Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 [17] 18 19 20 .. 29 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 5 post(s) |
DogSlime
Wilde Cards
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 18:43:00 -
[481]
Originally by: Nyphur
Additionally, the fact that issues occur is not a valid judging criterion. Problems will invariably occur, the only valid judgement criteria would be how those issues are dealt with. In this specific case, the way this issue has been dealt with is extremely poor. The only official response was to repeat the announcement that people had issues with, which is considered offensive and arrogant where I live. However, in the boot.ini case you cited, the handling of that disaster was perfect. An unknown, unintended bug went out that didn't occur when testing in-house for some reason. They pulled the patch pretty quickly and made announcements in the player news center, forum stickies, in-game news and login MOTD.
They analysed the problem, released a fixed patch and dealt with the aftermath. They then transparantly explained the problem, which turned out to be an obscure quirk of the syntax that a piece of code in the installer uses which had never caused problems before. One fellow I remember saying he didn't realise eve had broken his computer and paid a specialist $200 to fix it. He said CCP then credited his account with over $200 of game time as an apology. You can't really be angry that an unforseen problem occured, only if it was handled badly.
I disagree. An unforseen problem occurred with the installer... fine. The effect of the bug was MAJOR. How can the testing department not notice that some of the test machines can't reboot once the patch is applied?
As far as I know, it was because CCP rushed out a new install script right before the patch was released, and this script hadn't gone through the proper testing. This is really BAD practice.
CCP might have done a good job with the aftermath, but the fact that this critical bug reached the end-users is down to sloppy working practice, and not due to an "unforseen problem" occurring.
|
Nariana Verex
Oberon Incorporated Morsus Mihi
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 18:45:00 -
[482]
I saw this topic in the CSM forum and it seems pretty popular over there. Then it struck me...
What if CCP is only doing this to test out CSM's functions? Give us a topic to discuss that is almost -certainly- going to go one way, just to see how the new electees respond to it.
/tinfoil
Do the right thing. Don't leave shuttles in space. |
Nyphur
Pillowsoft
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 18:47:00 -
[483]
Edited by: Nyphur on 23/05/2008 18:53:38
Originally by: Princess Gally Whatever, you can't see any other point of view than yours anw
EDIT: I apologise, I misread your last post a little. Let me just re-read it.
Originally by: DogSlime I disagree. An unforseen problem occurred with the installer... fine. The effect of the bug was MAJOR. How can the testing department not notice that some of the test machines can't reboot once the patch is applied?
Because the test machines DID reboot when the patch was applied. That's why it's called an unforseen problem - because it was unforseen. The severity of the problem are entirely inconsequential - the fact that appropriate measures were taken when an unforseen problem happened means they did a good job of handling the situation. You can't fault someone for making an unforseen mistake, only for dealing with the aftermath badly.
Eve-Tanking.com - We're sorry, something happened. |
Princess Gally
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 18:53:00 -
[484]
Edited by: Princess Gally on 23/05/2008 18:53:50 Edited by: Princess Gally on 23/05/2008 18:53:00
Originally by: Nyphur Europeans abusing the loophole to get cheap game time is a case for increasing the price of game time codes, NOT for abolishing the existance of 30 or 90 day codes.
Yes it is Sir, because europeans will stop exploiting the loophole only if the price if over $21 (equivalent to price of a 30 days CC sub in Ç). Do you really think ccp will sell $21 gtc when the CC sub is $14.9? Do I have to give you a reason for that? -------------ONCOMING REVOLUTION------------ Miners united. Set your Trit prices to 8.00! -------------------------------------------- |
Kiiikoooloool
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 18:54:00 -
[485]
@princess
http://www.shatteredcrystal.com/code.php/world_of_warcraft
well, in wow, europeans pay 25% more than Us versions.......
|
Ehronn
Perkone
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 18:57:00 -
[486]
just wish they'd keep a 30 day option open also even if I have to pay more :(
-----------------------
Dysfunctional Playground |
Princess Gally
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 18:59:00 -
[487]
Edited by: Princess Gally on 23/05/2008 19:02:43 Edited by: Princess Gally on 23/05/2008 19:00:05
Originally by: Kiiikoooloool @princess
http://www.shatteredcrystal.com/code.php/world_of_warcraft
well, in wow, europeans pay 25% more than Us versions.......
Yes and that's exactly what CCP is trying to do.
60days WOW european gtc = $41 = 26Ç. The 30 days CC sub for WOW is 12.9Ç. So europeans can't exploit a loophole here...
GTC here only purpose is to allow players without a CC to play. It's not cheaper. That's my point -------------ONCOMING REVOLUTION------------ Miners united. Set your Trit prices to 8.00! -------------------------------------------- |
Kiiikoooloool
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 19:01:00 -
[488]
Quote:
Yes and that's exactly what CCP is trying to do.
so CCP = Blizzard ?
|
Lemony Snicket
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 19:01:00 -
[489]
Originally by: Hasak Rain
Originally by: Lemony Snicket
I'm guessing the price will be around 400 million isk for 60 days. In this case running the second account may not be worth the hassle of coming up with the difference in isk every two months as you can see if you do the math it is almost twice the cost based on these figures.
What are your estimates?
400 million isk divided by 2 months is 50 million isk a week. That is basically two lvl 4 Worlds Collides a week to pay for the GTC.
Sure, somewhat of an easy solution if I could choose my missions
We could also break it down to a little over 6.6 million isk per day vs 4.4 mil at those figures which sounds minimal. But the truth is it is not. It is a considerable increase. These figures are of course based on my estimated price of a 60d GTC.
No matter how you look at it we (those who buy GTC's with isk) are going to be paying more for the same service. And for the casual player that does not hold a nice BPO, or have access to deep 0.0 mins/rats the increase amounts to more than the figures show.
_
|
Nyphur
Pillowsoft
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 19:02:00 -
[490]
Originally by: Princess Gally
Originally by: Nyphur Europeans abusing the loophole to get cheap game time is a case for increasing the price of game time codes, NOT for abolishing the existance of 30 or 90 day codes.
Yes it is Sir, because europeans will stop exploiting the loophole only if the price if over $21 (equivalent to price of a 30 days CC sub in Ç). Do you really think ccp will sell $21 gtc when the CC sub is $14.9? Do I have to give you a reason for that?
Let me get this straight so there are no misconceptions here. Your main arguments are:
1) It's alright to charge $34.99 for a 60 day code ($17.495 per 30 days) but not to charge $17.495 for a 30 day code. 2) European players should not have the flexability of paying on a 30 day basis without paying a higher rate of 14.99 euros per month. 3) Americans won't buy a 30 day game time code at 14.99 euros ($21) so it has to be scrapped. 4) The loophole allowing europeans to play for cheap using game time codes is only being abused if you're buying 30 day codes and this is not an issue with 60 day codes.
Is that right? Are those your arguments or am I misunderstanding them?
Eve-Tanking.com - We're sorry, something happened. |
|
Kiiikoooloool
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 19:06:00 -
[491]
What is the margin of the GTC re seller ?
|
Nyphur
Pillowsoft
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 19:10:00 -
[492]
Edited by: Nyphur on 23/05/2008 19:10:26
Originally by: Kiiikoooloool What is the margin of the GTC re seller ?
Im just trying to guess how cheap CCP could sell us their sub
Judging by the shatteredcrystal affiliate thing that pays a percentage on any sale, their margins are probably such that a 90d code currently costs $35 or less for them to buy in. Otherwise they don't make much on it at all.
Eve-Tanking.com - We're sorry, something happened. |
Princess Gally
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 19:13:00 -
[493]
Originally by: Nyphur
Originally by: Princess Gally
Originally by: Nyphur Europeans abusing the loophole to get cheap game time is a case for increasing the price of game time codes, NOT for abolishing the existance of 30 or 90 day codes.
Yes it is Sir, because europeans will stop exploiting the loophole only if the price if over $21 (equivalent to price of a 30 days CC sub in Ç). Do you really think ccp will sell $21 gtc when the CC sub is $14.9? Do I have to give you a reason for that?
Let me get this straight so there are no misconceptions here. Your main arguments are:
1) It's alright to charge $34.99 for a 60 day code ($17.495 per 30 days) but not to charge $17.495 for a 30 day code. 2) European players should not have the flexability of paying on a 30 day basis without paying a higher rate of 14.99 euros per month. 3) Americans won't buy a 30 day game time code at 14.99 euros ($21) so it has to be scrapped. 4) The loophole allowing europeans to play for cheap using game time codes is only being abused if you're buying 30 day codes and this is not an issue with 60 day codes.
Is that right? Are those your arguments or am I misunderstanding them?
1) I'm not saying it's good or bad, I try to understand. To be coherent CCP should have remove completely GTC. But they obviously cannot. So they nerfed. 2) Exactly, that's the key imho 3) No. It has to be scrapped because it's totally uncoherent. The only reason they would let it is to make the raise less hard for you guys who pay their account with isk. And that's not their priority, obviously. 4) Yes like i said, it's still an abuse but they can't possibly remove the GTC system like i said in 1) Because GTC exists for a reason, let ppl with few time to have isk w/o farming and let ppl with lots of time to play free (but i think they want to nerf the last case too. They want $ rather than ppl spending time on their servers) -------------ONCOMING REVOLUTION------------ Miners united. Set your Trit prices to 8.00! -------------------------------------------- |
Aldelphius
Carbide Industries
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 19:16:00 -
[494]
Originally by: Jakus Orellius Edited by: Jakus Orellius on 22/05/2008 19:05:20 Edited by: Jakus Orellius on 22/05/2008 18:58:57
Originally by: Lykah Storm LOL
How poor are you guys? Can't afford 17.5 dollars per month for internet game? LMAO
It's called edu-kay-shun.
Then mabey yoiu should be studying instead of playing a game you apparently cant afford...
|
Lemony Snicket
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 19:17:00 -
[495]
Originally by: Mystri
Originally by: StinkFinger 90 day gtcs are 38.50 the new 60 day ones are 34.95
30 fewer days for 3.55 less
that's the complaint
and thats where u get the 30-38% number
perhaps u should of take reading comprehension 101 as well?
My point was you are still getting a bargain, not the same as what you were, but still a bargain.
When the smoke blows over people will just have to accept it.
Thanks for your opinion of my opinion, but it's my opinion none the less.
Yeah, like i'm going to read 500 posts...
You Sir have no idea what a bargain is... I do however, have a packaged Raven I can sell you for 135 mil isk.. its a great bargain just a slight increase in price is all, about 30% give or take.
_
|
Sprobe
Panta-Rhei Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 19:18:00 -
[496]
Introduction of 60 day GTC means that we have to pay more for the same service. This isn't acceptable.
|
Khudo
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 19:21:00 -
[497]
Originally by: Sprobe Introduction of 60 day GTC means that we have to pay more for the same service. This isn't acceptable.
Yeah As i said ... +34%
|
Mystri
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 19:30:00 -
[498]
Edited by: Mystri on 23/05/2008 19:36:04
Originally by: Lemony Snicket
Originally by: Mystri
Originally by: StinkFinger 90 day gtcs are 38.50 the new 60 day ones are 34.95
30 fewer days for 3.55 less
that's the complaint
and thats where u get the 30-38% number
perhaps u should of take reading comprehension 101 as well?
My point was you are still getting a bargain, not the same as what you were, but still a bargain.
When the smoke blows over people will just have to accept it.
You Sir have no idea what a bargain is... I do however, have a packaged Raven I can sell you for 135 mil isk.. its a great bargain just a slight increase in price is all, about 30% give or take.
_
Quote my original post in context if you are going to comment. Paying in USD is still going to be a bargain compared to paying in Euros. Mystri |
Xavier Isaacson
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 19:41:00 -
[499]
Originally by: Lord XSiV
CCP please consider raising the price on this new 60 day gtc to 40 USD.
As it is has become apparent in this thread that the leechers have no appreciation for what you have allowed them to do in the past it would be appropriate to take that privelage away or at the very least charge a high premium.
Afterall, it isn't like these people are actually committed to the game like cc paying customers are so why should they not have to pay a premium? It is the dedicated, committed cc paying customers that allow CCP to count on revenue projections. GTC leechers on the otherhand are free to cancel at any time, abuse the skill training system by putting their accounts into 'hibernation' and abuse game resources farming isk to buy GTCs off people with money.
So, like many others who pay for the game via the preferred way of using a cc, it is finally somethign we can see that it is a move in the right direction to improving the game.
And for those who will whine because they don't have a credit card:
1. Your poor credit is not our problem 2. Your lack of a job is not our problem 3. Mommy and daddy should have a right to limit your playing ability 4. If you are a 'poor' student then you should be studying anyhow 5. Low income smokers have it way worse and they manage so quit your complaining
you are sir are a high grade moron. i cant say anything else because all i want to do is pound your sanctimonius elitist head into rush hour traffic. gdiaf
|
Terail Zoqial
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 19:53:00 -
[500]
I'm not against the increase of price at all, getting rid of 30 day cards is a massive pain in the arse though.
You never know when life is going to bone you, or life circumstances change. The 30 day card is pure awesome and it will be missed sorely by many.
Please just jack up the price, I haven't read all the posts yet, so if there have been any developments which indicate 30 day gtc's stays, huzzah!, if not, I will remain most unhappy.
|
|
Nyphur
Pillowsoft
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 19:57:00 -
[501]
Originally by: Princess Gally 1) I'm not saying it's good or bad, I try to understand. To be coherent CCP should have remove completely GTC. But they obviously cannot. So they nerfed. 2) Exactly, that's the key imho 3) No. It has to be scrapped because it's totally uncoherent. The only reason they would let it is to make the raise less hard for you guys who pay their account with isk. And that's not their priority, obviously. 4) Yes like i said, it's still an abuse but they can't possibly remove the GTC system like i said in 1) Because GTC exists for a reason, let ppl with few time to have isk w/o farming and let ppl with lots of time to play free (but i think they want to nerf the last case too. They want $ rather than ppl spending time on their servers)
Alright, I'd like to address point 2 and 4 then.
Point 2, that european players should pay a premium to play on a 30 day cycle, is your opinion and is not substantiated by any announcement. You personally think europeans should be unable to pay for one month at a time without paying extra for it but that's not CCP's official position. Their official position is that the reason for the 30d being abolished was to simplify the product range and not because they think europeans should pay more for the privilege of paying monthly. Furthermore, that point ignores two key issues:- The players who rely on game time codes are the ones that can't sign up for a normal subscription. They don't have the option of paying 14.99 euros per 30 days.
- If the issue is only with 30 day codes, why was the 90 day code removed?
Point 4 seems to misunderstand the purposes of the game time code. It was designed to give people an alternative way of paying for the game if they didn't have access to a credit card. It wasn't until much later that they allowed them to be traded for isk so that people without a lot of money could still play the game if they made enough isk. Since every game time code has to be purchased by SOMEONE, CCP don't lose any money when people use them instead of paying for their account with cash. Even if you buy the code off someone for isk, they had to pay cash for it so CCP don't lost out on any money.
Also, the loophole was not only abusable using 30 day codes. The loophole was that europeans buying US 30 or 90 day game time codes could play cheaper than if they subscribed normally. It was never about duration, in fact the 30 day code was slightly more expensive per day and it was most cost-effective to buy the 90 day one. The issue at hand is why we can't get a new 30 day code option for the large number of players who currently rely on them. Just go to the GTC forum and look at all the 30d codes that are sold daily and you'll see how big the market is for them despite 90 day ones being more cost-effective. Those are all the people affected and each one is a potential lost account that could go inactive as their sub time runs out.
For my counter-argument, I'd like to re-iterate a point from earlier. There is no monetary benefit to CCP from removing the 30d gtc option. Players who rely on them can't switch to a 30d CC sub so they can't pay that premium. They'll have to switch to 60d gtcs instead, but if they can't afford them then that's a potential lost account. It doesn't cost CCP any extra to provide the option of buying in increments of 30 days. There is no good reason not to give us a 30d gtc in principle (ignoring prices for the moment).
Eve-Tanking.com - We're sorry, something happened. |
Kiiikoooloool
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 20:03:00 -
[502]
But ccp have a monetary benefit to remove 90 days GTC (+34% )
|
Lemony Snicket
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 20:07:00 -
[503]
Originally by: Mystri Edited by: Mystri on 23/05/2008 19:36:04
Originally by: Lemony Snicket
Originally by: Mystri
Originally by: StinkFinger 90 day gtcs are 38.50 the new 60 day ones are 34.95
30 fewer days for 3.55 less
that's the complaint
and thats where u get the 30-38% number
perhaps u should of take reading comprehension 101 as well?
My point was you are still getting a bargain, not the same as what you were, but still a bargain.
When the smoke blows over people will just have to accept it.
You Sir have no idea what a bargain is... I do however, have a packaged Raven I can sell you for 135 mil isk.. its a great bargain just a slight increase in price is all, about 30% give or take.
_
Quote my original post in context if you are going to comment. Paying in USD is still going to be a bargain compared to paying in Euros.
LOL.. that is not a bargain. The USD is WORTH less than the Euro. But hey, we won't take face value into consideration (or in your case math) we'll just compare numbers... I've got a better offer for you than the Raven, I'll give you 100.00 USD in exchange for 100.00 Euro's.. deal?
_
|
Nyphur
Pillowsoft
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 20:21:00 -
[504]
Originally by: Kiiikoooloool But ccp have a monetary benefit to remove 90 days GTC (+34% )
Compared to increasing the price to be in line with the new 60d code, removing the 90d code provides no benefit.
Eve-Tanking.com - We're sorry, something happened. |
Snarker
Dragon's Rage Intrepid Crossing
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 20:27:00 -
[505]
I loved being able to pay in small 30 day increments of time. Please do not remove this, CCP. ----------------------------------------
|
Mystri
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 20:30:00 -
[506]
Originally by: Lemony Snicket
Originally by: Mystri
Quote my original post in context if you are going to comment. Paying in USD is still going to be a bargain compared to paying in Euros.
LOL.. that is not a bargain. The USD is WORTH less than the Euro. But hey, we won't take face value into consideration (or in your case math) we'll just compare numbers... I've got a better offer for you than the Raven, I'll give you 100.00 USD in exchange for 100.00 Euro's.. deal?
That's right, the USD is worth less than the Euro. So when i hand over 100USD it costs me 63EUR. Or when i hand over 100EUR i get 157USD.
So if i buy a $34.99 GTC, it costs me Ç22.18. That's cheaper than buying 2 x Ç14.95 subscriptions.
Over to you.
Mystri |
Saipil
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 20:32:00 -
[507]
Edited by: Saipil on 23/05/2008 20:33:01
Originally by: Mystri
Originally by: Lemony Snicket
Originally by: Mystri
Quote my original post in context if you are going to comment. Paying in USD is still going to be a bargain compared to paying in Euros.
LOL.. that is not a bargain. The USD is WORTH less than the Euro. But hey, we won't take face value into consideration (or in your case math) we'll just compare numbers... I've got a better offer for you than the Raven, I'll give you 100.00 USD in exchange for 100.00 Euro's.. deal?
That's right, the USD is worth less than the Euro. So when i hand over 100USD it costs me 63EUR. Or when i hand over 100EUR i get 157USD.
So if i buy a $34.99 GTC, it costs me Ç22.18. That's cheaper than buying 2 x Ç14.95 subscriptions.
Over to you.
but 30% more expensive than buying 1 x $38 90 day code from us-based websites
|
Eevul Rabbite
Universal Securities
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 20:45:00 -
[508]
Edited by: Eevul Rabbite on 23/05/2008 20:54:27 OK, the real problem CCP is facing is that evil Europeans are abusing the GTC system to pay "less" for the game. Lets look at the reasons maybe. Why is CCP the only company having this problem, anyway?
If you look at the prices of monthly subscriptions of other games, they all look more or less like this:
14.99 USD / 12.99 EUR / 8.99 GBP
This applies to both American and European companies. CCP is the only company that I know of that charges 15/15. No, it's not VAT. Other companies have to pay VAT as well, which is why the price in Euros is usually 11-13, not 9. EDIT: small correction, Funcom is charging similarly, although they're fair with the tax, which is applicable only when it should be.
If CCP provides fair pricing for customers in different currency zones, people will stop going around their system to pay less. Before you start going on how this is impossible because of currency fluctuations - somehow it is possible for every MMO company out there, at least for the three major currencies (USD/EUR/GBP).
The current CC subscription pricing and upcoming GTC changes throw the responsibility for weak dollar on European customers and additionally hurt people who rely on GTCs, which is a bit absurd tbh.
"To simplify the ETC reseller program and attune our product offerings with industry standards...". Obvious lie is obvious.
|
Mystri
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 20:56:00 -
[509]
Originally by: Saipil Edited by: Saipil on 23/05/2008 20:33:01
Originally by: Mystri
Originally by: Lemony Snicket
Originally by: Mystri
Quote my original post in context if you are going to comment. Paying in USD is still going to be a bargain compared to paying in Euros.
LOL.. that is not a bargain. The USD is WORTH less than the Euro. But hey, we won't take face value into consideration (or in your case math) we'll just compare numbers... I've got a better offer for you than the Raven, I'll give you 100.00 USD in exchange for 100.00 Euro's.. deal?
That's right, the USD is worth less than the Euro. So when i hand over 100USD it costs me 63EUR. Or when i hand over 100EUR i get 157USD.
So if i buy a $34.99 GTC, it costs me Ç22.18. That's cheaper than buying 2 x Ç14.95 subscriptions.
Over to you.
but 30% more expensive than buying 1 x $38 90 day code from us-based websites
At least your civil.
But i'm still saving money over my own currency.
The people who earn their money in USD and pay their subscription by GTC are going to get hit by this. It would now be cheaper for US subscribers to pay by CC or other means rather than GTC. Europeans can still get a bargain by buying the 60-day GTC.
I'll concede that the cost from 90-day to 60-day GTC has increased by 35.1%. But i will stand by my maths that the 60-day GTC has increased the base 1 month USD subscription by 17% in line with devaluation of the dollar.
Mystri |
Hasak Rain
|
Posted - 2008.05.23 21:04:00 -
[510]
Edited by: Hasak Rain on 23/05/2008 21:03:57 This thread is turning into a Threadnaught.
In one corner, you have the whiners. In the other, the usual morons telling the whiners to stop whining. Epic imo.
|
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 [17] 18 19 20 .. 29 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |