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Lord Droverson
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Posted - 2008.02.11 17:53:00 -
[1]
I like many others have played EVE for a considerable time, paying my ú's earning my isk. So i was dissapointed to discover that when thru a problem on the market system, wherein I was charged 450mill isk for a 450k isk BPO i got short shrift from CCP. I requested this isk back thru the petition system stating that an NPC corparation had taken this isk in error and that it was a potential bug/input error on the market. CCP's response was basically to call into question my judgement and typing abilites and to state that sometimes there are "Crazy" buy orders on the market and that the market is setup to take advantage of these "Crazy" buy orders. In my mind "Crazy" suggests not the norm and therfore I have a valid case, furthermore, i'm not asking CCP to refund the isk from a fellow player, if i had made that mistake i would of let it go, but this isk is in CCP's hands and can be returned. In 4 years I've only ever petitioned when I like many others have lost a ship thru lag during a fleet battle. The 1st time i ask CCP to do me a favour I get denied.
What a way to treat a loyal customer. |
flashfreaking
LFC FreeFall Securities
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Posted - 2008.02.11 17:56:00 -
[2]
Prove it was an NPC corp, and that you weren't scammed. Disallowed sig graphic. Send an e-mail to [email protected] when it meets the forum signature guidelines. ~Saint |
An Anarchyyt
Gallente Battlestars GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.02.11 17:57:00 -
[3]
Stuff, can I have it?
Originally by: CCP Wrangler Second, a gentile is a non jewish person
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Protrade
Gallente University of Caille
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Posted - 2008.02.11 17:58:00 -
[4]
Uhm, I paid 1billion for a hulk a few weeks ago because of a typo. I don't expect reimbursement.I won't petition. CCP is not in the business of favors. They are in the business of being unforgiving and laughing at petitions. Learn from your mistake and go on... Now I double check everything I buy/sell to ensure that the "percent to market average" is within 10%. You should do the same. _____________________________________
I am the trading alt for a very wealthy industrial corporation. Billions of isk flow through my Jita 4-4 account every day and I never undock. I'm lovin it. |
Agent Li
Caldari Galactic Defence Consortium BLACKHAWK FEDERATION
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Posted - 2008.02.11 17:59:00 -
[5]
There are many buy and sell orders set up on the market by other players specifically to catch people incorrectly typing the wrong amount.
It's not a bug. It's not an exploit. It's not CCP's job to keep you from typing the wrong amount. ------------------
Let me show you around. That's my lab table, and this is my workstool. And over there is my intergalactic spaceship. And here's where I keep assorted lengths of wire. |
Tarminic
Forsaken Resistance The Last Stand
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Posted - 2008.02.11 17:59:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Tarminic on 11/02/2008 18:00:36 First of all, CCP should treat all of their customers equally, regardless of their age or any other characteristic.
Second of all, it sounds like what happened to you was no "bug" but you accidentally typing a few too many zeros on your buy order. The way that the market works is that it will find the closest order to that amount and then pay them the price that YOU set for that buy order. You set an absurdly high buy order price, and a player fulfilled it and got all of the ISK that you specified.
Quote: In my mind "Crazy" suggests not the norm and therfore I have a valid case
No, because "crazy" buy orders are not a bug and not a misuse of game mechanics.
Originally by: flashfreaking Prove it was an NPC corp, and that you weren't scammed.
Even if it was, it would have been paid the amount that he specified in his buy order. ---------------- Tarminic - 31 Million SP in Forum Warfare Play EVE: Downtime Madness v0.78.2 |
Sul Condbax
Open Season
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Posted - 2008.02.11 18:05:00 -
[7]
Falling into a market trap like that is comparable to jumping into a gatecamp - it's pvp with other means, and you were ganked.
And how long you've played the game is totally irrelevant, other than it's pretty funny you would fall for it
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Tamia Clant
New Dawn Corp New Eden Research
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Posted - 2008.02.11 18:07:00 -
[8]
Let me guess, you put up a buy order for 450 million and were surprised when the NPC's sold it to you for that price?
That's how the market works, you ask for something at a ridiculous price, somone selling that item will get an instant sale, for the price you are asking for, it doesn't really matter if it's an NPC or a player.
Now, you may argue that since the money ended up with the NPC's, there's no harm by returning it. While that may be true, reiumbursement policies are very strict and there's nothing in the rules that states you should get reiumbursed. You may try getting the petition escalated or whatever, but most likely you still won't get anything back.
Looking for queue-free research slots? Click here!
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Korizan
Oort Cloud Industries
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Posted - 2008.02.11 18:18:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Korizan on 11/02/2008 18:25:50 Edited by: Korizan on 11/02/2008 18:20:06
NPC Traders have an Expires time of 364 Days blah blah blah
PC Traders have an Expires time of 89 Days blah blah blah or less.
If it was an NPC trader you should have no problem pulling up the vary same order on the market as they always sell multiples of an item to prove your case to CCP.
Last item Go to your wallet. Select transactions You will find a client column. THat will tell you who you purchased the item from. Player / Player Corporation or NPC Corporation.
However I am sorry but I doubt that is the case it is most likely a scam. I just pulled up the market and found the normal sell price for a shuttle of 9,001 ISK and there are 2 more selling for 9 Million ISK that are from PC Characters.
Sorry once again but nobody is going to believe you unless you give a region and item that was purchased. As that would be the decent thing to do if there is a bug so others would not be caught. But you have not done that.
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Matalino
Gallente Ki Tech Industries
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Posted - 2008.02.11 19:03:00 -
[10]
The point is that it doesn't matter who sold you the item. You chose to pay to much for it, and such is life.
Ship reimbersements are not dependant on who laid the final blow. It doesn't matter if your ship is destroyed by an NPC or a player, the same rules and policies for reimbursment apply. Likewise with the market: it does not matter if the transaction was with an NPC or a player.
It was an expensive lesson, but hopefully you have learned it the first time and will not repeat it.
If CCP had reimbursed you, then we could slam them for their absymal customer service for not following their own policies and proceedures.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2008.02.11 19:24:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Lord Droverson [...]discover that when thru a problem on the market system, wherein I was charged 450mill isk for a 450k isk BPO [...] NPC corparation had taken this isk in error and that it was a potential bug/input error on the market. CCP's response was basically to call into question my judgement and typing abilites
Need more data to make sure it WAS a NPC sell order you bought from. Seriously, screenshots of transaction logs are needed. And then again, assurance you didn't actually place a buy order at *1000 of normal value accidentally yourself, instead of making a direct buy at the NPC price.
1|2|3|4|5. |
Haniblecter Teg
F.R.E.E. Explorer Atrum Tempestas Foedus
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Posted - 2008.02.11 19:45:00 -
[12]
To the OPs problem:
That's market PVP man. Cornering markets and fake sell orders are a part of this game. You lost on that, even if its an NPC corporation.
Now, contrast that with my latest market f-up/reimbursement. I put a 'Solace' large Remote Armor Rep on the market for 3.95 BILLION, instead of 3.95 million (it was supposed to be 4.95 too!). I lost my money to a 45 MILLION broker fee. I got reimbursed and I most deffinantly didnt expect to be.
But, that isk didnt go to a player, npc or real, it was merely a game mechanic that gobbled it up.
In short, EVE is a brutal game where everyone 'pvp's' on some small level (either with modules or the markets). The more your mistake and loss is attributed to a 'player' (pc or real) the less your chance of reimbursement. ----------------- Friends Forever
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Osku Rei
Caldari Perkone
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Posted - 2008.02.11 19:57:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Osku Rei on 11/02/2008 19:57:05
Originally by: Haniblecter Teg
Now, contrast that with my latest market f-up/reimbursement. I put a 'Solace' large Remote Armor Rep on the market for 3.95 BILLION, instead of 3.95 million (it was supposed to be 4.95 too!). I lost my money to a 45 MILLION broker fee. I got reimbursed and I most deffinantly didnt expect to be.
Wait, did CCP reimburse you? -----------------------------------------------
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2008.02.11 20:04:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Osku Rei
Originally by: Haniblecter Teg 45 MILLION broker fee. I got reimbursed and I most deffinantly didnt expect to be.
Wait, did CCP reimburse you?
GMs are human too, they sometimes reimburse things they shouldn't. It's the primary reason why there's so many crappy reimbursement petitions to go around, and therefore the reason GMs are so overworked that they end up doing mistakes. It's a vicious circle.
1|2|3|4|5. |
Terminus adacai
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.02.11 20:07:00 -
[15]
You purchased a bpo from a player that was scrupulous enough to "reprice" his print to make it look similar. Not sure of the Latin, but "buyer beware" seems to fit here.
Opinions reflected on my posts are just that, my opinions. They do not reflect views held by my corp or alliance. |
Surfin's PlunderBunny
Minmatar GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.02.11 20:18:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Terminus adacai You purchased a bpo from a player that was scrupulous enough to "reprice" his print to make it look similar. Not sure of the Latin, but "buyer beware" seems to fit here.
No, this is a case of buyer-be-smart
Originally by: Avaricia look a goon lol
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Archa
Caldari Chickens with an Attitude No Law
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Posted - 2008.02.11 20:31:00 -
[17]
I don't think it is poor customer service as there was no bug. You made an error and there is no way to turn this around easily.
Something similar happend to me once. I accidently put in to many zeros in a sale order and put i dunno something on the market for 100 billion isk.
Automatically i had to pay about 1 billion isk in tax. CCP was kind enough to undo my error and warned me not to do it again.
If no other players get hurt by an undo action then ccp will most likely undo it.
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Tarminic
Forsaken Resistance The Last Stand
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Posted - 2008.02.11 20:35:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Archa I don't think it is poor customer service as there was no bug. You made an error and there is no way to turn this around easily.
Something similar happend to me once. I accidently put in to many zeros in a sale order and put i dunno something on the market for 100 billion isk.
Automatically i had to pay about 1 billion isk in tax. CCP was kind enough to undo my error and warned me not to do it again.
If no other players get hurt by an undo action then ccp will most likely undo it.
This seems pretty reasonable, honestly. It's one thing to carelessly lose ISK to a player scam, but losing a billion ISK to a broker fee seems like a bit much, even for CCP's usual bar for reimbursement. ---------------- Tarminic - 32 Million SP in Forum Warfare Play EVE: Downtime Madness v0.78.3 (NEW VERSION!) |
Anson Halleck
Lost Eden
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Posted - 2008.02.11 20:45:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Tarminic
Originally by: Archa I don't think it is poor customer service as there was no bug. You made an error and there is no way to turn this around easily.
Something similar happend to me once. I accidently put in to many zeros in a sale order and put i dunno something on the market for 100 billion isk.
Automatically i had to pay about 1 billion isk in tax. CCP was kind enough to undo my error and warned me not to do it again.
If no other players get hurt by an undo action then ccp will most likely undo it.
This seems pretty reasonable, honestly. It's one thing to carelessly lose ISK to a player scam, but losing a billion ISK to a broker fee seems like a bit much, even for CCP's usual bar for reimbursement.
I lost about 600M on broker fee (3 more zeros on sell order) and even though ISK went to NPC broker, CCP told me they won't reimburse me. Fair enough. Few months later same thing happens to someone else and he got ISK back. So I guess, like many other thins, it depends on your luck/GM you get to answer your petition.
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Lord Droverson
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Posted - 2008.02.11 23:48:00 -
[20]
screenshot added, thoughts please
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Estel Arador
Minmatar Damage over Time
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Posted - 2008.02.11 23:54:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Lord Droverson So i was dissapointed to discover that when thru a problem on the market system, wherein I was charged 450mill isk for a 450k isk BPO i got short shrift from CCP.
Have you identified this 'problem'? And did you buy from a sell order or place a buy order?
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Tortun Nahme
Minmatar Heimatar Services Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.02.12 01:07:00 -
[22]
op fails at eve
this should teach you too very important lessons
read before you hit submit, and stfooj
Originally by: Cecil Montague They should change that warning on entering low sec to:
"Go read Crime and Punishment for a few days then come back."
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Dionisius
Gallente Critical Analysis R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2008.02.12 05:50:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Akita T
Originally by: Lord Droverson [...]discover that when thru a problem on the market system, wherein I was charged 450mill isk for a 450k isk BPO [...] NPC corparation had taken this isk in error and that it was a potential bug/input error on the market. CCP's response was basically to call into question my judgement and typing abilites
Need more data to make sure it WAS a NPC sell order you bought from. Seriously, screenshots of transaction logs are needed. (...)
If GM's have logs why should we have to provide pictures?
_____________________________________
Your signature is too large. Please resize it to a maximum of 400 x 120 with the file size not exceeding 24000 bytes. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] - Mitnal |
JordanTwoDelta
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Posted - 2008.02.12 06:04:00 -
[24]
They really dont have logs, the roll a 3 sides dice, if 1 hits its reimbursed, if 2 hits they have to roll again, and if 3 hits it cannot be found in logs ;)
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Sythyss
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Posted - 2008.02.12 06:14:00 -
[25]
well, it certainly looks like a glitch to me. That screenshot proves he paid it to "Caldari Navy" which means it's not a player scam, and I doubt he could have just "typed an extra 0" because that would have been like 1000% of the market norm, which means a little info box would've popped up asking him if he was sure. And yeah, I don't see why a screenshot is even needed, as this should've been logged by the devs.
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Vested Interest
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Posted - 2008.02.12 06:16:00 -
[26]
I'm guessing the OP pushed the "buy" button instead of going to the item details and then just accepted the default price it gave him--which was someone else's outlandishly high price. Of course the money went to Caldari Navy.
Sometimes the Buy button won't give you the best price available (bug) but you have to watch for it. Always buy from the details screen.
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Sandeep
Raptus Regaliter Brutally Clever Empire
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Posted - 2008.02.12 06:47:00 -
[27]
Something like this happened. Note: The NPC (or anyone else who happens to have the lowest priced sell order) did not scam you. They just got lucky.
Btw, it looks like you fell for this order. The "scammer" did not provide a corresponding lowest-priced sell order, so he didn't get your money either.
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Taua Roqa
Minmatar Eve University Ivy League
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Posted - 2008.02.12 07:24:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Vested Interest
Sometimes the Buy button won't give you the best price available (bug) but you have to watch for it. Always buy from the details screen.
Almost always the buy button gives me something obscenely priced and not even in the same station! the players who put those huge sell orders up know this and are exploiting this odd quirk/bug in the game. -------------------------------------------- Threads are stacking-nerfed; the more posts you add the less effective those posts are. mooooooo. |
Sandeep
Raptus Regaliter Brutally Clever Empire
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Posted - 2008.02.12 07:58:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Taua Roqa Almost always the buy button gives me something obscenely priced and not even in the same station! the players who put those huge sell orders up know this and are exploiting this odd quirk/bug in the game.
Strange. I rarely encounter this problem when I buy stuff. Would you kindly tell me how to reproduce this phenomenon?
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Thuul'Khalat
Gallente Phoenix Wing
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Posted - 2008.02.12 08:13:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Sandeep
Originally by: Taua Roqa Almost always the buy button gives me something obscenely priced and not even in the same station! the players who put those huge sell orders up know this and are exploiting this odd quirk/bug in the game.
Strange. I rarely encounter this problem when I buy stuff. Would you kindly tell me how to reproduce this phenomenon?
Not to mention the fact that the lowest sell order is ALWAYS the one that is filled, thus, the players you claim "exploit" this would not see that obscene amount, and only lose loads of money to broker fees.
As the good old saying goes... LRN2PLAY!!OMG ---
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