began to lock people our ships were entering warp however at that point approximately 500 fighters and drones were launched and many people never saw another frame. As I said, the devil's own timing. <1% Hull. TNT lost 6 Battleships in the engagement although that's not a very fair description of what was to all intents and purposes a freeze frame slideshow. I think that if anyone is going to maybe stop you doing a job in EvE as a merc than surely MC has to be the primary contender and I found it quite satisfying that ISS felt the need to employ such entities as CONIN and BDCI etc. to protect their assets from us. Less than 45 miinutes later and the shield was at 25%, the armour at 100%. Amusingly the hull remained at its almost non-existent level. MC began to jump away and we were left to wonder what could have been. We learnt a lot from attempting the task including our first use of Dreadnaughts in a POS engagement and we feel that we are now in a much better position to undertake and plan these jobs in future. In this instance and in spite of the original misinformation on the contract and what it entailed we refunded the client. We may not have achieved the destruction of the POS but for the sake of a minute and a sliver of luck we would of. When it takes 31 Capitals including 8 super-capitals to ensure we didn't then I guess I can't be too unhappy with the result. It could potentially have been a lot, lot worse. The third job down and the first two contracts to go. First on the list; Our war vs Spectre Ops, begins this evening. Contract against Spectre Ops, the guys that are mostly ex-Shinra and mercs in high-sec - or at least they were 2-3 months ago ? Hmm, i hope you publish a report about it, i want to see somet things confirmed. :) Rifter is not X-Wing CCP. Trinity model kinda sucks.
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS	Posted - 2007.11.28 00:09:00 - [74] this thread would have been epic had it been a decloaking cyno drake sounds like one hell of a fight. 1% hull is just a facepalm moment
UnsignedInt Gallente GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.11.28 05:00:00 - [75] Edited by: UnsignedInt on 28/11/2007 05:00:43 Originally by: Slinktress Edited by: Slinktress on 27/11/2007 11:00:13 Originally by: Seleene Nice write up. We had a little less than two hours notice on this from the time it was brought forth, payment hit the holding corp and the cynos started going up. We were expecting 15-25 BS, a few cap ships plus at least one mothership to be at the target. We were also expecting that we'd be defending a tower just coming out of reinforced. Turns out that the client screwed up the time so we had to hustle. When we jumped in the tower was completely red. All three bars. I have no idea if the thing even had 1% structure left. As for our numbers, well.. I said it on SHC - this is what happens when a bunch of animals haven't been fed in a while. So MC does after-hours emergency "plumbing" services now? Niiice... can't imagine the cost. Sounds like fun though! And, how are the rest of us mercs supposed to compete with that? Good job and good story! PS> Hi to my old buds in "TNT" o/ If MC are the plumbers of EVE, which alliance do I need to go to for my heater? It's starting to get cold here.
crudhunch Templars of Space Terra Incognita.	Posted - 2007.11.28 05:58:00 - [76] Originally by: UnsignedInt If MC are the plumbers of EVE, which alliance do I need to go to for my heater? It's starting to get cold here. If your heaters out and your cold, I'd call the Minmatar *** Rights League. BB will likely keep you warm.
Wesley Baird Murder-Death-Kill	Posted - 2007.11.28 06:50:00 - [77] Originally by: UnsignedInt If MC are the plumbers of EVE, which alliance do I need to go to for my heater? It's starting to get cold here. MDK aren't an alliance, but we get called in for the dirty jobs...
Kai Zion Amarr The Zion Accounts	Posted - 2007.11.28 06:55:00 - [78] Cheers for a nice write up of an interesting event. Classy as always, TNT.
Kojirochan Trinity Nova	Posted - 2007.11.28 12:03:00 - [79] Wow what a bomb that was dropped on us, i was going to attend this. But as i was in the process of moving items & ships. The op was a fair few jumps away so wasnt enough time. Would of been interesting to see some of the big ships in space :)
Rukaz Endgame.	Posted - 2007.11.28 12:52:00 - [80] The line between success and failure looks like a matter of minutes in this case. How awesome would it have been to have killed the tower and got out just as the MC Mombomb (tm) hit? Well done TNT, you've got to be in it to win it.
Umek Minmatar Drones Of Annihilation. Terra Incognita.	Posted - 2007.11.28 13:01:00 - [81] Nice write up Viqer. Props to my old corp mates at TNT and to MC for another 'just in time'
Flashh Gorden Trinity Nova	Posted - 2007.11.28 16:18:00 - [82] I had just warped my second account to the POS in a bustard. I was in the middle of serving up refreshments and munitions when the cyno went up, and my overveiw filled up with cap ships. I remember thinking to myself, ..................bugger............................
Tridgit Infortunatus Eventus HUZZAH FEDERATION	Posted - 2007.11.28 16:56:00 - [83] Nice write up OP. sounded exiting Quote: ...Our war vs Spectre Ops, begins this evening. wouldnt expect much. we were at war with them recently, and the only engagements we really had were small. 2-5 ships on each side. we simply never saw them in space if we outnumbered them. hopefully they'll be more than an empty uniform for you lads! -Trid << Mercenary >> - - !INEVE is currently recruiting! - -
Dark Avatar Caldari The Black Rabbits The Gurlstas Associates	Posted - 2007.11.28 18:02:00 - [84] Originally by: Viqer Fell Edited by: Viqer Fell on 27/11/2007 10:00:40 The only interuption was when Veto popped through local but with reports of a 50-60 man mixed Veto/friends gang 3 jumps out we decided to simply hold off till their fleet moved on. Dont flatter yourself sir, the Veto and Friends gang was 14 strong, only 6 bs. We came to engage your 14bs and Phoenix at the tower. No sooner had we disembarked warp, you were fleeing to the station. Shame. We thought your would put up a decent fight! D.A For you, the day I rolled into your system and killed your ace pilots was a most memorable day. For me, it was Tuesday...
Janu Hull Caldari Order of Z Industries	Posted - 2007.11.28 18:29:00 - [85] Originally by: Wendat Huron I can't wait for the day when someone hires MC to defend a POS and they warp in their entire cap fleet only to be doublecrossed and met with a superior force themselves. I wonder how much utter annihilation of said cap fleet would set them back? Nearly 10 moms and 30+ carriers? Help me here...who in the devil fields a force that could be defined as overwhelmingly superior enough to flatten it? To say nothing of the fact that getting MC to field that kind of firepower in the first place would probably cost enough to replace most of it. Not bashing your idea, just boggled by the logistics of pulling off a stunt like that, given that MC's one of the smarter packs of wolves on the block.
Mynas Atoch Eternity INC. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2007.11.28 18:43:00 - [86] Edited by: Mynas Atoch on 28/11/2007 18:45:20 Originally by: Janu Hull Nearly 10 moms and 30+ carriers? Help me here...who in the devil fields a force that could be defined as overwhelmingly superior enough to flatten it? To say nothing of the fact that getting MC to field that kind of firepower in the first place would probably cost enough to replace most of it. Not bashing your idea, just boggled by the logistics of pulling off a stunt like that, given that MC's one of the smarter packs of wolves on the block. TBH, its worse than that. I think any two of our corps could field around that number between them. Add other assets in, and allocate the Mythical Street Value to the ships and fittings and you wouldn't get much change from a Trillion isk. If we were factoring in full replacement cost in our pricing structure, none of you could afford us. That's a fleeting thought that goes through the mind of every MC Capital FC as he gives the order "All Caps Jump!" One day we will lose big, in an engagement that makes the loss of Armagedon Dawn look like a flesh wound. But not today... Myn If YOU want to hire MC to defend YOUR assets, or simply crush the despotic dreams of your friendly neighbourhood tyranical empire, call Mynas Atoch or Dri Kulsane for a competitive quote. No job too big; ALL targets considered. --- Sir Molle says : Mynas is Dead!
Miriallia Clyne Gallente Silver Snake Enterprise Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.11.28 20:12:00 - [87] Good Good you had some fun! Catch you on the flip side! Too bad, was actually hoping Grimpack going loco with his inner voices in local! And Good PR to MC too, hire them 100% worth it!
Grimpak Gallente Trinity Nova	Posted - 2007.11.28 20:24:00 - [88] Originally by: Miriallia Clyne Good Good you had some fun! Catch you on the flip side! Too bad, was actually hoping Grimpack going loco with his inner voices in local! And Good PR to MC too, hire them 100% worth it! A THREAD MY FRIEND. THAT WAS HOW MUCH I WAS CLOSE TO LOSE IT. A THREAD. --- planetary interaction idea!
Viqer Fell Minmatar Trinity Nova	Posted - 2007.11.28 22:16:00 - [89] Originally by: Dark Avatar Originally by: Viqer Fell Edited by: Viqer Fell on 27/11/2007 10:00:40 The only interuption was when Veto popped through local but with reports of a 50-60 man mixed Veto/friends gang 3 jumps out we decided to simply hold off till their fleet moved on. Dont flatter yourself sir, the Veto and Friends gang was 14 strong, only 6 bs. We came to engage your 14bs and Phoenix at the tower. No sooner had we disembarked warp, you were fleeing to the station. Shame. We thought your would put up a decent fight! D.A You misunderstood my statement sir. I did not state what I did to suggest you had gathered it for us. Just that we were aware that you had masive numbers nearby. If our intel was wrong then so be it but it matters little. If what you say is true and had I known that you had only what you had in local (rather than what we were told you had nearby) then you could have been assured of a fight. Click here to visit our site
Daniella Trump Caldari Bombshell Cartel	Posted - 2007.11.29 04:40:00 - [90] nicely written, great story! Keep it up please! More more!
Thorek Ironbrow Ironbrow Industries Co. Empire Research	Posted - 2008.01.05 21:44:00 - [91] Yeah, I saw some pictures of this on the ISS site, pretty sweet. _____________________________ Thorek Ironbrow of Ironbrow Industries Co. Part of the Empire Research Alliance Look us up in Nomaa or Itamo to join!
DHB FooFighter Dark Knights of Deneb Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2008.01.05 21:49:00 - [92] Originally by: Thorek Ironbrow Yeah, I saw some pictures of this on the ISS site, pretty sweet. Honestly, you looked back to find this thread just to post that? -------------------------------------------------

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