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Ann Holt
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Posted - 2008.03.08 19:53:00 -
[181]
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=705507
Sorted. Couldn't be bothered reading the entire thread, but it seems the GM's have said it's no exploit. So for 1 time payment of 8m isk, avoid all war decs forever.
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Burnharder
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Posted - 2008.03.08 19:54:00 -
[182]
Yeah, except mine describes how things are in Eve. People just don't seem to get it, possibly you as well. Yours just described lowsec. Next time take more mates to the pub.
So yeah... your analogy ftl.
I get it. I've been in game since beta (not on this character); I get it very well. One of the things that never fails to amuse me is the assumption in a lot of peoples posts that current game mechanics are perfect solutions to problems/gameplay desires, when many of them clearly are not. A lot of them are just the easiest partial solution given the capabilities of the technology base CCP is working with.
You assume with your analogy that the corp is only a mechanism for people to band together to defend themselves. That is one of the reasons for starting/joining a corp. There are many others. If your football team goes to play a football match, but the other team picks up the ball, deflates it into an oval and starts playing rugby, your footballing skills aren't going to be much help, especially when they've brought their own ref.
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Ehranavaar
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Posted - 2008.03.08 19:54:00 -
[183]
Originally by: Cassandra Wolf Edited by: Cassandra Wolf on 08/03/2008 07:13:16 Yeah.. sounds dumb.. but since i lost my dominix, eve is a very expensive irc client with ship on a station as background
And from where do we know that they stop doing this after we pay? or do they wardec us every time they need money?
more than likely they will end the war only to return in a couple months with a new demand. worse they are likely to spread the word you are an easy mark. probably the best thing you can do is hire some mercs to do some head bashing for you and then you can see if you can find someone to train you in pvp tactics etc for the next time.
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Kale Kold
Caldari V i r u s
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Posted - 2008.03.08 19:55:00 -
[184]
Originally by: Ann Holt http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=705507
Sorted. Couldn't be bothered reading the entire thread, but it seems the GM's have said it's no exploit. So for 1 time payment of 8m isk, avoid all war decs forever.
We could use our sister corp to wardec as well if that plan is executed.
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Esmenet
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.03.08 19:56:00 -
[185]
Originally by: Ann Holt http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=705507
Sorted. Couldn't be bothered reading the entire thread, but it seems the GM's have said it's no exploit. So for 1 time payment of 8m isk, avoid all war decs forever.
The more you do that the faster that method will be nerfed.
Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -Kreul Intentions ([email protected]) |
Ankhesentapemkah
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.03.08 20:15:00 -
[186]
Originally by: Esmenet
Originally by: Ann Holt http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=705507
Sorted. Couldn't be bothered reading the entire thread, but it seems the GM's have said it's no exploit. So for 1 time payment of 8m isk, avoid all war decs forever.
The more you do that the faster that method will be nerfed.
And the more griefers and harrassers in that make highsec less secure than 0.0, the faster suicide ganking and corp griefing is nerfed too.
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Esmenet
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.03.08 20:17:00 -
[187]
Originally by: Ankhesentapemkah
Originally by: Esmenet
Originally by: Ann Holt http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=705507
Sorted. Couldn't be bothered reading the entire thread, but it seems the GM's have said it's no exploit. So for 1 time payment of 8m isk, avoid all war decs forever.
The more you do that the faster that method will be nerfed.
And the more griefers and harrassers in that make highsec less secure than 0.0, the faster suicide ganking and corp griefing is nerfed too.
Actually no as they play within the rules and have done so for many years. However ccp has shown they do not like alliance/corp hopping with the purpose of getting away from wardec mechanics. Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -Kreul Intentions ([email protected]) |
Kale Kold
Caldari V i r u s
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Posted - 2008.03.08 20:22:00 -
[188]
Originally by: Esmenet However ccp has shown they do not like alliance/corp hopping with the purpose of getting away from wardec mechanics.
Exactly! The only way out is to pay the ransom.
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Ankhesentapemkah
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.03.08 20:24:00 -
[189]
Originally by: Esmenet Actually no as they play within the rules and have done so for many years. However ccp has shown they do not like alliance/corp hopping with the purpose of getting away from wardec mechanics.
Last time I checked, that was perfectly legal. And as Ten Tigers already quoted, CCP intended highsec to be relatively secure and an area for people to learn the game mechanics in relative safety, not a jungle where everyone can shoot/gank everyone without (serious) reprecussion. They got space to suit everyone's playstyle, and I'm quite sure that CCP never intended highsec piracy and griefing to flourish as much as it is now. The more this weed flourishes, the sooner CCP is going to burn it away.
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Esmenet
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.03.08 20:32:00 -
[190]
Originally by: Ankhesentapemkah
Last time I checked, that was perfectly legal. And as Ten Tigers already quoted, CCP intended highsec to be relatively secure and an area for people to learn the game mechanics in relative safety, not a jungle where everyone can shoot/gank everyone without (serious) reprecussion. They got space to suit everyone's playstyle, and I'm quite sure that CCP never intended highsec piracy and griefing to flourish as much as it is now. The more this weed flourishes, the sooner CCP is going to burn it away.
Yes its legal for now. Hence why i said that it would eventually be nerfed.
High sec is relative safety as it is. If you cant handle wardecs there are npc corps present. For player corps its expected that you can handle a wardec. Then you get a 24 hour warning and good time to prepare. Easy to avoid combat if wanted as you only face threats from one corp wich you can easily scout using local.
Cheating your way out of a wardec using such things as corp hopping is things that ccp has stopped before. And especially if it becomes common practice ccp will do something about it as they have before.
High sec was never supposed to be safe.
Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -Kreul Intentions ([email protected]) |
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Cassandra Wolf
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Posted - 2008.03.08 20:34:00 -
[191]
Originally by: Kale Kold
Originally by: Esmenet However ccp has shown they do not like alliance/corp hopping with the purpose of getting away from wardec mechanics.
Exactly! The only way out is to pay the ransom.
Ah.. there he is... one of the "griefers"
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Kale Kold
Caldari V i r u s
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Posted - 2008.03.08 20:36:00 -
[192]
Originally by: Cassandra Wolf Ah.. there he is... one of the "griefers"
Ah.. there she is... one of the "carebears".
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Ki An
Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.03.08 20:37:00 -
[193]
Edited by: Ki An on 08/03/2008 20:44:24
Originally by: Ankhesentapemkah Hehe, Ki An losing yet another debate and getting mad, stamping his feet and threatening with violence like the regular out-smarted schoolyard bully.
Seen that before Ki An, you really need to pick up some debating skills, otherwise you will keep on losing, like you lost to me last time.
What, you mean the thread where everyone, including the carebears, thought you made a complete ass of yourself and totally ruined the argument for your side making all carebears look stupid? Yeah, you totally won that argument, bud.
Edit: You didn't win that argument. Just wanted to make that clear.
Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
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Ankhesentapemkah
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.03.08 20:44:00 -
[194]
Edited by: Ankhesentapemkah on 08/03/2008 20:45:30
Originally by: Esmenet
Originally by: Ankhesentapemkah Last time I checked, that was perfectly legal. And as Ten Tigers already quoted, CCP intended highsec to be relatively secure and an area for people to learn the game mechanics in relative safety, not a jungle where everyone can shoot/gank everyone without (serious) reprecussion. They got space to suit everyone's playstyle, and I'm quite sure that CCP never intended highsec piracy and griefing to flourish as much as it is now. The more this weed flourishes, the sooner CCP is going to burn it away.
Yes its legal for now. Hence why i said that it would eventually be nerfed.
High sec is relative safety as it is. If you cant handle wardecs there are npc corps present. For player corps its expected that you can handle a wardec. Then you get a 24 hour warning and good time to prepare. Easy to avoid combat if wanted as you only face threats from one corp wich you can easily scout using local.
Cheating your way out of a wardec using such things as corp hopping is things that ccp has stopped before. And especially if it becomes common practice ccp will do something about it as they have before.
Originally by: Esmenet High sec was never supposed to be safe.
Check Ten Tiger's quotes, it sure was supposed to be, even if it wasn't 100% safe, it would be more like 90% safe instead of the 10% it is now.
CCP just made the same mistake as the people from Ultima Online did. Check Raph Koster's blog on this. They expected the community to be able to defend itself and police itself against griefers. They found out that people cannot, and that there are way more immature, antisocial arses around than they ever imagined, ruining the game for a multitude of people, people that will never pick fair fights and will never PVP against their own kind or anything that can put up a fight, but instead just go about griefing, harrassing and smacktalking innocents that are unable to defend themselves. Every time they 'rebalanced' the game mechanics, these people would go to a new low, such as killing new players the moment they spawned, all day long.
A sheep remains a sheep, and they are not to blame. ~5% of the people in real society are psychopaths. ~80% want nothing more than being left alone in peace. Who is wrong here?
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Ankhesentapemkah
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.03.08 20:45:00 -
[195]
Originally by: Ki An Edited by: Ki An on 08/03/2008 20:44:24
Originally by: Ankhesentapemkah Hehe, Ki An losing yet another debate and getting mad, stamping his feet and threatening with violence like the regular out-smarted schoolyard bully.
Seen that before Ki An, you really need to pick up some debating skills, otherwise you will keep on losing, like you lost to me last time.
What, you mean the thread where everyone, including the carebears, thought you made a complete ass of yourself and totally ruined the argument for your side making all carebears look stupid? Yeah, you totally won that argument, bud.
Edit: You didn't win that argument. Just wanted to make that clear.
I very much did, but obviously someone like you cannot admit that he is infact, wrong. And stupid.
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Ki An
Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.03.08 20:47:00 -
[196]
Originally by: Ankhesentapemkah I very much did, but obviously someone like you cannot admit that he is infact, wrong. And stupid.
I'm sure that in your own little world you are, like, the top dog...
But in the real world you are a pretty sad little person.
But then... you are kind of funny...
... in that special kind of way.
Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
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Ankhesentapemkah
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.03.08 20:52:00 -
[197]
Originally by: Esmenet
Originally by: Ankhesentapemkah ~80% want nothing more than being left alone in peace. Who is wrong here?
In terms if this game, the ones that just wants to mine alone have to adapt or find another game.
Funny, how you and the other 'get-back-to-wow' crowd always want all the 'carebears' to leave the game.
You're talking about ~80% of the players, or whatever the latest statistics are.
If they all leave, what would there be for the griefers?
Suddenly they'd have to pick real fights instead of ganking defenseless players. I'm very sure that they wouldn't like that, and they soon find themselves without a game, and forced to go back to shouting pwnd in counterstrike.
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Kale Kold
Caldari V i r u s
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Posted - 2008.03.08 20:54:00 -
[198]
Edited by: Kale Kold on 08/03/2008 20:55:22
Originally by: Traidor Disloyal I am not griefer (well, not since I left Racketeers). I just like watching pixels make pretty explosion graphics. And then I like to hear the sound of the pod being squished. Is that so hard to understand? Am I a bad person for liking that part of the game?
lol! Carebears will never understand Pvpers.
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Ankhesentapemkah
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.03.08 20:55:00 -
[199]
Originally by: Ki An Yes please, I'd love a hug. Are you a girl?
Yes in fact.
*hugs Ki An and hopes he doesn't have a knife on him, that would be so messy on our clothes*
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Ki An
Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.03.08 20:57:00 -
[200]
Originally by: Ankhesentapemkah
Yes in fact.
*hugs Ki An and hopes he doesn't have a knife on him, that would be so messy on our clothes*
That's not a knife you're feeling.
Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
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Malcanis
R.E.C.O.N. Black-Out
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Posted - 2008.03.08 21:02:00 -
[201]
Originally by: Ankhesentapemkah
Originally by: Esmenet
Originally by: Ankhesentapemkah ~80% want nothing more than being left alone in peace. Who is wrong here?
In terms if this game, the ones that just wants to mine alone have to adapt or find another game.
Funny, how you and the other 'get-back-to-wow' crowd always want all the 'carebears' to leave the game.
You're talking about ~80% of the players, or whatever the latest statistics are.
If they all leave, what would there be for the griefers?
Suddenly they'd have to pick real fights instead of ganking defenseless players. I'm very sure that they wouldn't like that, and they soon find themselves without a game, and forced to go back to shouting pwnd in counterstrike.
Test this theory by never logging in again. If EvE is still going in 5 years, you'll know you made a mistake.
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
Ankhesentapemkah
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.03.08 21:04:00 -
[202]
Originally by: Malcanis Test this theory by never logging in again. If EvE is still going in 5 years, you'll know you made a mistake.
Me leaving would not significantly affect the other 80%.
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Esmenet
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.03.08 21:15:00 -
[203]
Originally by: Ankhesentapemkah
Funny, how you and the other 'get-back-to-wow' crowd always want all the 'carebears' to leave the game.
You're talking about ~80% of the players, or whatever the latest statistics are.
If they all leave, what would there be for the griefers?
Suddenly they'd have to pick real fights instead of ganking defenseless players. I'm very sure that they wouldn't like that, and they soon find themselves without a game, and forced to go back to shouting pwnd in counterstrike.
Actually most of carebears of your type that cant handle a wardec leaves the game. There are plenty of empire huggers left that are in corps that are not inept or at the very least understand that EVE is what it is.
You just show your complete lack of game knowledge/understanding in every post you make. Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -Kreul Intentions ([email protected]) |
Ankhesentapemkah
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.03.08 21:37:00 -
[204]
Originally by: Esmenet Actually most of carebears of your type that cant handle a wardec leaves the game. There are plenty of empire huggers left that are in corps that are not inept or at the very least understand that EVE is what it is.
You just show your complete lack of game knowledge/understanding in every post you make.
I understand perfectly what this game is about, but it is pointless talking to psychopaths, who fail to understand any of the following: * Empathy * Compassion * Selflesness * Helpfulness * Respecting people's wishes to be left alone
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Malcanis
R.E.C.O.N. Black-Out
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Posted - 2008.03.08 21:37:00 -
[205]
Originally by: Ankhesentapemkah
Originally by: Esmenet
Originally by: Ann Holt http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=705507
Sorted. Couldn't be bothered reading the entire thread, but it seems the GM's have said it's no exploit. So for 1 time payment of 8m isk, avoid all war decs forever.
The more you do that the faster that method will be nerfed.
And the more griefers and harrassers in that make highsec less secure than 0.0, the faster suicide ganking and corp griefing is nerfed too.
Less secure than 0.0, you say?
Actually, you've finally said something I agree with. I feel much safer in alliance space than I do in hi-sec. In 0.0 you can fight without weird rules and restrictions; if you can target it, you can shoot it. And if you're not a nut-case with huge, obvious emotional issues (or even if you are, providing you're amusing) you'll have friends to fight alongside you too. No stupid gate guns or game breaking concord ex machina.
The ore is better too. wtf am I gonna do with all this crokite...?
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
Liang Nuren
Black Sea Industries Insurgency
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Posted - 2008.03.08 21:40:00 -
[206]
Originally by: Ankhesentapemkah
Originally by: Esmenet Actually most of carebears of your type that cant handle a wardec leaves the game. There are plenty of empire huggers left that are in corps that are not inept or at the very least understand that EVE is what it is.
You just show your complete lack of game knowledge/understanding in every post you make.
I understand perfectly what this game is about, but it is pointless talking to psychopaths, who fail to understand any of the following: * Empathy * Compassion * Selflesness * Helpfulness * Respecting people's wishes to be left alone
8/10 troll imo. Good one.
-Liang -- My new keyboard is awesome... I can type again (beware Eve-O spreaders of misinformation!) |
Brun Thorvald
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Posted - 2008.03.08 21:49:00 -
[207]
Originally by: Larg Kellein Edited by: Larg Kellein on 08/03/2008 15:20:09 Ok Cassandra, first of all: Don't pay the ransom. They will milk you every time they want some quick money if you do. Secondly, get in some cheap, insured frigs and cruisers, go out there and shoot them. If you lose 10 frigs and they lose a HAC, you still come out way ahead in the isk game. And finally, too late for this war, but as an investment in the future, come see us at Agony, get your people on a basic class and learn that you don't need a billion SP to fight back.
Agony Unleashed's course is 7 million. Fund every member of your corp to go through it.
www.agony-unleashed.com
Spend a million per member on disposable frigates (standardise a design, so you all get the same skill set).
Put the membership in the disposable frigates, and go hunting in packs. Lose the pack ? Who cares ! Theres fifteen more frigates, each. Manage to make the griefers run with their tail between their legs ... wooot ! Carebears strike back !
Kill one of their ships ... that, my friends, is a Victory - especially if it was a bigger ship than theirs.
Once they are on the receiving end, they either blob up, resulting in less fun for them, or you start winning engagements, which is also less fun for them.
Finally, work on the diplomacy. Find other people GreiferCorp has extorted, and get them into your blob. Remember, Goonswarm forced Band of Brothers back to Delve with a combination of blobs of disposable ships and diplomacy - and BoB were a bigger challenge than anything you'll deal with.
PS Remember, lo-sec is full of pirates to practice on. Send a frigate first to find the gate camp, then come in as a gang and take out that lone pirate attempting to mug missioners.
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Kale Kold
Caldari V i r u s
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Posted - 2008.03.08 22:11:00 -
[208]
Edited by: Kale Kold on 08/03/2008 22:12:08
Originally by: Brun Thorvald
Originally by: Larg Kellein Edited by: Larg Kellein on 08/03/2008 15:20:09 Ok Cassandra, first of all: Don't pay the ransom. They will milk you every time they want some quick money if you do. Secondly, get in some cheap, insured frigs and cruisers, go out there and shoot them. If you lose 10 frigs and they lose a HAC, you still come out way ahead in the isk game. And finally, too late for this war, but as an investment in the future, come see us at Agony, get your people on a basic class and learn that you don't need a billion SP to fight back.
Agony Unleashed's course is 7 million. Fund every member of your corp to go through it.
www.agony-unleashed.com
Spend a million per member on disposable frigates (standardise a design, so you all get the same skill set).
Put the membership in the disposable frigates, and go hunting in packs. Lose the pack ? Who cares ! Theres fifteen more frigates, each. Manage to make the griefers run with their tail between their legs ... wooot ! Carebears strike back !
Kill one of their ships ... that, my friends, is a Victory - especially if it was a bigger ship than theirs.
Once they are on the receiving end, they either blob up, resulting in less fun for them, or you start winning engagements, which is also less fun for them.
Finally, work on the diplomacy. Find other people GreiferCorp has extorted, and get them into your blob. Remember, Goonswarm forced Band of Brothers back to Delve with a combination of blobs of disposable ships and diplomacy - and BoB were a bigger challenge than anything you'll deal with.
PS Remember, lo-sec is full of pirates to practice on. Send a frigate first to find the gate camp, then come in as a gang and take out that lone pirate attempting to mug missioners.
Lol, please please please get a gang of tech1 frigs and cruisers to take us on, oh please please please!!! It would be a turkey shoot.
The last time a corp did this to us, we popped all their ships without a single loss. Do you really think t1 frigs and cruisers can go against a fleet of commandships?
Like i keep saying to this corp, its nothing personal, it's how we make isk. Just pay the ransom and we leave you alone, ask anyone that's paid us before. Once the deals done, we honour our agreement or else no-one would pay us again.
You can even haggle the price.
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Esmenet
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.03.08 22:32:00 -
[209]
Originally by: Kale Kold
Lol, please please please get a gang of tech1 frigs and cruisers to take us on, oh please please please!!! It would be a turkey shoot.
The last time a corp did this to us, we popped all their ships without a single loss. Do you really think t1 frigs and cruisers can go against a fleet of commandships?
Never fought your corp so i cant say anything about how it would work in this specific case. But i have been apart of 10-20 man T1 fitted cruiser gangs attacking gatecamps vastly outnumbering/outgunning us and won the ISK war by popping such things as command ships. Lost a lot of ships but won the isk war. Loosing a fully insured t1 cruiser with T1 fittings is practically zero loss. But loosing a well fitted command ship is a fair bit of isk. Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -Kreul Intentions ([email protected]) |
Cipher7
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Posted - 2008.03.08 22:40:00 -
[210]
Corps who pay ransoms are fools.
You don't have to pay anybody schit, just use the game mechanics ya tools.
Discorp and use a private channel to keep doing your thing.
Find friendly corps and dec each other.
Why should a carebear corp be honorable?
Abuse the game mechanics in the same way.
KNOW the game mechanics and USE them.
Don't like it? Dial 1-900-Eat-Schit
Use alts in NPC corps to gather intel on the enemy.
Use corp-switching method.
Use private-channel method.
Use wardec-friendly-corp method.
Then sit in station and use your Trash Talk level 5 skill. Talk about their moms in local. Get em mad. Make em have to take Pepto Bismol to assuage their newfound ulcers.
Frustrate them. Anger them. Harass them by staying %100 happy. Use smileys in every sentence.
Blob the schit out of them with 100 rifters.
It's a psychological game.
If you give them happiness by paying, they win.
If in RL they start having ulcers and don't feel like logging in, YOU win.
Make them contact CCP and whine about it. "Dear CCP we griefed this corp and asked for a ransom, but they just started corp switching. Boo hoo."
What's CCP gonna do about, cut away some of their RL subscription money so Virus can collect their ransom?
HAHAHAHAHAHA
This is what I love about Eve.
Here the lambs can become wolves.
The victim can become the victimizer.
You can meet people who are a-holes in RL and make them suffer in RL.
And it doesn't take millions of skillpoints.
It doesn't take 24 hours of play.
All it takes. Is knowing the mechanics. And using them.
Eve is not for dumb ppl who except "da guverment" to help them.
It's for smart people who help themselves.
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