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Gnulpie
Minmatar Miner Tech
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Posted - 2008.02.29 20:02:00 -
[1]
With Ambulation hoovering at the horizon and being the main focus of CCP for quite a while now I think it is time to suggest (again) a really nice feature. It would fit well into Ambulation, but is not necessarily related to it: Ambulation TV - Battle Transmissions.
I am talking about battle transmissions in a TV like surrounding, watching your corpmates in space fighting or doing whatever else. There could be a special room in Ambulation stations for your corp where you can watch ongoing battles or watching playbacks from happenings.
Current client rendering
CCP transmits data from their servers to the client and the client then renders what we are seeing. We or someone else is doing something, data gets transferred back to the servers, they calculate new data and send it back to the client and we get an update on the situation. This is repeated over and over again. If the server is overwhelmed with data we get some lag or even desyncs. But the important point here is that the servers don't transmit a video stream or something like this but just some data of ships positions etc. and the client then renders the final picture - in whatever resolution we want.
Proposal for in-game TV
- Sending the same battle data not to one client but to severals. When CCP sends the data necessary to render the current frame to the client of the player, the same data could be also transmitted to someone else! And if this someone else recieves that data, he could render then the same picture which the pilot on the battlefield can see. It is not necessary to calculate new data, there wouldn't be any more strain to the database servers, no additional lag would be created. Only a bit more bandwith is necessary to send this data to the player - and here comes Ambulation into the account.
- Playback of remote TV. Sitting in an (ambulation) station in your own office you could have a strategic battle room where you can have some sort of device which could playback (remote) TV. This means you could in this room watch a battle which is going on at the other end of the universe without delay (if there is no lag). The strain on the servers wouldn't be high because no need data needs to be created, it is already calculated once and it only needs to be sent to TWO places instead of one: the active pilot and the battle room in the station and to people who are watching there.
- Recording and playing back of TV. There is lot of more potential here. Why not being able to record those battles? Also These records could be named - holoreels! The data necessary to be stored shouldn't be that high, and if it is getting too large then cut records down to a certain time limit. With the data stored you could always playback these battles, after all it shouldn't matter if the client gets the data freshly calculated from the eve servers or just out of a stored file from the eve servers. Also, if you have battles stored in these holoreels you could give the reels to other people so that they can watch the battles as well - in as high quality as they want.
Please CCP, think about it. This feature would be fantastic. And together with Eve voice we could also have tournaments and such transmitted and commented and stored all in Eve!
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Trojanman190
Yultani Advanced Research and Reproduction
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Posted - 2008.02.29 20:09:00 -
[2]
The fact that this would allow us to turn off all our settings during fights for permormance, then watch the videos later with the settings on would be amazing by itself.
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Donna Maria
Amarr
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Posted - 2008.02.29 20:38:00 -
[3]
Umm, No. Fix fleet lag first, then bells and whistles later. CCP knows that the people that really pay for this game's bread and butter are the addicts that live in 0.0 Im the girl momma warned you about..
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Asestorian
Domination. UnNatural Selection.
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Posted - 2008.02.29 20:43:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Donna Maria Umm, No. Fix fleet lag first, then bells and whistles later. CCP knows that the people that really pay for this game's bread and butter are the addicts that live in 0.0
They are trying to fix lag. That's what all their talk about investing in new server technology was about before. They can't just stop doing everything to fix lag, there's only so many people they can realistically assign to a single task, and they need to have their other guys doing something too.
---
MOZO
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Niko medes
Gallente Bad Production Inc
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Posted - 2008.02.29 20:47:00 -
[5]
i agree with donna
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Weeaboot
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Posted - 2008.02.29 21:06:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Donna Maria Umm, No. Fix fleet lag first, then bells and whistles later. CCP knows that the people that really pay for this game's bread and butter are the addicts that live in 0.0
Too bad that 90% of the player base is in Empire then.
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Ash Vincetti
Decorum Inc
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Posted - 2008.02.29 21:10:00 -
[7]
I think this idea is great. When you really think about it, there should be a 3-4 hour delay between playback and the actual event. Something about transmitting the signal through deepspace.
The really interesting thing about this proposal, is that the entire mechanism for displaying the battles already exists.
Give it some thought, until you get to the *gasp! of course!* moment.
The logs. You know, then ones that never show anything wrong? That don't show lag, or issues with any one ship or fleet performing out of the ordinary?
Yes. Those. Now think about it, if they show nothing out of the ordinary, then perfect playbacks should be possible. As a bonus, you get to find out what *really* happened to your ship. -----
free bree! |
Kahega Amielden
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Posted - 2008.02.29 21:14:00 -
[8]
Epic idea.
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Gedhir
Gallente Disciples Of Apocalypse
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Posted - 2008.02.29 21:41:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Gedhir on 29/02/2008 21:42:32 This is a great idea. This kind of recording is what allows for great videos using the Source engine in HL2-like games (thanks to Source Recorder), and I've hoped for a while that CCP would seek to implement this sort of feature.
/signed
Oh, and Donna's attitude toward getting things done would, applied to the real world, paralyze all human progress until all wars and suffering end.
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Kyra Felann
Gallente Noir.
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Posted - 2008.02.29 22:53:00 -
[10]
How does this make sense from an immersion/role-playing perspective?
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Gnulpie
Minmatar Miner Tech
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Posted - 2008.02.29 23:02:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Kyra Felann How does this make sense from an immersion/role-playing perspective?
I think it makes perfect sense from an in-game perspective. Think about that each ship has a transmitter so that it can transmit the battle data. And data transmtters the ship have, how else could you talk with players at the other end of the universe then?
Actually I think it would be a really good feature for Ambulation. So far the use of Ambulation is a bit ... limited. You can run around, play a poker game and do what else? With the idea I proposed, you would have (another) really good use for Ambulation
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Minariel Airalat
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Posted - 2008.02.29 23:14:00 -
[12]
I must say, speaking as an alleged BoB-alt, that this is quite possibly the most incredibly awesome idea I've heard in a long time. And it makes perfect sense, when you factor in those CEO meeting rooms and other corporation-oriented services. A corp. at war would WANT visuals on their battles. You think they'd just accept a piece of paper that says "we won." and be satisfied? Of course not! They'd want to see details. How did the various captains perform in battle? Was their latest tech. useful? Did it fail in someway? How did the enemy respond? Etc, etc.
I agree that fixing lag is nice too, but I didn't read the suggestion that CCP focus entirely on this to the exclusion of all other features. I think this idea is MARVELOUS!
PS: I'll get you next time, Gnulpie! No one escapes the Panzerbr÷tchen!
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Deviana Sevidon
Gallente Panta-Rhei Phoenix Allianz
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Posted - 2008.03.01 08:36:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Donna Maria Umm, No. Fix fleet lag first, then bells and whistles later. CCP knows that the people that really pay for this game's bread and butter are the addicts that live in 0.0
Telling everybody that Ambulation needs to be canceled and lag to be fixed first before any new feature is implemented in EVE, is like ordering scientists and engineers to stop inventing new technologies before the hole in the ozone layer is fixed.
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Jim McGregor
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Posted - 2008.03.01 08:55:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Deviana Sevidon
Originally by: Donna Maria Umm, No. Fix fleet lag first, then bells and whistles later. CCP knows that the people that really pay for this game's bread and butter are the addicts that live in 0.0
Telling everybody that Ambulation needs to be canceled and lag to be fixed first before any new feature is implemented in EVE, is like ordering scientists and engineers to stop inventing new technologies before the hole in the ozone layer is fixed.
Well said.
--- Its dead, Jim.
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Grimpak
Gallente Trinity Nova
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Posted - 2008.03.01 09:01:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Donna Maria Umm, No. Fix fleet lag first, then bells and whistles later. CCP knows that the people that really pay for this game's bread and butter are the addicts that live in 0.0
fixing lag is as realistic as fixing the internet.
but if you want to help, there's a quicker solution.
can I have your stuff? ---
Trinity Nova Mercenary Services Web Site - Nominated for the 2008 E-ON Magazine Awards |
000Hunter000
Gallente Missiles 'R' Us
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Posted - 2008.03.01 09:12:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Donna Maria "CCP knows that the people that really pay for this game's bread and butter are the addicts that live in 0.0
I LOLLED!!!
clueless Troll. _______________________________________________________ CCP, let us pay the online shop with Direct Debit!!!
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ghosttr
Amarr ARK-CORP
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Posted - 2008.03.01 09:18:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Donna Maria Umm, No. Fix fleet lag first, then bells and whistles later. CCP knows that the people that really pay for this game's bread and butter are the addicts that live in 0.0
Maybe you should stop blobbing first so we can have good features without always whinimg about the lag that you create
My Blog |
Spenz
Gallente Dark Knights of Deneb Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2008.03.01 09:30:00 -
[18]
Would it be possible to use that same tech to relay images from outside a station? I would be nice to be able to see outside a station while docked.
If I had an Alt I would probably post with it... |
Slarty Baardfast
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Posted - 2008.03.01 09:46:00 -
[19]
Lag isnt really an issue until you add the human factor. We naturally feel safer in groups, the larger the group, the safer we feel.
Until CCP can fix human nature theres always gonna be laggy systems/battles
On the whole I kinda like Gnulpie's idea
Regards
------------ Linkage
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ghosttr
Amarr ARK-CORP
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Posted - 2008.03.01 10:24:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Slarty Baardfast Lag isnt really an issue until you add the human factor. We naturally feel safer in groups, the larger the group, the safer we feel.
Until CCP can fix human nature theres always gonna be laggy systems/battles
On the whole I kinda like Gnulpie's idea
Regards
------------ Linkage
I don't think its human nature, rather a herding instinct All CCP needs to do is make is so that fighting in blobs is inferior to squad-based combat.
One way of doing this would be to make things in eve (besides the ships) much much larger. They have already spoken about system wide belts. But what about multiple in/out gates?, some hidden some not.
CCP Bottlenecks everyone into 1 gate where a blob is most effective. split the amount of entry paths and you will split the blob.
My Blog |
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Cpt Fina
Mutually Assured Distraction
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Posted - 2008.03.01 10:28:00 -
[21]
signed if it was exclusive for 0,0 and possibly low-sec.
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Grimpak
Gallente Trinity Nova
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Posted - 2008.03.01 12:26:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Grimpak on 01/03/2008 12:26:28
Originally by: ghosttr One way of doing this would be to make things in eve (besides the ships) much much larger. They have already spoken about system wide belts. But what about multiple in/out gates?, some hidden some not.
CCP Bottlenecks everyone into 1 gate where a blob is most effective. split the amount of entry paths and you will split the blob.
subsystem targeting and destruction.
starts at BC level and goes upwards.
the idea that I've just cooked in my head however would make EVE a totally diferent game of what it is today tho. ---
Trinity Nova Mercenary Services Web Site - Nominated for the 2008 E-ON Magazine Awards |
Terail Zoqial
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Posted - 2008.03.01 14:49:00 -
[23]
The devs did mention such a feature a year or so again, it has probably been put on the back burner due to factional warfare, ambulation, the need for speed and other such additions.
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Athena Minoko
Mean Corp
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Posted - 2008.03.01 20:38:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Donna Maria Umm, No. Fix fleet lag first, then bells and whistles later. CCP knows that the people that really pay for this game's bread and butter are the addicts that live in 0.0
There is no lag. Move along, nothing to see here. ---- Sig starts here --- "Anyone caught using this exploit will be punished accordingly, as this can easily be tracked and verified in our logs."
Pity they can't track or verify anything else. |
Gnulpie
Minmatar Miner Tech
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Posted - 2008.03.04 19:18:00 -
[25]
Any chance for a dev commenting if those ideas are just complete utopic or if they could be considered to get implemented sooner (or later)?
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Gone'Postal
Minmatar Vengeance 8 Interceptors
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Posted - 2008.03.04 19:22:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Grimpak Edited by: Grimpak on 01/03/2008 12:26:28
Originally by: ghosttr One way of doing this would be to make things in eve (besides the ships) much much larger. They have already spoken about system wide belts. But what about multiple in/out gates?, some hidden some not.
CCP Bottlenecks everyone into 1 gate where a blob is most effective. split the amount of entry paths and you will split the blob.
subsystem targeting and destruction.
starts at BC level and goes upwards.
the idea that I've just cooked in my head however would make EVE a totally diferent game of what it is today tho.
The most fun i've ever had in ANY space game was a star trek one, where you could shoot subsystems out, and watch them slowly repair.. only for me to take them out again
add this, and a TUG class ship to eve and i'll fly to the next fanfest and kiss wrangler and every other dev i can lay my hands on! V8I
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Reiisha
Splint Eye Probabilities Inc. Dawn of Transcendence
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Posted - 2008.03.04 19:41:00 -
[27]
I would *love* being able to watch a battle on the holodesk in my office come ambulation.
EVE History Wiki
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Kweel Nakashyn
Minmatar Aeden Tau Ceti Federation
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Posted - 2008.03.04 19:49:00 -
[28]
op : if you want to be looked at, you hit the wrong forum.
Anyway, I don't understand. If you're connected to watch a battle, why don't you participate ? It's a waste of manpower. So I don't agree with a liveshow. It would also add to the lag because the server have to work more and transmit more data with people just looking the show.
Recording whole battles may be something fine, I don't know if CCP have the disk space for this. On servers, it tend to cost money fast you know. 2isk
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Gnulpie
Minmatar Miner Tech
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Posted - 2008.03.09 12:52:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Kweel Nakashyn Anyway, I don't understand. If you're connected to watch a battle, why don't you participate ? It's a waste of manpower. So I don't agree with a liveshow.
Why is there Eve-TV from alliance tournament? Because people WANT to watch. And because they cannot all participate - for whatever reason. Same goes for other battles. And also ... it would add another level of strategy. If the commander sits in the station and watches battles and moves fleets
Originally by: Kweel Nakashyn It would also add to the lag because the server have to work more and transmit more data with people just looking the show.
It wouldn't really add much lag. Because the lag we know comes from database calls and not from a limited internet bandwith. Ambulation TV doesn't need any more database calls, because all the data is already compiled. So your argument that Ambulation TV would add lag is not reasonable.
Originally by: Kweel Nakashyn Recording whole battles may be something fine, I don't know if CCP have the disk space for this. On servers, it tend to cost money fast you know.
You wouldn't record a video stream but only vector data. Storage space shouldn't be a problem at all. But if storage space becomes a problem I am sure CCP could limit the length and the amount of holoreels every player can own.
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Martineth
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Posted - 2008.03.09 12:56:00 -
[30]
Lag in such an occasion could be zero. Why? Simple. CCP allready keep tracks of data of what happened. Streaming segments of those of main server and in to a new one were some info would be retrievable would be no issue if this would work as a retrievable telemetry option. To be saved and projectet in forums or reproduced offline for analysis by another even client. Even than by running a third server a player should be albe to see all that in semi real or not real time while sitting in main server. Many people have an old monitor to spare and this is just one more possible feature for a dual monitor eve client.
As for those who dare us to enter 0.0 i have to say: 0.0 is booooring as hell. Try an empire war and you know what drama is. But i agree. Speed is first issue we got to solve. For what it is worth...... thank you all for playing. EvE rocks and you are our favorite band. Thumbs up to all of you........ ooops those were not my thumbs. sry!
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