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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Wet Ferret
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Posted - 2008.04.22 21:30:00 -
[691]
Originally by: KapnKaboom And while you are at it can you please, for the love of God, get rid of local also? Thanks.
I'm sure they'll get right on that for you |
Cori4n
Caldari principle of motion Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.04.22 21:31:00 -
[692]
Originally by: DigitalCommunist The EULA/TS are a series of enforcement guidelines and nothing more. They're not there to describe, in detail, every possible situation. They're not taking any action because they can't prove you're using this tool, not because they don't want to, or because the EULA says not to. Otherwise, why would they be frowning upon this tool?
Oh yeah, cause you just modified gampelay with a completely new mechanic. Damn cheaters. I would punish you in the name of the Moon, if it didn't involve stepping off my gloriously high horse.
Well, CCP could easily declare BACON and exploit and delete/lock this thread. However, it remains open. Do you think that because in many cases you can't prove that someone's not using a macro, CCP will allow a topic with a link to download a macro, and discussion of the same?
Originally by: Ikki Phoenix Personally I see this as a double standard which doesn't promise much for fairness
Who said this game is fair?
Seriously. If some alliances have sufficiently competent members to create EVE tools, why should they not thereby gain an advantge? |
Ki Anna
Ki Tech Industries
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Posted - 2008.04.22 21:34:00 -
[693]
Originally by: Cori4n Well, CCP could easily declare BACON and exploit and delete/lock this thread. However, it remains open. Do you think that because in many cases you can't prove that someone's not using a macro, CCP will allow a topic with a link to download a macro, and discussion of the same?
Exactly! |
Lady Natacha
Minmatar Water and Power
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Posted - 2008.04.22 21:34:00 -
[694]
Originally by: GM Grimmi Greetings,
The LogServer output is solely intended by CCP as information for developers to help identify and fix bugs. While BACON, and the many similar tools currently used by a large number of players, may technically not be in violation of our EULA/TOS, we frown upon the use of this information for any other purpose and we are currently working on changes to prevent this sort of unintended use of information provided by the LogServer.
Regards,
GM Grimmi Lead Game Master
I smell fried-BACON |
Cori4n
Caldari principle of motion Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.04.22 21:34:00 -
[695]
Originally by: Sekhen If you want to play a game that has lots of "mods" that help you in your gameplay, one of our competitors (Blizzard/Vivendi) offer exactly that product (Worlf of Warcraft).
Here we play the game as it is and on equal terms.
And what the heck is this? Does WoW have static data dumps? An API? A dev blog titled "Third Party Development"? Tools like evemon and EFT which are made possible by the former?
Since when was the spirit of EVE ultraconservative with respect to development? |
Dictum Factum
Gemini Sun Tenth Legion
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Posted - 2008.04.22 21:35:00 -
[696]
I had no personal problem with the existance of this program until the message today from CCP. I find it a bit disturbing that programs like this were just fine with CCP until the "masses" found out about them. That, to me, is worse than the programs themselves. |
Shaun Klaroh
Caldari Nova Mining Manufacturing and Research LTD
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Posted - 2008.04.22 21:42:00 -
[697]
Originally by: Dictum Factum I had no personal problem with the existance of this program until the message today from CCP. I find it a bit disturbing that programs like this were just fine with CCP until the "masses" found out about them. That, to me, is worse than the programs themselves.
Because now it is a double-standard. The alliances could use automated un-detectable tools all they wanted until the public found out and there was suddenly this vocal minority that started yelling about. I was dabbling in it, but since GM Gemm's response, I've terminated any dabbling, and configuring. -----
Quote: "Are these people prisoners?" Arkhan asked.
"Not at all," Melak replied. "They're free to run and get shot any time they like."
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Wet Ferret
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Posted - 2008.04.22 21:43:00 -
[698]
Originally by: Dictum Factum I had no personal problem with the existance of this program until the message today from CCP. I find it a bit disturbing that programs like this were just fine with CCP until the "masses" found out about them. That, to me, is worse than the programs themselves.
As long as you are not surprised that they knew. It's like some people just don't want to give CCP any credit at all.
Perhaps they were already working on a way to stop this type of program and didn't feel the need to discuss it openly?
But, yeah. These forums seriously need some indicator that the post has ended and the sig has started.
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Dictum Factum
Gemini Sun Tenth Legion
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Posted - 2008.04.22 21:53:00 -
[699]
Originally by: Wet Ferret As long as you are not surprised that they knew.
Not so much that they knew, more that they would approve that information to be released in the manner that it was.
On an unrelated note, your signature catches me almost every time that I read one of you posts. Plus 5 high-ground haxx bonus for you, Wet Ferret.
I know less than you think I do. |
Siigari Kitawa
Gallente The Aduro Protocol
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Posted - 2008.04.22 22:07:00 -
[700]
Excellent.
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Max Torps
Gallente eXceed Inc. eXceed.
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Posted - 2008.04.22 22:13:00 -
[701]
Originally by: GM Grimmi Greetings,
The LogServer output is solely intended by CCP as information for developers to help identify and fix bugs. While BACON, and the many similar tools currently used by a large number of players, may technically not be in violation of our EULA/TOS, we frown upon the use of this information for any other purpose and we are currently working on changes to prevent this sort of unintended use of information provided by the LogServer.
Regards,
GM Grimmi Lead Game Master
Excellent news. Well done CCP.
EvE blogspace, free! Max Torps CSM Candidate |
Lorna Loot
Caldari Nox Eternus
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Posted - 2008.04.22 22:15:00 -
[702]
[insert random joke regarding bacon in the pan/oven/grill etc.]
Great news :) --------------------- Nox Eternus is Recruiting, contact me or Sgt Shazz ingame for info. |
Shaun Klaroh
Caldari Nova Mining Manufacturing and Research LTD
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Posted - 2008.04.22 22:16:00 -
[703]
Originally by: Max Torps Excellent news. Well done CCP.
Well done what? They haven't actually done anything yet. |
Max Torps
Gallente eXceed Inc. eXceed.
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Posted - 2008.04.22 22:17:00 -
[704]
Originally by: Lorna Loot [insert random joke regarding bacon in the pan/oven/grill etc.]
I used bacon is off the menu in my blog. I thought it was funny at the time... |
Ki An
Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.04.22 22:18:00 -
[705]
Originally by: Ki Anna
Originally by: Cori4n Well, CCP could easily declare BACON and exploit and delete/lock this thread. However, it remains open. Do you think that because in many cases you can't prove that someone's not using a macro, CCP will allow a topic with a link to download a macro, and discussion of the same?
Exactly!
*sigh*
You are not reading and understanding what DigitalCommunist, among others, is saying. Try to actually READ and find out WHY CCP can't just state that it's forbidden. Is that really too much to ask?
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Max Torps
Gallente eXceed Inc. eXceed.
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Posted - 2008.04.22 22:19:00 -
[706]
Originally by: Shaun Klaroh
Originally by: Max Torps Excellent news. Well done CCP.
Well done what? They haven't actually done anything yet.
They've acknowledged that they will do something which is progress on yesterday where it was allowed. Am I missing your point? |
Shaun Klaroh
Caldari Nova Mining Manufacturing and Research LTD
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Posted - 2008.04.22 22:21:00 -
[707]
I don't know if saying "We're working on it." counts as doing something, as it isn't a result. I mean, what was said was "We never intended." But nor do we have a time-frame, nor is there a concrete reason to not use it other than ethics. |
Max Torps
Gallente eXceed Inc. eXceed.
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Posted - 2008.04.22 22:25:00 -
[708]
Originally by: Shaun Klaroh I don't know if saying "We're working on it." counts as doing something, as it isn't a result. I mean, what was said was "We never intended." But nor do we have a time-frame, nor is there a concrete reason to not use it other than ethics.
You speak the truth. We do have a promise that it is being "looked at" which is better than "this looks ok". So I guess all we can do is monitor and ensure it gets followed through. I look at that as a step forward. |
bLuEbErRy MuFfInMaN
mUfFiN fAcToRy Sex Panthers
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Posted - 2008.04.22 22:30:00 -
[709]
Edited by: bLuEbErRy MuFfInMaN on 22/04/2008 22:30:21
WOW Sorry for you empire warriors LOL
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Fifth Horseman
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Posted - 2008.04.22 22:32:00 -
[710]
In the meantime, could you search all the alliance mails for "BACON" because I'm at war with an alliance that, in the last two days, suddenly gained unnatural docking abilities. |
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Maliber
TALON'S GRIP Green Alliance
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Posted - 2008.04.22 22:54:00 -
[711]
pfff another tool to make ppl blob more and make roaming and small gangs less effective i hope you are proud of yourselfs.
This tool should be banned as it ruins gamplay for small roaming gangs it makes 0.0 even more save.
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Shaun Klaroh
Caldari Nova Mining Manufacturing and Research LTD
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Posted - 2008.04.22 22:56:00 -
[712]
Originally by: Maliber pfff another tool to make ppl blob more and make roaming and small gangs less effective i hope you are proud of yourselfs.
This tool should be banned as it ruins gamplay for small roaming gangs it makes 0.0 even more save.
You could have quoted maybe... ten other posts in this thread without actually having to write something, since it's just a restatement already.
You can't ban this program, because it's a read-only program. Can't detect it. So, how would CCP ban people? -----
Quote: "Are these people prisoners?" Arkhan asked.
"Not at all," Melak replied. "They're free to run and get shot any time they like."
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Maliber
TALON'S GRIP Green Alliance
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Posted - 2008.04.22 23:02:00 -
[713]
i was just voicing my opinion. Which is ok on any forum. Ccp should just fix logserver so it no longer passes these messages and bacon is broke. Problem solved. Its just that i think this program breaks a part of eve I like... Roaming...
I also encourage ppl to find security holes in bacon so i can post code in local and crash/freeze bacon using ppl and gank em while they are ratting. Maybe inject some kind of malicous code or something. As local is for chat only and the logserver wont be affected i would technicaly not break any eula or tos rules.....
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Wet Ferret
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Posted - 2008.04.22 23:10:00 -
[714]
Edited by: Wet Ferret on 22/04/2008 23:11:59
Originally by: Maliber i was just voicing my opinion. Which is ok on any forum. Ccp should just fix logserver so it no longer passes these messages and bacon is broke. Problem solved. Its just that i think this program breaks a part of eve I like... Roaming...
I also encourage ppl to find security holes in bacon so i can post code in local and crash/freeze bacon using ppl and gank em while they are ratting. Maybe inject some kind of malicous code or something. As local is for chat only and the logserver wont be affected i would technicaly not break any eula or tos rules.....
I'm sure it's that simple and they've just never thought about that at all. Genius.
Also: two wrongs... etc
Edit- I apologize for responding to non-constructive posts with more non-constructive posts, and hereby dismiss myself from this thread
But, yeah. These forums seriously need some indicator that the post has ended and the sig has started.
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Maliber
TALON'S GRIP Green Alliance
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Posted - 2008.04.22 23:12:00 -
[715]
Edited by: Maliber on 22/04/2008 23:13:05
Originally by: Wet Ferret
Originally by: Maliber i was just voicing my opinion. .... Its just that i think this program breaks a part of eve I like... Roaming...
plz break tha program.....
I'm sure it's that simple and they've just never thought about that at all. Genius.
Also: two wrongs... etc
i simpified the post for you. Still something wrong....
p.s. ow and it ruins small roaming gangs...
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Kvirie
Caldari Children of the Wind
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Posted - 2008.04.22 23:18:00 -
[716]
Originally by: RebelWithACause Whether you like BACON or not, how can this not bug EVERYONE on this thread? CCP has openly admitted that they KNEW others were ALREADY using similar tools... We just had the guts to bring it to light, for better or worse.
Because if they knew about it, didn't like it and were working to change stuff so they wouldn't work anymore, all you did was tell people it existed before they made their changes that kill it? |
Kvirie
Caldari Children of the Wind
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Posted - 2008.04.22 23:21:00 -
[717]
Originally by: Cori4n
Originally by: Ki Anna Until you make whatever changes you will be making, are tools that read realtime data from the LogServer allowed or disallowed?
Quote: While BACON, and the many similar tools currently used by a large number of players, may technically not be in violation of our EULA/TOS
Quote: we frown upon the use of this information for any other purpose and we are currently working on changes to prevent this sort of unintended use of information provided by the LogServer.
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Kvirie
Caldari Children of the Wind
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Posted - 2008.04.22 23:28:00 -
[718]
Originally by: Lurana Lay
Quote: and we are currently working on changes to prevent this sort of unintended use of information provided by the LogServer
Why just now?
This sort and other similar things has been around a while, and not just the Goons either.
Why? Because the general public knows about it and now has some access, WE CAN'T HAVE THAT NOW CAN WE?!
Where does he imply they haven't been working on changes to prevent cheats like this from working, since before the public thread? It's not like CCP's devs don't play the game, or are only in 1-2 alliances (well I'd hope not anyways).
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Kvirie
Caldari Children of the Wind
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Posted - 2008.04.22 23:32:00 -
[719]
Originally by: Cori4n
Originally by: Sekhen If you want to play a game that has lots of "mods" that help you in your gameplay, one of our competitors (Blizzard/Vivendi) offer exactly that product (Worlf of Warcraft).
Here we play the game as it is and on equal terms.
And what the heck is this? Does WoW have static data dumps? An API? A dev blog titled "Third Party Development"? Tools like evemon and EFT which are made possible by the former?
Since when was the spirit of EVE ultraconservative with respect to development?
You fail in realizing EFT and EVE-mon do not automate any aspect of game play for you. EVE-mon does not change skills, and EFT doesn't fit your ship for you. BACON watches local for you.
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Maliber
TALON'S GRIP Green Alliance
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Posted - 2008.04.22 23:53:00 -
[720]
Originally by: Kvirie ... stuff...
I totaly agree...
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