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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2008.01.21 00:55:00 -
[31]
The better question here is, was anybody actually punished (ISK penalities, bans, etc) for account sharing ? And if yes, what was the trigger ? Simply logging into another person's account, to, say, change skills for a friend who's away ? Somebody reporting them for account sharing ? Operating a alliace-owned "cynonet" of commonly-owned alts ? Robbing them blind, then them reporting you for stealing (or petitioning for "been hacked") ?
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Dr Paithos
Minmatar Republic Deep Space Institute
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Posted - 2008.01.21 01:13:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Akita T The better question here is, was anybody actually punished (ISK penalities, bans, etc) for account sharing ? And if yes, what was the trigger ? Simply logging into another person's account, to, say, change skills for a friend who's away ? Somebody reporting them for account sharing ? Operating a alliace-owned "cynonet" of commonly-owned alts ? Robbing them blind, then them reporting you for stealing (or petitioning for "been hacked") ?
well someone has to report them to ccp obviously
ccp have said stuff like your family can change skills for you so it seems very unlikely they will punish account sharing unless there is some loss involved but who knows
i think the ccp policy is based around stuff like someone "giving" a friend his account when he leaves eve then coming back and petitioning it to get it back so ccp of course just ban them both for being ********
people being stupid the above kind of situation is really common
this kind of thing mostly goes on hearsay though due to it being verboten to publish gm convos and so on
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Mr Friendly
That it Should Come to This Derek Knows Us
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Posted - 2008.01.21 01:21:00 -
[33]
Only a piece of scum in RL would take from someone else's account. Congratulations, Istvaan... you're dirt
Originally by: Mangala Solaris
EVE really doesnt have set goals, its a freeform sandbox - yes a sandbox with kids that occasionally take a dump in it, but a sandbox never the less.
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ry ry
StateCorp The State
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Posted - 2008.01.21 01:22:00 -
[34]
Edited by: ry ry on 21/01/2008 01:22:22
Originally by: Istvaan Shogaatsu I just wanna get the game rules clear on this so it doesn't bite me in the ass [...] will I be banned?
CCP have, in my experience, treated the EULA more as a set of guidelines than actual rules.
i've found myself enjoying a SpecialEveHoliday a couple of times when i was 100% confident i was within the EULA, albeit by a hairs bredth. trying to get CCP's official stance on this is a good idea though, since different GMs nova seem interpret the rules in the same way as one another.
and i'm sure this post will get moderated too, since thats the way these things go.
ps. 'ilikesausagedogs' is a crap password. you should probably change it.
[IMAGE REMOVED] |
Yuri VanKaer
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Posted - 2008.01.21 02:37:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Mr Friendly Only a piece of scum in RL would take from someone else's account. Congratulations, Istvaan... you're dirt
qft In game actions are one thing, RL theft/vandalism (which what you're suggesting really is) is another thing entirely. Grow up.
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Duke Grail
Umbra Congregatio Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.01.21 02:57:00 -
[36]
this would not be legal under article 2 section B
near the end of the first paragraph of 2.B
Originally by: EULA "...You may not obtain, attempt to obtain, use or attempt to use the password of anyone else."
also at the end of the second paragraph of 2.B
Originally by: EULA "You may not obtain, attempt to obtain, use or attempt to use the login name or character name of anyone else."
You're better off just getting the dude to give you roles and then making off with their stuff. If they're dumb enough to give you their login, they'll probably give you their stuff without a second thought. I have no signature... it keeps getting nerfed by the mods for no good reason :( |
Ashley Sky
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.01.21 03:03:00 -
[37]
Another he said, she said situation, with reference to GM rules of abstraction. I fail to see how this is enforceable.
However, certain protective measures could be taken from the wireless IP of the coffeehouse down the street, and several generous donations to other players that you would feel the blame should be shifted on to.
Click for iMune Empire FAQ
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xOm3gAx
Caldari Stain of Mind
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Posted - 2008.01.21 03:06:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Istvaan Shogaatsu I just wanna get the game rules clear on this so it doesn't bite me in the ass.
Let's say another Eve player willingly gave me his account password. Would it be considered a violation of EULA to log onto his account and jack his stuff? The way it reads, I'm guessing that once someone gives me their account password willingly, they're pretty much trusting me to whatever's in there. To quote:
Originally by: CCP EULA You are responsible and liable for all activities conducted through your Account, regardless of who conducts those activities.
There's also the more concise passage stating...
Originally by: CCP EULA You are responsible for maintaining the confidentiality of your Password and for any damage, harm, lost or deleted characters, etc. resulting from your disclosure, or allowing the disclosure, of any Password, or from use by any person of your Password.
But, again, this doesn't address my question - aside from the generic admonishment against sharing accounts (which is pretty much a unenforcable joke and ignored by all of Eve Online) there's really not much clarity on this subject.
tl;dr: if I log on to someone's account, with the password they themselves gave me of their own volition, and rob them blind... will I be banned?
You both get banned. Them for giving you the pw and you for maliciously using someone elses account. This has happened once b4 that i know of probably more times then that.
The time i know of was between a boyfriend and girlfriend it was all over the forums so im sure someone else can remember the details.
Originally by: CCP Abraxas Her boyfriend's way hot, too; tall and tanned. And I say this as a very hetero male who doesn't ever dream of the man on cold, dark nights.
[url="http://myeve.eve-online.co |
Dahin
Maza Nostra oooh Shiny
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Posted - 2008.01.21 03:58:00 -
[39]
Say someone gives you his account details. You login as him, rob him blind, then laugh at him.
He petitions you, both your accounts get instantly banned. (seen it happen at least twice) Chances are neither your accounts will ever get reactivated. Victim has better chances tho.
Why fly covops? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u0WOIwlXE9g |
Stakhanov
Metafarmers
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Posted - 2008.01.21 12:01:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Mr Friendly Only a piece of scum in RL would take from someone else's account. Congratulations, Istvaan... you're dirt
lol
Originally by: ivan draco we didnt want your post anyway
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Manipulator General
o.0
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Posted - 2008.01.21 12:13:00 -
[41]
Given your history, who in their right mind would trust you with anything?
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Istvaan Shogaatsu
Guiding Hand Social Club
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Posted - 2008.01.21 12:22:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Mr Friendly Only a piece of scum in RL would take from someone else's account. Congratulations, Istvaan... you're dirt
Well... duh.
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Richard Phallus
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Posted - 2008.01.21 12:30:00 -
[43]
HEY! You guys aren't even actual EULA lawyers are you?! Yea, where did you go to school, pshhh. Have you been called to the EULA Barristers Association? Which is amusingly known as the Hula Bar for some reason, but I can't figure why, Iceland is mighty far away from Hawaii.
Wait what? --
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Niccolado Starwalker
Shadow Templars
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Posted - 2008.01.21 12:30:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Istvaan Shogaatsu
Originally by: Mr Friendly Only a piece of scum in RL would take from someone else's account. Congratulations, Istvaan... you're dirt
Well... duh.
I met Istvaan at the Fanfest 2 years ago, and he seems to be a nice enough fellow. Nicer for sure then the character he plays
One of the largest mistakes people do is to compare their ingame behavior with their rl behavior, although I think Istvaan should not attempt to log into others accounts and clean them. As pointed out by someone earlier in this thread it is against the EULA for sure.
Originally by: CCP Whisper I got your ambulation right here... <walks off to get more wine>
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Kuolematon
Space Perverts and Forum Warriors United Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2008.01.21 12:30:00 -
[45]
Known EVE Facts:
Noone ever shares accounts with others. They always change their skills themselves and never shares accounts inside alliance or corporation. It's honest and total truth.
It's great being Amarr isn't it.
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facepalm johnson
a sackful of sacrificial sacrifices
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Posted - 2008.01.21 12:31:00 -
[46]
I love these self-important nobheads who write forum poasts as open letters to CCP staff.
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CCP Navigator
C C P
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Posted - 2008.01.21 12:33:00 -
[47]
Accessing another players account is against the EULA.
If you believe someone may have your account information you should file a petition and bring it to the attention of the GM's.
Accessing another players account, especially if that access is to cause harm, will not be looked upon favourably.
It is completely a matter between the GM's and players involved in these cases. CCP will not divulge ban details on any player to the general public. This is always a matter of privacy between the GM's and those parties involved.
Long story short - it is in your best interest to never access another players account. Bad things may happen to your account if you do.
Navigator, Community Representative EVE Online, CCP Games Email/Netfang |
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CCP Xhagen
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Posted - 2008.01.21 12:36:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Istvaan Shogaatsu I just wanna get the game rules clear on this so it doesn't bite me in the ass.
Let's say another Eve player willingly gave me his account password. Would it be considered a violation of EULA to log onto his account and jack his stuff? The way it reads, I'm guessing that once someone gives me their account password willingly, they're pretty much trusting me to whatever's in there. To quote:
Originally by: CCP EULA You are responsible and liable for all activities conducted through your Account, regardless of who conducts those activities.
There's also the more concise passage stating...
Originally by: CCP EULA You are responsible for maintaining the confidentiality of your Password and for any damage, harm, lost or deleted characters, etc. resulting from your disclosure, or allowing the disclosure, of any Password, or from use by any person of your Password.
But, again, this doesn't address my question - aside from the generic admonishment against sharing accounts (which is pretty much a unenforcable joke and ignored by all of Eve Online) there's really not much clarity on this subject.
tl;dr: if I log on to someone's account, with the password they themselves gave me of their own volition, and rob them blind... will I be banned?
To answer your question:
Originally by: CCP EULA
B. Passwords and Names You will be asked to select a password during the registration process ("Password"). You may not disclose your Password to anyone or allow anyone to use your Password to access the System or play EVEÖ. You are responsible for maintaining the confidentiality of your Password and for any damage, harm, lost or deleted characters, etc. resulting from your disclosure, or allowing the disclosure, of any Password, or from use by any person of your Password. You may not obtain, attempt to obtain, use or attempt to use the password of anyone else. You are responsible for remembering your Account information and Password.
You will be assigned a login name and a character name during the registration and character creation process. You may not allow anyone to use your login name or character name to access the System or play EVEÖ. No player may use the character name of another player to impersonate or falsely represent his or her identity. You may not obtain, attempt to obtain, use or attempt to use the login name or character name of anyone else.
I must admit that your selective reading is rather surprising. ____________________________
EVE Online CCP Games |
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Virtuozzo
IRON Tech Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2008.01.21 12:56:00 -
[49]
It's human nature ... not surprising :P
CAOD FTW.
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Anglo
Minmatar Astral Mexicans
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Posted - 2008.01.21 12:59:00 -
[50]
in all hounystly i think the current eula is kinda sucky, it should be ok to act as a "babysitter" for another player if he/sh is on vecation etc.. as in u are ok to log on change skill, etc.. all it had to take was a vecation mode button where when pressed you can choose an alternate password wich u give to the babysitter, when thats done in vecation mode all would be locked down, wallet items etc... everyhting but skills.. also u cant undock..
this would be a nice feuture..
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Istvaan Shogaatsu
Guiding Hand Social Club
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Posted - 2008.01.21 13:08:00 -
[51]
Edited by: Istvaan Shogaatsu on 21/01/2008 13:11:30 Thanks Xhagen. Missed those parts.
Please do not discuss player bans on the forums. Navigator
Sorry for making y'all change your mom pilot passwords, heh.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2008.01.21 13:13:00 -
[52]
Originally by: CCP Navigator CCP will not divulge ban details on any player to the general public. This is always a matter of privacy between the GM's and those parties involved.
This part I can understand.
However, what about "back in the day" with the whole "shared cynonet" accusations against some parties that shall remain nameless, I believe there would have been absolutely no breach of privacy whatsoever to announce something akin to "25 shared cynonet alt accounts were perma-banned, and 50 other account owners that participated were also punished in some way" ? I mean, you didn't have any trouble in stating the number of banned RMT/farming accounts and amount of ISK removed from the economy in the process back when a massive op was conducted.
I'm not saying there actually WERE any "shared cynonet" alt accounts, I'm not saying I know any of them were banned or not banned (because frankly I have no clue), but you can see why the LACK of any statements (as general / non-privacy-breaking / whatsoever as they could have been made) makes people think it's somehow "allright" to share account details. And especially (HYPOTHETICALLY speaking) since in case that those "cynonet" accusations WOULD have been true, they would have (directly or indirectly, you be the judge of that) been damaging to the gameplay of many others... while, in contrast, giving a friend your password to change skills for you while out of town or somesuch seems so benign that many people quite often are tempted to VOLUNTEER that information to real-life friends.
So, basically, it's a "if they did it, and they did damage in the process, yet still nobody punished them, why should I be punished for something that doesn't damage anybody". This is only made worse by anecdotal evidence that family members accessing eachother's accounts would actually be condoned by CCP (don't ask me where I got this from either, I don't recall the forum threads right now).
Again, I'm not stating that as something I'd say or do, but it IS a pretty far-spread mindset among EVE players. So... which one is it ?
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ElCoCo
KIA Corp KIA Alliance
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Posted - 2008.01.21 13:19:00 -
[53]
So to make it more clear: -The person obtaining another one's login/password may be banned -The person giving his login/password is unaffected as an account but the transactions while the account was compromised aren't reversed? (thus any items/isk will remain in the offender's banned account?) |
Marcus Marcellus
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Posted - 2008.01.21 13:26:00 -
[54]
Edited by: Marcus Marcellus on 21/01/2008 13:29:16
Originally by: ElCoCo So to make it more clear: -The person obtaining another one's login/password may be banned -The person giving his login/password is unaffected as an account but the transactions while the account was compromised aren't reversed? (thus any items/isk will remain in the offender's banned account?)
Or in some cases, the person who the victim gave his login/password to is permabanned on first offense, the victim recieves no punishment, and is given back at minimum, his/her isk for his/her stupidity.
Of course this has nev...oh wait.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2008.01.21 13:28:00 -
[55]
Originally by: ElCoCo So to make it more clear: -The person obtaining another one's login/password may be banned -The person giving his login/password is unaffected as an account but the transactions while the account was compromised aren't reversed? (thus any items/isk will remain in the offender's banned account?)
Anecdotal evidence says yes, and it gets even worse... somebody (that shall again remain nameless) once claimed in a pretty high-profile case ("on the internets") that his account (actually, not just his EVE account but also Paypal and other) was HACKED (well, trojan/keylogger, allegedly), and somebody sold everything he had (INCLUDING his character) for real-world money. Resolution being... nothing returned, AND account banned since, well, he engaged in RMT. Hillarious, isn't it ?
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Shinnen
Caldari Northern Intelligence The Reckoning.
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Posted - 2008.01.21 13:45:00 -
[56]
Edited by: Shinnen on 21/01/2008 13:50:35 Although GM consistency is somewhat of a hit and miss. I think we can all look upon the (well-known) case where a - CEO of a Tanking nature - had money stolen from his account case as pretty good indication of what happens to the person taking the money.
edited as we're not allowed to discuss this really. -- Banned since 2005, back by popular demand! They said it wouldn't happen!! |
Kuolematon
Space Perverts and Forum Warriors United Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2008.01.21 13:50:00 -
[57]
I still don't get it. It's MY account and I pay for it. It's my damn own business if I go and share with it someone (I have NEVER done this nor WILL DO! *cough*). Why should CCP punish me for something I own (My account) and do whatever I liek?
It's great being Amarr isn't it.
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Shinnen
Caldari Northern Intelligence The Reckoning.
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Posted - 2008.01.21 13:51:00 -
[58]
Originally by: Kuolematon I still don't get it. It's MY account and I pay for it. It's my damn own business if I go and share with it someone (I have NEVER done this nor WILL DO! *cough*). Why should CCP punish me for something I own (My account) and do whatever I liek?
You don't buy your account you "rent" it from CCP, the account remains property of CCP -- Banned since 2005, back by popular demand! They said it wouldn't happen!! |
Marcus Marcellus
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Posted - 2008.01.21 13:55:00 -
[59]
Originally by: Shinnen Edited by: Shinnen on 21/01/2008 13:50:35 Although GM consistency is somewhat of a hit and miss. I think we can all look upon the (well-known) case where a - CEO of a Tanking nature - had money stolen from his account case as pretty good indication of what happens to the person taking the money.
edited as we're not allowed to discuss this really.
This particulally occurs if the CEO of a tanking nature claims that his computer was hacked, even if he shared, for maximum effectiveness against offender and high horse for "victim"
Oh how sad it is that punishment can be manipulated by the players.
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Shwedagon Paya
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Posted - 2008.01.21 13:55:00 -
[60]
Originally by: Shinnen
Originally by: Kuolematon I still don't get it. It's MY account and I pay for it. It's my damn own business if I go and share with it someone (I have NEVER done this nor WILL DO! *cough*). Why should CCP punish me for something I own (My account) and do whatever I liek?
You don't buy your account you "rent" it from CCP, the account remains property of CCP
This.
99.9% of consumers are under the impression that purchasing the right to use someone's virtual property is the same as ownership. It isn't.
An annoying technicality, I agree, but important nonetheless.
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