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solla bolla
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Posted - 2008.05.17 06:22:00 -
[1]
Edited by: solla bolla on 17/05/2008 06:23:28 As before t2 indusrty is still a isk print machine for few. Invention helped a lot but rare moons of 2 types make all the isk instead of t2bpo before. Im guessing the new regions will have some more of this moons as the price for the raws r ridiculous. But why not make it possable for all to get without getting ripped off. Current prices r nowhere near reality. (dont get me wrong i have had both dys and prom moons wich i choose to leave to others due to lot less playtime). My idea is to make it possable to make this materials.
New features special reactor. nothing more u would need 5-6 materials to make f.e dys. some npc stuff some player generated stuff. it should take time to make it and maby even a reverse engineering, like u take 10 dys to invention slot it and u get 10k bpc back this would take a week or 2 and making those 10 k takes about a same time.
Moon holders will always have the benifits of constant production and faster but it will be a possability to make it for a reasonable price.
It would be a nice addon to science and industry part as well as making it possable for the avrg not 0.0 alliance players to get theyr hands on it for a reasonable price.
It would reqiuer large pos special reactor 5 input silos 1 output silo (and this should use up all cpu on the tower regardless of race)
just an idea regards solla
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Sir Substance
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Posted - 2008.05.17 14:15:00 -
[2]
english, spelling. i have given up trying to understand your post.
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Nekopyat
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Posted - 2008.05.17 21:08:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Sir Substance english, spelling. i have given up trying to understand your post.
I am not sure, but I THINK the OP is suggesting a POS module that can convert one type of raw material to another, so basicly a substitution engine.
Actually, not a bad idea. Usually in manufacturing you can change what materials something needs by looking for substitutions that either require differnt amounts of materials or slighly alter the quality of the device.
Computer heat sinks are a good example. You can make a heat sink out of copper or aluminum. Copper ones behave better, but if copper prices go up you can switch materials and keep producing something with less value but a cost more in line with what people expect.
Soft drinks would be another example. When the price of cane sugar went up they switched to corn syrup. Not as good but produced much more sweetness for the buck.
I could easily see a market for ship production where the stats are a little worse but you can do it with more available input materials. Conversely making a ship just a little bit better by using superior materials (such making ciruit connectors out of gold instead of tin)
It would make for a very intersitng marketplace and could easily introduce a whole new mini-profession.
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Marcus Gideon
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Posted - 2008.05.17 21:14:00 -
[4]
Part of the problem with this though... is that ships aren't made to be that diverse yet.
A Navitas, for example, will look the same and have the same stats... whether it's made my an incompetent character or a master builder. The database isn't made to support so much variation on every ship, module, implant... there's too much to account for already, without adding subtle nuances to each. You want slightly different performance, add some Rigs.
As for a module that makes necessary materials from extra useless materials. How does this not encourage players to station a POS in orbit of almost anything, and continue to craft all they want. They start sucking up moon dust or whatever they're collecting, and then "transmute" it into the necessary materials.
This sounds too much like some mystical alchemy. If/when this happens, I wanna be the Full Metal Alchemist!
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solla bolla
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Posted - 2008.05.19 15:27:00 -
[5]
it seems not all get what im talking about :/
My idea is to make it possable to make subditude materials for more complex moon raws (rare) in a POS with special equipment
Like this f.e. u take 1-2 of the common moon raws mixit with some npc trade goods in a special reactor and out comes dysprosium.
solla
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CCP Lingorm
C C P
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Posted - 2008.05.19 15:42:00 -
[6]
This is something that has been talked about (not in depth). That being alternate production methods for some items.
F.e. you could produce 'Nanotransistors' by using 2x, 3y, 1z or 4u, 4y, 1z. where U and x have differing availabilities. It is something we think would be a good edition to the game, but is not currently supported by our db structure ....
That being said it is still doable with a rewrite of that small section. So this could happen.
Like all 'alternate' path production there would be some other factor that you would have to balance, like making it via method 2 takes twice as long and/or require better skills.
Another possibility exists to them make 'tiered' blueprints ... So you could have the Original Scorpion blueprint or another Scorpion blueprint that takes the different materials to build but has a higher skill requirement to use the blueprint ... ie adding that specialisation that builders and industrials have been asking for.
WARNING. This is at teh stage of Coffee machine discussion only. No firm designs have been written up. We have talked about it and think it would be cool, but nothing beyond that ... so there are currently no plans to bring this in as a feature, but we are aware of the idea and like it. This is just to make it perfectly clear that this is not a promise, but a statement to say we like the 'idea'.
CCP Lingorm CCP Quality Assurance QA Engineering Team Leader
Originally by: Lord Fitz Eve is to WoW as Wow is to an 8 player game of Unreal Tournament.
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Somatic Neuron
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Posted - 2008.05.19 17:16:00 -
[7]
Originally by: CCP Lingorm This is something that has been talked about (not in depth). That being alternate production methods for some items.
F.e. you could produce 'Nanotransistors' by using 2x, 3y, 1z or 4u, 4y, 1z. where U and x have differing availabilities. It is something we think would be a good edition to the game, but is not currently supported by our db structure ....
That being said it is still doable with a rewrite of that small section. So this could happen.
Like all 'alternate' path production there would be some other factor that you would have to balance, like making it via method 2 takes twice as long and/or require better skills.
Another possibility exists to them make 'tiered' blueprints ... So you could have the Original Scorpion blueprint or another Scorpion blueprint that takes the different materials to build but has a higher skill requirement to use the blueprint ... ie adding that specialisation that builders and industrials have been asking for.
WARNING. This is at teh stage of Coffee machine discussion only. No firm designs have been written up. We have talked about it and think it would be cool, but nothing beyond that ... so there are currently no plans to bring this in as a feature, but we are aware of the idea and like it. This is just to make it perfectly clear that this is not a promise, but a statement to say we like the 'idea'.
Would love you forever if you could do something like that, to make manufacturing more interesting and more of a profession, instead of an alternate's job.... ---------- |
procurement specialist
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Posted - 2008.05.19 17:35:00 -
[8]
the idea of frigate construction being used on t1 frigates to make them build faster or a (small) mineral reduction appeals to me greatly. That would be very very awesome. The other idea of being able to use more of one min than another would be fantastic as well. I could happily throw in an extra ten thousand trit sometime instead of megacyte or 20 megacyte to replace a lot of trit.
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Nekopyat
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Posted - 2008.05.19 19:59:00 -
[9]
Originally by: CCP Lingorm
Another possibility exists to them make 'tiered' blueprints ... So you could have the Original Scorpion blueprint or another Scorpion blueprint that takes the different materials to build but has a higher skill requirement to use the blueprint ... ie adding that specialisation that builders and industrials have been asking for.
Inversely, the ability to produce cheap but less effective ships would also be great, esp to newbie builders who are more interested in producing yogos for the masses. Cheap junk for everyone!
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Goumindong
Amarr Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.05.19 20:16:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Goumindong on 19/05/2008 20:18:25
Originally by: CCP Lingorm This is something that has been talked about (not in depth). That being alternate production methods for some items.
F.e. you could produce 'Nanotransistors' by using 2x, 3y, 1z or 4u, 4y, 1z. where U and x have differing availabilities. It is something we think would be a good edition to the game, but is not currently supported by our db structure ....
That being said it is still doable with a rewrite of that small section. So this could happen.
Like all 'alternate' path production there would be some other factor that you would have to balance, like making it via method 2 takes twice as long and/or require better skills.
Another possibility exists to them make 'tiered' blueprints ... So you could have the Original Scorpion blueprint or another Scorpion blueprint that takes the different materials to build but has a higher skill requirement to use the blueprint ... ie adding that specialisation that builders and industrials have been asking for.
WARNING. This is at teh stage of Coffee machine discussion only. No firm designs have been written up. We have talked about it and think it would be cool, but nothing beyond that ... so there are currently no plans to bring this in as a feature, but we are aware of the idea and like it. This is just to make it perfectly clear that this is not a promise, but a statement to say we like the 'idea'.
We were talking about this over at SHC with regards to moon mining.
While i really really do not like the idea of allowing non-moon holders to produce moon minerals[as fighting over these things is good for the game]. You could produce new reactions for moon minerals that allow you to take x of some other moon mineral, run it through the reaction and come out with y of the desired moon mineral.
This would allow you to keep moon prices within an acceptable level of each other(thus enforcing the risk/reward balance with a tiering of value for moons) while not allowing non-moon holders to produce[undercutting profits when not being in the moon mining game] and add an buffer for t2 production to extend into[as your cap is now however many moons there are rather than however many dyspro moons there are]
edit: As well, the only thing you have to add is new reactions[though you are going to have to do a lot of work to figure out how much you want each to convert to]
Vote Goumindong for CSM |
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Somatic Neuron
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Posted - 2008.05.19 23:36:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Goumindong While i really really do not like the idea of allowing non-moon holders to produce moon minerals[as fighting over these things is good for the game].
Oh come on now, never, ever, in my alliance director meetings or forums, did we ever one single time talk about attacking some other alliance for moon mineral rights. Get real. NullSec politics have never been about resources, merely about bragging rights (these guys are ebil, let's go overwhelm them so we can brag on the forums). The only time I have ever seen a war declared because of POS placement has actually been in HighSec space to get people to clear out unused POSes. ---------- |
demonfurbie
Minmatar Covert-Nexus White Core
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Posted - 2008.05.20 02:13:00 -
[12]
what about planetary ring harvesting and toss those into a reactor and move up from there cause planetary rings are moons that got destroyed so there would still be moon mins in them just small amounts and they would be hard to extract
make it like current reactions but add 2 or 3 more steps and more mins needed to make the base mins. But the rings dont need to be static or they will end up just like all the good moons ... taken and guarded. Or they could be random higher chanced for rare mins as the sec gets lower
no new skill needs to be introduced make it work off the gas harvesting skill and gas harvesters ... give people a reason to train that skill besides making boosters.
thats just my idea ... i dont know there database but it may be less programming.
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Wren Alterana
Minmatar The Baros Syndicate Kissaki Republic
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Posted - 2008.05.20 03:23:00 -
[13]
current science has the ability to transmute metals into one another, at a large price do to the energies involved, but in The FutureÖ we could expedite the process. I think what the OP is saying is: I mine moon mineral A and moon mineral B, dump them in a reactor, toss in NPC good xyz and out comes better mineral Q.
you could make the xyz items some sort of heavy reaction crystals, which themselves are made from crystal alloys, opening up whole new venues, call it Advanced Refining. _________
Dynamic Maps |
Mighty Baz
HUSARIA Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2008.05.20 06:14:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Mighty Baz on 20/05/2008 06:14:41
Transmuting minerals could be nice idea if moon minerals like cobalt could be a dysporsium hehehe
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Thunderbird Anthares
Crimson Star Empire
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Posted - 2008.05.20 06:18:00 -
[15]
Originally by: CCP Lingorm
Another possibility exists to them make 'tiered' blueprints ... So you could have the Original Scorpion blueprint or another Scorpion blueprint that takes the different materials to build but has a higher skill requirement to use the blueprint ... ie adding that specialisation that builders and industrials have been asking for.
i SO love this ------------------------------------------------ When you get to the end of your journey,everything that really matters is the journey itself. |
S Vai
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Posted - 2008.05.20 06:40:00 -
[16]
Originally by: CCP Lingorm
.... F.e. you could produce 'Nanotransistors' by using 2x, 3y, 1z or 4u, 4y, 1z. where U and x have differing availabilities. It is something we think would be a good edition to the game, but is not currently supported by our db structure .... ....
This or you can do it one "level" before on the Reaction Level with new Reactions. Like: Moon Material x1,x2,x3,x4 gives Some Dysp or whatever. That would help: - Bring Down Dysp price a little (sure no way you could catch with a Dysp Moon Holder, but thats should be so) - Bring up the Low Level Mins.. but thats good.. becouse they're to low anyway
Maybe also with a new Reactor Type so when you use that on a pos you cant fit manye defense on it.
Think that would be easyer to bring in game... no "alternate" path's in the db just new reactions?
so next time when you go to the coffe machine.. talk again about it :)
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fuze
InfoMorph Services Ltd
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Posted - 2008.05.20 10:09:00 -
[17]
Originally by: CCP Lingorm That being said it is still doable with a rewrite of that small section. So this could happen.
Like all 'alternate' path production there would be some other factor that you would have to balance, like making it via method 2 takes twice as long and/or require better skills.
These changes are rather superficial and I think CCP should consider looking at production at its entirety and rewrite this to accommodate customized products. And try to smear it out in several stages over a couple of years in order to avoid breaking too much. |
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